Official Standard Custom Moveset Project: Donkey Kong

[Amazing Ampharos]

Welcome to the official Smashboards Standard Custom Set project. In brief, this project is designed to be a logistical solution to using custom movesets in tournaments by filling many of the in-game slots with the most popular and powerful sets for each character so they can be quickly selected without further 3ds import. This will allow tournaments with customizations on to save large amounts of time throughout the event. More details about the project's ideas and mission can be found here:

http://smashboards.com/threads/project-proposal-we-can-make-custom-moves-fast-easy-and-legal.379555/

Our goal here is to find out what the most popular and powerful sets are for your particular character the best way we know how: asking you the mains of this character. To be clear, we're not talking about disallowing any particular custom sets or even imposing any rules in general; we're talking about making sure the popular and powerful options are simply accessible quickly in a tournament environment as our sole mission. We need up to three critical sets that represent the best options your character has that have wide general utility and from there to fill up to slot 6 with supplemental movesets that will cover less mainstream, more match-up specific, or even teams sets. Slots 7 and 8 are reserved for 2222 and 3333 to allow all moves to be explored more easily in the new metagame, and slots 9 and 10 are left open for 3ds import of non-standard sets.

Please list all movesets in the order NSUD, that is neutral special, side special, up special, and down special. This four digit code will be the naming convention so players can quickly and easily identify which moveset is which.

I know for many characters the default moveset, 1111, is a powerful and useful option. However, it should not be included; the game allows default to be picked regardless of what custom options are prepared so including it does not add any additional options to players.

I further know that some characters may find six slots a large number to fill. Others may find six very limiting. Do your best to pick out the overall six most likely to be picked even if some good stuff has to be left on the table or if some more experimental sets have to be included to fill out six. Every set included is time saved in tournament when that set would be picked, and we want to make the best use we can of these slots.

I would ask that everyone please be respectful of each other's opinions; this game is young, and the metagame is still very much forming so we are likely to each perceive it differently. This project will be revisited throughout the game's lifespan and revised to properly include the most mainstream movesets at the time. What we want for now is what will be commonly selected for now, and don't worry, other options are not being discriminated against as those last two slots are left open for 3ds transfer for a reason. This first version of this project will be refined throughout the rest of the year, but I hope to have a very rough draft up and usable by December 5 so TOs who wish to use the results of this project will have something to plug in for that weekend's worth of events. Thank you for your cooperation in this project, and we look forward to making sure the most useful options are quickly available for your character under this system.

 

[popsofctown]

@SolidSense

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

I've found 1221 and 1321 to be optimal.

Giant Punch is fine the way it is. It doesn't get a ton of opportunity to charge, but the power output if successfully executed makes it worth in the idle time during a KO that DK gets. Lightning Punch is too much of a power loss and one is better off using a Smash attack than fully investing in it. Storm Punch, while it has utility, seems more situational due to its increased charge time and reliance on an opponent having already used their recovery above ledge height.

The alternates for Headbutt, however, I feel each have merit. Jumping Headbutt is quick and allows for a level of unpredictability, which can be helpful if one needs an opening from the opponent's pressure at higher percents. Stubborn Headbutt's armor can be extremely helpful if one reads an opponent correctly in an attempted dash attack. Team Battles are where it especially shines, however. With one quicker and one harder to interrupt, I feel the default Headbutt is outclassed.

Chopper Kong is a straight upgrade, I feel. The damage from Spinning Kong is negligible and is easily replicated throughout the rest of DK's moveset. Chopper Kong is much faster and gives more vertical height, which in turn makes DK's recovery much more efficient, especially when recovering from an attempted meteor smash or likewise trying to avoid a gimp.

The other variants of Hand Slap are so bad it's not even funny. Both take away the large range the default has and neither are fast or powerful enough to find usage, especially when Hand Slap is seldom ever used in 1v1 in the first place.

Again, of these, Chopper Kong (Up 2) is essential, while Jumping Headbutt (Side 2) and Stubborn Headbutt (Side 3) have use over the default Headbutt.

 

[Big O]

I'd say DK's best special moves are Up B 3, Up B 1, Down B 1, Down B 3, and Neutral B 1. The other punch options are situational, and all 3 headbutt variants are situational/preference based. Side B 1 is probably what most are comfortable with overall and the most straight forward one to use.

Deciding which Down B/Up B to use are the most impactful decisions. Up B 3 should be used most often, but on stages with few abusable slopes/platforms like FD Up B 1 is better. In those situations, the default 1111 is probably close enough to what you would like to run. Down B 3 is best for MU's and stages where the opponent prefers the air. It also is a very nice for ledge/platform traps. His two standard sets should be the ones below imo.

1131

1133

Side B 2 can be useful as another option to have against juggle traps. Side B 2's jump is also useful in dodging various things, but can be annoying on stages like BF where platforms often mess up your attack. It doesn't bury them as long and it is a little slower and laggier than the default.

Side B 3 is okay as a counter-like attack. Jab combos and such that aren't true combos can be punished with this move. The slow startup keeps it from being too useful, but in teams the super armor can be a valuable asset.

Neutral B 2 is useful in MU's where charging the punch takes too long to be practical.

Neutral B 3 is useful in MU's where the opponent has terrible recoveries (Little Mac) or spams moves that induce freefall (Zelda).

Based on the above, I think the following are good supplemental sets to have.

1231

1331

2131

3131

Up B 2 is awful and should never be considered in any serious competitive set. It has 0 offensive or defensive capabilities due to having no hitboxes. It goes maybe twice as high as the other 2 variants, but also has so little horizontal mobility that it is worse at recovering.

Down B 2 is like a rapid fire half-charged smash attack with grab range. However, the opportunity cost of losing either Down B 1's utility as a poke or Down B 3's anti-air properties makes Down B 2 not worth using.

As an aside @ Amazing Ampharos , I think it's a little silly to reserve slots for 2222 and 3333. I'm not sure why that is necessary and what it is supposed to accomplish. The players themselves will be testing and exploring the customs on their own terms. For characters where these slots are unviable, it is really just wasted space. No one will really want to explore sets that are just obviously bad to try out the 1 or 2 particular customs that might be useful within them.

 

[Brickbox]

You are insane if you use up b 2

You are taking away a move that
1.Is amazing OoS
2.Provides good damage
3.Has a ton of active frames
4.Punishes rolls
5.Takes care of almost all opponents ledge get up options
6. Can easily help gimp
7. Is one of the best horizontal recoveries in the game.
Not to mention all the uses that up b 3 has.
You are nuts if you a going to give up all those thing just to have a slightly better chance against recovering from a spike.

Question: Do the rules allow you to change customs after you win?

edit: just realized I have the last post in almost all the dk threads. Hopefully I am not getting annoying :I

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

@ Big O Thanks for the very informative post on DK's options. When I was toying with DK I was really impressed with the raw kill power of Down-2, but I'm bad with DK so my strat really was just turtle up, wait for them to make a mistake, and punish with down-2 to kill at like 80% because that move does that for some reason. I can definitely see how if your DK play were significantly less fraudulent that you would likely prefer the options with general utility. It would still be good to hear from some more DKs, of course, to see if your analysis matches their opinions on what they'd like to pick and to see if this supported up-2 is a common preferece.

As per your suggestion on 2222 and 3333, when Thinkaman suggested we include those I gave basically that same response, but then I thought about it like this. As I've gone to some early smash 4 tournaments, very few players owned or significantly played the 3ds version, and literally no one other than me had unlocked all of the moves in any version with few having done much unlocking at all. Loading these pre-sets onto every set-up means that everyone can then bring home the set-up and see how these moves work when a very large number of players otherwise would have no way to even see how these less popular moves even work. I would like to phase out 2222 and 3333 eventually, but it would be good to make sure in the early metagame everyone has some ability to try out every custom move even if those sets are going to be very rarely picked for most characters in tournament.

 

[Davis-Lightheart]

*Sigh* The more of these I put on reddit, the shorter these get.

"I like 3131.

Storm Punch charges faster than normal punch, does alright damage, and the windbox can gimp some recoveries.

Normal headbutt can be used for quick run off stage spikes, but I sometimes like to change it up with Jumping Headbutt (2).

Kong Cyclone so good. No landing lag if you recover properly, and the suction can mess your opponent's movements up.

I usually use normal hand slap because I like the range, haven't tried much of the other two." - 1 upvote

 

[beanguyensonr]

Neutral B 1 or 3 (Storm Punch)
Side B 1 or 2 (Jumping Headbutt)
Down B 1 or 2 (Focused Slap)
Up B 1 or 3 (Kong Cyclone)

Neutral B1 is the best choice the majority of the time, but there can be times where the windbox of B3 can be really useful for gimping.

Side B1 is good because people are just used to it, not to mention the shield break potential of it. Side B2 I'm not too sure about since I haven't been able to test it out on humans, but I can see the jumping dodge being useful. I'm also not too sure about the shield damage of Side B2, but if it's the same, it has potential.

Down B1 is good for mixups, roll punish/reads, and I swear it can meteor when used as an aerial. Down B2 is actually surprisingly good despite the **** range on it. When I used it, I star ko'd an Ike at around 100% on Battlefield on the middle of the stage.

Up B1 is better than Up B3 on flat stages, but man am I in love with Up B3. Super Armor on some frames, disorienting suction-effect, and kill potential at around 125%, I think Up B3 is one of the best custom moves in the game. To me, there aren't many reasons to use Up B2 over Up B3.

To conclude:

1113, 1223, or 1211

 

[Aninymouse]

I'm not like some wiz kid with DK or anything, but I do play with DK and Ike almost exclusively.

Neutral 3 is interesting on FD stages, but it takes so long to wind up neutral 1 that I have not incorporated any of the punches into my game that much. Neutral 1 takes forever to charge, but the power it brings is useful. The psychological effect of a fully charged Giant Punch can also be useful (even if you never use it), since many people instinctively fear it. The problem with it is that you will probably only get one chance to use it in a 2-stock match! Neutral 3 is good for the strong windbox, but the actual damage-dealing part of the attack seems not so hot. Neutral 2 is fast, but it's considerably weaker than 1 and has nothing else special about it to make up for the power, like 3. Neutral 2 seems easy to discard, I feel.

I love side 3. It's slow, but you can power through attacks and hit your opponent. If any character can afford to eat some percentage in order to get in and hit the opponent, it's DK. Dude is heavy. So often when playing DK, I just get zoned out. DK is a big target and has no projectiles, so it's hard to get in against campy or reactive play styles. Side 3 helps me by allowing my opponent to go ahead and hit me while I am guaranteed some form of retaliation. It's almost like a Counter, except you have to take the damage. I haven't figured out how to use side 2 quite yet, but I see that people see it favorably, so it needs to have a spot or two. I feel like my inexperience with Jumping Headbutt holds me back from making a definitive call on which side special to use for what. Side 1 is fast, side 2 is evasive, and side 3 is slow but reliable. They seem very matchup-dependent. I think it's important to remember that using side 2 off-stage will result in your death, as well!

The most important custom is Kong Cyclone (up 3). At first I wasn't impressed by it, since I was mostly using it on the ground, but using it while airborne is amazing. I think there is a case for using Spinning Kong (up 1) on FD stages, where you're going to want to use it on the ground a lot. I think DK really struggles on FD stages in general in this game. Jumping around and using up 3 on a FD stage is kind of awkward, but I guess if they shield it DK is in no worse shape than if they shielded his up 1 special. Up 2 seems useless and should be discarded. Up 1 is such a nice grounded attack, though, that I feel there has to be a place for it, at least on FD.

Down special? All of the Slap moves have that nasty start-up lag on the ground, so I'm not sure how often you're going to want to punish opponents above you with it (Fire Slap down 3). I mean, most of DK's best positions are when the opponent is above him on stage, I think. Why waste the potential? Up tilt, up air, up smash, etc., can all be kill moves at the right percent and are leagues faster than any of the Slap moves. Well, up air is a bit laggy on start-up, but it's so versatile and strong, you have to give it respect. Returning to the down specials, though, while I feel that down 3 being used as an anti-air move is questionable, I think that down B 3 is an excellent aerial attack. If you're moving forward in the air towards your opponent while facing them, down special 2 and 3 are probably your best and only options, outside of a side B or Giant Punch. I like the big power of down 2, but the tiny hitbox is a tad off-putting while on the ground. Down 1 while airborn has got to be the worst, but it's got such a stupidly huge hitbox on the ground, and even hits behind you. It's also decently powerful, and pops the opponent in the air, where DK likes to kill or combo them, ideally... if the lag on down 1 wasn't so bad, I guess. It's a big disjointed hitbox that can kill, though, so I find it very useful.

So, baseline, what are the must-have sets?

1131
1231
1331

Those, I think, we all could agree on no matter what. Deciding what to do with the neutral and down specials is where I think most people will have trouble agreeing. But for your average stage with platforms, those three setups have got to be the most useful for general utility.

Neutral 3 and Up 1 are likely to be useful on FD stages. That much is certain. However, what Headbutt will you use?

3111
3211
3311

That puts me at 6 picks so far, and I haven't even addressed the down specials... None of the Headbutts are especially great at combating projectile spam/camping, but the armor on side 3, I feel, is still very useful.

Since down 2 and 3 are best used as a replacement forward air (IMO), and since you're reserving two open spots for people to bring their own setups, I feel that the people who enjoy down special 2 and 3 ought to set up their own sets. Right now, I don't think they're too popular in the (admittedly tiny and young) DK metagame to warrant an early cemented spot.

I don't feel like neutral 1 is all that feasible on FD stages. When are you going to make time to charge it? At least with platforms, you can run away at times. I don't see much point to neutral 2, but it could easily be used instead of neutral 3 on flat stages. That's my reasoning.

 

[zephyrnereus]

*Sigh* The more of these I put on reddit, the shorter these get.

"I like 3131.

Storm Punch charges faster than normal punch, does alright damage, and the windbox can gimp some recoveries.

Normal headbutt can be used for quick run off stage spikes, but I sometimes like to change it up with Jumping Headbutt (2).

Kong Cyclone so good. No landing lag if you recover properly, and the suction can mess your opponent's movements up.

I usually use normal hand slap because I like the range, haven't tried much of the other two." - 1 upvote

3131? more like WHAMU:

but in all seriousness, I personally use 3331 for casual play, but I could go with 3131 or 1131 for more serious matches.

the shenanigans DK can do with up-B 3... it's just too much. it makes the match silly and it gives you both stage control and mental control over your opponent, literally throwing them off their game. to add insult to injury, neutral-B 3 can sometimes work with up-B 3 if they are flung offstage.

 

[Dre89]

B1 is the best punch because you need the early KO power. You don't wind it up in one go, you sneak in winds throughout the stock. Storm punch gimps are too situational and DK is good at gimping anyway due to bair and spike threat.

Headbutt is preference at the moment. Jumping headbutt can ledgesnap and gives mobility options. It's possible to avoid some attacks and counter with the headbutt. The easiest place to do this is when you're on a platform and the enemy tries to poke you from underneath. I haven't played around with stubborn headbutt yet but it might have potential as DK can afford to trade due to his weight.

Upb3 is way too good to pass up even on stages like FD. It's just so good in pretty much any situation that involves aerial combat. Juggling, aerial KOs, avoiding juggles, and edeguarding to name a few. The stuff you can do with platforms is nuts. I haven't tested this yet, but aerial upb3 may be our best follow up to a low percent headbutt. The hitbox is so big that we may be able to catch them in the cyclone as they emerge from the ground.

I haven't played around the with the downbs yet, but I'm still favouring 1 atm. Downbs niche was always the constant hitbox and the enormous range, so 2 and 3 will have to have something special to justify the range drop.

1131 will end up being the standard set, with people possibly tinkering with side and/or downb.

 

[Aninymouse]

B1 is the best punch because you need the early KO power. You don't wind it up in one go, you sneak in winds throughout the stock. Storm punch gimps are too situational and DK is good at gimping anyway due to bair and spike threat.

Headbutt is preference at the moment. Jumping headbutt can ledgesnap and gives mobility options. It's possible to avoid some attacks and counter with the headbutt. The easiest place to do this is when you're on a platform and the enemy tries to poke you from underneath. I haven't played around with stubborn headbutt yet but it might have potential as DK can afford to trade due to his weight.

Upb3 is way too good to pass up even on stages like FD. It's just so good in pretty much any situation that involves aerial combat. Juggling, aerial KOs, avoiding juggles, and edeguarding to name a few. The stuff you can do with platforms is nuts. I haven't tested this yet, but aerial upb3 may be our best follow up to a low percent headbutt. The hitbox is so big that we may be able to catch them in the cyclone as they emerge from the ground.

I haven't played around the with the downbs yet, but I'm still favouring 1 atm. Downbs niche was always the constant hitbox and the enormous range, so 2 and 3 will have to have something special to justify the range drop.

1131 will end up being the standard set, with people possibly tinkering with side and/or downb.

I haven't seriously used the custom down Bs either, but their main use, to me, seems to be in the air. This is the exact opposite of down B 1, which is interesting... but it definitely changes how DK plays quite a bit. For that reason, I'm not sure they're ever going to be popular unless a special combo/technique is discovered for them.

I agree that Giant Punch is the best punch. While DK isn't short on ways to kill opponents that are recovering, I think it's the massive RANGE on the neutral 3 windbox that is the most attractive. It seems to be comparable to the Gust Bellows item, except the wind on it is maybe a tad weaker. Still, we all know how powerful the Gust Bellows is if you've played any For Fun matches. The only thing that drives me nuts with intermittently charging Giant Punch throughout the stock is that each time you stop, it rolls you back a wind-up. I really feel like this nearly crushes my desire to use it, in most matches. It does have great range, speed, and power, though, once you finally wind it up. It's still not exactly reliable, either... and if you miss, good luck winding it up again.

 

[Dre89]

If it's true that stubborn headbutt gets SA on frame 1 onwards, I wonder how legit it would be as a landing tool. The idea being that you simply SA through their attack in an attempt to land and return to neutral.

 

[Smog Frog]

stubborn headbutt is like rock smash but it buries instead of sends rock shards all over the stage. and if you've played a good zard on for glory, you know how useful rock smash is. i think the same can be applied to stubborn headbutt, because it lets you live to stupid amounts. or at least, that's how i've been using it.

 

[Dre89]

stubborn headbutt is like rock smash but it buries instead of sends rock shards all over the stage. and if you've played a good zard on for glory, you know how useful rock smash is. i think the same can be applied to stubborn headbutt, because it lets you live to stupid amounts. or at least, that's how i've been using it.

It's not really that similar because hitting someone with the boulder as it comes out combos into the smash component, which makes it far easier to land. You can't land a stubborn headbutt unless they commit to an attack and you SA through it. Hopefully you bury them, or better yet they're forced to shield at the last second and you pop their shield.

Aside from landing and punishing commitments I think it could be good at the ledge too. If you read a get up attack, regular get up or a roll you might be able to force their shield.

 

[SAHunterMech]

*Sigh* The more of these I put on reddit, the shorter these get.

"I like 3131.

Storm Punch charges faster than normal punch, does alright damage, and the windbox can gimp some recoveries.

Normal headbutt can be used for quick run off stage spikes, but I sometimes like to change it up with Jumping Headbutt (2).

Kong Cyclone so good. No landing lag if you recover properly, and the suction can mess your opponent's movements up.

I usually use normal hand slap because I like the range, haven't tried much of the other two." - 1 upvote

HYESZ! Couldn't agree more. Storm Punch just seems better than Giant Punch to me, because of the faster charging and the usage outside of point blank range. It really kind of feeds itself, you charge it, blow someone away (offstage or onstage), and you can charge again in the down time. Also, it's true that the wind gimp is situational, but you can use this to your advantage: Wind Gimping makes opponents recover low. When they recover low, they're just setting themselves up to get the crap spiked out of them!

What's more, if you use the windbox while the opponent is moving away from you, the momentum stacks and you can KO them outright. It's even decently strong at point blank to boot!

In tandem with Kong Cyclone, DK becomes the master of wind! Cyclone is a really safe recovery, even becoming a great approach tool, too. Using it to pick up kills when you can't get smashes to connect is really helpful, and it's just so much fun.

Meanwhile, Default Headbutt + Default Slap = IMMENSE shield pressure! DK NEEDS the range of Hand Slap, the others just don't fill that void and it really hurts him. He needs something to get people backing off, scared to approach. The damage racks up too now, really really fast, so the knockback nerfs are permissible. Hell, default slap SPIKES now, which is absurd.

Did I mention that Up-B AND Down-B are B-Reversible? Let the craziness commence!

 

[itsaxelol]

i think everything dk has sucks, its just situational, and the go-to normal DK with customs on is everything default and kong tornado up b

Edit just played with storm punch a week ago. Definitely can be useful

 

[SAHunterMech]

I've... been experimenting more this past week, and I've changed my moveset a little: 3233.

Default and Focused slap are definitely situational, especially since as soon as you start using them, people get jump-happy (Focused Slap's saving grace is the hard hitting aerial version). But hot slap seems to be a solid move that's more flexible. It does 16% grounded, launches at a better trajectory (horizontal), and has a deceptively big hitbox, specifically in height. Being able to shrug off jumpers is just amazing, and don't get me started about using it as a ledgeguard....

The aerial version also has massively sized hitboxes, and is good for gimping, especially helpful since DK didn't need another spike (Default Aerial Slap), or another aerial kill move (Aerial Focused Slap). All you have to do to overcome people trying to get behind you to avoid getting slapped is B-Reverse the move.

Meanwhile, Jumping headbutt trades off offstage spikes for turning DK into friggin' Bowser onstage, giving him a way to get back to the ground from being juggled, while still giving immense shield pressure.

 

[Kantolin]

I... must assume you guys are all getting a lot more oompf out of giant punch than I am.

I used to love it for its ability to power through attacks in previous games, but in this game it doesn't have the armour until you're already punching, and thus I often get smacked out of it and don't find a lot of situations where it's particularly helpful. This results in a lot of danger you're putting yourself in just to chance the blasted thing.

Summarily, I like using the lightning punch. Using the giant punch results in a lot of situations where I take damage or are put in a disadvantageous position due to the need to wind up... while using the lightning punch removes that while still giving me 'another forward smash but usable in the air'. Still violently kills people, too, and since it's so quick to charge it's not a big deal if you whiff/block/etc with it (Whereas I'm very hesitant to spend my precious fully wound giant punch).

(I then love kong cyclone for the reasons everyone has mentioned, love default slap for countering rolls, and haven't experimented much with the alternate headbutts, but those are all things I haven't really played with too much.)

 

[MegaBlaster1234]

1132
Kong Cyclone is possibly the greatest custom they could have given DK.
At first I was reluctant to use Focused Slap because of its poor range and loss of being able to punish rolls like Regular slap, but the more I used it the more I realized how devastating it can be. DK is all about reads and if you read a bad roll or position yourself for a whiff punish you can kill as early as 80%! Not to mention how rage can improve its kill potential, and you can kill even earlier on platforms! It also double as a slightly less laggy F-air, and since it hits twice you can punish air dodges too!

 

[FS Fantom]

What are the SA properties on Cyclone? I'm able to use the Up B1 SA pretty efficiently, so I'm curious if that would translate over to Cyclone?

Also, do we know if Stubborn Headbutt buries for as long and/or does as much if not more Shield damage vs Side B 1?

 

[MegaBlaster1234]

What are the SA properties on Cyclone? I'm able to use the Up B1 SA pretty efficiently, so I'm curious if that would translate over to Cyclone?

Also, do we know if Stubborn Headbutt buries for as long and/or does as much if not more Shield damage vs Side B 1?

Cyclone's super armor activates really fast and it seems the armor is very strong. I took an aerial Wizard Kick at 120% and didn't flinch.
Stubborn Headbutt seems to just provide more super armor. People can still mash out of being buried just as quickly as regular headbutt and the shield damage is the same as far as I can tell after testing, but the startup is so slow that catching someone holding shield instead of dodging is unlikely.

 

[Brickbox]

What are the SA properties on Cyclone? I'm able to use the Up B1 SA pretty efficiently, so I'm curious if that would translate over to Cyclone?

Also, do we know if Stubborn Headbutt buries for as long and/or does as much if not more Shield damage vs Side B 1?

Frame data thread should contain everything you are looking for when it comes to finding when move have special properties such as SA. http://smashboards.com/threads/dk-frame-data-smash-4-edition.381083/

 

[Ultima 3]

Neutral B
Giant Punch: Takes 3 seconds to charge. Can hold charge. Charge reset if hit while charging. Does 10-28%. KO move. Near the edge 70%, in the centre 80%. In the air does 6-25%. Goes into free fall after use in the air. KO move. Near the edge 90%, in the centre 110%.
Lightning Punch: Takes 1 second to charge. Can hold charge. Charge reset if hit while charging. Does 12-15%. KO move. Near the edge 110%, in the centre 130%. In the air does 6-13%. Goes into free fall after use in the air. KO move. Near the edge 140%, in the centre 170%.
Storm Punch: Takes 2 seconds to charge. Can hold charge. Charge reset if hit while charging. Does 8-18%. Has windbox. Windbox has pushback effect. Longer the charge, stronger the pushback effect. KO move. Near the edge 100%, in the centre 120%. In the air does 6-14%. Goes into free fall after use in the air. KO move. Near the edge 135%, in the centre 160%.

Side B
Headbutt: Does 10%. Buries grounded opponents. Higher the % of oppoenets longer they are buried. Massive shield damage. Does 8% non-direct hit. Spikes aerial enemies at 120%. KO move. In the air, Spike.
Jumping Headbutt: Jumps up then descends rapidly. Does 10%. Buries grounded opponents. Higher the % of oppoenets longer they are buried. Massive shield damage. Does 5% to aerial opponents. KO move. In the air 210%.
Stubborn Headbutt: Does 13%. Buries grounded opponents. Higher the % of oppoenets longer they are buried. Slow to hit. Has super armour. Massive shield damage. Does 9% non-direct hit. Spikes aerial enemies at 90%. KO move. In the air, Spike.

Up B
Spinning Kong: Spins on the ground. Can move forward or backwards whilst spinning. Hits a maximum of 7 times. 1st hit does 7%. 2nd-6th hit does 1%. Final hit does 4%. Maximum 17%. KO move. Initial hit: Near the edge 180%, in the centre 230%. Final hit: Near the edge 150%, in the centre 190%. Spins upwards when used in the air. Can move both left and right. In the air hits a maximum of 8 times. 1st hit does 10%. 2nd-5th hit does 4-5%. 6th-8th hit does 2%. Maximum 36%. KO move. Near the edge 190%, in the centre 230%.
Chopper Kong: Does no damage. Spins upwards into the air. Only goes straight up.
Kong Cyclone: Spins on the ground. Can move forward or backwards whilst spinning. Hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 4%. Final hit does 15%. Maximum 19%. Has windbox. Windbox has vacuum effect. KO move at 140%. Spins upwards when used in the air. Doesn't go very high in the high. Can move both left and right. Has a lot of horizontal movement. In the air hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 3%. Final hit does 12%. Maximum 15%. KO move at 140.

Down B
Hand Slap: Creates a shockwave on both sides. Repeatedly press B to continue. Does 14% to grounded enemies. In the air hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 5%. Final hit does 6%. Maximum 11%. Final hit spikes at 51%. KO move. In the air, Spike.
Focused Slap: Electric hit directly in front. Repeatedly press B to continue. Hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 7%. Final hit does 14%. Maximum 21%. 1st hit stuns. Has high knockback. KO move 83%. In the air hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 7%. Final hit does 12%. Maximum 19%. KO move. Near the edge 130%, in the centre 150%.
Hot Slap: Creates fire pillars in front. Repeatedly press B to continue. Hits a maximum of 2 times. 1st hit does 4%. Final hit does 12%. Maximum 16%. Flame pillars do 12%. KO move. Near the edge 120%, in the centre 150%. In the air hits a maximum of 2 times. Both hits do 5%. KO move. Near the edge 250%, in the centre Sudden Death KO move.

Now before I say anything, why the heck is he Elemental Kong?
He's got nearly all the elements in his moves.
He's just missing darkness and ice!

Anyway.
If you get the bury from a Headbutt, focused slap is a great punish and a great KO move. Otherwise the range from Hand Slap is great as Focused Slap is, as it says, focused, so not a large hitbox. Hot Slap is Anti-air.

Kong Cyclone for everything. One of the best customs in the game by far, next to Gust Cape.

Headbutt, or Stubborn Headbutt for the super armour to shrug off hits. However if you actually manage a hit on someone with it, I'd be rather surprised. Jumping Headutt I'd say is, again, anti-air.

Finally his punch moves are all pretty viable.
Strong punch, Quick punch, or Gimping punch.
I'm personally a fan of Storm Punch (WHAMU!!)

As such:

1131
1332
3131
3132
2233 (anti-air)

 

[Big O]

I think that things are trending towards getting rid of the 2222 and 3333 slots for potential customs enabled tourneys like EVO 2015. The last 2 slots which are reserved for imported sets might also be changed into placeholder slots instead, which means that while they will be overwritten if necessary, they will be set to a usable build by default. Given that this opens up at least 2 more slots for us and that a few months have passed since the start of this project, what would you guys like to see change?

These are his current sets:

1131
1133
1231
1331
2131
3131

So far, the only real complaint I've seen is the lack of a Focused Slap set. With 2-4 extra slots, that will probably be fixed.

When I had my last session of customs matches with a friend, I stumbled upon the best anti-Rosa set: (1/2)233. Hot Slap and Jumping Headbutt are immensely useful tools in the MU. Both always swat Luma away with ease and deal with situations DK struggles with (Rosa's air game and juggle traps). I didn't try 2233 because he didn't have Lightning Punch unlocked, but I can imagine that having access to a semi-spammable safe on block poke that kills Luma would be cool. This combination skewed the MU a lot into my favor.

 

[Twin Rhapsody]

I find it very impressive that 7/8 of DK's Customs are playable and have merits. I too agree there needs to be a couple of Focused Slap setups. I like 2132 as a well rounded set.

 

[Jmex]

Would it make sense for us DK players to play with each other using these specific pre-determined sets to get a better understanding of them while actually using them? This should help speed up the process of deciding on what sets to use for Evo.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Yeah, we're definitely going to want to add 1132 to DK's list with the extra space (for EVO we're filling all 10 slots); a solid Focused Slap set was the main thing DK was missing. I feel like I can otherwise trust team DK to fill out the rest of these slots in a responsible way that should make the DK crew happy collectively.

 

[DaRkJaWs]

I know this thread is made to talk about the movesets that should be put in the slots, but as far as discussion of the moves are concerned.....I'm actually surprised more people haven't talked about his jumping headbutt...to me I would think DK has the most issues while he is in the air getting juggled, and if he could simply forward b and come down to the stage immediately, and even use it for reads and such, I really don't understand why this hasn't been talked about more...and I'm talking hypothetically because I've only played with customs once but just thinking about jumping headbutt is making me smile inside.

also, it seems to me that although you have greater stage control with kong cyclone, and can make quick horizontal recoveries, the slightly lowered vertical recovery can make this matchup dependent for sure. As DK I personally like to go off the stage a lot more than probably anyone else (almost anywhere off stage) and that slighly lowered vertical recovery can be a deal breaker.

Would it make sense for us DK players to play with each other using these specific pre-determined sets to get a better understanding of them while actually using them? This should help speed up the process of deciding on what sets to use for Evo.

Yes it would...we need to play vs. each other with other characters to get a good idea of which moves work better. Will probably take all of us as a community to figure it out.

 

[Big O]

Would it make sense for us DK players to play with each other using these specific pre-determined sets to get a better understanding of them while actually using them? This should help speed up the process of deciding on what sets to use for Evo.

That would actually be a really good idea. Would you mind if I add your NNID to the sparring thread?

So far the notable sets that should be added imo are 1132 and 1233.

I think we can replace 2131 with 2233 because Lightning Punch has synergy with Jumping Headbutt and Hot Slap in dealing with in your face pressure characters. Against characters that are aggressive and keep you from charging the punch in the first place, I feel this combination is probably more useful. It also doubles as a really good anti-Rosa set.

 

[Raijinken]

Lightning Punch definitely could use some slots just because it charges so quickly. It may also be worth including one set with default UpB (maybe 2211 or something of that sort). Despite Cyclone's aerial potential, it's very lacking when used on the ground, and some players prefer having that ground presence given DK's default strong aerial game.

 

[Jmex]

That would actually be a really good idea. Would you mind if I add your NNID to the sparring thread?

So far the notable sets that should be added imo are 1132 and 1233.

I think we can replace 2131 with 2233 because Lightning Punch has synergy with Jumping Headbutt and Hot Slap in dealing with in your face pressure characters. Against characters that are aggressive and keep you from charging the punch in the first place, I feel this combination is probably more useful. It also doubles as a really good anti-Rosa set.

Yeah feel free to add me. I plan on unlocking all of the custom moves i still dont have for DK tonight. I'll be up to playing a few matches tomorrow or sometime this week with anyone that would like to spar/test things out.

 

[Alphamew17]

I personally enjoy using 3333. The Storm Punch works well for a safe ledge game, and it still does a decent amount of damage if it connects. Hot Slap can cover enemies coming in from above, and has horizontal knockback, keeping them away. The heavy side b works well if they start a jab, or if you are coming in from above and need a (safe) option for landing. And finally, the dong cyclone. The range is great, it has reasonable horizontal recovery, and I personally love this move. In conclusion,

3333

 

[Lunaticker]

I'm unsure why people like Kong Cyclone so much. The main draw of Donkey's regular up special for me is the super armor, and Kong Cyclone's armor lasts for less time, meaning I can't use it to get through as many attacks. I also find that either the first or last hit of grounded Kong Cyclone just straight up misses way more. The only benefit I can see to it is the slightly expanded ground range, and better aerial utility, but other than that I prefer the normal option. I really think there should be at least 1 set with regular up b.

Is there some great use for this move I'm missing out on? I really don't get why everyone thinks it's a straight upgrade.

 

[Jmex]

I'm unsure why people like Kong Cyclone so much. The main draw of Donkey's regular up special for me is the super armor, and Kong Cyclone's armor lasts for less time, meaning I can't use it to get through as many attacks. I also find that either the first or last hit of grounded Kong Cyclone just straight up miss way more. The only benefit I can see to it is the slightly expanded ground range, and better aerial utility, but other than that I prefer the normal option. I really think there should be at least 1 set with regular up b.

Is there some great use for this move I'm missing out on? I really don't get why everyone thinks it's a straight upgrade.

My understanding is that while yes it's not as good used on the ground as the normal up b it's aireal use is so good it trumps the overall usefulness of the normal one. You're invincible during the entire up b in the air, it can kill, and it has wind properties.

Side note. I've been unlocking DK's special moves and OMG. You can kill bowser from the center of FD while hes grounded with focused slap at around 80. Sure, DK's punch kills a bit earlier, but adding usefulness to DK's side b other than shield pressure seems like a huge thing that we shouldn't overlook.

 

[Alphamew17]

I've used the Kong cyclone as a gimp before, they used their recovery move and I took them away from the edge with the suction from the cyclone, then recovered since it seems to have more vertical movement that the default

 

[Jmex]

I plan on testing a few things out before i attend a custom tournament this sun. Would anyone be down to spar tomorrow or sat night? Probably late in the evening?

 

[Alphamew17]

Sho thang, I'd love to do DK mirror matches, they're so fun

 

[PhantomTriforce]

My favorite sets are 3333 and 3331.

 

[DaRkJaWs]

Damn, using dks throws to stage spike combined with chopper kong has so much potential it's crazy. I can kill a sheik from 0 to death with one throw against the stage on battlefield and a very easily done footstool. I finally decided to practice the cargo throws against the stage and combined with chopper kong there is so much potential given the map and character.