The 3DS Version experience and Wii U Version experience.

[BluePikmin11]

This thread took nearly 2 hours to write and think. Also sorry if all the information is not organized.

Refer to this: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=15210307&postcount=107

The 3DS Version has characters before the SNES era. This version acts as a retro training experience. There would be a special exclusive training mode, where an original guide character (like Chop Chop Master Onion) would teach you how to play and master SSB in different trials. There's multiplayer and online as an extra. There could be a story mode that once completed for each retro character, you are be able to transfer the character to the Wii U version, feeling like a rewarding experience. The story mode for each character is themed for each single character. Your starting roster is the 5 most popular known characters (Mario, Link, Kirby, etc.). As you beat story mode with these characters, you unlock more retro characters to train as. You can also transfer characters from the Wii U version, as they also get their own, themed story mode and there own training mode if you want to 100% complete the 3DS version. There is also exclusive trophies for this version that you can transfer. Unfortunately, there is no extra modes like All-Star Mode or Homerun Contest that Brawl had. There are exclusive stages available in this version, but luckily you can transfer it to the Wii U Version This version overall is focused on that players of old and new can be a great Smash player, or that they want transfer the exclusive stuff thats in this version for completionists.

The Wii U Version is basically the package, it has all the modes Brawl had, it's the casual, social experience. This version has characters that had their debut after the NES era. It's basically for the players who born in the 1990's or the young people who wanna play as Pikachu or Sonic. It has the Adventure Mode (Much like SSE), unlike the themed story mode in the 3DS version. The story should be SSE like, but with actual dialogue and great story. The adventure mode has 5 difficulties, but it gets slightly harder if more players join in. I'll say one extra about this mode, there are extra missions if you transfer the characters from the 3DS version. There is also online rankings and the ability to share custom stages with others.
The Wii U version overall is the basically the first sentence I said about the Wii U version.

What do you think?

 

[kikaru]

Trading content between consoles is definitely an interesting idea but I feel like the main bulk of the roster, if not all the characters, should be available to both consoles without requiring the other. Content such as stages, music, character customization, event matches, etc. would be more likely to work and stir less controversy on initial character exclusives.

As far as the roster goes you'll definitely need to cut down on some newcomers and reconsider a few characters you decided to cut.

Palutena, Little Mac, Pac-Man, Zoroark, King K., Ghirahim, Saki or Airan, Shulk, Ridley, Isaac or Matthew, and Bowser Jr. are all potential candidates in my opinion.

Additional newcomers you could consider are Toad, Lloyd Irving, Roy, and Chrom. (These four are definitely some of the stronger choices)

Ike, Snake, Lucas, Wolf, Lucario, and Toon Link were all cut.

Fire Emblem is a fantastic series (I recommend it) and definitely requires 2-3 spots on the roster. 1 spot will not do the series justice so a combination of Marth + X or Marth + Ike + X will definitely represent the series well. Depending on how well Chrom is received in the west can also affect his chances in appearing in the next Smash Bros as well. Overall, the series is highly praised, sells quite well, and has a strong fanbase on both eastern and western fronts. So reducing the series to one representative is not just.

I can see the exclusion of Snake since he mainly was a guest character in Brawl. But don't be so quick to knock him off as he was very well-received as a 3rd party character. Brawl was a goofy game in essence and Snake was able to contribute to that in his own way with the assistance of codecs.

I'm currently playing Mother 3 and so far, I would go as far as saying I might have to withdraw my consideration of cutting out Lucas from the roster. I cannot put much opinion of this at the moment.

Lucario and Toon Link are two cuts that currently make the most sense. Depending on the January 8th announcement a 5th generation Pokemon is most likely to replace his spot. (Or Mewtwo. Sakurai's decision) Personally, my replacement for Toon Link would be Majora's Mask Link where he can switch between Deku, Goron, and Zora forms. But Ghirahim, Skull Kid, or even another Link clone (Could be Toon Link) seem to also be possible options.

Also are you cutting out Sheik and Zero Suit Samus as well?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Trading content between consoles is definitely an interesting idea but I feel like the main bulk of the roster, if not all the characters, should be available to both consoles without requiring the other. Content such as stages, music, character customization, event matches, etc. would be more likely to work and stir less controversy on initial character exclusives.

As far as the roster goes you'll definitely need to cut down on some newcomers and reconsider a few characters you decided to cut.

Palutena, Little Mac, Pac-Man, Zoroark, King K., Ghirahim, Saki or Airan, Shulk, Ridley, Isaac or Matthew, and Bowser Jr. are all potential candidates in my opinion.

Additional newcomers you could consider are Toad, Lloyd Irving, Roy, and Chrom. (These four are definitely some of the stronger choices)

Ike, Snake, Lucas, Wolf, Lucario, and Toon Link were all cut.

Fire Emblem is a fantastic series (I recommend it) and definitely requires 2-3 spots on the roster. 1 spot will not do the series justice so a combination of Marth + X or Marth + Ike + X will definitely represent the series well. Depending on how well Chrom is received in the west can also affect his chances in appearing in the next Smash Bros as well. Overall, the series is highly praised, sells quite well, and has a strong fanbase on both eastern and western fronts. So reducing the series to one representative is not just.

I can see the exclusion of Snake since he mainly was a guest character in Brawl. But don't be so quick to knock him off as he was very well-received as a 3rd party character. Brawl was a goofy game in essence and Snake was able to contribute to that in his own way with the assistance of codecs.

I'm currently playing Mother 3 and so far, I would go as far as saying I might have to withdraw my consideration of cutting out Lucas from the roster. I cannot put much opinion of this at the moment.

Lucario and Toon Link are two cuts that currently make the most sense. Depending on the January 8th announcement a 5th generation Pokemon is most likely to replace his spot. (Or Mewtwo. Sakurai's decision) Personally, my replacement for Toon Link would be Majora's Mask Link where he can switch between Deku, Goron, and Zora forms. But Ghirahim, Skull Kid, or even another Link clone (Could be Toon Link) seem to also be possible options.

Also are you cutting out Sheik and Zero Suit Samus as well?

The roster was quite personal, and I picked characters of franchises I never heard of, but I made sure that it had the popularity to be a possible pick. Also no way I'm cutting ZSS or Sheik, I forgot to mention that. And I try to think like Sakurai too, even though the idea might sound strange.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I should also note:
Source: http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/04/26/change-coming-to-super-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds

"The key to that's going to be its dual support for 3DS/Wii U."

Sakurai, as well as Nintendo global president Satoru Iwata, had previously acknowledged his interest in linking the 3DS and Wii U versions of the game, which were announced simultaneously at E3 2011. "I'm really just getting started on this so it's going to take time, but I'll come up with something that uses that link as the game's central axis, so I hope you're looking forward to it."

So I can assume safely that trading content will be collectively important in the game and that my possible theory of two different experiences is very likely. Something to add about trophies, they could be separated into two categories, retro trophies for the 3DS version and new trophies forth Wii U version, if you know what I mean mentally.

Also note:
http://www.ign.com/articles/2011/06/08/e3-2011-early-super-smash-bros-details-revealed

Currently Sakurai's thought process is focused on the notion that a portable experience is a more personal one.

That's where my 3DS Version prediction of a personal experience shines.

http://www.nintendofuse.com/2011/06/09/new-super-smash-bros-details-arise/

However, Sakurai does not want to just expand the character roster, add more levels and enhance the graphics and call it a day. Instead, he wants to give players something different. For example, the 3DS version will have players battling and building their character up with battle rewards and the reason being for this is because the 3DS is a personal, portable system. The character can then be transferred over to the Wii U version of the game.

On bold, he wants a different experience for each version.
The one underlined also shows a good example of what possible ways the 3DS version can be different from the Wii U version. It's also noted again "because the 3DS is a personal, portable system."
So if you wanted a completely different experience for each version, you would have a completely different roster for each version, in order for both versions to feel special in their own way. So retro and new (roster) separate would be a possible idea.

And I'll note (As stated in many articles) that its going to take several years before the next Smash Bros release and that Sakurai wants people to wait, to make it worth the wait. So this mean the roster can be very big and bring many opportunities, even if my current, personal, predicted roster won't be the same as the future official roster (obviously a new popular franchise will come and have the popularity to have that new character join the fight). He said before in a way he doesn't want just spam 50 characters into one game, so technically dividing 25 characters that are different from the other 25 characters (adding the fact you can transfer characters) technically brings up a whopping estimate of 50 characters enough to satisfy and bring many new experiences.

 

[Dark Phazon]

So is the 3DS version gonna have alotta new chars and WiiU will have none or like 1-5?

What does it exzactly mean by customizing character?

Mii's?

Oww maybe like Mii you can customize it in Smash 3DS then trade over to WiuU smash

 

[BluePikmin11]

So is the 3DS version gonna have alotta new chars and WiiU will have none or like 1-5?

If you can see the roster I posted a link above, it shows what characters could be in each version seperated into different categories. its almost an even even roster, but it's just an example.

What does it exactly mean by customizing character?

It's basically skins of characters, but you customize what clothes and color they wear. It goes in-depth.

 

[Gene]

If Mario's on the 3ds version, why not the Wii U version? Veterans from smash 64-Melee that appeared since should be on both imo. It would be weird to have Mario playable on one and not the other for each games starter roster. Char transfer or not.

 

[Curmudgeon]

That roster is not even, the 3DS has the most famous Nintendo characters: Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, Yoshi, Wario, DK, Kirby, Metaknight, Dedede, Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, Samus, Pit...

 

[BluePikmin11]

That roster is not even, the 3DS has the most famous Nintendo characters: Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, Yoshi, Wario, DK, Kirby, Metaknight, Dedede, Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, Samus, Pit...

Remember how the characters were divided, characters who first appeared from NES and before era and the characters who first appeared after the NES era. It gives a retro feel to the 3DS version, and the new feel in the Wii U version.

 

[Frostwraith]

the problem with that roster is that it doesn't take in consideration those who might only buy one version... having big stars like Mario, Link, Samus, Pikachu, Kirby, DK, Luigi, Peach, Zelda, Bowser, King Dedede, Ganondorf, Meta Knight and Pit exclusive to one version is a recipe for disaster.

 

[BluePikmin11]

the problem with that roster is that it doesn't take in consideration those who might only buy one version... having big stars like Mario, Link, Samus, Pikachu, Kirby, DK, Luigi, Peach, Zelda, Bowser, King Dedede, Ganondorf, Meta Knight and Pit exclusive to one version is a recipe for disaster.

Then it would lose that retro feeling, unless the 3DS can handle lots of data, then we could have 55 characters total together, that's another idea

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

The 3DS version might not be able to handle lots of characters, but there is no reason for the wii u version to exclude characters like that

 

[Curmudgeon]

What if both versions have the same roster, but in the 3DS they have retro costumes. Because it will kill the retro feeling if the Link appearing is the Skyward Sword Link

 

[BluePikmin11]

What if both versions have the same roster, but in the 3DS they have retro costumes. Because it will kill the retro feeling if the Link appearing is the Skyward Sword Link

That's a good point, and a good idea..

 

[Frostwraith]

Then it would lose that retro feeling, unless the 3DS can handle lots of data, then we could have 55 characters total together, that's another idea

yes, but I don't think any of the characters I mentioned are 'retro characters', because they appear in both old and new games. Let's make a short analysis on the dates of their first title released and latest title released, shall we?

[COLLAPSE="Analysis"]Mario - Donkey Kong (1981), New Super Mario Bros. U (2012)
Link - The Legend of Zelda (1986), Zelda: Skyward Sword (2011)
Samus - Metroid (1986), Metroid: Other M (2010)
Pikachu - Pokémon Red / Blue (1995), Pokémon Black 2 / White 2 (2012)
Kirby - Kirby's Dream Land (1992), Kirby's Adventure Wii (AKA Return to Dream Land) (2011)
DK - Donkey Kong (1981), DKC Returns (2010)
Luigi - Mario Bros. (1983), New Super Mario Bros. U (2012)
Peach - Super Mario Bros. (1985), New Super Mario Bros. U (2012)
Zelda - see Link
Bowser - see Peach
King Dedede - see Kirby
Ganondorf - Zelda: Ocarina of Time (1998) (Gerudo form), The Legend of Zelda (1986) (beast form), Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3D (2011)
Meta Knight - Kirby's Adventure (1993), Kirby's Adventure Wii (AKA Return to Dream Land) (2011)
Pit - Kid Icarus (1986), Kid Icarus: Uprising (2012)
[/COLLAPSE]
All of these characters made apparences in games of this decade and are well-known Nintendo characters. any of them not being present in both versions of SSB4 would be a blasphemy. Do this same analysis to Yoshi, Wario, Fox and Marth to further understand my point.

The 3DS version might not be able
to handle lots of characters, but there is no reason for the wii u version to exclude characters like that

Agreed.

What if both versions have the same roster, but in the 3DS they have retro costumes. Because it will kill the retro feeling if the Link appearing is the Skyward Sword Link

this would be a great idea.

maybe in the 3DS version, Link would have his Ocarina of Time 3D appearence and in the Wii U version, his Skyward Sword appearence. with each look being transferrable between versions. maybe you could unlock his Twilight Princess appearence as well (or maybe his appearence from the Zelda HD Tech Demo, which was basically an HD TP Link?).

 

[BluePikmin11]

first appeared Frosty, I said it earlier.

 

[Frostwraith]

doesn't stop them from being well-known characters... >_>

isn't Smash Bros. a Nintendo All-Star mascot fighter? I think it is... no, I am sure it is. So, why would they limit big names like Mario, Pikachu, Link and Donkey Kong to only one version? it's bad for those who want to buy only one version and ruins the whole point of the game...

in other words, I find your lack of common sense disturbing.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Your Wii U roster's biggest names are Pikachu and Diddy Kong, I don't think that will sell

 

[Frostwraith]

that was my point. restricting big names to one version is a bad idea.

I would understand it for characters like Lucario or Falco, but not for big names like Mario or Pikachu.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I would understand it for characters like Lucario or Falco, but not for big names like Mario or Pikachu.

So it's going to be like Pokemon Smashred Version and Pokemon Smashblue Version?

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

So, in essence, the 3DS game is the Retro game and the Wii U game the Current game (like what Smash normally does)?

So Mach Rider, Mike Jones, Starman, Sheriff, Leaf, Takamaru, etc for the 3DS while there would be Isa, Micaiah, Chrom, Matthew, Andy, 2nd Gen Trainer, Shulk, Ghirahim, etc for the Wii U?

 

[BluePikmin11]

So, in essence, the 3DS game is the Retro game and the Wii U game the Current game (like what Smash normally does)?

So Mach Rider, Mike Jones, Starman, Sheriff, Leaf, Takamaru, etc for the 3DS while there would be Isa, Micaiah, Chrom, Matthew, Andy, 2nd Gen Trainer, Shulk, Ghirahim, etc for the Wii U?

Exactly. :3

 

[Frostwraith]

So, in essence, the 3DS game is the Retro game and the Wii U game the Current game (like what Smash normally does)?

So Mach Rider, Mike Jones, Starman, Sheriff, Leaf, Takamaru, etc for the 3DS while there would be Isa, Micaiah, Chrom, Matthew, Andy, 2nd Gen Trainer, Shulk, Ghirahim, etc for the Wii U?

Exactly. :3

As long as both versions have the more important all-star characters like Mario, Link, DK, Pikachu and Samus, it wouldn't be a bad idea. Otherwise it would be a complete failure of rosters.

 

[BluePikmin11]

As long as both versions have the more important all-star characters like Mario, Link, DK, Pikachu and Samus, it wouldn't be a bad idea. Otherwise it would be a complete failure of rosters.

Yeah, N30N said that earlier in a different thread, I think it's a good idea I never thought considering. (But its going to scare me if I don't feel that nostalgia)

 

[umegames]

I'm starting to wonder if the 3ds version is and will be a hindrance to the wiiu version. Making two smash games at once? Sakurai will have done an AMAZING job if he manages to chuck out both versions at high quality, with neither one suffering from lack

 

[Dark Phazon]

I'm starting to wonder if the 3ds version is and will be a hindrance to the wiiu version. Making two smash games at once? Sakurai will have done an AMAZING job if he manages to chuck out both versions at high quality, with neither one suffering from lack

100/ This.. big concern for me too.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Is there anymore ideas you guys wanna share about what the 3DS version should be like and what the Wii U Version should be like.

 

[ElvishSpirit]

Okay...lets be realistic here. Of course they are going to have classic smashers like mario or link on both games, anyone who argues against that has got the wrong idea on how smash bros works or has been.
That being said...I do like this idea. Think of a total 50 character roster. Put 35-40 characters in each game, making 10-15 characters from each game exclusive. Using your theory, make the focus of the 3ds game retro and wii u modern. Tada! Same theory, just not as unreasonable.


Edit: and yes, also trading characters from game to game also

 

[BluePikmin11]

Okay...lets be realistic here. Of course they are going to have classic smashers like mario or link on both games, anyone who argues against that has got the wrong idea on how smash bros works or has been.
That being said...I do like this idea. Think of a total 50 character roster. Put 35-40 characters in each game, making 10-15 characters from each game exclusive. Using your theory, make the focus of the 3ds game retro and wii u modern. Tada! Same theory, just not as unreasonable.


Edit: and yes, also trading characters from game to game also

Thanks for improving the overall idea, Maybe I just didn't realize earlier.

 

[ElvishSpirit]

I also made a character list to complement my version, ill be posting it when I get to an actual computer.

 

[RomanceDawn]

I'm starting to wonder if the 3ds version is and will be a hindrance to the wiiu version. Making two smash games at once? Sakurai will have done an AMAZING job if he manages to chuck out both versions at high quality, with neither one suffering from lack

If you think of it as both trying to be the same game then yes, one would hinder the other.

I'm guessing the exact roster between both but the game modes very different. Maybe an Adventure Mode for the Wii U and full on Story Mode for the 3ds. The 3ds version would certainly have more single player modes and experiences as was stated in the interviews.

The mechanics between both will almost undoubtedly be the same. So if one version plays like gold you can bet the other one will as well and that's what is most important. Single player Events flood the handheld while multilayer event matches could fill the U version. Stages could vary between them and as far as multiplayer goes that would probably be the biggest difference, that and C-sticking.

I'm not worried, I think this is honestly the best thing that could happen for us. I just can't wait to be on a trip, randomly passing someone with a 3DS and challenging them to a match.

 

[ElvishSpirit]

Okay, here is my personal example of your theory. I'd ask the focus not to be "oh, why did you pick Waluigi and not Toad blah etc" but rather how the concept works. I personally think that the line between retro and modern is 2000, which the OP thinks its 1990.

Edit: Oh, and besides Pac Man, because Namco is behind it, and Professor Layton, which I couldn't find a replacement, I left 3rd party characters out, not implying I don't want them in, but rather I didn't want to worry about them.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Okay, here is my personal example of your theory. I'd ask the focus not to be "oh, why did you pick Waluigi and not Toad blah etc" but rather how the concept works. I personally think that the line between retro and modern is 2000, which the OP thinks its 1990.

Edit: Oh, and besides Pac Man, because Namco is behind it, and Professor Layton, which I couldn't find a replacement, I left 3rd party characters out, not implying I don't want them in, but rather I didn't want to worry about them.

That's a pretty good example, I like that idea..

 

[BluePikmin11]

I got an idea for the 3DS and Wii U Version.
To make it feel retro, the 3DS version should have sprited graphics.
And the Wii U version could have the beautiful 3D graphics.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

I got an idea for the 3DS and Wii U Version.
To make it feel retro, the 3DS version should have sprited graphics.
And the Wii U version could have the beautiful 3D graphics.

That would be WAY too much work. Creating sprites is hard enough(hence why very few fighters use them these days), but doing them on top of using 3D models would be too much.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

@elvish and by extension OP
The flaw with this, besides the over ambitious roster count, is that you might as well add the "retro" and "modern" groups under dlc too as packs with the modern pack costing $60 and the retro costing $40. To fully experience the series' main draw, the multiplayer, you have to drop $100 assuming you already have both systems if not your wallet's in for some fun. And I'm making the assumption that when you say you can trade between versions you mean each version can hold the full roster once you have both versions. If you instead had in mind that neither version would exceed 40 characters at one point gg.

 

[BluePikmin11]

@elvish and by extension OP
The flaw with this, besides the over ambitious roster count, is that you might as well add the "retro" and "modern" groups under dlc too as packs with the modern pack costing $60 and the retro costing $40. To fully experience the series' main draw, the multiplayer, you have to drop $100 assuming you already have both systems if not your wallet's in for some fun. And I'm making the assumption that when you say you can trade between versions you mean each version can hold the full roster once you have both versions. If you instead had in mind that neither version would exceed 40 characters at one point gg.

The reason the Wii U version is $60 is because it has all the content Brawl had (and some new modes Sakurai might invent soon) It's the whole package..
The 3DS version is $40 is because it has limited features that I listed before in my first post..
Maybe you could unlock characters on the 3DS version through a Streetpass-like game, but it takes longer.
The 3DS version is a more personal one, it's a basically a trainer on the go game. From Elvish's roster perspective.. You could train yourself on the bus before the Super Smash Bros 4 Tourney starts, so when you get to APEX, you will be ready to kick their ***es.
And I got an idea, those exclusive characters should be unlockable characters, just to feel the exclusivity. The starting roster Elvish has seems good enough to satisfy everyone.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

I wasn't asking why the prices are what they are. My point for bringing up the prices was to point out how much you'd have to pay total if you want to play as all the characters. If the exclusive characters are truly exclusive and the only way to get them is to have both versions then you will have to pay $40 extra for the retro characters regardless of how many features the 3DS version has if you have the wiiu version or you will have to pay $60 extra to play as the modern characters regardless of how many features the wiiu version has if you have the 3DS version.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I wasn't asking why the prices are what they are. My point for bringing up the prices was to point out how much you'd have to pay total if you want to play as all the characters. If the exclusive characters are truly exclusive and the only way to get them is to have both versions then you will have to pay $40 extra for the retro characters regardless of how many features the 3DS version has if you have the wiiu version or you will have to pay $60 extra to play as the modern characters regardless of how many features the wiiu version has if you have the 3DS version.

Well if you payed attention to what I just said earlier, the amount of features given to 3DS not much, which is why it's $40. And I said before, you could play a Streetpass game that lets you unlock a character from the other version, which has all the features.
Characters literally are just $0.25 of the content Super Smash Bros contains.
Take Pokemon Black/White for example. Despite there being 649 Pokemon total, it was only $34.99.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Let me try to speak more clearly. You do not have to explain why you the prices are different. You can talk until you're blue in the face about how you'd justify separate price points and still will not effect my point. Let's set up a scenario. Bob just got a Wii u for his birthday and he goes out and buys ssb4. Oh no! Ice climbers has been his main since melee and he would like to use them again but they're not on his version. He's go online to download them, oh wait! They're only available on the 3DS version. Unlike if they were available for download or even the preferred scenario, available on the Wii u version by default, he has to buy the game again to play as them. See right now it doesn't matter why the 3DS version is $40 it just matters that Bob has to pay $40 to play as ice climbers. Yes the 3DS version will have less features than the WIIu version in this scenario but that doesn't change that he has to pay $40 to play as ice climbers. The 3DS isn't just a companion game in this case it is necessary to enjoy ssb4 in it's entirety or at least the game's main attraction in it's entirety (the multiplayer). $100=full character roster even though the 3DS version has less features I have to invest in it to play as all the characters, the reason most people buy smash bros. While the characters themselves are a snall part they are also the main draw. I guarantee you smash wouldn't be as successful without the mascots.



Also you just said unlock chars with street pass not unlock wiiou only chars with streetpass so that's on you. I thought you meant like mk7 where you can unlock chars through streetpass that you can also unlock normally. Now on to why that wouldn't work you'd need to be in a city filled with people who own both versions of the game, wgo transferred the characters over, and that carry their 3DS everywhere.