pikachu is not a counter

[PKboy89]

Ok, don't harass me or anything cause I am not a snake pro, my mains are Lucas and Diddy. But anyway, I been reading some forums and some people say that pikachu is snake's counter. I don't really think so. I play a decent snake and after messing around with my friend's pikachu with other characters, its not that pikachu is really a counter, but everyone has the same problems with pikachu...

Pikachu's down smash is extremely fast...perhaps the fastest in the game, even when I play metaknight it comes out faster then his attacks(Down smash the very least) Its not that its extremely effective against snake, but against everybody, its just so fast...it even looks like pikachu has very small start up lag with this move but he really doesn't, its instant. This move works really well against everybody...

Pikachu being a camper and ledgeguarder...well, thats what pikachu does, and most of the characters have the same problem...his forward smash at the ledge is great, powerful, and deadly, but as a snake, you shouldn't even be using your up b recovery near the edge in the first place...since any character can just grab you and watch you fall to your death (You can c4 recover, but still...you shouldn't be setting yourself up for a smash attack and just more damage) Snake's up b recovery already says "I can't do anything till I let go, come attack me" so pikachu's thunder is effective...but any character can jump at snake and just attack...you can dodge and stuff...so you can avoid the thunder as well...

Pikachu's aerials...well, any character can pretty much out aerial snake...while snake's aerials are extremely strong and have high priority...most of the other characters have faster and more effective aerials, and snake already isn't very mobile in the air...

What I'm trying to say is the problems snake has with pikachu are pretty much the problems he has with everybody, and they aren't that bad...if anything...snake can toss pikachu around like a rag doll, as he can do with any other character...and all the problems snake has pikachu, all the other characters have with him as well...I fought pikachu with several other characters and I had the same exact problems pretty much...I didn't win snake, but I am not amazing with him, I did win with Lucas and Meta Knight though...

These are just my thoughts but tell me yours. Agree or disagree? Just don't attack me cause I am not a snake pro, but this is just what I think...

 

[napZzz]

failed. pika is like, super effective on snake compared to others even with the same tactics

 

[Pabs]

I don't even play snake or pikachu, but based on your description, pikachu sounds like a snake counter to me. Can edgeguard snake well, has a better aerial game, and his dsmash gives snake problems (again, based on what you said)? If that isn't a counter I don't know what is!

 

[PKboy89]

I don't even play snake or pikachu, but based on your description, pikachu sounds like a snake counter to me. Can edgeguard snake well, has a better aerial game, and his dsmash gives snake problems (again, based on what you said)? If that isn't a counter I don't know what is!

His dsmash gives everyone problems, pretty much any character can edgeguard snake, and most characters already have better air game.

 

[Aggression]

The earthbounders, yoshi(yes yoshi), kirby, and pikachu seem to be some of the only good snake counters that I've come across.

 

[Depressed Man]

Toon Link (at least when my cousin plays him) does pretty well too.

 

[Dr. Hyde]

PKboy makes some fair remarks that are semi accurate. I however have Olimar for this match.

It's not that Pikachu is a counter but its annoying, small body, and not that easy to deal with when he's in the air.

basically with Snake I feel that you have to be really patient and use the Up Tilt for kills and stay in the center of the stage, not easy but doable I think.

 

[King Kuma]

I disagree. Yes pikachu is a problem for everyone, but with snake it's entirely a different story; his up-b and neutral-b being the most annoying edge hog ever. He's small and can manuever around Snakes projectiles like they're pieces of candy being tossed at him. His recovery rate is a lot faster compared to snakes and ariels dominate in general. So No. Pikachu is definitly a counter and a good one at it when compared to Snake. Perhaps you should get someone who uses Pika as a main and try playing them again. It's a huge difference.

 

[PKboy89]

I disagree. Yes pikachu is a problem for everyone, but with snake it's entirely a different story; his up-b and neutral-b being the most annoying edge hog ever. He's small and can manuever around Snakes projectiles like they're pieces of candy being tossed at him. His recovery rate is a lot faster compared to snakes and ariels dominate in general. So No. Pikachu is definitly a counter and a good one at it when compared to Snake. Perhaps you should get someone who uses Pika as a main and try playing them again. It's a huge difference.

My friend does main pikachu...and I obviously lost to him as I stated before...I'll admit that pikachu is much more effective against me when I try snake, but its not like pikachu just absolutely dominate over snake, I had the same problems when I used my mains, I won but still...

But yea, I'm not a snake pro or anything, and you are right, the problems everyone else has with pikachu are even a lot more annoying and effective against Snake. When I did play as Snake though, I had a lot more stage control then I did with my other characters, but thats snake's specialty.

 

[King Kuma]

My friend does main pikachu...and I obviously lost to him as I stated before...I'll admit that pikachu is much more effective against me when I try snake, but its not like pikachu just absolutely dominate over snake, I had the same problems when I used my mains, I won but still...

But yea, I'm not a snake pro or anything, and you are right, the problems everyone else has with pikachu are even a lot more annoying and effective against Snake. When I did play as Snake though, I had a lot more stage control then I did with my other characters, but thats snake's specialty.

Yeah. It's different when you find yourself having to play a completely different Snake when it's again Pikachu. At least for me it is. I'm a lot more defensive and careful with what moves I throw at him. Also I'm always making sure I never up-b over pika even though I sometimes forget. It's just that there's just a completely different set of tactics that go against Pika in a sense that I really feel like I'm not playing Snake to his full potential as I usually do with other characters. It's like I have to play chicken and hope my opponent is aggressive in order to win.

 

[PKboy89]

Yeah. It's different when you find yourself having to play a completely different Snake when it's again Pikachu. At least for me it is. I'm a lot more defensive and careful with what moves I throw at him. Also I'm always making sure I never up-b over pika even though I sometimes forget. It's just that there's just a completely different set of tactics that go against Pika in a sense that I really feel like I'm not playing Snake to his full potential as I usually do with other characters. It's like I have to play chicken and hope my opponent is aggressive in order to win.

Yea, I'm ********, pikachu is defiantly a snake counter, the fact that you have to play a completely different Snake from all the characters would defiantly make this little mouse his counter >.<

 

[edde]

pika just pwns snake... fail... mayber yure nto a snake pro, but maybe also your friend is not a pika pro (or at least a smart pika, and a smart pika will spam you to death)

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Not to mention the chain throw...

 

[∫unk]

Or Thunder when Snake is recovering...

 

[A2ZOMG]

Pikachu outcamps Snake and ledgeguards him brutally. He counters Snake. MOST characters can deal with Pikachu's spam and ledgeguarding much more effectively than Snake.

Snake can't autograb the ledge, so that's why he gets ledgeguarded horribly by Thunder. His projectile spam takes setup and besides the Nikita gets destroyed by Pikachu's spam if I recall, which hugs the ground and requires no setup.

I believe I've said at Brawl Central that the rat beats the Snake a while ago lol.

This is a good example of why Pikachu counters Snake. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASQXSwIVbmc&feature=related

 

[iankobe]

In a way, Pikachu is a counter, but in a way he isn't.

Pikachu beats Snake in EVERY aspect of the matchup except power.

I personally play a great Pika and for me personally, its easy to play Snake and at the same time, its hard. It really depends on how good the Snake is.

I played friendlies with Alex (DSF) and I can say that he's better than me by far. But our matches were always REALLY close. I mean real close. Everytime we play we would be down with last stock, 200+ damage.

SO i mean....yes Pikachu does counter Snake, but Snake can overcome it since Snake can KO Pikachu pretty easily if the Pikachu doesn't play smart enough.

 

[plasmid]

I thought one of the main reasons Pika was a good counter was the chaingrab, and yet you have somehow left that out of your post... Either way as much as other chars have the same problems, Snake is worse at dealing with them.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Pikachu outcamps Snake and ledgeguards him brutally. He counters Snake. MOST characters can deal with Pikachu's spam and ledgeguarding much more effectively than Snake.

Snake can't autograb the ledge, so that's why he gets ledgeguarded horribly by Thunder. His projectile spam takes setup and besides the Nikita gets destroyed by Pikachu's spam if I recall, which hugs the ground and requires no setup.

I believe I've said at Brawl Central that the rat beats the Snake a while ago lol.

This is a good example of why Pikachu counters Snake. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASQXSwIVbmc&feature=related

That Snake doesn't know the secrets of how to force Pika to approach. Pika's advantages fade when Pika has to approach.

 

[BbqCombo]

No, his advantages dont fade when pika has to approach, he can QAC right to the snake and nair him in the face in a very short amount of time if the player knows what they're doing. Also, Quick attack locking hasnt been mentioned yet so you might want to consider that . Plus, how would you force pika to approach? his thunderjolts stop snake's grenades in their tracks, im not sure about the nikita though but you cant control the stage with only that and the grenades are gone after the first explosion :9

I dunno though, i could be wrong.

 

[Crizthakidd]

either the pikas i play suck or maybe pika isnt really a counter vs snake. but this is online so i wounder how bad id do vs offline good pikachus.

snakes tilts overpower the electric mouse. alltho even shielding or powershielding that dam down smash is useless. what a broken move. along with thunder that kills at like 80 xD

 

[kanvis]

I don't think pika is a snake counter. Pika is a great character that can play well against match up if played correctly. Snake has several advantage over pikachu though. One, pikachu can not spam snake with electric shot very well since can timely knee the shots and advance forward. Pika is quick, but snake has more than enough power options to knock it back and kill. Thunder can ledge camp to prevent or knock back snake as he tries to grab the edge, but snake can c4 recover himself to get higher up to get back on stage. Yes Thunder can hit and kill snake when he is high up, but proper DI and timely air dodge. Good prediction will avoid the thunder majority of the time. Pika chain grab can be jumped out of by snake even at low percentage.