Reason for transformation's long delay and a weird way to reduce it

[Steb]

The transformation takes long because it starts loading the other character as soon as the initial animation ends (just when she turns into a ball of light). This is the same reason why Pokemon Trainer's switching was made so long. The Wii loads much slower than the GCN.

I found a way to reduce the delay, but its not a very good solution. As soon as she turns into the ball of light, pause the game and wait a few seconds. Then unpause the game and you should be transformed much quicker. Of course this isn't the best solution because you would have to disrupt the game.

For those who want to switch between Zelda and Sheik, only good way would be to transform when you respawn, because you keep your invincibility frames after transforming in Brawl. (Info taken from Ankoku's stickied Sheik thread http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=147752)

 

[RyokoYaksa]

Yeah, I realized it myself that the game has to take time to load the other character each time you transform. You can hear the disc drive going nuts, and the Transform times can vary somewhat because there's no definitive load time.

Melee didn't even do this, it just loaded up both Zelda and Sheik in the memory for the whole match that either of them participated in. Transform didn't previously cause any on the fly load times whatsoever.

 

[Ledger_Damayn]

That's actually an interesting find, one that might have to be dealt with once tournaments start running.

I wonder if it's a problem that can be rectified...

 

[Wind Owl]

Can the Wii be modded to use a hard drive? That would definitely speed things up...

 

[Krytha]

haha that's kinda funny and also sad. Also, I disagree with transforming in your invincibility frames. Chase!

 

[blink777]

Yeesh... that's a little sad and pathetic. A game mechanic that appears to be consistantly defined almost entirely (far too many adverbs there) by how much your system is chugging? For shame, Wii. For shame.

 

[Drake3]

Wow. Good find, but just wow. Here I was thinking that they had a legitimate game reason for doing that. But no.

 

[Zone]

Yeah, I realized it myself that the game has to take time to load the other character each time you transform. You can hear the disc drive going nuts, and the Transform times can vary somewhat because there's no definitive load time.

Melee didn't even do this, it just loaded up both Zelda and Sheik in the memory for the whole match that either of them participated in. Transform didn't previously cause any on the fly load times whatsoever.

lol since it loaded both, wouldn't that explain why shiek can save her charged needles if you died as Zelda.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

Wow. Good find, but just wow. Here I was thinking that they had a legitimate game reason for doing that. But no.

Same here. All this time I´ve been trying to figure out reason why tranformation is so slow and actually came up with a theory that made some sense to me, and now it turns out to be just technical issue? I hope that there´re at least some game consept related reasons for this,otherwise I´m just disappointed.

 

[popsofctown]

This discovery calls for other questions.. What else is loaded? When the Fire Emblem level changes, is that a loading process? If you transformed while that was loading, or while a pokeball is being opened, or while an item is spawning, does this slow down the transformation?

The fairness issues too. If i host a tourney, is everyone going to inspect the inside of my Wii to see if i souped it up so Zelda can switch faster?

 

[Luthien]

And THIS explains why sometimes the lag would be longer for Zelda than Sheik, and sometimes not. Oi. So wait, can you still save Sheik's needles if you die as Zelda?

 

[RyokoYaksa]

And THIS explains why sometimes the lag would be longer for Zelda than Sheik, and sometimes not. Oi. So wait, can you still save Sheik's needles if you die as Zelda?

Dying as Zelda no longer saves Sheik's needles.

And to further prove the loading mechanism, if you set the game to different speeds in Training Mode, the white ball of light portion of Transform is still consistent with the different speeds, even 1.5x vs. 1/4 speed.

 

[popsofctown]

i read the thread and got on the Wii and made a *MAJOR* discovery

If someone else on the field already is Sheik, and you transform into Sheik, it is faster than if you are becoming the only Sheik. And vice versa.

For 1v1, this doesn't get us very far. But this can have some great effects in 2v2 matches.
For instance, you could make a pure Zelda/dual Zelda team, a limited-skilled player with someone who has mastered both characters. The dual Zelda would get fast transforms whenever they are go back from Sheik to Zelda.
You could also have a pure Sheik/ dual Sheik team. In the changing circumstances of 2v2, it doesn't really matter as much as 1v1, the slate-wiping would be a bigger advantage than anything else.

 

[Metroid_01]

This is a very interesting discovery. Its unusual that the speed difference isnt largely noticeable when switching back and forth. I guess to save memory, that data is cleared. =(. Thats what we get for playing on a system with less RAM than your average rock.

 

[leogeo2]

You guys think they will use the Wifi to add patches to the game? Maybe fix this sort of issue and have both characters loaded into the game? Would be nice, help with some balancing as well.

 

[Ztarfish]

Yeah I found out the whole pause thing a while ago too.
That also explains why for some reason sometimes it takes inexplicably longer to transform from Sheik to Zelda than it does from Zelda to Sheik or vice versa.

Fine Luthien, beat me to it. Oh and I still need you on my Brawl List.

 

[Luthien]

Fine Luthien, beat me to it. Oh and I still need you on my Brawl List.

Okay, I added you. Just waiting for it to register.

 

[Drake3]

Use the Hellfire forums, Ztarfish. I never know when you're up for a game or online just for the fun of it.

 

[Mediator]

for this problem i usually just transform after my opp has just lost a life or when im launched in the air i transform while falling. and i tend to use transform when someone is using their final smash it saves me all da time

 

[rageagainst]

for this problem i usually just transform after my opp has just lost a life or when im launched in the air i transform while falling. and i tend to use transform when someone is using their final smash it saves me all da time

welll this is what most ppl do (that is, if they ever transform) and it completely destroys the point of transforming, using 2 movesets at once. Yeah the invincibility frames are useful during a FS but I can say with 100% certainty they won't be touched in competitive play.. ever since I read Sakurai saying in the interview that it was made so that a skilled big brother and unskilled little brother can play together and still have fun as both would get kills and the little brother may even win sometimes! YAY Smashbros Party 9!

 

[popsofctown]

LOL^^^ great reference... i HATE how the high numbered mario party's have gone south like that.

Little brother needs to make friends you know.

 

[Supersmashbro125]

aww man...the transformation solution u had aint gonna work for online then...

 

[Newuser12345215]

So the long transformation is an unintentional bug, which is kind of disappointing.


To test with the short transformation thing, I did a 4 player match with one CPU Zelda and one CPU Sheik.

I played Zelda.

When I transformed, it's twice as fast.

Makes me disappointed that the transformation is so long, not because it's intentional, but because the Wii has to load the character data from the disc.

Why didn't they just preload Sheik/Zelda characters and keep them preloaded so that it doesn't lag when you transform?



Though, the long transformation does have an advantage as you can use it to avoid Final Smashes(assuming you're playing with items of course).

 

[Lingy]

Well, if you're playing with final smashes and you want to dodge kirby's, the lag will help I guess that's just about the only benefit though.

 

[Newuser12345215]

Zelda transforms INSTANTLY in team brawl if your allies are Sheik and Zelda.

Zelda transforms INSTANTLY in team brawl if your allies are Sheik and Zelda.

Anyway, go in team Brawl, play as Zelda(or Sheik).

Pick Sheik and Zelda as your allies, fight against whoever(doesn't matter). So it'll be 3v1.

Ok, when the match starts, try transforming and....

Zelda transforms nearly instantly.

It's not completely instantly but I'd say she transforms in less than half a second.


I wonder if the developers "intended" for Zelda to transform that fast in the first place

 

[ecstatic]

This is ridiculous. I find that the longer I spend playing/reading about Brawl, the more disappointed I become.

At least this adds a layer of depth to 2 vs. 2's. >_>

 

[StoneColdLink]

Well, the main reason Brawl takes along time to load is Brawl was put on a dual layered DVD in stead of the standard 4.7 GB DVD. Making that one of the reasons why Brawl has long loading times.