Smash is NOT a Sport

[Strong Badam]

tl;dr version: Yuna can't make an argument without personally insulting other people in the thread and making himself look like an ******* that no one wants to listen to.

but smash is a video game

 

[Yuna]

tl;dr version: Yuna can't make an argument without personally insulting other people in the thread and making himself look like an ******* that no one wants to listen to.

I can and I did. I treated Stev completely civilly for several days, but he kept ignoring the vast majority of my points and kept on posting increasingly more insane arguments and I stopped treating him with kid gloves.

If someone says something wholly idiotic, I have no qualms about ripping them to shreds. This is debate, not tea at the library.

but smash is a video game

And things can only be one thing since when now? Why can't it be both?

 

[Stev]

Do you even know what the Olympic Games Committee is? "Games" is in the name because they're called the Olympic Games. And the committee classify all of those as sports, not as games. So, really, what was your argument here?



There are a bajillion sports which are not contact sports in which you cannot directly affect the outcome of your opponent. Like ballroom dancing or, really, any kind of dancing. Figure skating. Skiing. Anything where you are judged by judges (diving, figure skating, dancing, etc.) or even swimming.

I think I've proven sufficiently that what you think is wholly irrelevant.


Let me repeat myself:
I think I've proven sufficiently that what you think is wholly irrelevant.

Why should we place any weight on what you think again when, clearly, the majority of the people who decide what is and isn't a sport vehemently disagree with you?


And here you hit the nail on the head. You're yet another one of the neanderthals who think sports need to be "manly" and require "manly" things such as strength and athleticism, or, in your idiotic case: injuries!

Seriously, what kind of an argument is this?! A sport is only a sport if you can get injured doing it?!

TLDR version: Stev thinks that a sport can only be classified as such if one can get injured while participating in it.

A) It's called the International Olympic Committee, so you obviously don't know as much as you are saying

B) Are you really calling ballroom dancing a sport? I mean seriously. The point that I was making earlier is that no one is distinguishing between competition and sport. Everyone is basically saying if it's a competition, then it's a sport, and I think it should be more defined than that.

C) What I think is wholly irrelevant only to you, because I know lots of people IRL who completely agree with me, and frankly I think their opinion is more important than yours because you are very bad at arguing if you get that pissed off after like a day that consists of 3 posts of arguing.

D) You took my injury thing out of context. I'm saying their must be some sort of minimum athleticism required, thus you don't have massively overweight people consistently being successful (ie John Daily).

E) Seriously, read EVERYTHING i'm saying instead of jumping to conclusions. Like I've said over and over, THIS IS MY OPINION. Some people here may agree, some may not. You OBVIOUSLY don't, but isn't the point of this thread to debate? Learn how to.

 

[Sanu]

So uhh... about those debate hall forums.

Yup.

 

[Masmasher@]

Look this is stupid. Its a sport based on varying interpretations of a ever changing definition. This topic has a much relevance as SRK saying smash isnt a fighter. (which is stupid)
Humans associate things. its life.
/thread

EDIT : "track is not a sport." What the **** ?!
That makes no sense I run track. Bias opinion... no but it is a sport believe that

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

The pro starcraft gamers do about 4-5 actions per SECOND on the keyboard/mouse sometimes for hours if a set goes long. They sweat like crazy and its really hard. Much harder than golf or bowling. And they are under similar amounts of pressure since last season they were playing for a 96,000 first place prize in gomtv. Thats pretty serious business. Smash has really high apm its been proven. Check the apm thread so its also really tough, I think that if we had sponsors and really high prizes like in SC it would be just as competitive and be able to be called a sport like SC. If moving your fingers isn't competitive or physically demanding I guess playing guitar or keyboard in a rock band is easy to put up a whole concert and keep up energy and not sweat. people just think if it doesn't have a ball or tackles or teamwork that it isn't a sport.

Edit : My whole post is about melee. Brawl isn't even close to a sport lollllllllllllll.

Again...who cares?

R-E-T-A-R-D-E-D.


Edit: I don't think adults even take video games seriously, cause they shouldn't. They just go along w/ them to make money.

 

[Vulcan55]

If Rock paper scissors is considered a sport (espn), then **** videogame competitions are a sport. Everything is a sport including chess.

Have fun with semantics guys.

This

 

[Solaris1110]

lol the way I see it, anything that requires human judgement to declare a winner is not a sport. ie: figureskating, breakdancing, cooking. If it requires human judgement, it is an ART, not a sport.

What pisses me off more than anything is when people treat an art like a sport. ie: critics and judges. Choreography is the worst thing ever invented... Taking an art, and sticking on guidelines that determine what is right or wrong? Then its no longer an art, its just a ******** game of trying to fit the guidelines as best you can. There's a big difference between the act of letting yourself go and doing what feels right, and drilling a routine over and over again until it perfectly fits the guideline.

I remember that Ken and M2k had completely opposite styles of playing. Ken said something about how he doesn't think about what he does, he just does it. M2k on the other hand, memorized combo sequences and analyzed nearly everything in the game.
The thing with smash is, you can play it on either side of the spectrum. Because of this, its one of the few things I would actually call a "Competitive art" as you can use your own artistic flow to compete with your opponent's, and yet in the end there is a clear cut winner that requires no human judgement.

And a person's view on whether smash is a 'sport' or not varies depending on whether you think logically or socially/artistically. The definition of a sport depends on whether you see it from a static, dictionary standpoint or a fluid, social standpoint. So supposing smash meets the majority of the logical requirements to be considered a sport, then yeah, technically it is a sport.--if you're a logical thinker--. But if you care more about society's view as a whole, and if the majority of people dont think of video games as sports, then it isn't a sport.

And since the whole system of language is invented by humans in the first place, society's view has more priority than a dictionary. Therefore smash is NOT a sport. (unless of course the majority of society sees it as a sport...)

dun dun duuun.

 

[Yuna]

A) It's called the International Olympic Committee, so you obviously don't know as much as you are saying

Yes, I mistakenly called it something else. Obviously I know nothing about sports and the committee then. Excuse me for not being infalliable.

B) Are you really calling ballroom dancing a sport?

The Inernational Olympic Committee classified DanceSport (i.e. Competitive Ballroom Dancing) as a sport.

The point that I was making earlier is that no one is distinguishing between competition and sport. Everyone is basically saying if it's a competition, then it's a sport, and I think it should be more defined than that.

No, we're saying that if it's a Competitive organized activity, then it's a sport. By today's terminology.

C) What I think is wholly irrelevant only to you, because I know lots of people IRL who completely agree with me, and frankly I think their opinion is more important than yours because you are very bad at arguing if you get that pissed off after like a day that consists of 3 posts of arguing.

1) Your opinion is important because you know people IRL who agree with you?
2) I'm not pissed. I simply stopped being nice. You seem incapable of differentiating between "not nice" and pissed. This is how I usually am in most debates. It's just that I give everyone a chance to prove themselves not-idiots before unleashing my acerbity.

D) You took my injury thing out of context. I'm saying their must be some sort of minimum athleticism required, thus you don't have massively overweight people consistently being successful (ie John Daily).

1) You explicitly stated that you think the capacity for injuries is required.
2) Massively overweight people can do well at a whole bunch of sports. Any racing sport, for example. Competitive fishing. Bowling. Pretty much any sport that does not require fitness or simple arm strength.

E) Seriously, read EVERYTHING i'm saying instead of jumping to conclusions. Like I've said over and over, THIS IS MY OPINION.

And like I said time and time again: Your opinion is stupid. That's right, I think that some people can have stupid opinions.

Also, I specifically referred to your opinions as your opinions several times. However, you are currently participating in a debate about what should and shouldn't be classified as a sport. Thusly, one must assume that your opinion is that your opinion of what is and isn't a sport should be the opinion that counts, i.e. the one which officially decides what is and isn't a sport.

Some people here may agree, some may not. You OBVIOUSLY don't, but isn't the point of this thread to debate? Learn how to.

I am. You aren't. You are stating your opinion. I am refuting your arguments. So far, you've been unable to refute a single one of my arguments. In fact, you haven't even tried refuting the vast majority of my arguments except stating "Well, my opinion is that...".

No, your opinion means bupkis. Try refuting my arguments, such as why activities such as chess, ballroom dancing (yes, it is a sport) and racing (cars, boats) are officially recognized as sports. Stating "It is my opinion that that shouldn't be the case!" over and over again isn't debating.

Seriously, have you provided any arguments except "In my opnion..."? I mean, why should sports require a form of athleticism/opportunity for injury, ability to directly affect your opponent, etc.? You never actually argue why your opinion matters, simply that it's your opinion (and it matters because... you know people IRL who agree with you).

I suggest you look up the definition of the word "debate". It is not "Stating your opinion".

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Look at what Brawl is doing to my beautiful Melee forums. What ever happened to sensible topics?

Sport or not, Melee is amazing, thats all that matters really.

And brawl sucks.

 

[BluePeachy100]

Our fingers get more exercise than any chess player, yet chess is a sport, plus all the things to consider, strategy, all the practice you have t put in. It should be considered a sport, seeing how big it is, and all the work it takes to be good.

Oh, but Brawl doesn't count. =/

 

[Jash]

I believe Smash is sorta a sport because it uses a lot of mental energy and a lot of precise movements to get better.

For example, I main Toon Link, the precise way that I use my Boomerang to hit my opponent almost any given time is probably the same as hitting or putting a golf ball with exact precision so it can go in with no problem.

As far what the dictionary says, Game/Smash and Sport both use Skill and Agility, mental and physical agility that is needed for both things.

Also (I'm not sure if this has any relevance) picking a character "I Find" it to be like coaching or finding new players off the street that you believe are good. You watch them play and you deal with their strengths and weaknesses. That's just me though, I like to think creative

PS: If Chess is considered a sport, then Smash should definitely be considered a sport. I don't wanna hear "Smash is a video game and Chess isn't so that's why it's a sport" bull-ish. That is mad "Gamecist".

 

[Stev]

Yes, I mistakenly called it something else. Obviously I know nothing about sports and the committee then. Excuse me for not being infalliable.

The Inernational Olympic Committee classified DanceSport (i.e. Competitive Ballroom Dancing) as a sport.


No, we're saying that if it's a Competitive organized activity, then it's a sport. By today's terminology.


1) Your opinion is important because you know people IRL who agree with you?
2) I'm not pissed. I simply stopped being nice. You seem incapable of differentiating between "not nice" and pissed. This is how I usually am in most debates. It's just that I give everyone a chance to prove themselves not-idiots before unleashing my acerbity.


1) You explicitly stated that you think the capacity for injuries is required.
2) Massively overweight people can do well at a whole bunch of sports. Any racing sport, for example. Competitive fishing. Bowling. Pretty much any sport that does not require fitness or simple arm strength.


And like I said time and time again: Your opinion is stupid. That's right, I think that some people can have stupid opinions.

Also, I specifically referred to your opinions as your opinions several times. However, you are currently participating in a debate about what should and shouldn't be classified as a sport. Thusly, one must assume that your opinion is that your opinion of what is and isn't a sport should be the opinion that counts, i.e. the one which officially decides what is and isn't a sport.


I am. You aren't. You are stating your opinion. I am refuting your arguments. So far, you've been unable to refute a single one of my arguments. In fact, you haven't even tried refuting the vast majority of my arguments except stating "Well, my opinion is that...".

No, your opinion means bupkis. Try refuting my arguments, such as why activities such as chess, ballroom dancing (yes, it is a sport) and racing (cars, boats) are officially recognized as sports. Stating "It is my opinion that that shouldn't be the case!" over and over again isn't debating.

Seriously, have you provided any arguments except "In my opnion..."? I mean, why should sports require a form of athleticism/opportunity for injury, ability to directly affect your opponent, etc.? You never actually argue why your opinion matters, simply that it's your opinion (and it matters because... you know people IRL who agree with you).

I suggest you look up the definition of the word "debate". It is not "Stating your opinion".

So organization is the only thing that makes a competition become a sport. Well using your logic. I think your opinion of that is STUPID. You're basically saying, that they are the same thing when you boil everything down. You're basically saying if i get so and so to tell us how everything works, no just the to competitors to agree on a rule set, and they abide by those rules, then it's a sport. You're going to have to be MUCH more specific if you're going to say that sports are just organized competition. A lot of people when asked "do you play sports?" reply "just with my friends." If the difference between a sport and a competition is organization, then why does the term "organized sports" exist? Why is there a "sports organization" instead of a "competition organization?"

You yourself have not backed up anything about your own definition. The only real evidence you have is that if it's recognized by the ICO then it's a sport, but frankly, smash and any other game remotely close to it, is no where near being recognized by the ICO. But in America, no one really cares about the Olympics or the ICO (before people start yelling "hey! I like the olympics!" just look at the ratings during the last ones. They were horrible. More people, unfortunately, care about American idol, which would be a sport according to you).

I don't think that you should lose at a sport because you literally can't do anything about it (ie the guy runs x distance faster than you... always or a judge for some reason doesn't like your style despite everyone else loving it, so he gave you a 7 instead of a 9 like he gave that other guy). All those activities are proving is who's the fastest or who a select group of people like more.

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

Look at what Brawl is doing to my beautiful Melee forums. What ever happened to sensible topics?

Sport or not, Melee is amazing, thats all that matters really.

And brawl sucks.

This is Tournament Discussion .

No johns on that your simple mistake sir.

 

[L__]

You guys are getting really worked up over a concept that wouldn't be life-changing...

unless there were salaries involved :\

 

[Masmasher@]

What. If some runs a certain distance faster than you than its like all other sports
YOU GET BETTER. you train, work, implement race startegies and persevere through to be the best.
If someone is mindgaming you you dont say i cant do anything about it. you get your mango/armada on and you adapt or get you p.c chris on and TRY SOEMTHING NEW/DIFFERENT. Running is like anything else with time you get better.

MELEE/64 are sports

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

What. If some runs a certain distance faster than you than its like all other sports
YOU GET BETTER. you train, work, implement race startegies and persevere through to be the best.
If someone is mindgaming you you dont say i cant do anything about it. you get your mango/armada on and you adapt or get you p.c chris on and TRY SOEMTHING NEW/DIFFERENT. Running is like anything else with time you get better.

MELEE/64 are sports

Nicely done.

I can't wait for my high school to start the Smash Brothers Tryouts by the end of the year.

 

[JPOBS]

Sport: an athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess and often of a competitive nature
Athletic is defined as:

involving the use of physical skills or capabilities, as strength, agility, or stamina.

im dont see how smash bros, and specifically Melee, DOESNT adhere to these two clauses.

granted it doesnt require strength per se, but it requires other things like stamina and finger dexterity so...

You've done all te work for me in terms of proving you wrng.

 

[Yuna]

So organization is the only thing that makes a competition become a sport. Well using your logic. I think your opinion of that is STUPID.

It's not juts my opinion. It's the world's. It's the pretty much the current definition for sports (of course, it involves more than just "organized Competition", that's just a part of it).

A lot of people when asked "do you play sports?" reply "just with my friends." If the difference between a sport and a competition is organization, then why does the term "organized sports" exist? Why is there a "sports organization" instead of a "competition organization?"

You still don't get it, do you? It's not about what you or "a lot of people" think. It's about the current lexical definition of the term "sport".

You yourself have not backed up anything about your own definition.

Yes, Stev. Keep telling yourself that. Dictionaries and the International Olympic Committee =/= Nothing.

The only real evidence you have is that if it's recognized by the ICO then it's a sport, but frankly, smash and any other game remotely close to it, is no where near being recognized by the ICO.

No, that was never my argument. Learn to read better.

But in America, no one really cares about the Olympics or the ICO (before people start yelling "hey! I like the olympics!" just look at the ratings during the last ones. They were horrible. More people, unfortunately, care about American idol, which would be a sport according to you).

And the world at large should care because...? This is the country where loonies can claim that Obama's health care program will create Death Panels and not get run out of office. "In America..." really doesn't hold much water as an argument to me.

I don't think that you should lose at a sport because you literally can't do anything about it (ie the guy runs x distance faster than you... always or a judge for some reason doesn't like your style despite everyone else loving it, so he gave you a 7 instead of a 9 like he gave that other guy). All those activities are proving is who's the fastest or who a select group of people like more.

Track is not a sport? Weightlifting is not a sport? Tossing <insert item here> is not a sport? Swimming is not a sport? Golf is not a sport?

And again, I saw nothing in this post except "My opinion is that...".

 

[Tyr_03]

lol who the **** cares?

 

[Mr.Freeman]

I think this should be closed, before innocent children get hurt.

 

[fragbait]

If melee is a sport then Brawl is a sport. **** you Brawl haters. ****.

 

[BluePeachy100]

Does it take as much practice to get good at Brawl than it does at Melee? Not even close. Look into the facts, and the reason people go so far as to even bashing Brawl. Face it, most people who play Brawl, and don't understand why we don't like it can't keep up with the people who play Melee. It's as simple as that, show me the REAL competitiveness of Brawl, and I'll understand you a little more. If you can't, it makes you nothing more than a regular Brawl***.

 

[altairian]

Peachy, more people play brawl than melee. "Competitiveness" is a really subjective term, and just because you have to practice wave dashing and l cancelling to start to get good at melee doesn't make it more "competitive". It just means it requires more practice. I could easily argue that since more people play it, there's more competition and thus "more competitive".

Many melee players are concerned with "our game takes more skill" or other such comments. YOU ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT CARE. Go stroke your ego elsewhere.

 

[L__]

Melee players are always concerned with "our game takes more skill" or other such comments. YOU ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT CARE. Go stroke your ego elsewhere.

Generalizations...aren't the greatest thing

 

[altairian]

Edited for slightly less generalization. It's annoying regardless, it's as simple as not playing it if you don't like it. There's no point in telling people that do like it that they're wrong or stupid or lack skill or whatever other nonsense might come to mind.

 

[BMX]

It seems that Melee egos are pretty much the extremist egos( at least those who come to threads and state obvious differences between the games in an insulting manner, then bashing Brawl players for it).

Please keep those opinions to yourself because it is rude and people have different tastes in games.

10GTFO.

 

[breez]

Didn't read the thread; responding to the OP

Smash bros, or any competitive game is a sport in most definitions of the word. If you don't believe this, then I don't think you have been to any professional gaming events. The physical and mental dedication is extremely demanding, and they get just as much respect as any other sport in my opinion.

People who say it isn't a sport are just trying to make themselves feel better, as if running the length of a feild fits you into this category.

By the way, i've competed at national levels in multiple "sports", so no, i'm not just a bitter nerd, but I respect and admire the talent and dedication of professional gamers, just as any other sport. In my mind, they are too similar to not compare.

 

[BluePeachy100]

Likewise for Brawl, we don't particularly care for that either. It's funny how when I said it lightly, how Brawl wasn't a sport, and people say "**** you Brawl haters" when I get upset I'm somehow wrong. I also find it funny how when I said Prove to me the competitiveness, no one took the chance. Sports is purely competition, which was what I was getting at in the first place.

I like how you people say we have big egos, when you Brawlers often insult Melee, talking about how old it is, and we should move on.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Who even gives a ****?

Sports mean different things to different people, so stop trying to manipulate their way of thinking and let them believe what they want.

Not to mention that no one calls Smash a sport anyway and the OP's response of "Oh ya they do ppl be debatin bout it lately" is either untrue, or this debate is occurring in some invisible sub forum or something.

 

[Mic_128]

You know what, this really has nothing to do with tournaments and it's getting a bit too heated for my liking, both on topic and the beginings of Brawl vs Melee. (Serious, can't you just damn well get along?)

So uhh... about those debate hall forums.

Yup.

Yup. Take the debate there guys.