One stage tournaments

[hichez50]

I'm not sure whether this should go in the meta game discussion or the Rule set discussion, but I will post it here anyway considering this will change metagame.

Recently, I have found an interest in watching Tennis. I am certainly enjoying watching Wimbledon right now. While watching today I thought to myself what if smash tournaments only used one stage. Tennis players don't get to counter pick different courts when they lose a set, the same can be said with traditional fighting games. For those who don't know Tennis has a 5 different court types ranging from grass to indoor.

I suspect the first argument will be well that system will favor some characters over others. This is true. Is there a problem with that? We already know we are playing an unbalanced game and the best players will still win as they will have to adapt to there tournament by sifting playing styles or even playing other characters, which will still be optional. In tennis some player just don't do well on certain courts and it isn't because the game isn't competitive enough. There are faults with there play styles on that court.

I don't expect the the smash community to implement necessarily, but I would defiantly like to hear the opinions of other players whether or not this would even be viable? Would we only use this type of play on conservative stages? Will this create even more regional division? IMO i think this would be an interesting idea. Sadly we are plagued with the T.O's wanting attendance, which is a legitimate concern.

 

[Bobwithlobsters]

It depends for me greatly on how the whole sets would go. Is one stage picked for the whole tourney? Or do we do full stage list stage strike for each set of matches plaid? I could see going one stage strike to determine the stage for all the games in a set. picking one stage for the whole tourney would heavily skew the tier list depending on what stage you pick. I like the idea of the greater focus on character selection but don't think I would support this because I think stage diversity is one of the best things about this game.

 

[hichez50]

1 stage for the entire tournament

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Sounds incredibly boring and terrible

Can you think of any good reason to make the change?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I could only see this being a good idea if we didn't already have a more balanced counterpick system in place. People like the game to be as diverse as possible to keep things interesting. While tennis may not have counterpicks, you may also notice that tennis is boring as ****.

One stage isn't just boring, it's unbalanced. Now you can say "So what?" all you want, but as long as a more balanced alternative exists, then that'll be the system people want to use. Stage striking and counterpicking aren't that difficult.

Even the most conservative stagelists have more than one stage. If you feel the need to limit the counterpick system, just run Japanese rules. It's all the rage these days.

 

[Vinylic.]

One Stage tournaments is a bad idea. And not even fun at all.

It even speaks for itself on why it is bad.

 

[hichez50]

@ private joker brown

If tennis was so boring to the masses why does it have so much more following than brawl. One stage tournament would be better than Jp stagelist. If you are going to have multiple stages be more flexible with the idea.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Tennis has a much larger following than Brawl because it is much older (which means that it has become ingrained in culture and family tradition), more accessible and has a much more positive stigma due to its association with good health.

Though, I could be wrong. Maybe Joe Generic Guy watches the tennis every day and exclaims "Boy, I love the way they only play on one court, its the only reason I tune in!"

----------

I'm not sure if you're a tennis player or not, but just a little bit of info: When I used to play my coach had a sand/fake grass court - but when I played in competitions or practiced at my club it was a bitumen. After playing on the asphalt for a while, it was a great change to play on the sand court and have to change my technique.

 

[Flayl]

Why are we comparing spectating tennis to playing a videogame

 

[hichez50]

Well we need people to spectate.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Playing every single match on smashville (or whatever stage you had in mind) is not going to draw more spectators.

 

[hichez50]

What will? What we have been doing doesn't seems to be flourishing?

 

[Vinylic.]

The same will apply to any stage.

Spectators draw in more either by:
Their own will
Wanting to see a good match (like ally vs m2k or something)
Or something great is happening in a match (Comeback, Flashy moves and attacks)

I'm only a rook in the competitive scene, so this is all I can think of.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Hichez: Stop trying to come up with statements to back your claim, and instead base your claim on statements.

...Unless you seriously thought to yourself "Yes, the reason we should have one-stage-tournies is because more people will want to watch", rather than "Oh, people disagree with me, better come up with more reasons - hopefully one of them will stick!"

If its the latter, I want you to seriously consider this post rather than just responding defensively straight away. Its the reason that 99% of the people on this board are stubborn.

 

[Luigi player]

Well it could be interesting. What it would def help is reducing time at tourneys since players wont need to strike and cp stages anymore... Could be boring though.

 

[hichez50]

Hichez: Stop trying to come up with statements to back your claim, and instead base your claim on statements.

Fair enough. Is providing more statements innately bad? I don't think so. I am really just trying to provoke thought. I was trying to get at the point that one individual opinion(i.e you think it would be boring) is justification enough to not like some that has never been attempted in any capacity.

I don't think that brawl tournaments run too long, because of people taking to long to counter-pick. Top level and mid level players already know there options generally by the time the game is ending.

This will really solidify metagames on certain stages though. People will be encouraged to exploit every trick and gimmick on stages. Let say that a T.O hosts a FD legal tournament. Straight away it would The tournament would favor characters that would have projectiles, chain grabs. locks, and characters that generally have poor platform control. Lets take a character like MK to this tournament. He will be in a more nerfed position that he is normally is. MK has a tough time dealing with projectiles and not having platforms doesn't really help him. On the other end of the spectrum you have DDD and diddy who will have a more presence at the tournaments since the stage favors there cookie cutter playstyles. With Diddy tough the other player has an opportunity to abuse banners just like diddy does meaning that players will have to improve there technique in order to compete.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I'd be against this and ride an argument along the lines of its not what your local community would want.

As an analogy, the MK ban in some regions seems like its entirely based on a majority simply preferring to want to play without MK. Talking with a few people in my region and others, they honestly do not care at all about what happens with MK situation, but a number tell me they think it would be more fun without him.

I think this single stage attempt would be something similar. Playing on a single stage match after match is not enjoyable to many, myself included. In the end, people would prefer to have a variety of stages to play on.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

People don't watch Brawl streams because

A) They aren't very well advertised most of the time. Even when people know a big tourney is coming up, they probably won't know the dates, times, location, or how to find the stream unless they were planning to attend that event, thus they already did the research necessary to even find the stream.

B) Everybody knows that the stream is being recorded. Why make time in your schedule to watch a laggy livestream? You gotta sit through a bunch of matches that are decent, but you heard so-and-so was at this tourney and you really only wanted to watch them play. Most people watch the good matches on Youtube after they're uploaded.

C) Our community isn't THAT huge. I mean, seriously, how many really active (or even semi active) smashers are there? (I'm actually kinda curious about the answer to this) My guess is something just under 1,000? Factor in those other 2 points, and you get events as ****ing huge as Apex still only having a few hundred veiwers.

 

[TreK]

D) Some people live in another continent and have to watch streams at 3 am if they wanna watch them.

 

[MR. K]

problem with this idea;

certain characters will heavily dominate on one stage.

take for instance if the stage was Final destination.

Helloooooooooooo Ice climbers, you'll be seeing them a LOT more, as you basically are giving them their best stage the entire tournament.

the thing you don't seem to realize is this is basically giving a huge unfair advantage to some characters while completely and unfairly nerfing others.

one of the reasons the counterpick system is in place is to keep something like this from happening.

 

[sunshade]

Tennis might not have stage advantage to utilize when "counterpicking" but they do alternate the serve (which is a major advantage). To win in tennis you must beat the opponent on their serve. In regards to stages tennis has more in common with multistage smash than a solo stage smash.

 

[Raziek]

Would probably just kill myself if I had to play this game on one stage only.

(This is not to say I hate 1-stage games, I play anime fighters as well. I'd just hate to HAVE to play on only one with 15+ other viable stage choices in the game.)

And yeah, this is of course blatantly unfair, unbalanced, and simply a poor idea all around.

I'd bite if it was Norfair every game.

 

[Claire Diviner]

One has to remember that every character has glaringly bad MUs against certain characters on certain stages. While some can argue that's what counterpicking characters are for, and I can understand that argument, it does no favor to the person who uses just that one character and happens to not have a solid secondary. Boredom seems to be factor too, but I also feel a lack of balance will also be an issue.

That said, if I must choose one stage to go with for a one stage-only tournament, I guess I'd go with either Battlefield or Smashville, but that's just what comes to mind.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

It would be too different from SF if it was stuff on one stage, since stages in those kind of games are irrelevant for the most part.

But I agree that is can bore people when stage diversity is something smash has that can attract people.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'd bite if it was Norfair every game.

This is why I love you. Ban MK, bring back Norfair. Best game ever.

 

[Seagull Joe]

No...Just no to this topic.