Official MBR Tier List

[CloneHat]

I think he said, "Don't blame your character, just suck it up and admit that your character is worse."

 

[P.C. Jona]

no character johns

pick a better character or shut up

ggnore

 

[KirbyKaze]

no character johns

pick a better character or shut up

ggnore

For once I actually just... agree with you.

 

[P.C. Jona]

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[Rappster]

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that was beautiful.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

in your words....scar didnt know the MU, bowser can never be good. He will never win a match vs a good player if they know the MU.... never.


Back around pound I showed that vid to my friend who was in WKs pool lol. he also plays falcon, I told him it was over.

pkmvodka vs djnintendo

 

[KAOSTAR]

pkmvodka vs djnintendo

explain? im not familiar with that set.

pc jona that tickled me no homo lol.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

djn beat pkmvodkas marth with bowser.

 

[The Good Doctor]

when was the last time fox, falco, marth, sheik won one lol?

you don't have to win to be "usable".

making it into bracket is pretty legit.

It's the fact those characters actually have, while characters like MewSuck won't ever come close, b/c he sucks.

 

[rhan]

Jonas is the man for those pictures!

 

[bryu_1337]

fox, falco, sheik, and jigglypuff all win/top3 at national tourneys. this is because they're top tier.
the tier list in the first post of this thread is irrelevant, in case one of you guys wanted to go "but stronbad teh first post (2008) sez marf is better than puff"

The results at APEX 2010 singles were:
1. Puff
2. Peach
3. Marth
4. Falco
5. Pikachu/Falco
5. Ice Climbers

The reason Hungrybox won with puff is because he really is that good with his character. The reason Armada got 2nd with Peach is because he's that **** good with peach. Mew2king got 3rd because he's still better than most of the melee world despite only playing before tourneys. Dr. Peepee got 4th because he is one of the most consistent Falco's out there and is one of the best at his character. Axe repping with a LOW tier character and getting 5th while Wobbles gets 5th with IC's.

Sheik, Fox, Falco, and Jigglypuff are great characters, sure, but so are Marth, Peach, Falcon, IC's, and most other characters. For the sake of the tier list, I think it does need to be updated a bit because the metagame has developed quite a bit, but for the sake of competitive play, the skill of the player outweighs the viability of the character for a large portion of it. Axe didn't get 5th with a low tier character for no reason. He's taken pikachu to a whole different level, but the character still suffers from bad matchups.

In the end, however, the matchups play a big part in tournament placings, too, but when you see Armada beating M2K effectively at the 3 nationals he's been to even when playing bad matchups every time, it shows that player skill and the player's ability to adapt on the fly it key to being a top player. This is how Mang0 has been dominant for so long. He's good enough to keep up with every player from a head-to-head point-of-view, but is better at catching on to habits and capitalizing on mistakes.

 

[rhan]

I'm so glad people keep bringing up the Apex results like it's the global results for Genesis, Pound 4, and RoM2..

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

^ Like half the cast is considered unfit for Tourney play. There isn't much balanced about this game.

We are still arguing about who the best character in the game is, 10 years after release. The **** you talking about.

melee is such a dead game :/\

Which is why the biggest Melee tournament of all time happened this year. The **** you talking about.

I don't even know why I check this thread anymore. Oh yea, KirbyKaze. <3

 

[Merkuri]

We are still arguing about who the best character in the game is, 10 years after release. The **** you talking about.

I don't see anyone saying anyone other than Puff/Fox is the best character. Also the top being fairly balanced doesn't mean too much if they render almost half of the cast useless(not viable to place well in tournies); this game is not balanced, it's stupid to think otherwise. Characters like Pichu, Kirby, Ness, Bowser, Ness etc sadly stand no chance against the top tiers.

And lol your argument is that we don't know who the best is. Marvel vs Capcom 2 is the most broken successful fighting game of all time, and people still argue whether or not Storm, Sentinel, Cable and a few others are the best in the game.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Also the top being fairly balanced doesn't mean too much

Yes it does. In fact, thats all that matters.

No one cares that Pichu is bad. Now you might say that means that the game is imbalanced, but really, all that means is that Pichu isn't part of the competitive game. Hes a joke character that you use when you wanna troll somebody. The relevant characters are balanced, and therefore Melee is a fairly well-balanced game in tournament.

 

[MarioNathanSmasher]

I fully intend to move Mario up.

 

[Aegri Somnia]

Yes it does. In fact, thats all that matters.

No one cares that Pichu is bad. Now you might say that means that the game is imbalanced, but really, all that means is that Pichu isn't part of the competitive game. Hes a joke character that you use when you wanna troll somebody. The relevant characters are balanced, and therefore Melee is a fairly well-balanced game in tournament.

you're a smart man.

loool @ mario main. go watch videos of mango, it'll give you a tip or 2

*edit* to clarify, i meant him showing how mario should be played, not that it can't be done.

although it is pretty much impossible if mango can't win

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Indeed, the number of viable characters is more important than the percentage of characters that are viable.

 

[Merkuri]

Yes it does. In fact, thats all that matters.

No one cares that Pichu is bad. Now you might say that means that the game is imbalanced, but really, all that means is that Pichu isn't part of the competitive game. Hes a joke character that you use when you wanna troll somebody. The relevant characters are balanced, and therefore Melee is a fairly well-balanced game in tournament.

Lol dumb. I'm guessing you don't know much about fighting games, but there are some fighting games where pretty much the entire cast is viable to place well or even win tournaments. A great example would be SSF4; which is by leaps and bounds the most popular fighting game out there right now. The game is balanced and what actually counts is the players skills and not the characters they use. The characters you refer to as ''relevant'' are only ''relevant'' because the game is imbalanced. Please tell me you were trolling me because I'd rather not think you are this ignorant.

Also the idiocy that no one cares about lower tiers is completely wrong. Plenty people care about them, they were simply forced to chose other characters because the game is ****ed up and imbalanced. The fact that so much of the cast is referred to as ''Joke characters'' proves the game is unbalanced.

 

[Aegri Somnia]

^

you're repeating the same points about sf4 which i'm certain someone refuted already

sf4 was meant to be balanced, smash wasn't. the melee cast, the viable characters, are balanced well enough to ensure a decent amount of viability at top levels of play, with lower-tiered characters causing enough upsets.

to me, that's balanced enough. due to the complexity and unorthodox nature of smash, counterpicks decide several more factors such as stages, matchups, and viability than other fighters such as sf4 and blazblue do.

people just need to learn about them, and implement strategies based on aforementioned areas

 

[Merkuri]

^

you're repeating the same points about sf4 which i'm certain someone refuted already

sf4 was meant to be balanced, smash wasn't. the melee cast, the viable characters, are balanced well enough to ensure a decent amount of viability at top levels of play, with lower-tiered characters causing enough upsets.

to me, that's balanced enough. due to the complexity and unorthodox nature of smash, counterpicks decide several more factors such as stages, matchups, and viability than other fighters such as sf4 and blazblue do.

No one refuted my points about SSF4(not sf4) they simply explained why I was right and why the developers shouldn't be blamed for the imbalance of melee.

I'm not sure what you refer to as ''decent''. The viable characters in melee are extremely limited. Compared to many other fighting game the balance in melee is a joke, it is flat out ********.

Forgive me if I sound condescending but I'm going to assume that you're not a hardcore fighting gamer and perhaps because of that you're satisfied with 8 at max 10 characters being legitimate threats for winning a tournament. But in a game with around twice that amount it's just stupid that the rest of the cast is useless at the highest level of play. I understand that you're satisfied with having so few viable characters, I'm just saying that many people are not satisfied with so few viable characters; and objectively speaking calling the game balanced is laughable.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

I'm guessing you don't know much about fighting games.

A great example would be SSF4

K.

Win a national with Dan or Makoto. I dare you.

 

[Merkuri]

K.

Win a national with Dan or Makoto. I dare you.

Lol whoops, I forgot to mention that like any fighting game there are tiers in SSF4 and it's less likely to win with some characters than others lmao. But what's even funny is that you conceded and didn't respond to my argument

Seriously though, I hope you got the point.

 

[Aegri Somnia]

No one refuted my points about SSF4(not sf4) they simply explained why I was right and why the developers shouldn't be blamed for the imbalance of melee.

I'm not sure what you refer to as ''decent''. The viable characters in melee are extremely limited. Compared to many other fighting game the balance in melee is a joke, it is flat out ********.

Forgive me if I sound condescending but I'm going to assume that you're not a hardcore fighting gamer and perhaps because of that you're satisfied with 8 at max 10 characters being legitimate threats for winning a tournament. But in a game with around twice that amount it's just stupid that the rest of the cast is useless at the highest level of play. I understand that you're satisfied with having so few viable characters, I'm just saying that many people are not satisfied with so few viable characters; and objectively speaking calling the game balanced is laughable.

omg looooooooooooooooooooooool

so dan could win a tournament? makoto?

you assume wrong. there's nothing about "satisfaction" in this equation, they're simply not programmed as well, and have more exploitable weaknesses.

every single fighting game has these characters. including sf4, which sucks balls and is really limited, but w/e

and didn't i say even low tiers cause upsets? cosmo, lake, axe, taj, warriorknight, etc etc

and those aren't even the viable characters. fox, falco, peach, marth, jiggs, falcon, are all pretty much fairly even in terms of top level play.

they have a lot of competent, good players that rack in several tournament placings of good quality.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Lol whoops, I forgot to mention that like any fighting game there are tiers in SSF4 and it's less likely to win with some characters than others lmao. But what's even funny is that you conceded and didn't respond to my argument

Seriously though, I hope you got the point.

Dan is as irrelevant in SSF4 as Pichu is in Smash.

For some reason, you seem to think there is a difference, when there is not.

 

[Abilities]

not to mention street fighter sucks anyways and is therefore irrelevant

lool

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

pichu has the tools to win he can't be movement camped on legal stages, sheild works, has a attacks/mix-ups/recovery, has a good grab game, fast enought to keep up with most people and his small size lets him weave in and out of attacks. there is nothing game breakingly bad about him maybe if you put pichu in SF he may fail worse than he does in smash but still pichu has the tools he needs.

No matter how much you hate the idea of it you know i'm right f*** pichu even has some form of pressure sheild/stage/edge/platform wise it's bulls*** to say otherwise and I possible you that one of those are going to be the reply: totally go the wrong way with this post and compare pichu's stuff to someone esle, no pichu's tools are good enough to work it's simple as that.

that or some other BS really people can't admit pichu could in fact win and he does have the tools.

 

[Abilities]

pichu has absolutely nothing to win a match except for 3 factors

1. nair

2. opponents sd

3. opponents can't play melee at a competent level

pichu and kirby are realistically the -only- characters that are completely horrible. not even outliers can change their fate.

 

[The Good Doctor]

not to mention street fighter sucks anyways and is therefore irrelevant

lool

Thousands and thousands of people disagree, as do I.
Wasn't Dan MEANT to be a joke character
Melee balance is a joke, like 8 characters are viable, while in SSF4 everyone besides the joke character are somewhat viable.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I made me smile thank you here I go man.

1st off you said he can win a match and his nair is seriouly an answer to everything and can be used to beat out like every case in melee other than movement camping in which case you jolt to cut off their options.

But really nair is a move that isgodly good. it beats sheilds, CCs if spaced(but really why nair when you could jolt/d-tilt?), edge gaurd and everything. I dare you to dare argee I really do want you walk in to this s***.

tell you what i'll break down a normal match for me on FD pichu vs falco I start off running full hop jolt so he loses half the stage and takes damage if he refleted i'd go and nait him into a combo. I have half of the stage now. falco will start to laser to take back control/get combos.

I am pretty good at powersheilding them back so let's so every 1/3 laser I powersheild back right? he can't approach without a solid laser or to try and fake me out. after every laser he shoots i take more space or try to nair him maybe full jolt to avoid laser and ounush him for lasering. however if he fakes me out I take a f-smash most likly. If I know 100% he's going to laser i'll run up and sheild perfectly as he lasers and get a grab.

rememeber i've taken over half of FD he can't keep backing up so laser backwards wouldn't save him from powersheild grab I do. so I get a grab and chain throws are fun enoufgh to get a kill with.

however if he uses one of those lasers he uses he can get a nice combo doing 40%-80% damage rarly= death as pichu buut pichu is just a f-smash away from death. falco has more options for punishment combos, and junk. But the thing i pichu can counter any of his single tactics. Pichu has to be very smart same for falco if the pichu is good.however knowing how to fight pichu isn't uber helpful this isn't like fighting kirby this is like fox because pichu can be played fairly different and has many tricks and mindgames. pichu's large sheild makes powersheilding easier thann it is for most people.

also pichu's 3 movbes to approach with are d-tilt, nair and jolt which can all mix up into each other to be harder to predict.

pichu has to adapt(not to the extremes) but he can win any match-up but maybe ice climbers i'll have to play against some good ice climbers however I used to think gannon was impossible. i'm dumb. duck under grabs.jabs jolts and nair him.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Somehow, after saying that I shouldn't check this thread anymore because it has become exceedingly bad, I made it worse.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

sorry man someone dropped the P is useless bomb on me.

 

[CloneHat]

Nobody really gets Pichu. He has better grabs, movement, recovery, edgeguarding, approaching, and pressure than the likes of characters like Bowser, Zelda, Kirby, etc. His greatest weaknesses are the range of his attacks and his stupidly light weight.

He's just Pikachu, but with slightly worse moves.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

It's range and can't take a hit that right there covers EVERYTHING that is wrong with pichu. but at least the projectile and movement make up for his range and also not being able to take a hit in some ways.

how i'd explain pichu from being different from pikachu is pichu is much better build for more defence and mindgames than pikachu for being more offencive.

 

[Cosmo!]

pichu does not have better pressure than zelda.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

cosmo=more right than your avarage bear

 

[.Marik]

Thousands and thousands of people disagree, as do I.
Wasn't Dan MEANT to be a joke character
Melee balance is a joke, like 8 characters are viable, while in SSF4 everyone besides the joke character are somewhat viable.

No, what I meant is that Street Fighter 4 is inherently limited in comparision to Smash.

A lot more characters are more viable than you're giving them credit for.

 

[ZIO]

Pichu isn't better than Pichu, to say the least. :/

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Pichu isn't better than Pichu, to say the least. :/

I disargee pichu strong counters pichu surprisingly I mean went you pick pichu pichu just totally outranges you and DD camping is near impossible to deal with and you'll get camped to death.

it's A 20-80 match-up I don't see what your saying when pichu isn't better hard match-up man.

 

[P.C. Jona]

wrong

goggles pichu is better then pichu or pichu or pichu

hes atleast 3 full tiers higher then garbage tier