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Teams - Why you should sometimes let yourself die

FoxoF

FoxoF

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
59
So I've seen on so many videos that one of the team mates is on very high %, and he spends like 30-40 seconds getting juggled about, recovering, and shielding excessively, and not dishing out any real damage at all.

And then he dies.

For this 30-40 seconds, it has basically been 2v1 against his team mate.

This got me thinking, does anybody feel that at high % in teams, you should try to play more aggresively than normal, as this is the only way to utilise your stock properly? And not excessively postpone the KO when your bro is getting whooped.

I see a lot of people shielding and being too scared to attack properly, because they feel that if they do, they will just die.

This theory applies more to some characters, like Marth, who just takes so long to recover, and applies less for others, like falco, who generally doesn't live that long as his recovery is no good.
 
Omni

Omni

You can't break those cuffs.
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 10, 2004
Messages
11,635
Location
Maryland
It depends on the team comp. And usually percentages. And alot of other things.

If your teammate is a person who can easily handle and disrupt a 2v1 (i.e. Fox) then you should simply focus on holding on to your stock. Peach, for example, at high %'s becomes extremely hard to kill if she's avoiding kill moves.

If your teammate is a person who can't easily handle or disrupt a 2v1 (i.e. Marth) then, yes, you should be playing aggressively all the time.

Every character serves a different role in teams and that role can change based on playstyle and the team comp. Marth tends to be more of an opportunist in teams placing himself in strategic positions that avoid a 2v1 whereas Fox tends to be more of a disrupter intentionally placing himself in 2v1 scenarios to split/isolate the opposing team so that his partner can capitalize.

tldr; Depends on team comp. Holding on to stocks for more volatile teammates can be a good thing. Holding on to a stock for a teammate that can't handle 2v1 is bad.
 
Lovage

Lovage

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 15, 2007
Messages
6,746
Location
STANKONIA CA
ya i used to think about this but it's only worth doing in like 1% of cases

it's only worth killing yourself if you're at like 130% and you keep getting baired off stage and taking 15 second to recover while they 2v1 your partner.
 
Mahone

Mahone

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 19, 2010
Messages
2,940
Location
Blacksburg, VA
Omni is right, it's all about team comp... if ur teammate is a fox, i would never suggest killing urself

I'd say some obv. spots to do this are like... if you are popo at 130 and you just keep getting hit off and having to recover when ur teammate is like falcon and getting 2v1d

I think this strat is interesting, i've thought about it and it seems like it should work, but in my experience, i never needed to make it work, because most teams don't actively try to just abuse the fact the other character is at high percent... they just try to kill the 200% peach, instead of hitting her off and 2v1ing, which is likely a better strategy
 
Omni

Omni

You can't break those cuffs.
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 10, 2004
Messages
11,635
Location
Maryland
Mahone said:
Omni is right, it's all about team comp... if ur teammate is a fox, i would never suggest killing urself

I'd say some obv. spots to do this are like... if you are popo at 130 and you just keep getting hit off and having to recover when ur teammate is like falcon and getting 2v1d

I think this strat is interesting, i've thought about it and it seems like it should work, but in my experience, i never needed to make it work, because most teams don't actively try to just abuse the fact the other character is at high percent... they just try to kill the 200% peach, instead of hitting her off and 2v1ing, which is likely a better strategy
Click to expand...
In Singles.
Pick Fox.
Go Dreamland.
Get 1-2 stock lead vs. character that can't chase you (IC's, Peach, Ganondorf).
Get them to about 100%.
Run circles around them.
No kill moves.
Bwahaha.
 
Mahone

Mahone

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 19, 2010
Messages
2,940
Location
Blacksburg, VA
lol, what a ****...

i remember everlasting yay talking about how once he timed out uberice's popo on yoshi's with fox by just like running around cuz its popo lol
 
Juggleguy

Juggleguy

Smash Grimer
Premium
Joined
Aug 16, 2005
Messages
9,354
Location
Ann Arbor, MI
It's not necessarily about "letting yourself die" in those situations, just playing the situation right. If you're hanging out at the ledge and chipping in some damage to the other team because they don't have full control over your partner, then you should keep playing that role at a high percentage. If you're only getting tossed around and being forced to recover repeatedly, then you should be more aggressive in looking for an opening and trying to do the most with it before dying.

A much better example is if the game has come down to the final three stocks for each team, with one team consisting of a clearly stronger singles player and a clearly weaker singles player. If the stronger one has one stock at super high % and the weaker one has two stocks at super high %, then it might be worth letting yourself die as the stronger player so you can take your teammate's fresh stock and prepare for a 1v1 or 1v2 vs the other team.
 
CloneHat

CloneHat

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
2,131
Location
Montreal, Quebec
Omni said:
It depends on the team comp. And usually percentages. And alot of other things.

If your teammate is a person who can easily handle and disrupt a 2v1 (i.e. Fox) then you should simply focus on holding on to your stock. Peach, for example, at high %'s becomes extremely hard to kill if she's avoiding kill moves.

If your teammate is a person who can't easily handle or disrupt a 2v1 (i.e. Marth) then, yes, you should be playing aggressively all the time.

Every character serves a different role in teams and that role can change based on playstyle and the team comp. Marth tends to be more of an opportunist in teams placing himself in strategic positions that avoid a 2v1 whereas Fox tends to be more of a disrupter intentionally placing himself in 2v1 scenarios to split/isolate the opposing team so that his partner can capitalize.

tldr; Depends on team comp. Holding on to stocks for more volatile teammates can be a good thing. Holding on to a stock for a teammate that can't handle 2v1 is bad.
Click to expand...
Good point in the OP, and this post is really true.
 
Prince_Abu

Prince_Abu

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 19, 2009
Messages
1,008
Location
Midwest
as puff a lot of the time when im at high % i go for a risky rest cause im gonna die soon anyway so i try to make the most of my life
 
B

Bl@ckChris

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 4, 2009
Messages
7,443
Location
Greensboro, NC
has anyone seen l0zr play teams?

that guy is 100% balls in, especially at high percents lol. i wouldn't say he lets himself die, but he sure isn't ever afraid of getting tossed around haha.
 
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