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Taj is the best Mewtwo (Ask Taj Stuff Thread)

Magnawolf

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
197
Location
San Diego
Mewtwo's recover is too fast for me. I can't point the direction I want to go in fast enough. Halp.
 

Cloud9157

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 11, 2009
Messages
298
Location
Chicago, Illinois
Scrub question, but do you see any good in Usmash being used as a punish for bad recovery from Fox? It seems the Usmash catches him whenever he Fire Foxs at Mewtwo.

Seems to only trade hits when Fox hits Mewtwo from below though.
 

Shadow Huan

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
2,224
Location
Springfield, MA
I like all of m2s throws. f throw is bad but its cool. still if ppl di away at the edge expecting d throw you get aight distance. but they are high up :(
Well F-throw is actually slightly useful against the iceclimbers if one is on the platform and the other is in your clutches... Nana doesn't DI she just eats it up.

mind you D-throw is better against the IC's but they're the only char that I've ever had romotely good F-throw results against. and usually i didn't even mean to F-throw. lol

Scrub question, but do you see any good in Usmash being used as a punish for bad recovery from Fox? It seems the Usmash catches him whenever he Fire Foxs at Mewtwo.

Seems to only trade hits when Fox hits Mewtwo from below though.
I love the U-smash, and I have to say that it's good for intimidating the Fox with your frame perfect skills by catching them in it (Works against side B as well), but for a punish it's not good against the fast fallers.

GalaxyBlast (or Burst depending on where you've read the name) has decent priority; it will eat through Peaches D-smash from below, it's capable of stopping Link's Dair and several other moves, and it can kill some floaties @ over 100% off the top if you're slick/lucky enough to land it.

Although it gives you good cover from above, there's no protection for M2's body from the sides or below, and it has a TON of wind down time (36 frames or more) leaving you a sitting duck, as opposed to the D-smash, which is IASA frame 38 out of 59 total frames.

Long story short, it's a situational move with it's utilities, don't abuse it.
 

Clint_Eastwood

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Messages
140
Location
It's Super Secret
Taj is the best falcon. Discuss.
How about no.

I STILL think confusion is underrated guys. I use it on Fox sparingly and it seems safe at medium percents; like 50 or 60. I don't feel comfortable using it unless I'm under a platform most of the time though. Oh, and it ***** Link, serious.

Mewtwo's forward throw is great if your opponent is thrown against a wall. Most of the time they tech it and then things go bad, but sometimes they will get caught in your stream of purple ball things. When that happens they can take quite a bit of damage.
 

AXE 09

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 3, 2006
Messages
3,825
Location
Avondale, AZ
Even if every single shadowball hits from the Fthrow, I think it's still M2's weakest throw in terms of damage. Am I right?
 

KAOSTAR

the Ascended One
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
8,084
Location
The Wash: Lake City
yea f throw isn't strong. but I love when ppl di away at the edge. I swear u can di the multi shadow shots.

confusion isn't safe at ANY percent. I still **** with it tho. occassionally I wd and confuse ppl who are shielding.

but at low percents and them a bit higher. its probably ok to use to "make them bair" and u cc punish.
 

AXE 09

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 3, 2006
Messages
3,825
Location
Avondale, AZ
Vman and Taj have shown me that confusion is safe if your opponent's under a moderately low platform (like on PS or YS). Other than that... I don't think it's safe lol. But it can still be good if your opponent doesn't know how to punish it. Most people will try to tech, I think.

This was all probably already discussed before. Sorry guys lol.
 

KAOSTAR

the Ascended One
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
8,084
Location
The Wash: Lake City
Oh tru dat. they land on the platform and cant bair.
If you disable the "boost" its harder to be punished when u pull ppl thru surfaces as well.

Good call aXe.



whats really ****. is using DJc on platforms at perfect heights. you can still do **** like upthrow fair regrab on spacies if there is a low platform like BF YS FoD PS. Of course they are DI dependent but I think there are possibly still some mixups that can be done on reaction when they DI so the fair doesnt work.

These last few days Ive been trying to experiment alot more with platform scaling combos from low percent instead of the standard start combos from the ground and finish in the air. Ive been ****ing around with using the djc-N auto cancel [also Idjc-F/Idjc-N] to land on platforms and extend combos by eliminating extra jump and fall times.

Ive always had a weak platform game. only really used them to move on top or ledge cancel. but Im gonna try to use the platforms alot more in my comboing and general gameplay alot more. just being technically more efficient, FF everything (unless unneeded) DJc to fall early, dropping throught platforms instead of jumping. idk I was just sittin here watching mewtwo teeter and I really wanna just make him do more because I know he can.
 

omgwtfToph

Smash Master
Joined
May 28, 2008
Messages
4,486
Location
San Jose
Taj, I understand you used to play the **** out of World of Warcraft. Why did you do this?

No, seriously. This week, one of the main smashfest organizers in Kansai "closed up shop", and the community's kind of had this wake-up-call, like, "****, we need to actually grow and attract people." How does this happen?

First of all, there's something fundamentally different about getting someone to play a game like, say, Super Mario Galaxy, than Super Smash Brothers. If I say to a friend, "Yo, you gotta play the new Super Mario Galaxy 2," he can buy it, play through it, experience every level and every secret, and be done with it in about 2-3 weeks, and have had a great time. If I say, "Yo, you gotta get into Melee and come to tournaments," I'm not just asking him to get the game SSBM and play through it. I'm asking him to dedicate himself to a community, and dedicate himself to improve and sharpen his game. No competitive smasher can say that smash isn't a part of his life.

And asking someone to dedicate himself to a video game sounds absolutely ****ing ridiculous, when you step back and think about it.


But wait, I thought to myself. People willingly dedicate themselves to certain video games all the time. They start even start playing these video games with the full knowledge that the game is going to be an addictive timesink... These games are MMORPGs.

I want to revitalize the smash community in Japan, and take my experience from that to hopefully bring in a new wave of players in America, too. So ultimately, I want to somehow take the hype that people seem to get from games like WoW, and "convert" that to SSBM.

So what is it that attracted you to WoW and why did you dedicate yourself to it for such a long time? Do you think that, be it in the present or the future, that it will be possible to attract people to fighting games in the same magnitude that people are attracted to MMORPGs like WoW? And don't act like it's possible to play a game like WoW without dedicating yourself to it on a much greater scale than SSBM. A friend of mine in washington had to quit Guilty Gear because our fests coincided with his guild's raid nights.....
 

earla

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Messages
1,422
tips on approaching falco? i get stuck in shield too frequently.

tips on dealing with lasers?
 

DelxDoom

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
1,555
I'm not a hardcore mmorpg player, toph. But I think there's a sort of basic idea of real teamwork/specialization in mmorpg teams (guilds?). Also, not to knock on these games or anything, but it doesn't seem like you need to develop a lot of skill for these types of games, just a ton of time. But I think the community/teamwork/specialization is a big part of mmorpgs.

You might have already thought of this. Just wanted to put it on forumtype.
 

omgwtfToph

Smash Master
Joined
May 28, 2008
Messages
4,486
Location
San Jose
That's what keeps people playing, but what gets people started? Most people KNOW that if they start playing WoW, it's going to be a massive time commitment. Why do they start in the first place?

Taj? >.> Or anyone else who played WoW for a long *** time.
 

ynnek123

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Belgium, Antwerp
That's what keeps people playing, but what gets people started? Most people KNOW that if they start playing WoW, it's going to be a massive time commitment. Why do they start in the first place?

Taj? >.> Or anyone else who played WoW for a long *** time.
I didn't really play wow for a long time, but i've played another mmo for 3 years. The thing that really gets you started and keeps you in the game is seeing your character develop, and getting stronger and stronger. Much like melee, really, except that in melee you can't really get good by yourself and you have to have friends who are good at the game themselves.
In MMOs, if you get into the guild everything comes by itself. So I would say it's mostly the learning curve that melee has that keeps people from dedicating themselves. Think about it, would you like to play a game for the first time and get ***** by everyone, not even knowing what's happening?
 

omgwtfToph

Smash Master
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Messages
4,486
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San Jose
yeah, i did. i started playing melee in 2008, after brawl came out

i guess a lot of people don't like to put in work for something that's supposed to be mindless entertainment (video games) but literally the most boring thing i've ever done in a video game was level up a character in ragnarok online when i played that MMO in 8th grade. i mean, yeah there's a learning curve to melee but at least you get to do cool combos and stuff. grinding in MMOs is sooooo gay. so what do people honestly enjoy about it? and how do you translate that into getting people into a fighting game? it can't be THAT hard....
 

Fried Ice Cream

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 31, 2010
Messages
569
Location
Funkadelica ๏̯͡๏﴿
I've played WoW for a while, and I think the biggest reason that people put so much time in it because it's nearly 15 dollars a month. They feel like they need to play a lot to make it worth the money they put into it. In reality, they're looking at it the wrong way. I asked my dad if he wanted to give me 6 months for the game, cost him about 60 euros, he was up for it.
Normally, a video game costs about 50 euros, but I'm easily finished with those games within 3 months (exceptions being Smash games :p).
I realized this while playing, so I didn't play a whole lot. After the 6 months were over I felt like I shouldn't get any more, because I knew if I renewed more than once, I'd end up in a cycle.

Still, it was pretty fun. Talked to a lot of people, enjoyed playing a lot of different classes, and I even made money off selling my WoW account with 4 level 80's and a load of Heirlooms/money xD. Got me about 80 euros for it, I was happy.
 

ynnek123

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Belgium, Antwerp
yeah, i did. i started playing melee in 2008, after brawl came out

i guess a lot of people don't like to put in work for something that's supposed to be mindless entertainment (video games) but literally the most boring thing i've ever done in a video game was level up a character in ragnarok online when i played that MMO in 8th grade. i mean, yeah there's a learning curve to melee but at least you get to do cool combos and stuff. grinding in MMOs is sooooo gay. so what do people honestly enjoy about it? and how do you translate that into getting people into a fighting game? it can't be THAT hard....
The thing is that in MMO's, at the start you manly fight against computer opponents which are weaker then you, so you get encouraged. However in smash, when you start out and someone wants you to play competitively, you get discouraged because everyones you play against has alot more skill then you. You could play against cpus, but then that's discouraging as well because you have to train and get better first before you actually can "get into the game" (playing against real people), and we all know how boring it is to practice l-cancelling, wavedashing and all the other stuff in training mode.

So I think the problem is that smash wasn't meant to be competitive but just a fun game, so theere's a high learning curve before you can really start playing. On the other hand, in MMO's, you are meant to learn while playing, so the game is fun from the start, and you learn how to get better while actually playing the game like it's meant to be played(assuming you generally like MMO's of course, cause if people hate grinding they won't play any MMO, likewise if people don't like fighting games they won't play melee).
 

Taj278

TIME TO GET PAID!
BRoomer
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MT. OLYMPUS, Arizona
WoW is different from other MMOs in that it actually has a fairly large Player vs. Player scene. Only 25% of the total WoW player base even steps into arenas, but at least 50% of the player base engages in some kind of PvP content from time to time, like battlegrounds, twinking, and ganking.

I honestly wouldn't give two ****s about World of Warcraft if it wasn't for PvP. WoW would still have over 8 million subscribers, but I only play the game to kill people. For me, it was my new Diablo II. All I did was make characters for pvp. It was enjoyable to me.

I just got back from Blizzcon, and I got second place in the Steel Series Fan 2v2 tournament out of 64 teams. It was a lot of fun taking my **** talk, my lingo, and my knowledge of competitive gaming into a WoW Lan tournament. The game has a decent amount of depth despite its balance issues and some of the developer's ******** ideas of game balance, but it is actually the social aspect, just like why we travel across the country or around the world to play SSBM.

It is genuinely fun to work together with, and play against people that have the same aspirations, love, and dedications to an activity that you do. Melee doesn't have the same fan-base that WoW does, and I'm actually a minority in the way that I play. I'm one of the best players on my server and in the battle group, but only the hardcore pvpers actually know me. I tend to keep to myself and just kill people in my spare time for little to no benefit.

A lot of people quit and come back to WoW for various reasons, kind of like Melee players. They get tired of the game, they get discouraged because they think they're not improving, they found something better and more interesting to do, or they got in a fight with teammates or guildmates became upset.

WoW brings in new content to help maintain its player-base, and it is a mostly online community so most people can handle the conflict a bit better than something that might happen locally for Melee players as well.

I'm genuinely good at WoW, I know a lot about the game in a similar way that I know a lot about Melee. I mostly play it because I feel like I'm too good to quit and I just generally like playing games that I'm good at. :) The dedication usually comes from just liking something. THere is a niche for everything, and since WoW appeals to more groups of people than SSBM does, it can easily attract more kinds of people.

Some people despise fighting other players or are terrible at it, so computer stomping like raiding (Which I hate) is a lot more attractive to them, and that Player vs. Environment sense of accomplishment from clearing through content with your guildmates gives the majority of that player base incentive to play and only some of them might dabble in the content that I'm interested in.

SSBM was originally designed with the party game in mind, and as a minority, we turned it into a competitive platform fighting game, and most of us were very excited about Brawl following that up, but Nintendo didn't really care about it's hardcore competitive player-base like Capcom cares about the Street Fighter players.

So what we got was an even more party-focused game and the minority once again tried to make it competitive, but then it split the community that loved Melee and the players that want something new or wanted to break into the scene of the new revamped game.

We just have to really show how amazing Melee is, keep it fun for people learning to play and encourage them to learn and develop on their own. Not many people really want to do it for this game, but that's just the way it is... As much as I love Starcraft, I just think I'm not cutout for competitive play on the same level as the pros. Fortunately, the game is very spectator friendly in my opinion, and a lot of people like me have just as much satisfaction watching games.

If possible, I would hope Melee also gravitated toward that e-sport mentality, so that people don't feel as obligated to play, but they can still support their favorite players by watching, and messing around casually with their other amateur smash friends.
 

SpeedGhost

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 14, 2010
Messages
67
Location
Toronto, Ontario
Hey Taj, I've bin looking through your character match-up guide, but I'm still having alot of trouble playing samus. They seem to decide to just camp the sh*t out of my with missiles and bombs and I'm having a tonne of trouble dealing damage due to the lack of combo possibilities I suppose.

The last time I tried to teleport spam the projectiles and bb shadowball all over the place, but It just seems my approach is covered off on all sides. Maybe I'm just experiencing a natural side effect of the matchup, but it just seems so ****ing hard to get inside and deal damage. Other then little one-piece's I get in before they drop some bombs down, my main offense just comes from throwing them off the edge and edgeguarding..
Basically, I know this is long-winded, but is there some secret you could share with me that would help a mewtwo player against campy samus's?

Any advice is really appreciated man. Shadowclaw series inspired me to pick up mewtwo btw... I was a SSB64 player until then..
 

V3ctorMan

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Messages
2,261
Location
Sierra Vista AZ
Taj... you're Mewtwo is amazing...

Just letting you know.......
....................................















again...............XD
 

Rubyiris

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
6,033
Location
Tucson, AZ.
You're = You are.

Your = your.

Your sentence says "Taj, you are Mewtwo is amazing."

What's wrong with this picture? C:
 

Shadow Huan

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
2,224
Location
Springfield, MA
Isn't it ironic that mewtwo is heavy officially but is lighter than peach in melee? Lol boy peach is a heavy ***** if she outweighs a 270 lb pokemon... >_<
 

KAOSTAR

the Ascended One
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
8,084
Location
The Wash: Lake City
More upsetting really lol. But his lightweight does get him out of alot of bs. but vs like falcon and fox it puts him into more trouble than the avg floaty. M2 is a special breed, thats why I love this dude.

The left number is the calculated poundage while the right number is the official measurement from ssbm. Its actually number of capsules which each weigh 1 unit. So on the scale in the mushroom kingdom the character on one side vs X number of capsules on the other will be equal in weight.

370.3--- 117 --- (1) Bowser
360.8--- 114 --- (2) DK
348.11--- 110 --- (3) Samus
345.0--- 109 --- (4) Ganondorf
341.8--- 108 --- (5) Yoshi
329.1--- 104 --- (6-7) Captain Falcon / Link
316.5--- 100 --- (8-10) Dr. Mario / Luigi / Mario
297.5--- 94 --- (11) Ness
284.8--- 90 --- (12-14) Peach / Sheik / Zelda
278.5--- 88 --- (15) Ice Climbers (139.25 if equal weight)
275.3--- 87 --- (16) Marth
269.0--- 85 --- (17-19) Mewtwo / Roy / Young Link
253.2--- 80 --- (20-21) Falco / Pikachu
237.4--- 75 --- (22) Fox
221.5--- 70 --- (23) Kirby
189.9--- 60 --- (24-25) Jigglypuff / Mr. Game & Watch
174.1--- 55 --- (26) Pichu

M2s official weight was the benchmark for consistency in this set
 
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