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Who are you to define low % KOs as a ban?
they can easily be used for a cheap KO,their consistency makes it worse because it makes setting up an easy KO easier
they can easily be used for a cheap KO,their consistency makes it worse because it makes setting up an easy KO easier
anyone can be good at a stage,my IC's d-grab to f-air into car will beat you every time
The same as you or anyone else.
Debatable, especially when it isn't clear where's safe.
I disagree. Depending on the character, some can die on 80% of stops as low as 30% for some.
True.
Debatable
Definetly not.
If you land on the road you die.
The chaingrab doesn't last forever though does it?
Really? You really think so?
Can you elaborate on this Fox-on-Yoshi's-Island thing? I thought it was due to the walk-off on the side. I don't think a low ceiling would constitute a ban, even in Melee...
from what i recall light and normal wight characters could get up air'd by fox and die almost every time at absurdly low percentages(at around 30-40%,heavy chars at 50-60%)
It's banned already. Permanent walk-offs are banned.
And it was explicitly banned because Fox was the only one to be able to take advantage of this low ceiling? I doubt that was the case.
The point is, our definition of stalling doesn't apply to the stage, because the opponent can still have a viable approach. So we shouldn't ban it for stalling purposes, the scenario you're describing is just camping using the stage.
yes, and yes. go look it up in the melee discussion or wait for another older player to confirm it for you>.> actually i think it was mentioned in the beginning of THIS discussion(prolly in like the first 5 pages or so...)
Fox wasn't the only one who could do it. Anyone with a move that can KO vertically would do so at very low percentages there.
the hazard is constant.
don't you get that your just hurting your argument but saying that they move at a constant speed? this would distract from the match and have people focusing on where the cars are in order to spike, throw or trip into to the cars having them die at like 40 or 50%. There are also 2 places with a huge lack of warning and if your in the middle of a move be it a grab or mortar slide you won't have time to react before the cars can hit you.
that is right i think. each character has its advantages and disadvantages on each stage... on final destination (everybody accept this one as a tourney map) for example characters with a better ground-moveset than air-moveset are often a bit better than the character with a better air-moveset
It's a constant speed, yes, but the stops are random.
Lol at the first 5 pages to this thread. They were discussing which stages should be legal due to Final Smash effects. Anyway, I found nothing about Yoshi's Island Melee on there, and my light scavenging in the Melee discussion bared no fruit. I think I'll take AlexX's word for it - I really doubt ONE character's upsmash would get an entire stage banned.
No, the walk-offs should not be any reason to ban the stage. They're not permanent and thus can't be abused easily - exactly like Delfino Plaza (an agreed counter-pick).
Thank you for reading posts and trying to gather some conclusions before posting - not like other newbies >_>.
Am not an office reminder!
You are right, one character isn't normally enough for a stage ban and it isn't usually the ban reasoning. Low damage kills were often the reasoning, and so is camping/running in circles. Extremists also believe that Rumble Falls and Big Blue should be banned and that having more than 20 stage bans is reasonable. Rumble Falls and Big Blue should be CP's, they are different, but not broken. Big Blue may have random car placement, but the track is still an option, footstool jumping onto the track could be a problem, but footstool jumps are already oftenly low % kills. 20 bans is WAY too many. I'm not totally against bans, I would still ban wario ware inc., Summit, bridge of eldin, Temple, New Pork City, and Mario Bros., and probably Yoshi's Island. But maybe not Spear Pillar because the hazards can prevent running in circles, that stage needs more testing first. Spear pillar needs more testing. I think a Global Ban should be given to both players, and that it should still apply to the Starter Stages (That way I can use mine on fd). Green Greens also needs more testing, as the exploding field glitch needs to be fully understood.
