Q&A The Barracks - Robin Q&A Thread [ASK GAMEPLAY QUESTIONS HERE]

[Laggalot101]

You can only B-reverse the Thunder CHARGE. So if you haven't reached Thoron yet, you can use B-reversal to reverse your momentum (and the direction you're facing). Unfortunately, you can't B-reverse the actual casting of the spell.

 

[Finding Waldo]

Can anyone tell me how Nosferatu damage is determined? It's a real puzzle for me. In actual matches, it seems that the more damage I have, the more I recover and the more damage they take. It seems like the more damage my opponent has, the longer they stay ensnared.

Training showed otherwise though. Damage and healing was always the same, regardless of damage. I set it to 100%, 300%, 900%, etc and it was always the same, even when I healed myself to have a greater difference. While it will do 15 in training, a level 9 Mario can get out at around 5. Is training different somehow? I could have sworn I've healed much more than 15 at once, closer to 30 in a few fights, but if the damage and healing changes, I'm not sure by how much.

Has anyone found a better way to test this? It would help to have a general idea of how much to heal and damage when I'm at say, 130% with my opponent at 100%.

 

[Raziek]

Can anyone tell me how Nosferatu damage is determined? It's a real puzzle for me. In actual matches, it seems that the more damage I have, the more I recover and the more damage they take. It seems like the more damage my opponent has, the longer they stay ensnared.

Training showed otherwise though. Damage and healing was always the same, regardless of damage. I set it to 100%, 300%, 900%, etc and it was always the same, even when I healed myself to have a greater difference. While it will do 15 in training, a level 9 Mario can get out at around 5. Is training different somehow? I could have sworn I've healed much more than 15 at once, closer to 30 in a few fights, but if the damage and healing changes, I'm not sure by how much.

Has anyone found a better way to test this? It would help to have a general idea of how much to heal and damage when I'm at say, 130% with my opponent at 100%.

<From my data thread>

Nosferatu: 15 damage, 13 healing (front). 15 damage, 16 healing (back). The Vortex spawns right in front of Robin, fairly quickly.

Important: Nosferatu's healing values SCALE! The more percentage you have than your opponent, the more you heal.

25 vs. 0 - 16 (front), 20 (back)
50 vs. 0 - 24 (front), 29 (back)
75 vs. 0 - 32 (front), 38 (back)
100 vs. 0 - 40 (front), 48 (back)
75 vs. 25 - 24 (front), 29 (back)
999 vs. 0 - 326 (LOL)
Based on some trial and error, Nosferatu heals you for approximately 13% (from the front, no mashing) + [(Your HP - Opponent's HP) * 1/3].

It gets a bit wonky when the numbers get large because smash likes to use invisible partial percentages.

That testing is a bit out of date, though. I think they may have nerfed it slightly, but the idea is the same. The higher % you are compared to your opponent, the more it heals.

Also, you can mash out of Nosferatu like you would mash out of a grab. So it's easier to mash out at low percents, and harder at higher percents.

 

[Finding Waldo]

Thanks, I couldn't find a thread for it and it was driving me mad. It looks like I didn't try ME having more damage than THEM. Trying it that way, I'm getting huge healing numbers now.

 

[Teve31]

So when robin sends out his elfire it stuns the opponent allowing you to grab/attack them. I was facing bowser jr. and i got him in my elfire at around 50% (i cant remember the exact percent), so i jumped up to hit him with a forward air and it didn't send him flying away. What happened was i jumped up hit bowser jr. and he slid across the stage very fast to the edge and then fell off the edge. He was touching the stage the whole time until he fell off. When he fell off it acted as spike and sent him for a fast fall off the stage. He recovered from it and that's about it. I went to training mode trying to re-do what i did using various combinations and i can't do it. If anyone knows what happened please let me know. This is a very useful move if you can do it.

 

[Raziek]

So when robin sends out his elfire it stuns the opponent allowing you to grab/attack them. I was facing bowser jr. and i got him in my elfire at around 50% (i cant remember the exact percent), so i jumped up to hit him with a forward air and it didn't send him flying away. What happened was i jumped up hit bowser jr. and he slid across the stage very fast to the edge and then fell off the edge. He was touching the stage the whole time until he fell off. When he fell off it acted as spike and sent him for a fast fall off the stage. He recovered from it and that's about it. I went to training mode trying to re-do what i did using various combinations and i can't do it. If anyone knows what happened please let me know. This is a very useful move if you can do it.

Merged into Q/A thread since it doesn't really need its own.

From the sounds of things, what you experienced was a case of CPU's having extremely strong (inhuman) ability to Smash DI.

The CPU most likely SDI'd into the ground which caused the ground slide, rather than being launched diagonally like Fair usually does.

 

[Zeiah92]

Hello first time poster here but I have been around. I was thinking about making this a thread but since I am barely learning smash competitively I thought I better ask it here. My question is, how does Robin benefit from footstooling? I noticed that after arcfire, many Robin players always go for smashes or his/her special moves. I thought to myself, what if I try footstooling instead? From my understanding (I could be wrong), footstooling is untechable, you can combo into it and land a guaranteed smash attack. I saw a Megaman video a while back where he foot stooled, dropped his saw, and did jab locks on mario. Unfortunately, I saw a video a while back that said Robin could not Jab lock. Using this video for inspiration though, I began to mess around with Robin in a similar fashion.

Basically what I am doing is first arcfire, followed by footstool, then I drop a book, then I do an fair with the levin sword. However, as mentioned previously I am barely learning smash so I feel that if I were to do this in game (none of my friends play competitive smash so it's hard to try it out) I could be missing something and maybe it is techable and I understand footstooling wrong. So with all that said, is what I'm doing good and what other benefits can Robin get out of footstooling? Thanks in advance.

 

[Raziek]

While you're correct in that foot-stooling isn't techable, the video you saw with Megaman is guaranteed because the saw hitting him on the ground causes a forced stand.

Otherwise, you can roll, get-up attack, etc.

But yes, your footstool idea (z-drop book) into fair would work, I believe.

As for other uses of foot-stooling:

• Back hit Nair (stage spike) into Foot-stool often works.
• Foot-stool into Elwind works.
• I've been exploring seeing if Fair (on shield) into foot-stool works to make the Fair safe, but I'm not sure on that yet.
• Foot-stooling someone who's trying to trap your landing with a grab is often useful to get away.

You can probably foot-stool someone out of Arcthunder, if I had to guess.

In general, foot-stooling is fairly situational, though.

 

[Janno]

too bad robin cant lock

there would definitly be potential like arcfire -> footstoll -> lock somehow -> d/f smash

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

A z dropped book can jab lock at very low %s.

 

[Janno]

arcfire does too much damage to make a footstool z drop lock possible. But you can lock with your sword, but then again you cant use it for a strong follow up after the grab

wait actually nvm that
it works against bowser, doesnt work against ness thou. Gonna test that more tomorow. its late here in germany

 

[Zeiah92]

A z dropped book can jab lock at very low %s.

How do you test if something can jab lock or not without the use of other people? I saw a video on youtube where it mentioned in the description that Robin can't jab lock with anything yet a person stated in the comments that he could with ElThunder and now you're saying the book works as well. I want to see if maybe the person who made the video might have forgotten to test other parts of Robin like the dropped book or the charging spells.

 

[Funkermonster]

You think Robin would make a good 2ndary to a player?

 

[Raziek]

How do you test if something can jab lock or not without the use of other people? I saw a video on youtube where it mentioned in the description that Robin can't jab lock with anything yet a person stated in the comments that he could with ElThunder and now you're saying the book works as well. I want to see if maybe the person who made the video might have forgotten to test other parts of Robin like the dropped book or the charging spells.

There seems to be a confusion in wording here.

"lock' implies that you get the full 3 resets before the game's anti-infinite protection kicks in and they stand up.

Robin can reset someone once, but none of her moves are fast enough to do so multiple times.

 

[Zeiah92]

There seems to be a confusion in wording here.

"lock' implies that you get the full 3 resets before the game's anti-infinite protection kicks in and they stand up.

Robin can reset someone once, but none of her moves are fast enough to do so multiple times.

Sorry about that. As I mentioned before I am barely beginning to play smash competitively so I am getting accustomed to the tech in the game. Thanks for the help!

 

[Janno]

arcfire does too much damage to make a footstool z drop reset possible. But you can reset with your sword dropped, but then again you cant use it for a strong follow up after the forced get up

wait actually nvm that
it works against bowser, doesnt work against ness thou. Gonna test that more tomorow. its late here in germany

Whoops, didnt ment to repost this, i wanted to edit my post. Phone pls

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

There seems to be a confusion in wording here.

"lock' implies that you get the full 3 resets before the game's anti-infinite protection kicks in and they stand up.

Robin can reset someone once, but none of her moves are fast enough to do so multiple times.

Oh, your right I'm sorry.

 

[Teve31]

Is the roll cancel grab still available to Robin or did they do an update to get rid of it? I've been trying to do it for the past couple days and just can't pull it off. I Input Froll and hold it then i do an A attack and it doesn't seem to cancel. Am i doing it wrong or did they take it out of the game? Please reply if I'm doing it wrong.

 

[Janno]

its still possible. the timing is a bit weird thou

 

[Teve31]

its still possible. the timing is a bit weird thou

What's the proper timing for it?

 

[Janno]

how do i explain. You have to do it almost at the same time, but not quite. I dont know the frames but i'd say about 10 frames after roling press grab.
it only works for forward role

 

[Centicerise]

Follow three steps in rapid succession.
1) Push forward (-->)
2) Shield (R/L)
3) Grab (Shield+A or use grab button)

You will know if you are successful if you see a little flash behind you that indicated you started the rolling animation before you grab.

 

[Lavani]

10 frames is 1/3 of a roll, the window is before roll intangibility starts so no more than 4f, and feels more like 1~2f.

Anyway, just press A slightly after you press R and you should get it fairly consistently. Keep in mind that it doesn't work if you put up your shield.

By the way, is RCG actually better than boost grabbing for Robin? Boost grabs seem like they give a tiny bit more distance, and are easier to do out of a run anyway.

 

[Teve31]

Thanks for helping me out guys, i can do it now. Also I noticed whenever you do it right you get a rumble from your controller as if you were rolling.

 

[Zeiah92]

Has anyone tried out that frame cancel thing recently discovered with Robin? If so, how is it done? I would love to see what type of things Robin can do with it.

 

[Teve31]

Has anyone tried out that frame cancel thing recently discovered with Robin? If so, how is it done? I would love to see what type of things Robin can do with it.

What frame cancel thing? I'm very interested.

 

[Zeiah92]

What frame cancel thing? I'm very interested.

It's on the Wii U competitive discussion board. From my understanding you can actually cancel aerials before you land so that they have normal landing lag and can do true combos such as Ganondorf down air to up smash.

 

[Lavani]

What's happening is you land during hitlag, so your landing lag ends sooner than it normally would.

Tried it with Robin in training for two minutes and got levin fair/uair pretty quickly. Fair still had too much knockback for Robin to follow up on, uair very cleanly combo'd into another levin uair on a 50% charizard with plenty of time to react.

I get the feeling something silly like levin bair>Thoron might be EDIT: is definitely possible.

 

[Raziek]

Problem is doing so requires atrocious spacing and Robin is not a character with the mobility to afford that luxury.

 

[Lavani]

I recall it briefly being a subject of discussion in the research thread back in mid September, but I don't think much came of it; have applications for the bronze sword variants of moves been looked into?

Mostly bringing this up because while experimenting with Just Frame/Frame Sync/whateverthehellwe'recallingit for the above post, I inadvertently discovered bronze uair still has a ton of hitstun despite the lesser knockback, and even with the full landing lag falling bronze uair>double jump levin uair was true comboing and KOing Sheik at 80%.

 

[Raziek]

I recall it briefly being a subject of discussion in the research thread back in mid September, but I don't think much came of it; have applications for the bronze sword variants of moves been looked into?

Mostly bringing this up because while experimenting with Just Frame/Frame Sync/whateverthehellwe'recallingit for the above post, I inadvertently discovered bronze uair still has a ton of hitstun despite the lesser knockback, and even with the full landing lag falling bronze uair>double jump levin uair was true comboing and KOing Sheik at 80%.

That might actually be worth exploring. You're certain it was a true combo even in Training Mode?

 

[Lavani]

That might actually be worth exploring. You're certain it was a true combo even in Training Mode?

Positive. Though I'd imagine in practice you'd be using it as antiair or something, and the opponent's resultant position wouldn't make it a kill combo, but the main point is combo potential exists.

 

[Raziek]

Positive. Though I'd imagine in practice you'd be using it as antiair or something, and the opponent's resultant position wouldn't make it a kill combo, but the main point is combo potential exists.

Very nice. I'll be sure to note that. I'm working on the mega-guide (that will eventually replace this one) as we speak.

 

[Zeiah92]

Though I'd imagine in practice you'd be using it as antiair or something, and the opponent's resultant position wouldn't make it a kill combo, but the main point is combo potential exists.

Woww that's awesome! Might need to try that out myself. Another question. How does down air benefit from this? I mean Ganondorf can down air to upsmash as a true combo but can Robin down air (with or without levin) and then do a smash attach afterwards?

 

[Tomoya Okazaki]

So what would you guys say are some true combos for robin? I know Dthrow to Uairs and some percents can work, but is there anything else?

 

[Raziek]

Arcfire -> Stuff.
Arcthunder -> Stuff.

Fair -> Fair -> Fair.
Bair -> Weak Bair -> Bair
Fair -> Fair -> Uair

Utilt into itself a few times.

Those are the main ones that matter.

 

[Tomoya Okazaki]

Arcfire -> Stuff.
Arcthunder -> Stuff.

Fair -> Fair -> Fair.
Bair -> Weak Bair -> Bair
Fair -> Fair -> Uair

Utilt into itself a few times.

Those are the main ones that matter.

Thanks! I as well would like to ask if there are any specific techs I should learn with robin like perfect pivoting or any movement options I should practice?

 

[timetotipthescales]

Since Roll Cancel Grabbing increases Robin's grab range by a lot, does anyone have any proper input for it, or tutorial for it?

I can't seem to find any good ones, despite using the almighty god Nagoogle.

 

[Lavani]

Roll forward, and grab during the roll's startup.

Since R+A grabs, it works to hold R for the roll then press A immediately after.

Keep in mind that it doesn't work if you put your shield up.

EDIT: lol I just realized I answered this on this page already. Which reminds me, still wondering about this:

By the way, is RCG actually better than boost grabbing for Robin? Boost grabs seem like they give a tiny bit more distance, and are easier to do out of a run anyway.

 

[Pazzo.]

I'm looking for a heavy character to compliment Robin. Any ideas?