THE Broken Character

[Tharn]

I'm saying this from an objective point of view.
I'm sticking to what's factually accurate and evident in game play.

Metaknight is THE broken character.
Why?
First think back to Marth in Melee. He wasn't broken per say, but he's an example as is DeDeDe when it comes to not being able to hit through a weapon. What I mean is that if you try to out prioritize marth, it won't work, because he's hitting you with his sword and you're not hitting him, but instead meeting his blade. Same with DeDeDe, you're not going to be able to hit dedede by hitting his hammer, you're not hitting dedede, you're hitting his hammer. SAME goes for Metaknight, you're not hitting metaknight, you're hitting his sword, not metaknight.
Now that you've wrapped your mind around that concept, apply it. The first thought that may come to mind is "It's too short, it's not even half as deadly or as overall 'good' as Marths sword was in melee or is in this even though it's proven to be shorter as well" - and that is a perfectly viable argument however this argument isn't even considerable when the speed of metaknights attacks are taken into consideration. What I'm getting at this that you can't inflict damage on metaknight simply by hitting his sword. You can inflict damage on metaknight by hitting metaknight, but if you try to go blow for blow with metaknight, unless you're metaknight or someone who also uses a weapon(in which case you meet a nice clang), metaknight will deal damage do you. Metaknight attacks fast enough that he's pretty much invincible. He can stop anything you do by pressing A. All he needs to do is drawl his sword. "Same with Marth" Sure, with a few exceptions though and the main one is that Metaknight is much much faster.

Second: Metaknight is the epitomy of what brawl is and that's multi-hit attacks. As we know, multi-hit attacks were trash in Melee because of DI'ing and other things. However in this installment of the Super Smash Brothers beloved series, multi-hit attacks work just about every time. Multi-hit attacks do more overall damage than non multi hit attacks. That's a fact. Metaknight has the most multi hit attacks. Therefore metaknight does the most overall damage. Now factor in his speed. Now factor in the aforementioned expliation of what sword priority is. What do you have? Damage stacking like it's nobody's business.

"Alright fine, perhaps sword usage overall is cheap and it's true that with metaknights speed it's a bit ridiculous. And sure perhaps multi hit attacks aren't 'cheap' per say, but are for sure what seperates Brawl from previous generations and Metaknight has lots of them, including aerial versions." is what you may be saying to yourself, but closing with "But how's his survivability"

Which goes without saying. He glides. He has plenty of jumps. Apply concepts: Sword priority+metaknights quick attacking+ up airs+many jumps. It's just a bit ridiculous.

This is all from an objective point of view.
To sum up my argument I'll try to make a list of key points:
1. Sword Priority
2. Quick attacks
3. Multi-hit attacks
4. High surviviability
5. Glide
6. Aerial multi-hit attacks
7. Multiple jumps

His only down side? ..? Lack of killers is the only one that my friends could come up with. Which was argued back at with "When a character puts up that much damage that quickly, everything is a killer" which may not be entirely true on the 'everything' part of the predicate however it's still an accurate statement as an idea. It makes sense.


Argue for or against me. Remember this is all from an objective point of view.
SUBjectively, I'm entirely disinterested with metaknight. I find 0 enjoyment playing him, but I don't dislike him either. I'm personally a luigi main :x

 

[Mr.Showtime]

Try to play as him and see how well you get. Meta Knight is a harder character to play than you think. First of all he could die as early as 60-90% in this game from a good smash attack. He's such a lightweight character. His attacks might be fast but he's just as balanced as any other character in the game due to his easy deaths. It is true though that he might not have kill moves, that he could make up for it by his easy quick damage, but if you take Pit...he does faster damage than Meta Knight does.

Like I said above just try playing with him a bit.

People usually get mad at stuff like this when their friends usually repetitively beat them or I guess now I can say online battles. Basically just adapt to the game-play. Look for the weakness in Meta Knight instead of getting agitated and just saying flat out that he's a broken character.

Im sorry if I sounded a little mean..but this is the only way I could put it.

 

[kingofping4]

I'll say he's pretty annoying to play against, especially online where a little lag means you're stuck in the mach tornado or drill rush that everyone spams all the time, but I don't think he's broken. Even against decent metakinghts, as long as you get a few good shots in they'll go flying. Just punish missed drill rush and try some UAirs while he's recovering.

 

[Neoteric]

play against a character with a bigger sword and see how well your "press a to stop any form of attack" theory works.

 

[zarkawi]

i kind of agree with you on some points, but he's just as balanced as most characters. You completely overstated his priority as it's really not that fantastic. i have been hit out of every single one of MKs attacks at least once, especially his neutral a combo. his neutral a combo can easily be hit out of, the other person just has to mash a as fast as they can and they'll knock him out of the combo. I don't believe metaknight is broken, very few if any characters are.

 

[bigafromusclekid]

Yeah, I play Ike against Kerploplesteesh's MK, and I have nooo problem what-so-ever. It was a little ridiculous at first, and if anything, his off stage edgeguarding is the most ridiculous thing ever, but just spot dodge => punish.

Rinse and Repeat.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

From what I´ve seen, many think at first that Metaknight is broken, but after a while they realize that he´s got plenty of weaknesses. From what I´ve seen from the vids (I live in Europe and don´t have Brawl yet) he seems pretty easy to juggle in the air. He´s floaty, dies early and doesn´t have crazy priority despite his sword. His special moves also have many disandantages. All of them (exept U-b) put him into freefall motion so they must be used considerably in the air. And then there´s still one fact that can´t be denied. Yes, you guessed right: lack of killing moves. That´s huge disadvantage, no matter how well you can combo. He doesn´t seem broken from what I´ve seen. People just have to learn to fight him first.

 

[Psydon]

I'm saying this from an objective point of view.
I'm sticking to what's factually accurate and evident in game play.

Metaknight is THE broken character.
Why?
First think back to Marth in Melee. He wasn't broken per say, but he's an example as is DeDeDe when it comes to not being able to hit through a weapon. What I mean is that if you try to out prioritize marth, it won't work, because he's hitting you with his sword and you're not hitting him, but instead meeting his blade. Same with DeDeDe, you're not going to be able to hit dedede by hitting his hammer, you're not hitting dedede, you're hitting his hammer. SAME goes for Metaknight, you're not hitting metaknight, you're hitting his sword, not metaknight.
Now that you've wrapped your mind around that concept, apply it. The first thought that may come to mind is "It's too short, it's not even half as deadly or as overall 'good' as Marths sword was in melee or is in this even though it's proven to be shorter as well" - and that is a perfectly viable argument however this argument isn't even considerable when the speed of metaknights attacks are taken into consideration. What I'm getting at this that you can't inflict damage on metaknight simply by hitting his sword. You can inflict damage on metaknight by hitting metaknight, but if you try to go blow for blow with metaknight, unless you're metaknight or someone who also uses a weapon(in which case you meet a nice clang), metaknight will deal damage do you. Metaknight attacks fast enough that he's pretty much invincible. He can stop anything you do by pressing A. All he needs to do is drawl his sword. "Same with Marth" Sure, with a few exceptions though and the main one is that Metaknight is much much faster.

Second: Metaknight is the epitomy of what brawl is and that's multi-hit attacks. As we know, multi-hit attacks were trash in Melee because of DI'ing and other things. However in this installment of the Super Smash Brothers beloved series, multi-hit attacks work just about every time. Multi-hit attacks do more overall damage than non multi hit attacks. That's a fact. Metaknight has the most multi hit attacks. Therefore metaknight does the most overall damage. Now factor in his speed. Now factor in the aforementioned expliation of what sword priority is. What do you have? Damage stacking like it's nobody's business.

"Alright fine, perhaps sword usage overall is cheap and it's true that with metaknights speed it's a bit ridiculous. And sure perhaps multi hit attacks aren't 'cheap' per say, but are for sure what seperates Brawl from previous generations and Metaknight has lots of them, including aerial versions." is what you may be saying to yourself, but closing with "But how's his survivability"

Which goes without saying. He glides. He has plenty of jumps. Apply concepts: Sword priority+metaknights quick attacking+ up airs+many jumps. It's just a bit ridiculous.

This is all from an objective point of view.
To sum up my argument I'll try to make a list of key points:
1. Sword Priority
2. Quick attacks
3. Multi-hit attacks
4. High surviviability
5. Glide
6. Aerial multi-hit attacks
7. Multiple jumps

His only down side? ..? Lack of killers is the only one that my friends could come up with. Which was argued back at with "When a character puts up that much damage that quickly, everything is a killer" which may not be entirely true on the 'everything' part of the predicate however it's still an accurate statement as an idea. It makes sense.


Argue for or against me. Remember this is all from an objective point of view.
SUBjectively, I'm entirely disinterested with metaknight. I find 0 enjoyment playing him, but I don't dislike him either. I'm personally a luigi main :x

*sigh*

1. Yes, it is true that the Galaxia has a disjointed hitbox, as do all the other swords. However, its effect on attack priority is severely marred by one key factor:

Galaxia is SHORT. Seriously. Mario's legs are longer than it; hell, Metaknight's feet are longer than it. The reason why Marth's Falchion's disjointed hitbox was/is so deadly is because it's so much longer than most other attacks, allowing Marth to attack with a high degree of safety knowing he can always put his long sword between him and his target and not have to worry. But there are plenty of attacks that will reach straight past Galaxia and hit Metaknight because of the sword's short length.

2. Metaknight's attacks tend to eat through other attacks but he's far from unstoppable. Put him against Lucas and see how he'll fare; all of Lucas' best non-special attacks are also disjointed hitboxes. And guess what? They reach farther than Galaxia.

3. You know how much damage Metaknight's fair does? 10. Metaknight's second biggest weakness is that, while he can stack damage well, he has to stack a LOT of damage because he has few effective kill moves. You make the argument that "at certain percentages everything is a killer". Well, in Metaknight's case, you'd have to get your opponent, unless it's a Jigglypuff or Kirby or MK, to about 200% or more before that could even begin to be possible, whereas Metaknight can be killed by just about anything at around 80-100%.

Not just that, in order to rack damage with Metaknight, you need something else besides speed: precision. Let's use Marth as an example again. Almost all of Marth's attacks are wide, sweeping arcs; he can hit all over himself. Metaknight's attacks are much more narrow, and the small size of Galaxia makes it even worse; it's easy to miss with Metaknight.

Lastly, all of Metaknight's multi-hit attacks except for his neutral A combo send the opponent away on the final hit, so it's not like you can just go from one multi-hit attack to another in insane combos that deal 40+ damage in a few seconds.

So, basically, Metaknight has a plethora of small-radius, very weak, multi-hit attacks that do not combo with each other...yeah, I guess he just completely ***** every character he sees, huh?

4. Glide isn't as good as you might think. It leaves Metaknight terribly vulnerable. And Metaknight's survivibility is horrible. He may have multiple jumps, a good up+B and a glide, but he's light and very easy to KO.

Metaknight is far, far from broken.

 

[MLG Mune]

how does metaknight not have kill moves. if u save ur attacks, a nuetral air or dsmash can kill.

u also are probally complaing about metaknights fair multi hit. yea it looks pretty tough and all but seriously, punish it. sheild grab.

 

[WingedKnight]

I main Meta Knight. I consider myself to be pretty good, I beat my friends consistently but I gotta tell ya. He is FAR FAR FAR from broken. This doesn't mean he's bad, he is BALANCED. Like others have said, he is ridiculously light and is low-mid tier in terms of attack power. True, he can mutli-hit and combo like a god, and he has beastly recovery, but he is overall balanced and fair. He is a very unique character playstyle wise, not as easy to pick up and own with as you might think. I still love him though, my favorite and best main ever!

 

[penguinman]

his other weakness is he is really light

 

[Orpheus]

Meta-knight is my main character. I say he is pretty balanced like all the other characters.
Few pros and cons thrown around. As long as you know how to use Meta-knight very well, I don't see the problem with him.

 

[The_Smash_Champ]

I agree that metaknight is broken, he does have killing moves that yal dont know. His Dsmash actually kills me easely and he cant get shield grabbed if you know how to play with him. He is impossible to hit from the sides in the air because all his moves are lighting fast. His dodge is fast and his Side b Overuns most moves. However if your going against a metaknight keep him airborn!

 

[Taso]

Orpheus, try not to bump a week old thread without any new information to add to it.

 

[DarkMagus505]

Just so you guys know, Imain him as well, and my friend completely destroys me with his lucas. another flaw you guys have not yet pointed out to, has been his inability to close the distance. A well placed pk fire, or thunder for that matter will stop his tornado/corkscrew cold. any character with any type of projectile should find fighting him to be a lot easier than you might think. Thusly, not broken.

 

[Taso]

Just so you guys know, Imain him as well, and my friend completely destroys me with his lucas. another flaw you guys have not yet pointed out to, has been his inability to close the distance. A well placed pk fire, or thunder for that matter will stop his tornado/corkscrew cold. any character with any type of projectile should find fighting him to be a lot easier than you might think. Thusly, not broken.

The problem lies not with the character, as Meta Knight can easily close distances. The problem lies in the user.

Fspecial blocks PK fire if I recall correctly, and it charges them down.

Beyond that, the problem is that humans simply do not air dodge enough. A PK thunder from Lucas leaves him wide open if you dodge it. Meta Knight is very fast, and he has two specials that have massive priority, and when he's gliding, he can change the angle at which he glides to mess with an opponent's mind.

This isn't from a fan of MK's perspective, but rather someone who's used him a lot.

 

[Jonkenden]

The problem lies not with the character, as Meta Knight can easily close distances. The problem lies in the user.

Fspecial blocks PK fire if I recall correctly, and it charges them down.

Beyond that, the problem is that humans simply do not air dodge enough. A PK thunder from Lucas leaves him wide open if you dodge it. Meta Knight is very fast, and he has two specials that have massive priority, and when he's gliding, he can change the angle at which he glides to mess with an opponent's mind.

This isn't from a fan of MK's perspective, but rather someone who's used him a lot.

Massive priority on his 2 specials? that almost makes me laugh, I main meta but I play sonic sometimes. A friend played meta knight and I played sonic, even sonic's spin dashes outprioritize meta's forward special and it seems to cancel out on the neutral B.

Didn't get to test much on N B so can't say for that. But his attacks have terrible priority, his up B gets beaten by links DOWN A a simple regular attack. At best they clash and both get damaged. I haven't tried the forward special on pk fire but I doubt it goes through it. Considering sonic's dashes has some of the lowest priority I seen in the game.

 

[lonelytraveler8]

You're both off about some things. I'm pretty sure Drill Rush won't go through PK Fire and against a good Lucas, a missed PK Fire will not leave him open much, if at all.

However, Mach Tornado does have good priority. Not the best, but it's definitely good. It goes through the majority of projectiles in the game and through a lot of various attacks (including a good number of sword attacks).

The comment about Link's dtilt is misleading. Swords generally have good priority, and tilts themselves can have incredible priority, so just because it's a dtilt doesn't mean it can't stop something that looks scarier.

 

[DarkMagus505]

The problem lies not with the character, as Meta Knight can easily close distances. The problem lies in the user.

Fspecial blocks PK fire if I recall correctly, and it charges them down.

Beyond that, the problem is that humans simply do not air dodge enough. A PK thunder from Lucas leaves him wide open if you dodge it. Meta Knight is very fast, and he has two specials that have massive priority, and when he's gliding, he can change the angle at which he glides to mess with an opponent's mind.

This isn't from a fan of MK's perspective, but rather someone who's used him a lot.

As for air dodging PK Thunder, I have yet to successfully do it without getting hit by its tail. I still honestly believe that due to the nature of his character, he is a close quarters fighter, and if the moves that he has to close the gap, get blocked by mere projectiles, then I cannot see him as being "broken"


EDIT: I love Mach Tornado

 

[lonelytraveler8]

It's quite easy to air dodge PK Thunder. It just takes practice. I find PK Fire to be much more of a nuisance than PK Thunder.

 

[vills]

i dont get it

mains
captain falcon,meta knight

secondary
snake,marios

 

[NoVaLombardia]

MK has no kill moves?

why hello thar d-smash and up-b, you tickle me completely!

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

Metaknight is for the pros. He won't be broken, as you definitely have to play him insanely well to be effective in high level matches. He's good but, he's not stupid easy like some other characters.

 

[Azzizaz]

All I have to say is: Marth.

 

[Admiral Pit]

Meta Knight does not have a Projectile. He also has problems with Projectile spammers (Pikachu, I wont forgive you for what you did to my Golden Meta Knight).
In addition to that, he's a lightweight and is guarenteed to get KOed around 70-90% from Strong attacks, especially from Bowser's famous F-Smash.

Example: Pit's Projectile can give Meta Knight a hard time. Not only is it fast, it can be curved.
Also, Donkey Kong's Strong hits can KO Meta Knight before he hits the 100% line. (So can Bowser)

To sum this up, Meta Knight is NOT Broken! And no, Pit isnt broken either, for those who have that thought in mind.

 

[PKboy89]

All I have to say is...everyone I know...and everyone they know...plays meta knight...I admit, he is a really great character, he is actually my third main, next to Lucas and Olimar...but I hate using him...just cause everyone else does...lol. Sad part is that half the people that play as him suck. A lotta people say he is easy to use and cheap but that is so not true. Anyway...yea, he is the broken character, everybody uses him.

 

[Ballistaboy]

he is good when starting a combo, cuz he can easily rack up to 70 damage, but has a hard time getting back on his feet after a good hit he gets comboed like crazy.

 

[sathenzar]

I haven't read teh above posts so this may of already been said (sorry) but I play meta knight as my main and I have to admit I almost gave up. He's very very hard to play aganist characters such as marth especially at first. You have to learn techniques with him, you can just constantly run and slash, run spam more a, it simply doesn't work (unless whoever you're playing sucks royally). He's far from invincible, in fact, with that attitude you're probably going to just lose most of your games, b/c he's really light and can be smashed off the stage and ko'd much easier then a good amount of other characters (such as DeeDee). I'm not saying meta knight is a bad character, I like him a lot, but I hate the idea of someone saying he's invincible Not meant to be a pain, just giving my 2 cents.

 

[Umpy]

That entire post showed how much ignorance you consist of.

Metaknight's sword is short as hellllllllll

have you ever even played a ZSS or Olimar with their ridiculous ranged and grab attacks, even a bad one will beat you because of their range.

every character, even in melee, has a counter character.

yes metaknight is beast but he still lacks range.

 

[-Jumpman-]

@ thread starter: Your point of view eliminates the fact that other characters could have the same or even better qualities. Having theoritic qualities doesn't make them useful. Maybe you just think (with some other people) that he has those qualities. Don't jump to conclusions too quickly.

 

[Adriel]

Didn't even read it, but I don't think that Meta Knight is broken. It's just that he is easy to win with.