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The Official Falco Critique Thread

shadownoss45

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 11, 2009
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MN
What swordsaint says is true, especially due to the fact that most of the stuff I saw in one vid will probably only happen in Wifi.

Based on the Shiek vid though, Work on your spacing a little more. Also, don't always SHDL, SHL is just as good and even better in some situations when you opponent isn't jumping. Lastly, if you really throw you you down smash whenever you're trying to go for a bdacus, then you're abusing it a little too much, bdacus is a situational kill move, not something that should be spammed in order to get a kill.

Either than that, it's all pretty good, but it's a wifi vid, so a real vid will probably be better.
thanks, and ill be going to a tourney in about a month and hopefully i can get some vids xD
and also i couldve been trying to buffer a dash attack too, they were like a month or two old so i cant really remember. I really appreciate help, ill be using shl more too.
 

SlashTalon

Smash Ace
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Messages
613
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Virginia Beach, VA
Every action you take, whether it be rolling, spotdodging, shielding, lasers, anything should be done with a purpose and thoughts of the consequences if you miss. Is the risk worth it?

Use Falco's amazing jumps and his lasers to keep the opponent chasing you.

Not specifically directed at anyone, just general tips :)
 

GameStation aka C4?!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 30, 2006
Messages
341
Ya know what. It's the matches against G&W that I had the most trouble with. But Dont sweat it, I Quit playing anyway
 

Choice

Smash Champion
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Apr 28, 2010
Messages
2,578
You were sorta getting it at the end of the first match.

Mix up between lasering (mostly shsl instead of shdl) and not lasering when you jump vs gnw and that hinders his approaches greatly. whenever he's really close and at high enough % to ko, lasering is always a good option since if he buckets a laser you get a free move.

Jab is really really good vs gnw double jab or full combo. once he gets out of jab3, just start it up again (aaa->aaa).

Don't fish for usmash so much. If people know what you want to hit them with, it gets tons easier to avoid it. I think that was mainly only an issue in the 2nd match though.

Try to side-b closer to people so they're within the first 3rd of it. You can't be hit during it and you kept being hit out of side b so i figure it'd be a good remedy.

Just work on all that for now and you should do a lot better.
 

Sph34r

Smash Journeyman
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palo alto, middlefield road
Dodge less. 0:00 - 0:15

Laser more. If he buckets them, he can't bucket brake, and a bucket with 3 lasers won't kill you at ridiculous percents. You only lasered ~2 times in these matches, both of which were when G&W was dead anyway.

And if you're going for a grab, don't fish for it so hard (especially with a dash grab. Falco's dash grab sucks, NEVER use it outside of a CG).
 

Choice

Smash Champion
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Apr 28, 2010
Messages
2,578
Dodge less. 0:00 - 0:15
yea i was confused what all the dodging at the start was accomplishing, but i mean you werent getting punished for any of it so its not necessarily bad, just doesnt accomplish much i guess.
 

-DR3W-

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DrewTheAsher
yea i was confused what all the dodging at the start was accomplishing, but i mean you werent getting punished for any of it so its not necessarily bad, just doesnt accomplish much i guess.
It's a bad habit, and normally would get *****.
 

Choice

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Its not necessarily a bad habit. What he did at the beginning of the match was different than anything else throughout the match. Though again, it did not really achieve much, unless the aim was just to throw people off or confuse them.
 

-DR3W-

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DrewTheAsher
Point is, as Choice said, it didn't affect anything at the beginning or during the match. Case closed. Someone else post a video.
 

-DR3W-

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DrewTheAsher
Why so aggressive? We're simply discussing if a certain gamestyle is a good idea to keep following.
It was more of a quarter-minute recurring of a tactic. ;)
Nothing really significant, really. But I'm aggressive becasue I want to rapte more people.
 

Choice

Smash Champion
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Messages
2,578
Yea, just be sure to implement things one at a time, not everything at once. If you can do one thing 100% of the time its tons better than being able to do 100 things 1% of the time.
 

Kasper!

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 21, 2008
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can i ask, why do falco's critique?

do you do it cause u wanna see falco higher the tier list?

u care about falco players?

u cant stand seeing bad falcos?

or

u hate the characters they are playing against so give as much advice as possible so that they can woop there *** and make you smile?
 

Choice

Smash Champion
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can i ask, why do falco's critique?

do you do it cause u wanna see falco higher the tier list?

u care about falco players?

u cant stand seeing bad falcos?

or

u hate the characters they are playing against so give as much advice as possible so that they can woop there *** and make you smile?
I critique caz people ask for it. I know myself a lot of my progress as a player has come from asking others about what i'm doing wrong and what i could be doing better so it only makes sense to me to try to do the same to others.
 

-DR3W-

Smash Champion
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DrewTheAsher
can i ask, why do falco's critique?

do you do it cause u wanna see falco higher the tier list?

u care about falco players?

u cant stand seeing bad falcos?

or

u hate the characters they are playing against so give as much advice as possible so that they can woop there *** and make you smile?
I want my character to succeed as much as possible in the Smash scene, so I try to identify errors so people can correct them and flourish. Falco has quite a bit of potential, and people aren't reaching it as much as I would like to see. We were impressed by RAIN's simple but unique use of lasers at APEX 2010. So, imagine how much we could build off that.

Also I really hate seeing the same dumb mistakes and habits repeated. I strongly believe people would do so much better both confidence and game-wise if they got off their usual, every-day habits and 'explore' their character's possibilities. But, one can only hope...

The tier list placing doesn't matter to me, nor should it to anyone.
 

teluoborg

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teloutre
Chaos : too many punishable moves, mostly Fsmash and dash attack (like one time you Fsmashed Marth's shield at point blank). Don't use those when it's not for punishing.

Mick : try to use the naners as traps rather than projectiles.
For example get one, SH Dtoss it next to Diddy (not on him because he'll shield it) and FF Bair/Dair on the other side. Shieldpush > trip.
Be creative, Falco's jump and fall speed gives him some nice item tricks.
Also don't SHDL when you're on the wrong side of YI (aka the side where the platform eats your first laser).

Kasper! : I critique because I like to tell people how they are wrong and have them thank me for that :awesome:
 

Mick27

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Thanks teluoborg, I'll have to incorporate that shieldpush > trip thing more often. Thanks for the advice.
 

ChaosDrifter

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Thank teluoborg, ye for some reason i have this mindset that so many of falco's moves are unpunishable, including his smashes so I use them a lot. Falco has AMAZING frame data but he's still easily punishable, i need to learn to grab more and not just do it when i plan on chaingrabbing. I'll break that habit pretty soon, my falco is already improving slowly and im trying out plenty of different things to experiment and get a feel for what works and what doesn't
 

-DR3W-

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DrewTheAsher
He's another one for you DR3W, sorry it took awhile. This one was about a week ago now. As you can probably tell, we play each other ALOT. :ohwell: This Diddy player (CHEX), really knows what he's doing (as you can tell in my last stock) :smash: Anyway, thanks again!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kzy0qB2zIc
Actually using Bdacus properly instead of throwing it out. Nice. Much better.

I really don't know what to say, I'm losing interest in watching/playing this game. But when I do play it's fun.

I guess my advice to you is practice banana control, a lot. It ridiculously helps in the matchup.
 

Vlade

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Perth, Western Australia
So there was a tournament for the first time in a while because of exams and stuff. I came 2nd but I got absolutely ***** in Grand Finals and Winners Finals, and I'm also not confident at all about the Diddy matchup.

Grand Finals
Round 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaaKMyFw3x8
Round 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UDKprTJzc0
Round 3: I went Metaknight because I didn't feel I could win with Falco at that point

Winners Finals
Round 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5CkTBJGiZ4
Round 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYClXkHLgdo (I get a laserlock :bee:)
Round 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsIsFJeSAhI (I win!)
Round 4: I went Metaknight

Losers Finals
Round 1: My opponent went Lucas; I'm not really fussed about that matchup
Round 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVKBl5fwp9U
Round 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dT4kDQW7e1A


If you guys could watch at least one match from each section and provide some input that would be sweet. From watching these videos myself I've already observed I'm bad at landing (I don't DI to the side and airdodge enough on the way down) and I keep trying to punish some of Metaknight's moves when I can't. If you guys could give me some more tips in the Metaknight department and tell me what I could do better in the Diddy department that would be greatly appreciated.
 

SlashTalon

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Vlade you definitely made the first move like 90% of the time =/ Don't fall for them doing random moves just out of your range that's just asking to be punished. When you play are you watching them the whole time? Try and notice the move patterns that they follow, for example you could tell he knew you weren't going to stay on the ledge long so he just waited on stage and baited you or attacked where he thought you'd get up/roll/jump pantasm

Vs MK just play patient and safe, only attack when you know it will it him/he can't punish. So knowing what attacks he has that autocancel or don't have much lag (Fsmash) is really important, Actually that applies to every matchup...Every percent counts so whiffing an attack like an upsmash or phantasming into a nado are things you consciously need to avoid

also you rarely retreated, meaning when you did you either went into SHDL camp mode or IAP through them (which unless you were punished immediately you usually did again the opposite direction), both options become read easily when its the only 2 things they have to watch for. Try dashing away then walking away, little stuff like that will show that you have more options than just stand and shield/roll/spotdodge, forcing them to approach you and make themselves vulnerable

All that being said if you add patience and reading people to your game there's no way either of them will beat you. :D

good way to start reading someone is to dash just outside their range and shield, see what they do, condition them to do what you want them to do, and then punish accordingly.
 

teluoborg

Smash Otter
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teloutre
Vlade : you didn't get *****, the enemy just eploited your bad habits.
Bad habit #1 : phantasming when you're too far from them. Hitting your opponent with the end of the phantasm is unsafe. It puts you at a disadvantage that is not worth the few % you could inflict them if it hits.

Bad habit #2 : not enough mixups on the ledge recovery. First match of WF you almost only roll to get back up on stage. It's not only unsafe and punishable on reaction, it also leaves you with your side B lag. Don't do it so systematically.
If you want something that I use : ledgehopped SL to phantasm. Great for disrupting opponent that camp you at phantasm distance.

Also what Talon aid : play safer (which doesn't mean to camp more). Retreat your stuff and try SHL instead of SHDL. It's way easier to mix aerials with SHL than SHDL.

Just watched the WF, more advices when I watch the rest.
 

clowsui

Smash Legend
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Feb 14, 2007
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Chapel Hill, NC
Vlade
I intentionally have minute marks for some without minute marks for others. I felt like being more selective the more I saw

(WF, G2)
Got baited super hard on your grabs LOL, be more patient
I see that you're trying to work a very random close combat game when you think it's good to get in but you should only really do that once you've established control, i.e. random cross up rolls =! good unless you're already pressuring and forcing them to react
Stop nervously shielding/dodging. Shield/dodge should be used minimally
When you get a close range laser, don't always retreat. Close range lasers, when used intentionally, are a good gambit for a situation where you can get a grab or force a reaction. The gamble of course is that they will just grab you on landing or punish you by buffering actions between lasers but you keep retreating and letting off the pressure so he gets away w/ the same reaction everytime (shield) for free
Phantasm a little more conservatively, you seem to like to do it in reaction to everything but it should really be used as mix up. When he does something don't be afraid to just stand there, walk forward, or even bait him w/ empty short hop. Use it more when you see that he's trying to dash in
1:29 PLEASE PUNISH OPEN SHUTTLE LOOPS ON REACTION
Your grab setup seems to be single laser -> shield, walk toward grab to beat 2nd shield but he just spotdodges. Wait if you're going to use that set up. Personally I think that you should really think about incorporating more reads for grab if you want the grab so bad
1:38 what is this double laser bs, if he's up there and you're going to pressure him aerially you need to do it when he's higher above the ground and thus has to reduce his options if he wants to get away
1:42 WHY?
1:46 WHY?
Change up your DI but make sure to change your trajectory (i.e. don't DI down, then DI to the side, lol). If you're going to keep the same DI at least don't do the same thing twice in a row :/
You're eager to get onstage for some reason while recovering. Relax
Punished hard for being eager to kill lol, not necessarily for damage but for position. Stop it
2:01 this is what i'm talking about w/ the phantasm, don't just react to anything! be selective
2:07 onstage again?
2:15 hope you knew that was just a long shot LOL
2:21 onstage again
2:22 obvious back air. the first bair was a failure already, why do another one? i understand that it's one of those safe things - if he throws this out then it'll beat it + majority of his options won't cover this - but in the chance that he even picks the one option to punish you get hit not to mention he can count on you to do this again in the same position
2:35 again with this bad randomness, you haven't applied pressure yet so don't roll in
2:41- 2:42 Terrible series of actions, first you down air to land then you down air some retardedly safe pressure. You need to learn when to retreat
3:00 SIDE B :bee:
3:02 Nice, a new type of grab set up
3:04 Of course you would do the obvious thing! Just take the grab or retreat
3:14 lmao
3:34 THAT IS A WAYYYY BETTER PHANTASM THAN BEFORE
3:35 :( :( :( :(
3:37-3:42 I think these rolls are just coming from a bad shield habit that you're showing here. Not shielding even when there's a potential threat is important in a lot of matchups, particularly the MK one. vs. MK you HAVE to be willing to take certain risks
3:45 proper punish is buffered dash attack OOS, if you wanna be safe buffer roll back
3:46 momentum cancelling at low percents got you into this mess
3:48 sad he didn't properly punish you for that down air, which already happened twice (2:41 and 3:14). I know you don't wanna full hop and put yourself in a bad position, but at this point it's not really a choice since he's banking on you letting your chip shield (and judging from the level of MK shown here I don't think Corpse is gonna react quickly enough to your fullhop to escape)
3:51 the fourth time you've down air'd descending when MK is one character length away horizontally
3:55 onstage
3:57 why the down airs? actually you seem to like them near plats lol
4:06 OHHHHHH okay now I get why you do the rolls. That's more of a reads thing though, you're not gonna get it randomly like you did here
4:10 don't like that empty short hop especially because you're highly likely to
4:12 yep likely to try and short hop again, get baited son
4:16 you waited the first time, and then you went onstage lol

You put yourself in good positions sometimes but for some reason you don't understand risk/reward very well vs MK...normally it's the other way around. Your technical game is okay and I like your occasional ftilts to condition him not to random dash but there are a LOOOT of things you need to work on that I've mostly outlined above. Gonna look at the other vids later if I feel like it
 

Vlade

Social Outcast
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Thank VERY MUCH Clowsui, I am eternally grateful for this critique.

I'm going to try and summarise the critique to break it down so my head can get around it easier. Let me know if there's anything important I've missed.

-Do not prematurely spotdodge/shield/roll
-Be selective with phantasm
-Stop trying to punish things I can't
-Stop dairing when descending
-Recover on to the stage less

Also, I'd like clarification on this:

Change up your DI but make sure to change your trajectory (i.e. don't DI down, then DI to the side, lol). If you're going to keep the same DI at least don't do the same thing twice in a row :/
I'm not sure what you mean here. I'm having trouble understanding the first sentence and the example. Do you mean after the same dthrow to not DI down then to the side?
 

clowsui

Smash Legend
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That did not express what I wanted it to at all xD, that i.e. should've been an e.g.

I want you to not produce the same trajectory from dthrow two times in a row (from two different dthrows)
When you DI dthrow to the side or DI dthrow downwards they produce roughly the same trajectory, which is why it's not sufficient to say "don't DI the same way twice in a row"

Even if you DI a dthrow with the same trajectories twice in a row, don't do the same thing. In the video you had a tendency to DI inwards from the dthrow and try to airdodge.
 
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