Snake's Out-of-Edge Option(s)

[xDD-Master]

This scenario:

So what should I do ?

1. If I stay at the edge -> MK DSmash (Maybe FSmash or Dtilt)
   
2. If I roll -> MK DSmash
   
3. If I attack -> MK can Shield + Punish
   
4. If I edgejump -> 1. As Snake you will try to avoid beeing in the air... 2. He has no momentum canceling Move 3. All of his Aerials are nearly useless (DAir only hits with first part) 4. His Side-B and Down-B are too avoidable in this situations
   
5. If I fall down and then jump -> MK can dodge/shield/punish everything because 1. Snake has no good & quick Aerial to the front of him 2. UpAir would work, but if you land you will get the ****ing huge landing lag 3. Counts also for all other aerials

For 4+5 you could jump with holding a nade but should we really call this a "safty" option ???

The only semi-safe option is a quick Up-Air with instant ledge re-grab (But you cant do this forever and your oppenant can still punish it <,<)

So in conclusion: I realized that Snake has very bad Out-of-Edge Options <,<

Or is there something I miss ???

 

[bludhoundz]

That's just because MK's a monster.

Against other characters it isn't quite as bad.

But yes, his options are fairly limited.

 

[Shady Penguin]

That's just because MK's a monster.

Against other characters it isn't quite as bad.

But yes, his options are fairly limited.

What he said.

 

[Zajice]

Yeah. It's just cause it's MK. Just wing it and hope you make it on the stage just fine.

The best way for Snake to get back on stage against MK is to make a sudden loud yelping noise in real life to startle your opponent and recover while he's dazed.

 

[Corrupted]

Drop jump upair through stage and regrab gets him of your ****. His ledge attack is pretty okay.

 

[Jdawg26]

Yeah. It's just cause it's MK. Just wing it and hope you make it on the stage just fine.

The best way for Snake to get back on stage against MK is to make a sudden loud yelping noise in real life to startle your opponent and recover while he's dazed.

Isn't that not allowed? If not I'm SO doing that. XD

 

[SuSa]

As long as you aren't messing with their controller I actually do think it is legal to randomly scream at your opponent.

I'm pretty sure that's how this one guy got out of a chaingrab from the IC's. Looked to his right and yelled "DONT **** UP!!!!" and he messed up.

lol

 

[etecoon]

uh, it's not just MK, snake's ledge options are HORRID, really nothing you can do that consistently works, just be cautious about the situation and don't get predictable

 

[Kly]

I would jump+air dodge and trying to recover with stuff like nade pivot.

 

[xDD-Master]

I would jump+air dodge

This sounds good XD

uh, it's not just MK, snake's ledge options are HORRID, really nothing you can do that consistently works, just be cautious about the situation and don't get predictable

This <,<

Drop jump upair through stage and regrab gets him of your ****. His ledge attack is pretty okay.

Maybe Snakes Attack is strong, but it isnt that quick in the beginning and can be shielded <,< (Yeah everything can be shielded but other character have a lot of safer options) And additionally with only one good option we would get very predictable <,<

Well I begin to hate Snakes recovery and OoE Options more and more <,<

So ****ty character xDDD (Joke I love Snake <3)

 

[Gr1mmy]

You're never really supposed to get predictable with snake anyway right? Or any character.

 

[SuSa]

You're never really supposed to get predictable with snake anyway right? Or any character.

The problem is almost all of Snake's options on the ledge are relatively slow and MK can react to and punish each option.

Mix it up as much as possible and hope you can make it up I say. Don't stall on the ledge, but rathers quickly make your judgement BUT TO BE SURE TO THINK ABOUT IT.

 

[IxxI]

You never mentioned get up normally.
People often don't see it coming either.
:D

 

[xDD-Master]

You never mentioned get up normally.
People often don't see it coming either.
:D

This seems to be legit ^^

Maybe this is the clue. Does someone has framedata or something to see how "good" it really is xD

 

[gallax]

you can always jump and do a b-reversal nade pull to put yourself back on the ledge. the worst that is going to happen is a grab our you get smashd and it doesn't hit the nade.

 

[Bladewing]

I try not to go for the ledge, instead i cypher over and try to land safely.

If I do find myself grabbing the ledge, I wait a sec, and mix things up but usually do an edge jump> dair. It may not connect but for the most part it will get you back safely.

 

[SuSa]

you can always jump and do a b-reversal nade pull to put yourself back on the ledge. the worst that is going to happen is a grab our you get smashd and it doesn't hit the nade.

I've been doing this for a while. What I've got to say is:

If they just randomly through out any move on reaction, 80% of the time they don't hit the 'nade :/ so I stopped using this on MK's... but it is a quick ledge-option to throw a semi-cooked nade at an opponent on the other side of the stage.

 

[tuestresfat]

You COULD just let go of the edge and kill yourself. Then you can start over at the center of the stage rofl.

 

[Zajice]

What I usually do is just cypher really high up and fall back to the stage. B reverse a nade to mess them up so they don't catch your landing. Like, go all the way right, they follow you, B reverse a nade before you land to fling yourself to the left of them.

I try to avoid the ledge unless I'm hitting a person who's offstage or I get hit really low. And even when I get hit low, I usually blow myself up with C4 and cypher higher if they're near the edge to avoid getting grabbed and gimped.

You COULD just let go of the edge and kill yourself. Then you can start over at the center of the stage rofl.

If you're at like... 500% and you know you're screwed, do it for kicks.

Don't let them have the satisfaction!

 

[luke_atyeo]

Snake is pretty terrible on the ledge, luckily with his awesome recovery its not too much of a stretch to say that you can play a match as snake without ever grabbing the ledge.

another option is to ledge drop away from the stage double jump back even further and c4 recover at an angle so you end up above and over the stage, although I wound not advise this against metaknight and if they predict it your going to get gimped.

 

[xxCANDYxx]

really?? i think that snake isnt bad at all in that situation....your guys are all assuming that the mk is mindreading what you can do next....if your playing a mindreader it doesnt matter which character are in those 2 spots

the point is to outsmart your opponent....this isnt a topic to discuss b/c theres no such things as safe options with any1....you just gotta outsmart your opponent

 

[SuSa]

Candy, this is one of those "you are ****ed simply because of animation and they can react to what you do" situations.

Much like our tech chase on Toon Link.

It's more or less a "mix it up and hope they read the animation wrong or have slow reactions"

 

[Dominic]

obviously candy got it right since its relatively the oposite of what susa think.

 

[feardragon64]

I'm pretty bad with snake but when about ledgehop(not an everytime solution but a possibility), assess the situation:
1) If you think you can land, go for it?
2) If mk is going to try and **** you with nair or something and you really don't want to get knocked back....up+b super armor?

Granted you then have to worry about landing but at least now you have the capability of C4 planting, you still have your double jump, and you can wavebounce with nades?

Not the big solution or anything, but thought I'd throw that out there for situations when nothing seems to work.

 

[Zajice]

I half agree with Candy and half with SuSa. Animations make it easy for opponents to react, but it's still not perfect for them. There's always a chance they'll react wrong. I've messed up plenty of d-throw things Toon Link. Your opponent can't react perfectly every time.

obviously candy got it right since its relatively the oposite of what susa think.

Troll harder.

 

[misterpimp5757]

drop down edge full hop dair....it gets the 3rd and 4th kick where he is standing...if farther u wont make it...if closer u can get all kicks.

edge jump b reverse nade? idk...or edge jump fastfall airdodge? edge jump to up-b?

 

[Gr1mmy]

I wasn't aware there was anything but a full hop with the second jump. And dair's hitbox and priority isn't good enough for it to be a viable option. And the huge landing lag.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

As long as you aren't messing with their controller I actually do think it is legal to randomly scream at your opponent.

I'm pretty sure that's how this one guy got out of a chaingrab from the IC's. Looked to his right and yelled "DONT **** UP!!!!" and he messed up.

lol

PEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENIS!
lol

I just back up from the ledge, double jump and Cypher. Punishable yes but I hate Snake's edge options.

 

[EatMan]

let go of the ledge, then full hop air dodge, ????, profit

 

[skillskillfiretruck]

jump + shield

then jump again while in the air + down b(+tilt opposite direction straight after for confusion sending you to the opposite side with the same momentum.) (and quickly try to designate the bomb) or b.


youtube.com/EADPmymedia (1 snake brawl vid)

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

PEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENIS!
lol

I just back up from the ledge, double jump and Cypher. Punishable yes but I hate Snake's edge options.

This. I'd just try to recover high like you should've the first time. Either ledge drop to jump back and momentum-based cypher (C4?), or something like that.

 

[Gr1mmy]

You'd need to be out of grab range though =/

 

[theONEjanitor]

i'm pretty sure the animations for get up normal, get up roll, get up jump, and get up attack all look the same at the beginning.
if you're playing a MK and you're sure he's waiting to react just get up normal and grab him.
or roll up and run away or something

once you do that its back to a guessing game. just mix it up.

vote=Candy

I do agree that your decision needs to be quick. snake on the ledge is fairly bad.

this particular position isn't the worst though. MK in the air is more scary.

 

[Asul]

You can drop and make a fulljump nair

 

[VuSnake]

hmm i would jump off pull a nade and jump back again..
when he's attacking me we both egt 12% dmg and i would DI into the stage ^^.
when he wont attack me i would use the ZLG to protect myself from other attacks.
grenade shielding after that ^^

 

[xX Jolly]

I agree with Vu. If you quickly let go of the edge, jump, and pull out a nade you land on the stage with your back facing meta which could eliminate most of meta's options because if he hits you you both take damage. At that point all i think meta could do without taking damage is grab but with zero landing lag you could just roll away if he doesn't hit you in the jump towards the stage.