SD Remix - 3.3 Full with Slippi Rollback Released!

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

whats the word on Demo 2?

It's being worked on but it's not ready yet

 

[Stevo]

What was the reasoning for such radical changes? What is this project's mission statement?

This is important to know because if your intention is to make the low tiers as good as fox, that changes how people should give feedback then if you want to make the low tiers as good as say Ganon, or just change them to be slightly better to have a fighting chance.

Also, if you are able to do such changes down the road, how open would you be to universal changes such as diminishing returns on ledge regrab invincibility, not allowing to be grabbed during hitstun caused by a throw, or increasing the duration/button pressing requirements to escape things such as DK's side-b, yoshi's egg lay etc.

 

[bubbaking]

I think their mission statement was said to be to bring everyone to Top/High Tier's level without nerfing or even changing Top Tier (outside of that slight Sheik dthrow change).

Edit: DK's sideB and Yoshi's Egg Lay already guarantee free hits though, don't they? Increasing the mashing needed to break out of Yoshi's egg and some chars may be forced to die offstage, especially at higher %'s (if that matters).

 

[Stevo]

I'm not actually arguing for any of those things to be included, at this point in time, I was just curious if those types of things would be considered. I agree that Egg lay is still decent as is. DK's side-B though is already near impossible to hit with, and you can escape easily without really taking damage, plus you are invincible on escape. You would be surprised how quickly you can mash out of those things.

But again, I don't really want to argue for their inclusion, just examples.

 

[_OraNoS_]

What was the reasoning for such radical changes? What is this project's mission statement?

This is important to know because if your intention is to make the low tiers as good as fox, that changes how people should give feedback then if you want to make the low tiers as good as say Ganon, or just change them to be slightly better to have a fighting chance.

Also, if you are able to do such changes down the road, how open would you be to universal changes such as diminishing returns on ledge regrab invincibility, not allowing to be grabbed during hitstun caused by a throw, or increasing the duration/button pressing requirements to escape things such as DK's side-b, yoshi's egg lay etc.

I wouldn't mind a clear re-statement of the project's goals, either. (Go ahead, VietGeek )

I was under the impression that universal changes to how the game's mechanics work would be avoided, to keep the "familiar" feel of the game for those who wished to move between Melee and SD Remix. There are still some limitations to what can change, too. Most (if not nearly all?) changes so far have been along the lines of small tweaks to things that already behave in a certain way, to improve their functionality. Examples would include: adjusting the invincible frames after escaping Yoshi's neutral-b/DK's side-b or giving Mr. Game & Watch the ability to L-cancel all of his aerials.

With that being noted, individual characters have had changes that are more significant, like adjustments to shield or hitbox size (again, for functionality). Any changes are very open to constructive criticism between public releases, especially for the more extreme changes. Each and every adjustment will see a sizable amount of playtesting between public builds, in case you were concerned.

As far as character balancing goes, my experiences tell me that the goal is a loose range around high tier (A Tier?). Fox, Falco, and Jigglypuff haven't been adjusted, and Sheik's down-throw got a "nerf" to give other characters increased viability. The next group (Marth, Falcon, Ice Climbers, Doc, Ganondorf, Samus, etc.) have subtle buffs, if that's any indication. I get the impression that if a character still feels useless against most of the (present) top 7-8 with their buffs, they aren't "finished" yet.

Admittedly, most early builds for low tier characters have been a tad on the overpowered end of things. They have since been scaled back with one small adjustment at a time, before reaching a "healthy" feel for a public build like Demo #1. As far as what "healthy" is, I mean to say that the adjustments are evaluated relative to both the character and cast as it is then, and whether or not aspects of that character are too potent overall*. Some adjustments have been (and will continue to be) identified as "unnecessary", "too strong", or "too weak" and will continue to be a part of the development process.
[COLLAPSE="* = added note"]
As an example:

If memory serves, there was a build of Pichu that had Fox's speed and Falcon's knee for a b-air. He did not hurt himself either, on any of his moves. He also had other buffs, unlisted here. Despite complaints, this was definitely not the worst example at a failed attempt at proper character balancing. VietGeek (and others working on the project) took criticism and worked to produce a better build for him, and at this point, he may be in need of a few minor buffs. It's a tedious process, but playing/dissecting new builds is fun and exciting.

I must also note that most of the overpowered Pichu builds were really fun, despite not reaching the team's balancing goals. Kirby's hammer of chaos was not (if you missed out, be grateful).
[/COLLAPSE]

I'm not actually arguing for any of those things to be included, at this point in time, I was just curious if those types of things would be considered. I agree that Egg lay is still decent as is. DK's side-B though is already near impossible to hit with, and you can escape easily without really taking damage, plus you are invincible on escape. You would be surprised how quickly you can mash out of those things.

But again, I don't really want to argue for their inclusion, just examples.

In case you were curious:
[COLLAPSE="Demo 1 Notes, Relevant"]
Donkey Kong
Headbutt: Does more damage and is slightly harder to escape from. Escaping foes only have 1 frame of invincibility now.

Yoshi
Egg Lay:

• Opponents receive slightly more damage while being attacked inside the egg
• Upon escape, foes only have 1 frame of invincibility opposed to the original 14.

[/COLLAPSE]
If you haven't been able to try out a build, give it a shot (if it's reasonable to do so). I expect you'll have a good time.


tl;dr:

1. Good opening questions, [VietGeek] or [Ripple] will probably be the best one to answer them (I'm sending VietGeek a PM to answer them, hopefully he'll answer soon).
2. Most changes will stay "true" to Melee's original feel, but some will be surprising and/or obviously different (i.e. Samus' new up-smash).
3. Most characters are gravitating toward the level of the present "A Tier" characters.
4. The project is open to suggestions, but less likely to settle on more dramatic mechanic changes (serious overhaul of ledge get-up attacks, etc.).
5. If you haven't seen/tried the "new" levels, give them a chance. They are among the larger "changes".
6. Have fun (would also be #1, but seemed clichéd).

If anything in this oversized post seemed confusing, ask me, I'll respond soon-ish.

 

[Sixth-Sense]

Please help a fellow smasher out and release the second demo, armada retiring is......too much

ok no take your time, but is there anthing new with SDR?

 

[GunBlaze]

Please help a fellow smasher out and release the second demo, armada retiring is......too much

ok no take your time, but is there anthing new with SDR?

We've just resumed testing out.

 

[MVP]

We've just resumed testing out.

What do you mean testing out? Like testing is over now and its ready?

or you've begun testing?

 

[GunBlaze]

There were a few things that had to be taken care of regarding our playtesting, but now we're back on full force

 

[Sixth-Sense]

Full force as in "we'll release it in like a day or two"
Nah just kidding but that's good to know, but uhhhhhh could you guys at least tell us how pichu turned out? because he was SOOOOOOO OP in demo 1 that it wasn't even funny......at all. I guess i've got that big oh god i hope he's like a separte character and not Falcon + Fox + Shiek

 

[DrinkingFood]

If it's done by this weekend I might finally put forth the effort to figure out how to download and install this
I just want mewtwo to be good...

 

[Ripple]

ummm, if you don't think mewtwo is good in demo 1, I can't help you

 

[VietGeek]

i don't think he ever even played demo 1. he's just waiting for demo 2 just because

 

[DrinkingFood]

god damnit this ****ing tablet it so unresponsive sometimes

I havent downloaded it yet, i was referring to vMewTwo
a second demo might motivate me to download this finally, thats all i was saying

Also, have you guys given M2 hip hitboxes on his tail? Trying to hit someone that ends up inside of you can be very awkward with him. His tail feels like a spacing tool, yet he doesn't get the shoulder/hip hitbox analogous to theirs

 

[DrinkingFood]

ignore this

 

[DJLO]

dumb question: were any changes made to the top 4 characters?

 

[bubbaking]

Sheik's dthrow was slightly changed to avoid CGs but still allow follow-ups. That's it, I believe.

 

[Sixth-Sense]

BTW, how did the people at apex take the new demo? did they like it? Didn't like it etc, etc.

 

[Ripple]

I didn't get the chance to set it up at the venue because I basically became a staff member.

next tournament I could have people test it at would be SCSYN or SMYM.


also, demo 2 should be here on the weekend

 

[Sixth-Sense]

Awesomeeeee, i've been holding off on burning melee again on my last blank disc, good thing i know when it comes out now

 

[Zef]

recorded about 3+ hours of footage today

 

[_OraNoS_]

recorded about 3+ hours of footage today

any uploaded? and what characters were you trying out/showing off?

 

[Zef]

6-7 hours total, actually..
it was mostly roy, zelda, some ness, G&W, mario, doc, bowser, mew2.. a little of everyone i guess? some top tier melee characters too ofc

im not sure what to really do with it, rendering 6 hours of stuff is annoying. maybe just a little video or somethin

 

[Zef]

http://www.twitch.tv/CaptainZef streaming

 

[MVP]

I have a 2 quick questions?

1. Will i need to re-download/install etc. SD remix for the (hopefully soon) upcoming update?

2. Does having roms and emulators on my wii effect SD remix? Meaning they're on a separate SD card. Does it effect it freezing or in any other fashion. (sorry a bit vage)

 

[Zef]

im no dev, but..

1. you'll have to do the whole cmd DML thing again, so yes
2. no it wont

 

[MVP]

Cause i'm going to attempt to redownload this so it doesn't freeze everytime on the green screen again.
The problem last time was you couldn't unplug the wii without SD remix freaking out.


If no one minds, can i ask where you guys got you iso's from? I think that might be the problem

EDIT: you can pm the site of the iso if we're not allowed to post in thread.

 

[Ripple]

the only thing you have to do to put demo 2 on your SD card is replace the files. you don't have to redo the complicated process again

 

[MVP]

Also, can my SD card be formatted to FAT32 and still work? or does it (or rather prefer) FAT?

 

[Ripple]

it should be FAT 32 to play SDR, if not it won't work. did you mean something else?

 

[bubbaking]

I can just do this with a regular Melee disc, right?

 

[Ripple]

no


10nos

 

[MVP]

I used a different iso and i'm still getting that damn green screen freeze

i don't know wtf to do. This is so freaking frustrating.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

[bubbaking]

Wait, so I can't use a Melee disc in conjunction with an SD card? I have to use a burned CD?

 

[Zef]

what..? you dont need a disc at all.

 

[MVP]

I format my wii, then it plays fine. I can do whatever i want, but as soon as I unplug my wii it freaking freezes. If someone could please PM me where they got their iso that would be greatly appreciated.

 

[_OraNoS_]

MVP, I think I'm confused.

• Are you unplugging your Wii while its on?
  • If yes, why? Also, what parts are you unplugging?)
  • If not, what do you mean by "it freezes"?
• Did you format your Wii or your Wii's SD card?

bubbaking, I'm also confused.

Wait, so I can't use a Melee disc in conjunction with an SD card? I have to use a burned CD?

I'm confused what you would be using a burned CD for. You can use a SSBM disc with a SD card if you'd like to, but you won't have to.

If you choose, you won't even need to use a disc. (See: [Installation Guide for SD Cards/USB], [STEP 3: Running Melee SD: Remix!], "First, you should see SD Remix as a choice in the loader. Secondly, you can use a Gamecube controller to control this loader's menus if you wish. Press 'B' to go to Options and scroll through until you see a 'No Disc Patch' option. Enable it and please eject any disc you have inside your Wii drive." [in the first post, here]. This will let you play without a disc in the drive. You'll need to do the preceding installation steps first, of course.)

 

[MVP]

MVP, I think I'm confused.

• Are you unplugging your Wii while its on?
  • If yes, why? Also, what parts are you unplugging?)
  • If not, what do you mean by "it freezes"?
• Did you format your Wii or your Wii's SD card?

bubbaking, I'm also confused.

(I'll edit this in a minute)

I format my SD card to play SD remix. It plays and the worlds fine. Then i unplug the wii to move to another TV or tournament or smashfest etc. and then when SD remix loads, it freezes on the green screen. It loads dmi-soios but when the "green" part of the loading comes up it freezes on that screen.

I try redownloading to fix it and nothing works. I've tried the troubleshooting. Everything i can think of.

It seems the only thing that can fix it is if i format my wii and completely redo the ENTIRE process of getting SD remix. But as soon as i unplug the power cord to my wii it will freeze on that screen the next time i load. I'm thinking the iso or the wii model is the problem.

 

[VietGeek]

it's almost certainly your wii model or your sd card brand i'm afraid. :/

 

[MVP]

So the SD brand can effect it?


this is my sd card. is it good? and if not i'd really appreciate it if someone could help me find another one from walmart or something.....


http://www.walmart.com/ip/PNY-2GB-Premium-Secure-Digital-Memory-Card/11078643


EDIT: or better yet, could you guys whose SD remixs work share your SD card brand?