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TDB: SEASON 2! LEON (RE4) vs LARA CROFT

Spydr Enzo

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We're not playing with aura, we're not playing with PP, we're not playing with steel.

If diddy's got oranges then he wins.
Wow... some people take this too realistically...

If the character can use a certain ability in their respective game, that would be realistic in their case. If the character has certain characteristics in their respective game, that would also be realistic in their case. If you want to argue that Lucario can't use aura because its not a real life situation, then why are we even having this debate? Lucario wouldn't exist, Diddy wouldn't be wearing clothes, and he certainly wouldn't have a barrel jetpack on his back.

Diddy's footstool can take out bosses and Krocs... Lucario's jump can't do ****

Pro diddy
As we've seen with the Snake vs. Wolf debate, bringing experience into this doesn't help things. Who cares what Diddy can do to bosses and ckocs? He's a protagonist, the game was made so he would win!

And are you seriously basing this on jumping ability? How about real fighting, like strength, size, power, special abilities, AURA...
 

highfive

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Hmm. I'd say Diddy since there is always a plot device to save the silly, humor containing character of a series, and Diddy is a primate, therefore revealing that sooner or later antics such as banana peels and fecal matter would be involved, forcibly making Lucario retreat due to heavy odors and vertebrae problems. Generic stereotypes, it works b****es.
 

uhmuzing

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Hmm. I'd say Diddy since there is always a plot device to save the silly, humor containing character of a series, and Diddy is a primate, therefore revealing that sooner or later antics such as banana peels and fecal matter would be involved, forcibly making Lucario retreat due to heavy odors and vertebrae problems. Generic stereotypes, it works b****es.
:laugh::laugh: You're not taking this seriously. Let it be known that plot devices amount to nothing here.

 

MXblaze

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Hmm. I'd say Diddy since there is always a plot device to save the silly, humor containing character of a series, and Diddy is a primate, therefore revealing that sooner or later antics such as banana peels and fecal matter would be involved, forcibly making Lucario retreat due to heavy odors and vertebrae problems. Generic stereotypes, it works b****es.
A single aura sphere would annihilate diddy before he can even pick up a banana peel
 

Sieguest

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We're not playing with aura, we're not playing with PP, we're not playing with steel.

If diddy's got oranges then he wins.
You can't take out steel..it's part of what makes lucario..... lucario
Lucario is a fighting/steel type... so the steel stays...sticking to canon...
Diddy loses...
 

Spydr Enzo

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Hey Joe - its your thread. Does Lucario get to use Aura or not?
I'm not JOE, but Lucario without his aura? Thats just plain ridiculous. Ness and Lucas got to use PSI. Wolf got to use unrealistic space weapons. Bowser is a gigantic fire-breathing turtle with studded bracelets, a spiky shell, and a red mullet! Just because Lucario was paired with a weaker character doesn't mean he can't use aura. If its one of his characteristics, he should be able to use it.
 

Sieguest

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I'm not JOE, but Lucario without his aura? Thats just plain ridiculous. Ness and Lucas got to use PSI. Wolf got to use unrealistic space weapons. Bowser is a gigantic fire-breathing turtle with studded bracelets, a spiky shell, and a red mullet! Just because Lucario was paired with a weaker character doesn't mean he can't use aura. If its one of his characteristics, he should be able to use it.
^ this...is truth...:)
diddy got nothing on him...
 

uhmuzing

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I'm not JOE, but Lucario without his aura? Thats just plain ridiculous. Ness and Lucas got to use PSI. Wolf got to use unrealistic space weapons. Bowser is a gigantic fire-breathing turtle with studded bracelets, a spiky shell, and a red mullet! Just because Lucario was paired with a weaker character doesn't mean he can't use aura. If its one of his characteristics, he should be able to use it.
Exactly what I'd have said.

EDIT: I still want to know if Jiggs would be better for Diddy...
 

sneakytako

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Under Donkey Kong Country rules, toadstool = death
But lets consider this matchup under pokemon rules


Spyder calls out LUCARIO

Sneakytako calls out DIDDYKONG

DIDDYKONG uses TNT Barrel (diddy goes first because he runs faster in brawl lawl)

Its Super Effective! (because its fire based... more lawl)

LUCARIO faints. (because TNT barrels are pretty ****)

diddy ftw


And are you seriously basing this on jumping ability? How about real fighting, like strength, size, power, special abilities, AURA...
Wow... some people take this too realistically...
Well I at least agree with statement two...
 

Sieguest

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Under Donkey Kong Country rules, toadstool = death
But lets consider this matchup under pokemon rules


Spyder calls out LUCARIO

Sneakytako calls out DIDDYKONG

DIDDYKONG uses TNT Barrel (diddy goes first because he runs faster in brawl lawl)

Its Super Effective! (because its fire based... more lawl)

LUCARIO faints. (because TNT barrels are pretty ****)

diddy ftw






Well I at least agree with statement two...
Actually...i think in a pokemon way it'd be
DIDDYKONG uses TNT Barrel
It's super effective
because Lucario has mega **** defense he doesn't die
Lucario heals a little using leftovers
Lucario use force palm
DIDDYKONG takes Iunno 45% of damage and is paralyzed
Lucario moves again because diddykong's paralysis kills his speed
Lucario uses Aura Sphere
It's super effective
Enemy diddy kong faints
Lucario gains 452 exp points
Lucario grew to level 74
 

Spydr Enzo

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Under Donkey Kong Country rules, toadstool = death
But lets consider this matchup under pokemon rules


Spyder calls out LUCARIO

Sneakytako calls out DIDDYKONG

DIDDYKONG uses TNT Barrel (diddy goes first because he runs faster in brawl lawl)

Its Super Effective! (because its fire based... more lawl)

LUCARIO faints. (because TNT barrels are pretty ****)

diddy ftw
You still don't seem to understand. This isn't going under the rules of any game, this isn't based on characters experiences in their own games. All it is is the pitting of two characters in battle where they use their abilities from their games, and have the same characteristics from their games.
 

sneakytako

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All in good humor... diddy really doesn't have much to work with here lol.

But add some mudslaps in there and some lucky misses and Diddy might have a chance Marthage :p
 

_clinton

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People...game mechs aren't made for a "real" fight...and Lucario is faster than Diddy or about even because of what is said by the pokedex about his younger self...

Also the only part of Lucario that is part steel happens to be his claws and such...the games also have never said he has super strength as well I might add
 

Spydr Enzo

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People...game mechs aren't made for a "real" fight...and Lucario is faster than Diddy or about even because of what is said by the pokedex about his younger self...

Also the only part of Lucario that is part steel happens to be his claws and such...the games also have never said he has super strength as well I might add
About the steel part, we know that. But we are using it to prove that its better than anything Diddy Kong has (a wooden gun that shoots peanuts :ohwell:).

And when I mentioned Lucario's strength, I was only saying that Lucario has more strength than Diddy. I never said he had super strength (but if someone did and I didn't notice, sorry).
 

Snowstalker

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Diddy has a peanut gun (which may or may not be useful, depending on how fast the ammo can move), and a JETPACK. As far as I know, both of those things are scientifically possible. Judging from the fact that he's a middleweight in Mario Kart Wii, I'd say that he's between 90 and 100 lbs. How much does Luke way, like 150? Plus, TNT is pretty useful in a realistic situation.
 

Spydr Enzo

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Diddy has a peanut gun (which may or may not be useful, depending on how fast the ammo can move), and a JETPACK. As far as I know, both of those things are scientifically possible. Judging from the fact that he's a middleweight in Mario Kart Wii, I'd say that he's between 90 and 100 lbs. How much does Luke way, like 150? Plus, TNT is pretty useful in a realistic situation.
Yeah, but don't get too realistic. Lucario can still use Aura which pretty much overpowers a wooden gun that shoots peanuts or a Jetpack thats made out of barrels.

And anyway, if this was a real life situation, than wouldn't the flames of the Jetpack start the wood on fire and eventually burn Diddy, considering he's strapped to it?
 

Sieguest

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All in good humor... diddy really doesn't have much to work with here lol.

But add some mudslaps in there and some lucky misses and Diddy might have a chance Marthage :p
:laugh: maybe...I'll throw in a critical hit for diddy and call it game :)

anyway: @clinton (from a couple of pages ago) you miss the point...because lucario is part steel...physical attacks are pretty...errr...ineffective...and it's not like Diddy can fire a hyper beam or something.

@Snowstalker- TNT is pretty predictable...I'm pretty sure Lucario won't stand there and let Diddy throw TNT at him...:)
 

uhmuzing

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Lucario is also more adapted to fighting where Diddy isn't. Lucario is an especially powerful pokemon and Diddy's just...not.
 

JOE!

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Im back again (im on vacation, so only late nite and early morn posts from me)

@Spyndr Enzo,

We know these guys would not truly exist in a real world setting, but what we are trying to do is bring them into one.

We sometimes add in little bends to make it more interesting, like how ness and lucas both had PSI, but that was to make the fight more interesting, seeing as they both had it, and gave no super-******** advantage to either one.

In the same light, going by the straight-up game canon just as it sayd, and not editing it for the real world will be broken. For example, pikachu would never be able to produce as much electricty to kill something, based on his size and where the "pouches" would be


now, onto the matchup here:

:lucario: : 3'11" 119lbs

:diddy: 3'5" ~ 100lbs
-NOTE- Diddy's stats are based upon the fact that canonically, he's not that small compared to DK, which is reckoned to be well over 6' if he stood up. The weight is based off that of a large baboon, which diddy is kindof, seeing as he cannot be a chimp with his tail.

There isnt much of a size difference, but build-wise: Diddy would be stronger due to ape musculature, and more agile. Lucario would be swifter, and have better technique.

who would the brains go to?
 

Sieguest

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Im back again (im on vacation, so only late nite and early morn posts from me)

@Spyndr Enzo,

We know these guys would not truly exist in a real world setting, but what we are trying to do is bring them into one.

We sometimes add in little bends to make it more interesting, like how ness and lucas both had PSI, but that was to make the fight more interesting, seeing as they both had it, and gave no super-******** advantage to either one.

In the same light, going by the straight-up game canon just as it sayd, and not editing it for the real world will be broken. For example, pikachu would never be able to produce as much electricty to kill something, based on his size and where the "pouches" would be


now, onto the matchup here:

:lucario: : 3'11" 119lbs

:diddy: 3'5" ~ 100lbs
-NOTE- Diddy's stats are based upon the fact that canonically, he's not that small compared to DK, which is reckoned to be well over 6' if he stood up. The weight is based off that of a large baboon, which diddy is kindof, seeing as he cannot be a chimp with his tail.

There isnt much of a size difference, but build-wise: Diddy would be stronger due to ape musculature, and more agile. Lucario would be swifter, and have better technique.

who would the brains go to?
I think Lucario wins in the brain section...I mean if that thing can talk to someone...without even opening its mouth...that's some brainpower! :)
 

Spydr Enzo

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I still don't really understand... So if we're bringing it into a REALLY REAL REALISTIC setting, then wouldn't Diddy be a dumb monkey? The only thing he can do is throw fruit.

And since Lucario doesn't even exist, I have no clue what he would do...

I'm so confused... :dizzy:
 

Sieguest

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I still don't really understand... So if we're bringing it into a REALLY REAL REALISTIC setting, then wouldn't Diddy be a dumb monkey? The only thing he can do is throw fruit.

And since Lucario doesn't even exist, I have no clue what he would do...

I'm so confused... :dizzy:
I'll try to clear it up...
The situation is realistic...the characters brought into are not...characters keep their physical attributes...and are given certain special attributes ONLY if that attribute has been consistently shown canonically in that character! :)

it's like saying we had a machine that dragged Nintendo characters to the real world and pit them against each other...only to the characters' horror that some of they're awesome powers are gone...except a select few..:)
 

Spydr Enzo

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I'll try to clear it up...
The situation is realistic...the characters brought into are not...
it's like saying we had a machine that dragged Nintendo characters to the real world and pit them against each other...only to the characters' horror that some of they're awesome powers are gone...except a select few..:)
Okay, but no one ever specified WHICH powers were gone, so...
 

Sieguest

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Okay, but no one ever specified WHICH powers were gone, so...
Think of it like this...in the Lucario vs. Diddy matchup
Lucario won't have an arsenal of pokemon moves like Force Palm or Iron Tail
He might have Aura Sphere just because Lucario has always been associated with Aura in canon.

Diddy Kong...well there is nothing too out of whack "special" about diddy kong...he's just an heroic monkey that has plenty of tools to use...and he's always had them so he should be able to use them! :)

btw I edited the post above yours if you want to look back at it..:)
 

JOE!

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I still don't really understand... So if we're bringing it into a REALLY REAL REALISTIC setting, then wouldn't Diddy be a dumb monkey? The only thing he can do is throw fruit.

And since Lucario doesn't even exist, I have no clue what he would do...

I'm so confused... :dizzy:
primates are NOT dumb, just compared to humans.

Diddy has consitantluy shown his smarts throughout his games in being able to solve puzzles, use tools and even operate machinery. He has also regularly taken on opponents much bigger than him using his agile fighting style (the crocs, bosses, etc)

Quick edit:

Lucario doesnt have the "aura" as we know it, but he can use a sort of "focus chi" we'll call it, that gets him pumped for battle.
 

Sieguest

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primates are NOT dumb, just compared to humans.

Diddy has consitantluy shown his smarts throughout his games in being able to solve puzzles, use tools and even operate machinery. He has also regularly taken on opponents much bigger than him using his agile fighting style (the crocs, bosses, etc)

Quick edit:

Lucario doesnt have the "aura" as we know it, but he can use a sort of "focus chi" we'll call it, that gets him pumped for battle.


Justification for bolded statement?
 

JOE!

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^

martial atrists usually focus their "chi" by yelling out and moving in a certain way to maximize adrenaline and to set their mind to the battle.
 

Sieguest

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^

martial atrists usually focus their "chi" by yelling out and moving in a certain way to maximize adrenaline and to set their mind to the battle.
I'll accept that...(Aura's a way better name!:laugh:)

So..I still stand by the topic of what will Diddy do against Lucario...>_>
 

payasofobia

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I'll accept that...(Aura's a way better name!:laugh:)

So..I still stand by the topic of what will Diddy do against Lucario...>_>
Without Aura and martial arts only... Diddy would take a rock, take lucario down and begin smashing the rock on lucario's face. Lucario dies with a desfigured face.

Chimpanzees are much stronger than humans and can take adult humans down pretty easily because of their massive strenght, speed of their tackles and weight. If Lucario is not much bigger than diddy then the task is much more simplified for diddy. Also, chimpanzees cause alot of human deaths a year because of how vicious they are.

And, depending on which martial art Lucario has, then it may be:
A) purely aesthetical or for non-fighting situations.
B) made for ritual fights against other practicioners of the style or
C) to defend yourself from other HUMANS. (AKA *ss kicking)

And I bet Lucario's fighting style is purely aesthetical because of 'making your chi flow' crap.

Lucario is another one of those characters that would get totally screwed if they fought in the real life.
 

payasofobia

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Oh, and Diddy is smarter than Lucario because he can make high-tech stuff out of leaves, wood and fruit. Lucario talks with humans, becomes a pet ad doesn't afraid of anything.
 

adumbrodeus

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Without Aura and martial arts only... Diddy would take a rock, take lucario down and begin smashing the rock on lucario's face. Lucario dies with a desfigured face.

Chimpanzees are much stronger than humans and can take adult humans down pretty easily because of their massive strenght, speed of their tackles and weight. If Lucario is not much bigger than diddy then the task is much more simplified for diddy. Also, chimpanzees cause alot of human deaths a year because of how vicious they are.

And, depending on which martial art Lucario has, then it may be:
A) purely aesthetical or for non-fighting situations.
B) made for ritual fights against other practicioners of the style or
C) to defend yourself from other HUMANS. (AKA *ss kicking)

And I bet Lucario's fighting style is purely aesthetical because of 'making your chi flow' crap.

Lucario is another one of those characters that would get totally screwed if they fought in the real life.
Seriously? So many bad assumptions here.

A) Basically doesn't exist. Even stuff lik Tai Chi is a fighting art, just a number of people practice it for other reasons. Speed it up and it still works in a fight.

B) Yes, that happens, they're relatively rare these days, much more common are ones that are used as a sport. Many of the openly practiced styles like this have been adapted enough that they are usuable against other styles for self-preservation purposes.

C) Yes, this is the most common style HUMANS have. However you're making an assumption here, that just because it's built to fight humans means that it won't work against things that aren't humans. Honestly, that's mostly restricted to grappling only styles, because way too much depends on specific joint configurations and mass distributions. For Grappling it depends on how close they are to humans.

That said, striking styles are fine, in most cases, humans just lack the speed and/or strength to successfully execute them against animals. However, it's obvious that the fist-striking styles would work given the speed/strength required when we look at the fact that our weapons styles consistently destroy animals. A well-trained human with a sword>>>>chimpanzee.



Furthermore you forgot:

D) A style built to fight other Lucarios. Definitely a more practical variation on c, because Lucarios aren't exactly known for fighting humans. Still, this is highly unlikely, so...

E) A style built to fight a wide variety of animal form creatures. By far the most likely because this is what Lucario actually DOES, Lucario fights other "animals", aka pokemon. His fighting style would therefore be mostly striking based, and built to be as effective on various forms of opponents as possible.


BTW, "Chi flow" is just a mystical explanation for natural attributes, when you're pumped up, you have adreneline flow, when you strike from the ground, you get more force. While aura is a real force in the pokemon world, Lucario is a trained fighter reguardless. They may over-emphasize his "mystical" abilities in Brawl, but in pokemon, he's a balanced fighter in terms of physical and special abilities.

And "chi" certainly isn't the mark of a style built to show off, but if you're manipulating others' chi, it's a style that works only on humans, but there's concrete biological explanations why it works.


Lucario definitely doesn't have a have a human build, if you look at him, it's far closer to that of a big cat (panthers and such, not domestic cats). He also has extremely large legs, which means they're powerful, and based on the configuration they're built for leaping and short term very quick running. Whatever martial arts he has is obviously gonna be based on that.

Furthermore, he's got longer legs, that are obviously much more powerful (look at the muscular configurations, can you say, "kicks like a horse"?), and large protruding spikes on his paws, as far as natural weapons, he's definitely got the upper hand.

That right there's enough to guarantee his victory, combination of superior natural weapons, superior speed, and superior training (fighting type, remember?), and not techniques built to take down specific different creatures (like humans) but instead techniques built to take down animals.


If that's not enough, he's steel type. Good luck getting through his natural armor diddy.



Oh, and Diddy is smarter than Lucario because he can make high-tech stuff out of leaves, wood and fruit. Lucario talks with humans, becomes a pet ad doesn't afraid of anything.
That doesn't show tactical superiority, you're dealing with something bred to fight, vs. an inventor. And the thing bred to fight has shown that it can speak on a level equal with humans. Tactical superiority goes to Lucario.

BTW, I move for Diddy's "inventions" to be stricken, they wouldn't work IRL.
 

_clinton

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Oh, and Diddy is smarter than Lucario because he can make high-tech stuff out of leaves, wood and fruit. Lucario talks with humans, becomes a pet ad doesn't afraid of anything.
I'm sorry...but Diddy did not make high-tech stuff out of leaves, wood, and fruit...Crankey and Funkey did...

And Lucarios are willing to give their lives for their human allies...its more than just a pet...relation...because Lucarios are almost never seen by humans normally...

Without Aura and martial arts only... Diddy would take a rock, take lucario down and begin smashing the rock on lucario's face. Lucario dies with a desfigured face.
Right...because Lucario's spikes are just for show...they may be the only part of Lucario that is steel...but they sure do make their use known...good luck tackling a Lucario because of the steel chest spike...you'd have to get behind Lucario...which is a creature that when younger V

Chimpanzees are much stronger than humans and can take adult humans down pretty easily because of their massive strenght, speed of their tackles and weight. If Lucario is not much bigger than diddy then the task is much more simplified for diddy. Also, chimpanzees cause alot of human deaths a year because of how vicious they are.
cross 3 mountains in a night...you thinking Diddy is more phys. built than a Lucario is funny
 

daisho

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Does diddy get exploding orange nades? If not, I can't see how a chimp would beat a martial arts expert who has claws and knows tai chi... tai chi is pretty cool.
 

JOE!

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^

break his bones maybe?

does Lucario have grasping fingers/thumbs to hold onto Diddy?

Sure, he can strike, but can he grapple? Also, how flexible is he? can he reach behind him?
 

Sieguest

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Without Aura and martial arts only... Diddy would take a rock, take lucario down and begin smashing the rock on lucario's face. Lucario dies with a desfigured face.

Chimpanzees are much stronger than humans and can take adult humans down pretty easily because of their massive strenght, speed of their tackles and weight. If Lucario is not much bigger than diddy then the task is much more simplified for diddy. Also, chimpanzees cause alot of human deaths a year because of how vicious they are.

And, depending on which martial art Lucario has, then it may be:
A) purely aesthetical or for non-fighting situations.
B) made for ritual fights against other practicioners of the style or
C) to defend yourself from other HUMANS. (AKA *ss kicking)

And I bet Lucario's fighting style is purely aesthetical because of 'making your chi flow' crap.

Lucario is another one of those characters that would get totally screwed if they fought in the real life.
I'll throw this out there Lucario is still a partial steel type..good luck to diddy trying to dent that...

@Joe- Lucario is quite the gymnast in my view....although he may not have the appendages to grabble..he does have those spikes on his hands...and a chest tackle won't help diddy due to that spike coming out of Lucario's chest...
 
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