"The Aura is Mine!" Lucario Social Thread! (With More Moderators!)

[Swift Fox]

Not. a. chance. I may be sounding a little cryptic, but most will agree that Lucario will not over shadow most of the original 151. Aside from one movie, when was Lucario ever treated like a poster child? And Victini appeared in a BW promotional trailer and Zoroark, but that doesn't mean they're mascots. Don't get me wrong, I like Lucario. It's a member of my original Pokemon Diamond team, but I feel like he's already gotten his chance in Smash, and he's among the most likely to get cut.

Typical Genwunner's response...

I honestly don't think Lucario going to get cut because of number of reasons we mentioned in earlier posts. (please re-read and PLEASE give it a second thought, because whatever you're saying can hardly proven anything.)

Lets just conclude that Lucario will not going to get a cut for Mewtwo and Mewtwo has very little chance to be in SSB4.

That is all.

 

[Deleted member]

But characters ARE going. And compared to the rest of the roster, he'll probably be one of the first realistically speaking. When has Sakurai shown any special treatment to Lucario or Pokemon in general? The fans don't want him to go, but will be undoubtedly will be satisfied with Mewtwo in his place. Only reason Lucario got said attention is because he was in Brawl. this does not make him one of the most significant pokemon. And it's safe to say the same could be said about numerous pokemon from gen 1-3. Still well liked, but not getting any special representation. Why else would he bring back Mewtwo, if Lucario wasn't going? He picked Lucario at the time because he was relevant at the time, and the same could hardly be said now. I predict about 4 cuts from Brawl, and Lucario is 2nd on the chopping block. It isn't impossible, but if Mewtwo is announced its probably best to say he's gone.

You have no proof that Brawl veterans are getting cut. Even if we do see cuts, based on how much Sakurai despise cuts, he will keep them at a minimum and try to save as many as possible. It is very unlikely we will see more than three veterans get the axe and Snake, Sonic and Toon Link will likely go before Lucario because unlike Lucario, they would actually go for reasons other than time constraints.

If Sakurai/the Pokémon Company picked Lucario because of relevance, don't you think that would mean they would want Lucario back? Even if his generation has been gone for years, the Pokémon itself is still relevant and still appears in advertisement so it would make sense that they would want Lucario back for a 2nd time around.

Mewtwo and Lucario are not mutually exclusive. As said before, Mewtwo and Lucario were planned to co-exist during pre-Brawl; it was just that Mewtwo was cut due to time constraints. With both Mewtwo and Lucario being relevant now, it'd make a lot more sense for the Pokémon Company to get them both in rather than axe Lucario due to not being the mascot of the latest gen. Plus Lucario was a well-received unique character in Brawl so I'd figure Sakurai would want to keep him around as well.

 

[Silverjay323]

Typical Genwunner's response...

I honestly don't think Lucario going to get cut because of number of reasons we mentioned in earlier posts. (please re-read and PLEASE give it a second thought, because whatever you're saying can hardly proven anything.)

Lets just conclude that Lucario will not going to get a cut for Mewtwo and Mewtwo has very little chance to be in SSB4.

That is all.

Sakurai has already said he's putting Mewtwo into consideration, so "little chance" is inaccurate. Lucario will likely not be missed to the extent of Roy/Mewtwo. He also has a gimmicky ability with the aura, and the last pokemon with gimmicks,Pichu, got cut with that being one of the main reasons. I heeded your advice and read back, it seemed the popular reason for him returning was well, popularity. Popularity that has steadily died down since Brawl. Time for a new guy. 9/10 I believe Lucario will be replaced, then again, that's just me.

You have no proof that Brawl veterans are getting cut.

You have no proof that everyone's coming back, which is highly unlikely.

It is very unlikely we will see more than three veterans get the axe and Snake, Sonic and Toon Link will likely go before Lucario because unlike Lucario, they would actually go for reasons other than time constraints.

I understand Snake and TL but Sonic isn't going anywhere. He was the most anticipated character for Brawl, and with SEGA's current relationship with Nintendo,(3 nintendo exclusive game deal) Sonic's exclusion would probably be the biggest upset.

If Sakurai/the Pokémon Company picked Lucario because of relevance, don't you think that would mean they would want Lucario back? Even if his generation has been gone for years, the Pokémon itself is still relevant and still appears in advertisement so it would make sense that they would want Lucario back for a 2nd time around.

With that logic, Pichu is still relevant. But he's gone.

Mewtwo and Lucario are not mutually exclusive. As said before, Mewtwo and Lucario were planned to co-exist during pre-Brawl; it was just that Mewtwo was cut due to time constraints. With both Mewtwo and Lucario being relevant now, it'd make a lot more sense for the Pokémon Company to get them both in rather than axe Lucario due to not being the mascot of the latest gen. Plus Lucario was a well-received unique character in Brawl so I'd figure Sakurai would want to keep him around as well.

With X/Y how is Lucario going have any type of relevance anymore? He doesn't another reason for cut. Just my opinion again.

 

[Deleted member]

You have no proof that everyone's coming back, which is highly unlikely.

Except that I was never under the burden of proof of proving there won't be cuts, but when you say stuff like "Characters ARE going", that places you under the burden of proof that cuts will happen. Even when saying that it's highly unlikely that cuts won't happen, you've pretty much shown that you can't prove cuts will happen.

I understand Snake and TL but Sonic isn't going anywhere. He was the most anticipated character for Brawl, and with SEGA's current relationship with Nintendo,(3 nintendo exclusive game deal) Sonic's exclusion would probably be the biggest upset.

It depends on if Sakurai wants Sonic back. So far, there is no guarantees that guests from previous games will get to come back. It could happen, but we shouldn't be treating Sonic as guarantee unless we hear more information on whenever or not guests from previous games can return.

With that logic, Pichu is still relevant. But he's gone.

Pichu's inclusion in Melee had nothing to do with being the mascot of the 2nd gen but added as a joke character. This lead to Pichu being negatively received. The negative reception Pichu got in Melee was what likely lead to his removal, not being 2nd gen was over. Had Pichu actually been a popular character, Sakurai would have at least tried to bring Pichu back.

With X/Y how is Lucario going have any type of relevance anymore? He doesn't another reason for cut. Just my opinion again.

If Lucario is irrelevant, then we might as well axe Jigglypuff as well because he's even less relevant than Lucario is. At least Lucario was heavily promoted during 5th gen whereas Jigglypuff was not and who's to say that Lucario won't be promoted during the 6th gen as well?

 

[Swift Fox]

9/10 chance of Lucario being replaced? Hah, as if...

Also, I understand that Sakurai does indeed considering about Mewtwo for the next SSB4, but then again, there are two Mewtwo forms or maybe three forms (one could be for PKMN Y and one unconfirmed for PKMN X), this would be too much for Sakurai and drop Mewtwo.

 

[ItBeVoltage]

If Lucario is irrelevant, then we might as well axe Jigglypuff as well because he's even less relevant than Lucario is. At least Lucario was heavily promoted during 5th gen whereas Jigglypuff was not and who's to say that Lucario won't be promoted during the 6th gen as well?

I totally agree, wouldn't Jigglypuff be counted as a joke character for brawl? She wasn't very popular just like Pichu, Soooo you can see where I'm Going with this. (Kick jigglypuff out and make some room!)

As for Lucario, there is no reason to replace him. He and Mewtwo were suppose to be in Brawl, He is still Very relevant as Lucario is the Mascot of The Pokemon show in Japan, Still is very popular, AND is a Unique character. All of the arguments against lucario being in smash4 are irrelevant by this point. All of the evidence is present, but hey that’s just my opinion.

 

[IsmaR]

This "argument" is just silly, from both sides. I don't know why I feel compelled to get involved, but I am doing so anyway.

It isn't impossible, but if Mewtwo is announced its probably best to say he's gone.

I find it ironic considering you were defending Mother representation the other day, and back in pre-Brawl days this argument was used on why Lucas' confirmation all but "dis-confirmed" Ness. Feel free to believe whatever you wish, but nothing is final until the game is out.

Well, the problem is, Mewtwo is going to have yet another form. Sakurai wouldn't know how to handle Mewtwo with multiple forms into the next smash bros.

Lucario would be lot easier to work on than Mewtwo.

By that logic, Zelda/Sheik should've been dropped for Young Link in Melee. Forme changes (which aren't even confirmed for Mewtwo, at that) don't make a character necessarily hard to work with except in specific instances (3DS "issues" with Ice Climbers comes to mind). And really, you know what Sakurai knows how to handle? We're talking about the man that made this series possible in the first place. Seriously, I'm not sure how you reached that conclusion.

Typical Genwunner's response...

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. I'm actually for the inclusion of both, but you're making really hard to take the Lucario side seriously, especially when you resort to labeling the other side ignorant. Even discounting this particular post, all of your arguments just come off as "I LIKE LUCARIO BETTER REMOVING HIM WOULD BE STUPID EVERYONE WHO THINKS MEWTWO IS BETTER IS WRONG!"

With X/Y how is Lucario going have any type of relevance anymore? He doesn't another reason for cut. Just my opinion again.

If that's not enough, consider the fact that they made Lucario attainable BEFORE the 1st Gym Badge in Black 2/White 2.
That's not random, Nintendo realizes Lucario is popular and "relevant."

Edit: Are people seriously doubting Jigglypuff's popularity just because it isn't as "cool"? Jiggs has hella popularity in Japan alone. And it has a whole new Type to give it "Gen VI" relevance, on top of having Smash 64 veteran status. Maybe she was the joke character of that game, but there's a reason she's consistently returned. I really doubt it would suddenly stop now without good reason.

And I'm not even touching SSBF's arguments, which are the same no matter what the character, lol.

 

[Swift Fox]

I just heard there are YET another form for Mewtwo... Do you think Sakurai can handle that? If Mewtwo capable to change between only two forms was in SSB4, it would be very awkward when there is another form being around in 6th gen pkmn and not in SSB4.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Not. a. chance. I may be sounding a little cryptic, but most will agree that Lucario will not over shadow most of the original 151. Aside from one movie, when was Lucario ever treated like a poster child? And Victini appeared in a BW promotional trailer and Zoroark, but that doesn't mean they're mascots. Don't get me wrong, I like Lucario. It's a member of my original Pokemon Diamond team, but I feel like he's already gotten his chance in Smash, and he's among the most likely to get cut.

Black and White 2 kinda shoved him in there a lot with the anime promos, plus he did actually get a good number of promo from mystery dungeon games even before 4h gen I think.

He's in a lot of side games for the series Pikachu's park, etc.

Honestly he is kinda close for second mascot. Jiggs kinda get that probably more so, even though most of her popularity is from Japan compared to the states.

Edit: Jiggs kinda suffers in a way where she's kinda hard to stand out among the cast, Rest/multijumps, and Sing work but Rollout/Pound aren't really making her stand out. Heck Sing has problems with usage considering that it's hard to get it to land without a mindgame on someone off a ledge tactic or something.

That is the single reason I can see her getting cut, otherwise she has tons to back her up with staying.

 

[Silverjay323]

I find it ironic considering you were defending Mother representation the other day, and back in pre-Brawl days this argument was used on why Lucas' confirmation all but "dis-confirmed" Ness. Feel free to believe whatever you wish, but nothing is final until the game is out.

Lucas was intended to replace Ness in Melee, but due to Earthbound 64's cancellation he just appeared alongside Ness in Brawl. This is a different scenario. Lucario is a pokemon that could be easily replaced with too much displeasure to fans. Mother characters, however, can't.

If that's not enough, consider the fact that they made Lucario attainable BEFORE the 1st Gym Badge in Black 2/White 2.
That's not random, Nintendo realizes Lucario is popular and "relevant."

Still out of the entire roster, he and pokemon trainer have the smallest chance of returning.

If Lucario is irrelevant, then we might as well axe Jigglypuff as well because he's even less relevant than Lucario is. At least Lucario was heavily promoted during 5th gen whereas Jigglypuff was not and who's to say that Lucario won't be promoted during the 6th gen as well?​

​

But Jigglypuff is being promoted sixth gen because its now fairy type. Why won't Lucario be promoted? Why would he?​

 

[Starcutter]

it's very possible to have 5 unique reps, so I think that there will be. pikachu, mewtwo, jigglypuff, lucario and pokemon trainer would make a good rouster.

and that's my argument. mewtwo should not replace lucario, just be alongside him, due to both their popularity and their relevence.

i can also see him announcing lucario first just to troll the mewtwo fans, then announcing him in later.


EDIT: I found this picture on miiverse:

 

[gantrain05]

i don't think trainer is going anywhere...however, i think he WILL have different pokemon...afterall, the whole thing about pokemon is being a friggin trainer. but yeah....lucario just....isn't as popular as he used to be, and was never a huuuge deal in the first place. jiggs isn't going anywhere just for the fact that she's been a vet since 64. honestly the chances of lucario being cut are probably quite high. as for mewtwo returning i wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility, he's an original iconic pokemon that when wasn't included in brawl, made alot of people very upset. but given how so many pokes have had their own share of popularity, and possibly nintendo maybe wanting to promote a new pokemon game, by the time smash 4 is released we could have a pokemon in there we haven't even heard of yet, just so nintendo can advertise the next gen. dont forgot one huge factor for characters being included in brawl is to promote promote promote

 

[Gune]

First: stop with the "sakurai got mewtwo to replace Lucario" crap now, he already said he was NOT cutting charecter's outright only if time constraints happen. Second Sakurai said that noone has been cut so that even further proves my first point. Third when sakurai visited Pokemon company/Gamefreak do you really believe that lucario's name didnt come up in that conversation? Gamefreak love's the guy and so does a great majority of the pokemon fanbase especially in japan. Now how much sense would it be to cut a reliable new mascot that has been incredibly successful over his 8 years of existence? None what so ever.

 

[cephalopod17]

Lucario is still relevant and is still popular. Mewtwo is popular and has a good chance of appearing because of the new movie and form.

Also is it just me or would seeing these two fight in the adventure mode for SSB4 be awesome!

 

[Starcutter]

mewtwo vs lucario would be a great fight, especially if mewtwo is actually good this time.

 

[Swift Fox]

oops wrong thread

 

[CrusherMania1592]

I'd love to see a Mewtwo vs Lucario fight in SSB4. Would be interesting for story/event mode

 

[Toastie]

I think it's unlikely that Lucario will make it into SSB4. His role was to represent Gen IV, and I think he's served his purpose. I initially thought that Victini would replace Lucario, but now we're getting Gen VI, I think Mewtwo will probably be the replacement. Not only is it getting a new forme in X and Y, but it is one of the most requested characters, and certainly the most requested removed character. Because Mewtwo is a Gen I Pokémon, I think they'll change Pokémon trainer to his Gen VI equivalent.

 

[Deleted member]

I think it's unlikely that Lucario will make it into SSB4. His role was to represent Gen IV, and I think he's served his purpose. I initially thought that Victini would replace Lucario, but now we're getting Gen VI, I think Mewtwo will probably be the replacement. Not only is it getting a new forme in X and Y, but it is one of the most requested characters, and certainly the most requested removed character. Because Mewtwo is a Gen I Pokémon, I think they'll change Pokémon trainer to his Gen VI equivalent.

Lucario wasn't just to represent Gen IV. Lucario still remains highly popular to this day and continues to be heavily advertised (he was during 5th gen for sure). Even if he remains as the Gen IV mascot, he has made an impact far more significant than any 5th gen Pokémon could ever hope to achieve and the Pokémon Company still sees value in him.

And if they want to represent Gen IV, they can simply have Mewtwo's Awakened Form. No need to cause a huge backlash over the removal of Squirtle, Ivysaur and friggin CHARIZARD of all things.

 

[cephalopod17]

To me honestly Lucario is not going anywhere. He is still relevant and popular. Heck Riolu (and Lucario) were some of the first non-unova Pokémon announced to be capture-able in Black and White 2. Mewtwo could easily be put in as a Gen I and IV rep and not to mention he is the most requested character. (If not top 3) I am more worried about not getting a Gen V rep more than I am Lucario and Mewtwo getting in, as I liked Gen V just as much as Gen I and I do not want Gen V to get Gen III's treatment in SSBB.

 

[Toastie]

Lucario wasn't just to represent Gen IV. Lucario still remains highly popular to this day and continues to be heavily advertised (he was during 5th gen for sure). Even if he remains as the Gen IV mascot, he has made an impact far more significant than any 5th gen Pokémon could ever hope to achieve and the Pokémon Company still sees value in him.

I'm not denying Lucario's popularity. He is certainly one of the most popular Pokémon around, and I can see why he was chosen for Brawl. He was also a good replacement for Mewtwo, as they are similar in many respects. However, I think that Lucario's primary role was to represent Gen IV, just as Pichu's primary role was to represent Gen II. I don't think popularity alone will be enough for it to retain its place (Mewtwo being dropped from Brawl was a similar situation), although Lucario is certainly an interesting character, and he'll be missed if he does go.

And if they want to represent Gen IV, they can simply have Mewtwo's Awakened Form. No need to cause a huge backlash over the removal of Squirtle, Ivysaur and friggin CHARIZARD of all things.

To clarify, I assumed Mewtwo's awakened forme would be included as Mewtwo's final smash, and so I didn't think it would be deemed adequate representation for Gen VI, hence why I suggested a Kalos Trainer. However, you do make a good point about Charizard - it is commonly voted the most popular Pokémon in many polls. Personally, I'd prefer Kalos Trainer though, especially if Mewtwo returned, because the characters would be too Gen I-centric.

 

[Starcutter]

they are similar in many respects.

get out.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm not denying Lucario's popularity. He is certainly one of the most popular Pokémon around, and I can see why he was chosen for Brawl. He was also a good replacement for Mewtwo, as they are similar in many respects. However, I think that Lucario's primary role was to represent Gen IV, just as Pichu's primary role was to represent Gen II. I don't think popularity alone will be enough for it to retain its place (Mewtwo being dropped from Brawl was a similar situation), although Lucario is certainly an interesting character, and he'll be missed if he does go.

Mewtwo did not get replaced by Lucario since they were planned to both co-exist in Brawl. Mewtwo's cut was probably due to time constraints as he and Roy had the most data out of the cut characters and that Sakurai mentioned he has many characters he wanted to add but couldn't due to time constraints. Also, Mewtwo and Lucario barely share any similarities. Lucario, as I said, doesn't have just huge popularity but also being heavily marketed, so it's not like the Pokémon Company sees no value in him.

Pichu's primary role wasn't to represent Gen II, he was added as a joke character.

To clarify, I assumed Mewtwo's awakened forme would be included as Mewtwo's final smash, and so I didn't think it would be deemed adequate representation for Gen VI, hence why I suggested a Kalos Trainer. However, you do make a good point about Charizard - it is commonly voted the most popular Pokémon in many polls. Personally, I'd prefer Kalos Trainer though, especially if Mewtwo returned, because the characters would be too Gen I-centric.

Honestly, Mewtwo's Awakened Form is plenty adequate for representation, especially since Gen 6 is bound to get a lot of contents anyway. Mewtwo's new form still gets us Gen 6 representation, we don't need to have four Gen 6 representation. Sakurai doesn't look at representation the way most of us do.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

He was also a good replacement for Mewtwo, as they are similar in many respects

Get out. Lucario did NOT replace Mewtwo. He was removed due to the time constants. Don't know why people are still saying Mewtwo got replaced when they are nothing alike apart from two moves at least.

 

[1DeadRabbit]

*Creeps in*
May I add my two cents? (Eh, thread's a bit old, but what the hey?)

Now, I haven't read the whole thread, but I don't feel like I need to read it in order to understand just how emotionally charged this is.

We can throw around "Sakurai said this" and "Sakurai said that" all we want, but the truth is that right now, Lucario's return rests entirely on speculation.

I think there are plenty of good reasons for his return, and plenty of good reasons why he'd be dumped. Lucario may return because he's a popular character and Sakurai wants to avoid making cuts as much as he can. On the other hand he may be cut because there needs to be room for next greatest Pokemon, and it's anticipated that cuts will happen anyway (as stated by Sakurai). I mean, I know there are plenty of other reasons for both arguments, and plenty of counterarguments for those, but still. Fact is, we have absolutely no way of knowing right now beyond speculation.

But nobody likes a middleman! So I'll say this; If worse comes to worse and Lucario's cut, I'll probably bawl like a little baby, or at least be very saddened about it. I've only gotten into Smash Bros, and seeing as Lucario's my Main I won't take his exclusion very well. I mean, when you learn to play the game with a certain character only to find he won't be coming back, it's...well, you know...

 

[SpaceJell0]

*Creeps in*
May I add my two cents? (Eh, thread's a bit old, but what the hey?)

Now, I haven't read the whole thread, but I don't feel like I need to read it in order to understand just how emotionally charged this is.

We can throw around "Sakurai said this" and "Sakurai said that" all we want, but the truth is that right now, Lucario's return rests entirely on speculation.

I think there are plenty of good reasons for his return, and plenty of good reasons why he'd be dumped. Lucario may return because he's a popular character and Sakurai wants to avoid making cuts as much as he can. On the other hand he may be cut because there needs to be room for next greatest Pokemon, and it's anticipated that cuts will happen anyway (as stated by Sakurai). I mean, I know there are plenty of other reasons for both arguments, and plenty of counterarguments for those, but still. Fact is, we have absolutely no way of knowing right now beyond speculation.

But nobody likes a middleman! So I'll say this; If worse comes to worse and Lucario's cut, I'll probably bawl like a little baby, or at least be very saddened about it. I've only gotten into Smash Bros, and seeing as Lucario's my Main I won't take his exclusion very well. I mean, when you learn to play the game with a certain character only to find he won't be coming back, it's...well, you know...

All I want is for him to act like a FIGHTING TYPE and not so much like a psychic type. I want to feel like I'm controlling a martial artist w/ aura abilities, not a wizard with invisible punches :/

 

[1DeadRabbit]

All I want is for him to act like a FIGHTING TYPE and not so much like a psychic type. I want to feel like I'm controlling a martial artist w/ aura abilities, not a wizard with invisible punches :/

I can see that. He'd probably seem more like a fighting-type if his Aura ability wasn't so intrinsically tied up with his attacks. But alas.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

All I want is for him to act like a FIGHTING TYPE and not so much like a psychic type. I want to feel like I'm controlling a martial artist w/ aura abilities, not a wizard with invisible punches :/

This plus add the boneclub for a couple of moves or so.

 

[Swift Fox]

All I want is for him to act like a FIGHTING TYPE and not so much like a psychic type. I want to feel like I'm controlling a martial artist w/ aura abilities, not a wizard with invisible punches :/

Lucario from Project M felt more faster fighting with his physical attacks and aura effects are somewhat more visible to me, which are pretty good.

 

[Gune]

This plus add the boneclub for a couple of moves or so.

Yeah Bonerush is one of his best known signature moves next to forcepalm and aurashpere if they could work Bonerush and maybe even metal claw in he would be just perfect.

 

[Bowserlick]

They could take away the Aura mechanic as it is and have the B function in two different ways.

1. Charges a projectile just as it does now
2. Always charges and stores a Smash: So Lucario can either throw a charged shot or input a Smash and have it come out full power.

 

[DarkKry4]

I totally agree, wouldn't Jigglypuff be counted as a joke character for brawl? She wasn't very popular just like Pichu, Soooo you can see where I'm Going with this. (Kick jigglypuff out and make some room!)

As for Lucario, there is no reason to replace him. He and Mewtwo were suppose to be in Brawl, He is still Very relevant as Lucario is the Mascot of The Pokemon show in Japan, Still is very popular, AND is a Unique character. All of the arguments against lucario being in smash4 are irrelevant by this point. All of the evidence is present, but hey that’s just my opinion.

Pichu got the boot because he was a sucky clone no one played and Jigglypuff has an original moveset.

 

[Starcutter]

They could take away the Aura mechanic as it is and have the B function in two different ways.

1. Charges a projectile just as it does now
2. Always charges and stores a Smash: So Lucario can either throw a charged shot or input a Smash and have it come out full power.

but I liked the aura mechanic. that's what made me play him, because I had a good habit of avoiding strong hits while still getting hit by other random stuff, so my damage was usually pretty high.

if they take that away i wouldn't like him as much and would play diddy more instead.

 

[Gune]

but I liked the aura mechanic. that's what made me play him, because I had a good habit of avoiding strong hits while still getting hit by other random stuff, so my damage was usually pretty high.

if they take that away i wouldn't like him as much and would play diddy more instead.

Yeah the aura mechanic is what makes Lucario unique I would pretty sad to see his unique playstyle mechanic go not to mention its one of the reason why he should definitley stay.

 

[Swift Fox]

So I've been working on list with compilation of reasons ranging from the most clever reasons to the most dumbass reasons (especially the ideas from fanboys' attitudes for/against Lucario): contexts with Sakurai during his interviews, Lucario's relevancy in both Pokemon and Smash series, and the other reasons that might hurt/support Lucario's returning.

::OPPOSE - Outside of Smash series

• Mewtwo and Genesect are being promoted in latest Pokemon movie currently, plus Mewtwo got new form.
  • How can this affect to Lucario in Smash series: Mewtwo has potential to return to Smash again partly thanks to his new form. This could takes away one spot available from Lucario and other veteran fighters. There will be big backlash when Lucario didn't make it to SSB4, just like what happened to Mewtwo back in Brawl time. The only best solution is to have Lucario co-exist with Mewtwo. I'm sure Sakurai is starting to aware about this.

• Zoroark has been promoted in 5th gen but Lucario managed to be better than Zoroark for some obvious reasons, though.
  • How can this affect to Lucario in Smash series: Little to no effects on Lucario's returning, but for the worst case, Zoroark may make it to SSB4 (+Mewtwo or not) and cut Lucario out of the Smash series. And of course, there will be huge (and that word is still not enough to describe something) backlash about it, so Sakurai should knows so much better about this. This also goes the same for when there is Genesect instead of Lucario.

::OPPOSE - Within Smash series
clever reason

• Time constraints (Lucario on low priority is part of this reason)

awwright reason

• No 64 status
• Sakurai said there will be cuts (see 6th in SUPPORT section that counter this line)

stupid reason

• No Melee status
• Goes similar fate as Melee non-clone fallen fighter (Mewtwo) back in Brawl time
• Ignorant (anti-support Lucario fanboys) Genesect/Mewtwo/other pkmn supporters like Noah (don't look at me) Please give it a second thought when you try to remove Lucario from prediction roster in favor of another pokemon (except mewtwo), because it's true that Lucario is way more relevant than any more new Smash figher from the Pokemon series. The only way to remove Lucario is when there should be only 4 reps for Pokemon. If 5 pokemon reps can be done, Lucario should be in no matter what you think.

::SUPPORT - Outside of Smash series

• Popular to Pokemon series, he's (like) mascot next to Pikachu. This could be what helped Smash team to consider Lucario in for Brawl. (1/2)
• According to IGN's Top 100 Pokemon, Lucario is on 32th place, which is more popular than most Smash pokemon and speculated Smash pokemon in the Pokemon series except only Mewtwo and Charizard:
  • +Charizard 1st place
  • +Mewtwo 2nd place
  • Lucario 32th place
  • -Squirtle 46th place
  • -Pikachu 48th place
  • -Bulbasaur 52th place
  • -Zoroark 68th place
  • -Purin +100th place
  • -Genesect (unknown but I think it will be somewhere next to Deoxys 85th or just never gonna make it to top 100)

Ironic that Pikachu is more of a mascot than Lucario yet Lucario is more popular than Pikachu >_> (at least it's just IGN poll)
Even more ironic that Lucario and his trainer won over Ash in battle by beating Pikachu and his another pokemon alone in one anime episode. Goes similar to the poll that Lucario is on higher place than Pikachu.

• A protagonist in Pokemon movie (2006)
• Lucario's popular/fanbase never goes down

::SUPPORT - Within Smash series
clever reason

• Brawl status
• Not a clone
• Sakurai is against cuts
• Never been a fallen fighter (way to combo breaker if he wasn't in SSB4)
• "No cuts has been made so far"

awwright reason

• According to 3rd in OPPOSE section, it never mentioned that it may also apply to Melee fallen fighters and not just Brawl fighters. (counters 3rd in OPPOSE section) (contributes 5th in this SUPPORT section) So it's possible to see every Brawl fighters got into SSB4 before Melee fallen clones.
• Lucario fits in nicely as Smash fighter like other iconic human/humanoid punching/kicking-based (karate?!) Smash fighters; Mario, Samus, C. Falcon, and Fox. There are not many Pokemon that can fit in very well as karate Smash fighter. This is probably what helped Smash team to consider Lucario in for Brawl, and for sure it will go the same for SSB4. (2/2)
• Aura element

Any more reasons that I've missed out?

 

[Starcutter]

My next biggest problem with lucario being replaced with mewtwo is that there will only be generation 1 pokemon in smash. Something that hasn't happened since 64.

 

[1DeadRabbit]

Swift Fox, while you make some good arguments, I still think Lucario is going to be cut simply because he's not relevant anymore--popular, yes, but irrelevant. I feel like they originally cut Mewtwo for the same reasons, and the reason why Mewtwo's exclusion got so much backlash is because Mewtwo is a unique fighter and a timeless pokemon. Lucario just doesn't have that same status. Sure, he's a beloved character and we may yet see him and Mewtwo fights side-by-side, but given time constraints and his bygone relativity, I doubt Lucario is high-priority enough to be kept in the Smash Bros roster.

I could be wrong, though. And believe me, I wouldn't mind that.

 

[Starcutter]

Swift Fox, while you make some good arguments, I still think Lucario is going to be cut simply because he's not relevant anymore--popular, yes, but irrelevant. I feel like they originally cut Mewtwo for the same reasons, and the reason why Mewtwo's exclusion got so much backlash is because Mewtwo is a unique fighter and a timeless pokemon. Lucario just doesn't have that same status. Sure, he's a beloved character and we may yet see him and Mewtwo fights side-by-side, but given time constraints and his bygone relativity, I doubt Lucario is high-priority enough to be kept in the Smash Bros roster.

I could be wrong, though. And believe me, I wouldn't mind that.

I think lucario's only chance of being cut is the same as mewtwo's. time restraints.

 

[2 C H i L L E D]

I am about 95% sure that Lucario will NOT be in this game. The other 5% is Sakurai. (Unless he chooses to include them both, which is favorable but highly unlikely.)
I'm almost positive Mewtwo will take his rightful spot back. & @LucarioValkyrie I'm certain that if any Pokemon had a claim to the title of "badass" it would be no other Pokemon than Mewtwo. He's described through-out Pokemon history as: "The most savage and twisted Pokemon ever." (Brawl) "He's like a machine breed for fighting." (PMD) He's the original powerhouse, and in the event of a debate between who has contributed more to the Pokemon franchise Mewtwo or Lucario? Lucario isn't even in the discussion and any Pokemon fan will tell you that. Also with Mewtwo gaining a bit of spotlight in Gen VI with his own movie and him being given a new form, Lucario isn't in any position to retain his spot from brawl. It's likely Lucario & Mewtwo won't be in the game simultaneously. But it is likely that one of those two choices will be and that choice is Mewtwo. Sometimes you just have to face facts...

 

[Starcutter]

I am about 95% sure that Lucario will NOT be in this game. The other 5% is Sakurai. (Unless he chooses to include them both, which is favorable but highly unlikely.)
I'm almost positive Mewtwo will take his rightful spot back. & @LucarioValkyrie I'm certain that if any Pokemon had a claim to the title of "badass" it would be no other Pokemon than Mewtwo. He's described through-out Pokemon history as: "The most savage and twisted Pokemon ever." (Brawl) "He's like a machine breed for fighting." (PMD) He's the original powerhouse, and in the event of a debate between who has contributed more to the Pokemon franchise Mewtwo or Lucario? Lucario isn't even in the discussion and any Pokemon fan will tell you that. Also with Mewtwo gaining a bit of spotlight in Gen VI with his own movie and him being given a new form, Lucario isn't in any position to retain his spot from brawl. It's likely Lucario & Mewtwo won't be in the game simultaneously. But it is likely that one of those two choices will be and that choice is Mewtwo. Sometimes you just have to face facts...

no, seriously, Sakuri has more than enough time to include both this time.

I think lucario is more "Badass" because of the inspirations of his design in comparison to mewtwo. Mewtwo is the clone of a fetus-based pokemon. lucario is based on an Egyptian GOD. you tell me which is cooler.

Also, Lucario is more known and promoted then you think, replacing zoroark as the mascot on the japan TV show pokemon smash, still being heavily promoted in the black and white 2 trailer (only about a year old), and they also made lucario easily obtainable at the beginning of that game. many people have him in their party.