Special Attack Info

[\Apples]

So, there doesn't seem to be any one place where all of this info is documented. The changelogs may contain all of it collectively, but the most recently posted changelog is the only one that seems to exist on these forums.

The specifics of Sonic's Specials have been changed several times and some of them, I can't seem to quite figure out myself. I'm told Homing Attack can still be cancelled after the hit, but for the life of me I cannot make it happen. What are the specifics?

What are the exact differences between Homing and Blast Attack? I know how to trigger each, but how do they behave and what properties differ between them? Can Blast Attack also be cancelled? Can Homing Attack even still be cancelled? It doesn't feel like it.

Side+B can be jump cancelled, what is this window? Sonic seems to be required to be grounded in order to do so.

Down+B sometimes ends early and Sonic just runs out of it, why is this? I'd like to be able to control this, but I cannot reproduce this reliably at all. In fact, I feel like I have no control over it. How does Down+B's speed multiplier work based on horizontal input? How do his ledge-grabbing properties in this move work after he's jumped with it?

I'll happy condense all this info here if we'd like to sticky it after the info has been gathered.

What's the dealllllllllllllllllllllllll?

 

[Virum]

1) Homing Attack can technically be cancelled on hit, but not for a good few frames. A ground HA on hit for example won't be cancellable until you've almost reached the ground again after the bounce.

2) Homing Attack actually homes in on the target but has a slower start-up and can't be interrupted as quickly. Blast Attack has a set trajectory angled forward and slightly down but start-up is faster and it can be cancelled out of eariler than HA, making it a better pressure and out of shield tool. Both have their uses though. Homing Attack is best used for extending aerial juggles (e.g. you land a UAir and they DI a little too far away from you to follow up with another UAir so you HA) and recovery mix-ups whilst BA, as aforementioned, can be used for pressure and oos.

3) Side B is jump cancellable both on the ground and in the air. The window occurs for a few frames just after Sonic flashes white briefly. Something interesting to note is that due to how Side B was animated there are points where Sonic travels a further distance per frame and as a result you can retain more momentum when cancelled at a certain point (I believe it's just as the hitboxes would terminate though I'd need to check up).

4) One way that you can forcibly stop Down B with Sonic is by pressing shield during it. This causes him to go into a braking animation (as opposed to shielding). This only works when you're not in the turning animation of the move. As for terminating early, if you make contact with a hurtbox or shield the timer of your Down B is cut slightly. Speed multiplier for the move is based almost entirely upon how long you charge it for. Horizontal input has little effect. When you jump out of Down B from the ground, you can't grab ledges at all as you're still in your spindash. When you jump out of it in the air you go into a standard double jump so standard ledge grabbing rules apply.


Yeah there's quite a lot to know with this character. I'm still trying to explore a lot of it myself. Hope this was at least a bit helpful

 

[\Apples]

1) Homing Attack can technically be cancelled on hit, but not for a good few frames. A ground HA on hit for example won't be cancellable until you've almost reached the ground again after the bounce.

2) Homing Attack actually homes in on the target but has a slower start-up and can't be interrupted as quickly. Blast Attack has a set trajectory angled forward and slightly down but start-up is faster and it can be cancelled out of eariler than HA, making it a better pressure and out of shield tool. Both have their uses though. Homing Attack is best used for extending aerial juggles (e.g. you land a UAir and they DI a little too far away from you to follow up with another UAir so you HA) and recovery mix-ups whilst BA, as aforementioned, can be used for pressure and oos.

3) Side B is jump cancellable both on the ground and in the air. The window occurs for a few frames just after Sonic flashes white briefly. Something interesting to note is that due to how Side B was animated there are points where Sonic travels a further distance per frame and as a result you can retain more momentum when cancelled at a certain point (I believe it's just as the hitboxes would terminate though I'd need to check up).

4) One way that you can forcibly stop Down B with Sonic is by pressing shield during it. This causes him to go into a braking animation (as opposed to shielding). This only works when you're not in the turning animation of the move. As for terminating early, if you make contact with a hurtbox or shield the timer of your Down B is cut slightly. Speed multiplier for the move is based almost entirely upon how long you charge it for. Horizontal input has little effect. When you jump out of Down B from the ground, you can't grab ledges at all as you're still in your spindash. When you jump out of it in the air you go into a standard double jump so standard ledge grabbing rules apply.


Yeah there's quite a lot to know with this character. I'm still trying to explore a lot of it myself. Hope this was at least a bit helpful

Definitely helpful. Thanks.

PMBR might consider communicating these windows a little better. I find audio cues work well. Perhaps Sonic will yell, "Yeah!" or "Ha!" or some **** right before he can cancel HA/BA. Idk, just a thought, it's arbitrary atm.

Also, I've definitely grabbed ledges while still spin dashing. Spin dash and jump from the ground and DI at a ledge and it'll even grab it backwards. Sometimes it doesn't seem to work though and I'm not sure why. Maybe this works because the spin dash is technically over by the time he descends to ledge height and he's able to grab the ledge because I RAR before I jump?

 

[DAlegendarysamus]

Who do you do the blast attack?

 

[mtmaster]

Who do you do the blast attack?

Its B+A. You hit B button and then quickly hit A and he will do it. You'll know you did it right as the homing attack will be a lot faster than if you just hit B by itself.

 

[DAlegendarysamus]

Sorry I misread thr thread I thought it waa something different than what I was doing

 

[Piefrenzy]

Its B+A. You hit B button and then quickly hit A and he will do it. You'll know you did it right as the homing attack will be a lot faster than if you just hit B by itself.

I never knew about that. What advantage does using the Blast Attack give you instead of the Neutral B?

 

[mtmaster]

You

I never knew about that. What advantage does using the Blast Attack give you instead of the Neutral B?

You can attack immediately right afterward. You could use it as a combo starter or a combo ender.

 

[TensenROB]

Hi, I don't know if this is common knowledge already but you can do consistent spinshots easily with tap jump if you do down-b and quickly flick the control stick up, because tap jump can buffer a bit. This works for B-reverse spinshots as well and makes the tech much easier for me.

 

[internetmovieguy]

I would like some help understanding the homing attack.
The "Homing" nature of the attack is what i am interested in understanding.
the following are my conclusions based on my own experiments preformed using my wii (no dolphin or debug mode).

• The homing attack's horizontal targeting distance is 5 and 1/2 blocks and the vertical distance appears to be the same.
• Homing attack always targets the closest NON-invulnerable target.
• Only characters are targets (waddle dee's and pikmin are not targets). Smash balls are not targets
• The homing attack, from start to launch lasts about 26 frame (needs confirmation)
• Sonic will aim for the head or face of a standing or crouching target (some exceptions when aiming from behind the target)
• The last 1 or 2 frames (i don't know which frame) before the attack is released determine the final target.
• The last frame before the attack is released locks the trajectory.
• IF no final target is acquired sonic will preform a blast attack.

If possible I would like some clarity on "homing" such as the exact frame the homing attack chooses it's final target.

FYI counter frames are not invulnerable frames

 

[ynglink]

I'd also like to point out that I've noticed that Sonic's Homing Attack has a high priority vs. other aerial attacks. I don't know if this is true across the board or not, but in a lot of the match-ups I've played it's a very difficult thing to counter with just basic attacks.