Stuff About Puff

[username12345678]

Don't get throwed

when i read one of your post i feel its made out of gold. then i unwrap it and find that its just chocolate. but that's good too.

away (specifically down & away. except backthrow i think just never works so just Di kinda away and youll be fine)

thanks




also i think ledge is the end of the stage and edge is the thing you hang onto

 

[Massive]

Every time I would DI AustinRC's Marth's dthrow diagonal down he would just pivot-dash regrab me before I could tech, It's the most brutally annoying thing ever. Jiggs can also be pivot-dash regrabbed by fox if you DI his bthrow down and away, luckily not many people know they can do it.

If it's Fthrow at midrange % I say DI diagonally up/forward so they can't tipper fsmash. Getting hit with the wimpier fsmash hitbox is preferable to getting tippered or utilited.
You can eat a tippered fsmash even from a perfectly DI'd Fthrow at up to ~50% if they do a full length wavedash. This can be truly avoided with an airdodge, but if they wavedashed in and wiffed the smash, they will have a large frame advantage on you while you're in dodge animation (free fair, fsmash, utilt).

If you're getting thrown near the edge, try to aim yourself into the void, you are safe there.

Don't get throwed!

This is really the best advice for the whole matchup.

 

[crush]

I usually pause the game and look at the Marf players face and ask them if they're gonna attack me or grab me when I run up to them and shield. I then use my psychic powers to predict what they're gonna do and either run up and taunt (for mind games) or spot dodge the grab > rest

 

[Tekk]

I can't picture what a pivot dash is, can someone explain it to me please ?

 

[Massive]

It might not be directly using pivot mechanics (can you dash attack on pivot? I know if that's technically pivoting) but with the fox bthrow thing, he would usually turn and boostgrab me before I could even tell I was low enough to be regrabbed. We call it a the dmac grab here.

The marth one was just running and regrabbing.

 

[Tekk]

Oh okay, thanks.

 

[crush]

Resubbing even though I never play puff in tourney

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Magus said you can hold down and avoid marth's throw->fsmash combo but it was later proved that marth could pivot fsmash or wd fsmash at certain percents.

 

[unknown522]

Check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc15yRrEcvc

 

[Tekk]

Good stuff man, should be helpful, thanks!

 

[username12345678]

Check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc15yRrEcvc

oh wow is the whole upthrow+upair to rest thing reliable? CAN I START PUMMELING SPACIES?

 

[unknown522]

dunno about the rest part. Haven't tested it on human opponents yet.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Im surprised at how not-far fox moves from that uair. Are you sure he was DIing out?

 

[idea]

i was thinking that too, actually...i dunno how training mode works, is there any chance the Fox's DI changed when he got upaired?

 

[KirbyKaze]

CPUs on Evade in that situation DI the throw, but do NOT DI the attack (Uair, in this case).

It might LOOK like DI because of momentum, but Fox is not DIing the Uair.

 

[Tekk]

Oh boy we gotta do something about that Ylink matchup lol.

 

[genkaku]

Armada plays YL gayer than any puff has ever tried.
props to Hbox for coming so close, I would've just gotten angry and have had to forfeit.

 

[Tekk]

That's part of the game bro, you've gotta get over it. ^_^
I think more Nairs would've helped Hungrybox kill that Ylink's camping, as it would've just stopped the boomarang and the bombs.

Anyway, that 1% Time-out was pretty epic to watch hahaha

 

[Mahone]

Oh boy we gotta do something about that Ylink matchup lol.

I already have, i secondary falco lol

The reality is, its probably easier to learn the matchup with sheik or something, rather than practice the matchup with puff for years just so you can go even.

 

[Massive]

I would've just gotten angry and have had to forfeit.

This is what would've happened to me.

Every time I've been timed out in tournament I get so annoyed I don't want to smash again for weeks.

I've pull out kirby for ylinks.
It works surprisingly well.

 

[KirbyKaze]

I wouldn't get too worried. You guys can do this with Puff IMHO; Hungrybox didn't seem to learn anything from their Pound 5 set. Rolling to the same level as last time? Not trying to force a smaller stage (or one without platforms)? Trying to outcamp Young Link? Not using an effective shield game? Not constantly pressuring Young Link to high hell when he's in close proximity?

Such silliness.

 

[idea]

hey hungrybox...i was watching your set vs. mango's fox and, uh, how do you get so many grabs on him? i'm bad at that.

 

[crush]

wd back grab. duh. works every time.

 

[SummerSpeedyMix]

I completely agree with KK. I like to think of YL as a crappy marth with projectiles in terms of how to fight him. Spacing is key, since you need to be able to dodge the stuff he throws out at you, but if you play a good shield game, you will be able to defend yourself. The thing with YL is that if you're not the one approaching, you're going to lose, and it's a bit scary to approach but if you can dodge his stuff and get within his comfort zone, you can spank him around, like marth. It's not an easy matchup, but in no way is it in YL's favor. Also, most of his moves have such long animations that you can punish him reasonably well. YL is not a hard counter to jiggs.

 

[username12345678]

so how useful is sing instant edge-hogging?

can you guys do it consistently?

 

[crush]

so how useful is sing instant edge-hogging?

can you guys do it consistently?

its incredibly useful and i do it incredibly consistently

 

[idea]

tbh it's probably better to transfer that effort into spacing bair better

 

[Tekk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2RfRYoXg

Any thoughts, anyone ?

 

[KirbyKaze]

You guys play on LSD?

 

[Mahone]

you don't????

 

[idea]

well...you were kinda being too aggressive and jumping around too much vs. sheik, but you won anyway he should probably have spent more time waiting for you to miss fullhopped aerials and fairing you.

the same problem came up vs. falcon but he's a better character at punishing that. either you didn't approach falcon far enough in, and he dash danced and punished you, or you tried to cover an aerial space near you which falcons really don't jump into, and got punished for that too. to put it another way...you were being too vertical and not horizontal enough. falcon is so fast, there's no need for him to jump at you recklessly when he can just run around and wait for something better to come up. you have to follow him around so he won't have the space he wants to run. [this whole paragraph can pretty much be summarized as "spacing"]

also falcon wants to get below you so he can upair and stuff. so don't jump up so high. full hop is kinda bad against falcon.

more generally, don't be so hasty with rests, you keep going for them assuming it'll work, but jiggs has enough time after a hit to tell if rest will actually combo or not. i mean, still react quickly, but REACT, don't just rest the place you think they're going to go.

the ones you got that seemed really sudden were good but, it's funny, usually when jigglypuffs can get surprising rests like that they also have the above problem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2RfRYoXg&t=4m9s this was a free rest, no one ever hits that tech. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2RfRYoXg&t=5m46s this too, super obvious roll. and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kd2RfRYoXg&t=6m14s.

edit:
- it's usually best to dthrow falcon
- *don't pound so much* i know it's tempting, but it's so punishable...and even though it was working against this guy it's pretty much unnecessary to use against falcon
- edgeguarding...hold the edge more often...get up from it faster against sheik
- against both CROUCH MORE. crouch > shield against both sheik and falcon

i know these are little additions but the pounding and crouching things are very important, lol

 

[Tekk]

You guys play on LSD?

"LSD" is the name of the crew which hosted the smashfest.

Thanks a lot Idea, I will work on all that for BEASTII, gotta represent the puffs.

 

[genkaku]

shortened illusion - easy to deal with or no?
'cause I don't have a problem punishing at all and I'm a little perplexed on how it can be difficult outside of very specific situations.

 

[Mahone]

not really... if you try that hbox **** and crouch rest the illusion... they can shorten on reaction

I mean... its a mixup right? How can u punish shortened while not getting hit by unshortened?

 

[genkaku]

I space (on stage) in the middle so that I can punish the endlag with a fsmash or rest and react to the shortened with a bair. Got to be quick, but I've not had too much trouble. Most of the time I bait one or the other.
If I'm offstage I nair along the path.

I play with kinda' inexperienced people, though, which might be part of why I'm confused.

 

[Mahone]

If they sweetspot with the shorten i don't think you can hit with a bair from onstage, but mabye you are doing a really late one that hits it idk...

But it sounds like if you are in the middle you will only get a uncharged fsmash off in time to punish not shortened, which they will just di at low percents...

if you could just get a vid of what you are doing that would be much more helpful

 

[idea]

if you wait at the edge and nair it covers both...just sayin'.

i consider resting their illusion in the middle of the stage a hard read...meaning you have to commit to it anyway. it doesn't cover that option very well if you do it more than a few times per match. i mean, the only reason they're illusioning right on top of you is that they think you're going to move out of the way they could easily have done something else.

not saying it doesn't work, but it probably shouldn't be a main part of your edgeguarding. maybe if you live around really illusion-happy spacies.

 

[Mahone]

if you wait at the edge and nair it covers both...just sayin'.

i consider resting their illusion in the middle of the stage a hard read...meaning you have to commit to it anyway. it doesn't cover that option very well if you do it more than a few times per match. i mean, the only reason they're illusioning right on top of you is that they think you're going to move out of the way they could easily have done something else.

not saying it doesn't work, but it probably shouldn't be a main part of your edgeguarding. maybe if you live around really illusion-happy spacies.

I don't think nair will cover both if they sideb at max height

Also, there are just situations where you hit them and they are going to side-b and you don't have time to position yourself to cover both

 

[KirbyKaze]

Nair and Fair trounce illusions.

Shield is upgraded in PAL vs Sheik because you can attack OOS on a lot of her ground moves and her grabs don't really do anything. If she uses aerials then she can be safe, but that opens up room for WD OOS shenanigans and similar timing / spacing games. And you only need to win a few exchanges to kill her; one decent Rest setup or edgeguard is all it takes.

Crouching is still fabulous, though. Because it does the same sort of stuff.

 

[idea]

i can't really think of such a situation...maybe if they do it fast and catch you off guard...but then the point was that it was fast anyway, and positioning doesn't really come into question when you don't have any time to pick a position.

on the lower platforms, well, if you wait on a lower platform you can cover every option imo, just poorly for some. like if you wait on a platform and fox illusions to the edge...you can try to fall down and fair in front of the edge, but it's hard to react to. also, if you're on the ground and fox recovers to a platform and doesn't die, it's not necessarily your fault, his recovery is actually decent

in any case, usually best to face forward.