Smash Back Room Weekly Character Discussions! FINAL UPDATES: Ness + Lucas. All done!!

[manhunter098]

I was pretty sure that people did use his FLUDD, but it takes a fair amount of practice to be good at using it. But overall it really isnt something that is incredible enough even used perfectly to bring him out of mid tier since it is avoidable by many characters since they can just approach from under the stage, and otherwise its only good to help keep some distance for Mario if he REALLY needs it.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Bleh, I said Ike earlier, but I can't think of anything strange about him.

Bowser actually can approach with infinite jumps but I dunno...

Zelda can't approach...has strong aerials that are extremely situational. Zelda does have TONS of KO power. I guess she might fit the bill due to the ability to cancel diminishing returns with transformation, which is nearly impossible to do in a real match due to the lag.

 

[AlexX]

Bowser actually can approach with infinite jumps but I dunno...

I'm pretty sure all characters can ISJ.

 

[manhunter098]

I'm pretty sure all characters can ISJ.

Bowsers infinite jump isnt the same as the ISJ. Basically when you use his Koopa Klaw you can jump cancel the attack into your second jump if your close enough to the ground. You will never touch the ground and its easy as hell to pull off compared to the ISJ, but takes skill to incorporate aerials into your movements with it.

 

[samdaballer]

bowser or dk, i'll go with bowser i guess

 

[Grunt]

Ice Climbers.
no doubt.

 

[manhunter098]

Its not DK because his air game rocks. Sure hes only got two good aerials, but theyre so awesome he doesnt really need anything else. Plus a couple slow spikes one of which can easy kill even if you dont sweetspot it and a n-air with good priority, but an oddly timed and shaped hitbox. Either way b-air and u-air = WIN. Plus his tilts and b-air make for a good approach as well.

 

[Intercept]

Keep in mind, even though they mention the character is not good at approaching, doesn't mean all characters with bad approaches are viable options. If a character doesn't need to approach, like Zelda, they are not likely the next week's character.

 

[Intercept]

it is the ice-climbers



ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers, ice climbers!

Ice Climbers are not terrible at approaching/need to approach.

 

[DMG]

Ice Climbers are not terrible at approaching/need to approach.

They are horrible at approaching a lot of characters... They run somewhat slow, aerials are not too safe for them, you have to worry about Nana doing something stupid/not shielding in time/getting separated. The approaching options that do work for them are, for the most part, pretty predictable and punishable. Even if you De-synch them like crazy, they are still far from being solid at approaching.

It's not IC's for sure though, they are not doomed for Mid Tier, even though they aren't too good at approaching. IDK who it will be, it's 3:30 in the morning and I'm too tired.

 

[eskimo bob]

im saying sonic, he cant really ko, and few ppl use him
i can see him as middle tier, nothing higher

no, no, no, no, no. the sonic forum is one of the most populated ones and I personally can't see him going any higher than low tier. his specials are very obvious, his damage is flat out crap, he has problems killing people and he hasn't got much weight. I'm guessing zelda or pokemon trainer for obvious reasons.

 

[StoleUrCar]

I'm leaning towards ICs but he did say the character lacks ANY sort of approach...IC's definitely have some sort of approach...

They certainly fit the bill though. Sub-par aerial game, easy ability to KO once you get that grab in at high percents its grab attack+ double smash kill time. The unusual, difficult tactic would be the infinite grabs obviously.

Doubt it's bowser, infinite jump is a bit unusual but its easy as hell to do.

Maybe it was a bit of an exaggeration saying this mystery character lacks any sort of approach

 

[rathy Aro]

Can't sonic gimp? >.> Most people I know call his specials "unpredictable".... I don't play him so I don't really know.

I think its Bowser. ICs don't really fit the profile, because they are by no means "doomed". Anyway I'm thinking bowsers infinite jump. Its hard to do, few use it.

 

[TaurToph]

Pokemon trainer.

 

[Shök]

Ok, well I think (sadly) that it's leaning towards Marth. =/

 

[Snail]

Ok, well I think (sadly) that it's leaning towards Marth. =/

The hint said the character would probably not move past Mid Tier. And if you think Marth can't approach, you obviously haven't got a clue what you're doing XD And of course, what about the "interesting technique" that's hard to perform in tournament matches? Marth seems rather straightforward to me...

 

[ThaRoy]

Without a doubt it is Leon Scott Kennedy.

 

[Crow!]

I'm going for Luigi or Kirby. Someone too slow to approach, with a couple of effective kill moves. Kirby fits the bill for apparently good but actually not all that great air game IMO, while if Luigi's air game is actually bad, it would certainly be deceptive - I, for one, still think it's good.

For the weakness-eliminating strategy reference, something relating to Kirby's sucking or Luigi's tornado may suffice.

I wanted to say Pit for several reasons (including wing dashing) but I think he can approach just fine.

 

[BigRick]

To those that say that it isn't ICs because of the tier argument:

SP said that the character ''may'' be doomed to mid tier, and I totally agree since there are not many IC players out there.But he also said that the character can rise through the tiers very easily, if more players learn to use the character well.

About ICs approach/air game:

On the ground ICs do not run very fast and they lost their godly wavedash. When they are coming, you see them coming. They do have the iceblocks that they can chase after but these can easily be jabbed/tilted away.

In the air ICs are very vulnerable because they are much easier to separate. Their aerials do have good priority because of the disjointed hitboxes, but the hitboxes are not very fat so they can be knocked out of it.

Desynching: the unusual technique

Desynching is the unusual technique that IC can use and that requires SKILL to use. Not every player can do it because it is hard to use in a actual match (unlike running around with Sonic and switching from Zelda to Sheik). It also improves their approach with stuff like solo blizzard and helps them get that grab that will get them the easy KO. IMO it should not be compared with Bowser's infinite jump and Pika's QAC... these two techs aren't that good.

 

[Snail]

I'm going for Luigi or Kirby. Someone too slow to approach, with a couple of effective kill moves. Kirby fits the bill for apparently good but actually not all that great air game IMO, while if Luigi's air game is actually bad, it would certainly be deceptive - I, for one, still think it's good.

For the weakness-eliminating strategy reference, something relating to Kirby's sucking or Luigi's tornado may suffice.

I wanted to say Pit for several reasons (including wing dashing) but I think he can approach just fine.

Uh, Kirby's air game isn't fantastic but it is nowhere near "lacking". :D

 

[C@sH Mooney]

why do I wanna say Donkey Kong for number 12 >_>

 

[Robiin]

Im guessing Donkey Kong

 

[Linkplayer5678]

Marth or CF

 

[biohazard930]

I think people are putting too much weight on the mention of "mid tier" in the hint. Tiers (especially this early) are subjective, especially when it comes to communicating the idea from the back room to the "front room." Thus, I'd just use this hint to eliminate the perceived top, upper high, lower low, and bottom characters. There's a large amount of gray area in this hint, and I don't think it carries as much weight as some are giving it.

Also, to some, why Pokemon Trainer?

 

[Justaway]

ok Im gonna go ahead and guess Lucas

 

[Will_]

Without a doubt it is Leon Scott Kennedy.

Nah he'd have trouble KO'ing. It's Jack Krauser.

But yeah, maybe Donkey Kong. But if it's DK, I don't know what that risky strategy is.

 

[manhunter098]

But DK has a great air game, so it cannot be him...

 

[Will_]

But DK has a great air game, so it cannot be him...

That's true. Maybe Kirby?

 

[Faith]

That's true. Maybe Kirby?

I would say Pikachu ;o with his Quick attack cancel as unusual tech.

 

[S2]

The description fits Zelda very well.

Massive spacing/priority advantages on the ground, but no approach game. All aerials have to be sweetspotted basically.

You can swap to Sheik to counter some of her weaknesses, but due to the transform time you really need to know what your doing.

Then again, it could fit someone else too.

 

[Loooooni]

To those that say that it isn't ICs because of the tier argument:

SP said that the character ''may'' be doomed to mid tier, and I totally agree since there are not many IC players out there.But he also said that the character can rise through the tiers very easily, if more players learn to use the character well.

About ICs approach/air game:

On the ground ICs do not run very fast and they lost their godly wavedash. When they are coming, you see them coming. They do have the iceblocks that they can chase after but these can easily be jabbed/tilted away.

In the air ICs are very vulnerable because they are much easier to separate. Their aerials do have good priority because of the disjointed hitboxes, but the hitboxes are not very fat so they can be knocked out of it.

Desynching: the unusual technique

Desynching is the unusual technique that IC can use and that requires SKILL to use. Not every player can do it because it is hard to use in a actual match (unlike running around with Sonic and switching from Zelda to Sheik). It also improves their approach with stuff like solo blizzard and helps them get that grab that will get them the easy KO. IMO it should not be compared with Bowser's infinite jump and Pika's QAC... these two techs aren't that good.

Im pretty sure that this guy just got it. Desyncing isn't very easy to do in a match alll the time while the bowser jump doesn't even seem like it would be all that usefull during a match.

 

[DanGR]

DK's air game isn't good. It's rather bad. fair and dair both suck. He does have two good aerials in bair and upair though. I wouldn't be surprised if it was him, except that he's too good to be in the middle tier.

 

[Lucrece]

Zelda it is.

 

[BigRick]

Im pretty sure that this guy just got it. Desyncing isn't very easy to do in a match alll the time while the bowser jump doesn't even seem like it would be all that usefull during a match.

lol thanks looni for a while I was thinking that ppl were simply ignoring my posts

you guys dont have to agree with me so at least I'd like to see some ppl argue with me

EDIT: Also ppl should listen to biohazard cause he's very right. SP said ''The character MAY be doomed to mid tier'' so its a big gray area on that part of the hint.

heck, there isn't even an official tier list yet, how do you guys know which chars are mid tier?

 

[The Halloween Captain]

If I had to guess, I would say the hint refers to Bowser. Bowsercide + power = no trouble KO'ing. His approach - Firebreath? not much else. Also, Bowser has many unique tricks, the one most likely being refered to is this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch_UreOgveo&NR=1

 

[Bowserlick]

I would be surprised if it was anyone else, the King of Koopas. Half of Bowser's moves are killing moves easy. But being a large target and having very little approaching options means it will take hard work to rise up in tiers. Of course if more tricks are found and used to his advantage, such as his claw hop he might be able to make a decent showing.

 

[manhunter098]

DK's air game isn't good. It's rather bad. fair and dair both suck. He does have two good aerials in bair and upair though. I wouldn't be surprised if it was him, except that he's too good to be in the middle tier.

But his b-air is absolutely godly and his u-air is great as well (though not as godly as his b-air). He doesnt even need f-air and d-air to have a solid air game.

 

[Snail]

If I had to guess, I would say the hint refers to Bowser. Bowsercide + power = no trouble KO'ing. His approach - Firebreath? not much else. Also, Bowser has many unique tricks, the one most likely being refered to is this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch_UreOgveo&NR=1

Err yeah, but that's been proven not to work. And other than that, a trick hard to perform in tournaments? :/ Infinite jump? Not too useful and it's easy to do, too.

IC could be possible. Bad approaches, no problems KOing and too few people use them, so their tournament results could keep them in Mid-tier. And the trick would be desynching or the infinite chaingrabs or the combination of them. Which, if I may believe the IC mains of SWF, takes a lot of practice.

Kirby has a good air game, Pikachu's approach game is fine (QAC and full jump neutral B). DK... Maybe, but I don't think his air game strikes people as excellent at first but disappoints later... More like the other way around.

I think I'll go for the IC o_o

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Err yeah, but that's been proven not to work. And other than that, a trick hard to perform in tournaments? :/ Infinite jump? Not too useful and it's easy to do, too.

IC could be possible. Bad approaches, no problems KOing and too few people use them, so their tournament results could keep them in Mid-tier. And the trick would be desynching or the infinite chaingrabs or the combination of them. Which, if I may believe the IC mains of SWF, takes a lot of practice.

Kirby has a good air game, Pikachu's approach game is fine (QAC and full jump neutral B). DK... Maybe, but I don't think his air game strikes people as excellent at first but disappoints later... More like the other way around.

I think I'll go for the IC o_o

How was the Bowser thing proven not to work?

 

[Snail]

How was the Bowser thing proven not to work?

People could break out of the initial grab easily because of how slow Bowser's grab hits are, and it's possible jump out of the air-release.