The Official "Should/Will Metaknight be banned?" Thread (LISTEN TO THE SBR PODCAST!)

[homicidalrapist]

MK's weakness: liable to be banned
Paradox FTW

I think the no-parrying projectile is like Mk's low air speed; it can get covered up by his specials easily, so it becomes a techinical weakness, but not a practical one.

But MK can just spot dodge or SHAD easily. He can even fly over the projectiles, so he doesn't need to cancel out projectiles with attacks.

 

[XienZo]

But MK can just spot dodge or SHAD easily. He can even fly over the projectiles, so he doesn't need to cancel out projectiles with attacks.

Exactly, so in the end, its VERY hard to actually take advantage of it. Thus, it just becomes a minor footnote that the MK user should be aware of, and not really anything bad for them.

 

[Tenki]

Random assortment.

@brinboy: lol I tried this last night:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=5515503#post5515503

[this was in reference to da K.I.D and Sonic matchups]
Yes you can. Argue it using valid arguments. Show them in practice how Sonic works against those characters. Teach other Sonics to do what you do.

We actually tried bringing this up in matchups before.
"Hey, we can jump over projectiles at running speed by using spinshot-"
"Lolz ol u hav to do is to put a gyro in da middle of da stage xd"

"Sonic can run across FD in about 60 frames- apply that to just-out-of-range and ________ can be punished if whiffed, when it's normally safe against other characters-"
"lol speed doesnt matter in brawl"

Anyway, for some reason people Sonic's run speed, gimp ability, cancels, all are discarded and thrown into the pile of "oh well that's just you as a player" (and I'd agree on that one most of the time). I'm personally tired of arguing Sonic matchups because it always boils down to how x character can outprioritize Sonic in the air, and discarding Sonic's punishment ability.

I had something to say to Sucumbio, but I think he's gone back to his 4 player smashball ffas.

 

[Gishnak]

There is not enough evidence/reason to ban MK.

However, the game would be a more interesting and more competitive fighter if MK was banned. Does anyone disagree with that?

 

[da K.I.D.]

Bum wins tournies
Azen wins tournies
Chu wins tournies
Chillin wins tournies
M2k wins tournies (with ddd)
Futile wins tournies
sk92 wins tournies

i can make a list of elite players and say they win tournies too, even if they dont use MK

good job, great logic

lol...
i havent seen M2K play D3 in ages, not that im saying he couldnt win with him, he just doesnt anymore.
lol...
Azen plays MK too now, dont you know
also lol...
my MK mainer tourney winner list was bigger than this
lol...
the only reason i made my list was because brinboy said that M2K and Dojo are the only people that win tournaments with MK

 

[Master Raven]

Azen has been playing MK for a long time, not just now.

 

[da K.I.D.]

There is not enough evidence/reason to ban MK.

However, the game would be a more interesting and more competitive fighter if MK was banned. Does anyone disagree with that?

personally i believe that this is self contradicting... as the more competitive part is enough of a reason for a ban, but thats just me. and not everyone agrees

 

[Gishnak]

personally i believe that this is self contradicting... as the more competitive part is enough of a reason for a ban, but thats just me. and not everyone agrees

Just because it makes it a better competitive fighter doesn't warrant a ban. Infinites? They arn't banned, even though it would make this game a better fighter. (Or most of them anyhow)

 

[choknater]

da K.I.D.'s enthusiasm in getting metaknight banned reminds me of Mmac's enthusiasm in proving that Yoshi is even with Metaknight. Who knows, he might succeed.

 

[da K.I.D.]

actually infinites do make the game better, it makes you think harder and play smarter, and learn to not get grabbed in the case of the ice climbers

but do realise that most infinites ARE banned
D3 on
Mario
Luigi
Samus
Bowser
DK
Marth/Charizard on:
Ness
Lucas

are banned

 

[Mmac]

And I didn't? >_>

 

[Overswarm]

actually infinites do make the game better, it makes you think harder and play smarter, and learn to not get grabbed in the case of the ice climbers

but do realise that most infinites ARE banned
D3 on
Mario
Luigi
Samus
Bowser
DK
Marth/Charizard on:
Ness
Lucas

are banned

that's not true. >_>

 

[rehab]

Wait, Marth infinite on Ness is banned? Happy freaking day.

Edit crap.

 

[Overswarm]

Wait, Marth infinite on Ness is banned? Happy freaking day.

Edit crap.

Check the SBR ruleset for the SBRs official stance on these things. Past that, it is up to individual TOs.

 

[Mmac]

Infinites aren't banned for killing purposes, but is banned if used in a matter to purposely stall the match

 

[Gishnak]

Most infinities are NOT banned. Keep in mind, I said "(Most of them anyhow)"

I think ICs infinite is A-OK. DeDeDe's standing infinite?

Dtilting someone over and over? Yeah, they should not get in that position, but if they make that mistake, it often leads to free 100+ damage with no skill at all needed.

 

[ROOOOY!]

actually infinites do make the game better, it makes you think harder and play smarter, and learn to not get grabbed in the case of the ice climbers

but do realise that most infinites ARE banned
D3 on
Mario
Luigi
Samus
Bowser
DK
Marth/Charizard on:
Ness
Lucas

are banned

They aren't. As unfair and pants-on-head ******** as they are they actually aren't.

IC's infinites I can half accept because they require skill to perform.

There's nothing skillful about standing there, grabbing, mashing A, and then regrabbing like a faggot.

I wonder about this community sometimes. Why are we giving people free wins?

 

[brinboy789]

lol...
i havent seen M2K play D3 in ages, not that im saying he couldnt win with him, he just doesnt anymore.
lol...
Azen plays MK too now, dont you know
also lol...
my MK mainer tourney winner list was bigger than this
lol...
the only reason i made my list was because brinboy said that M2K and Dojo are the only people that win tournaments with MK

from what ive heard, azen plays EVERYBODY

 

[da K.I.D.]

huh.. my bad OS, didnt know that. but although my D3 is scrub tier, its still decent and i still eff that infinite up usually after 3 throws

 

[da K.I.D.]

and now that we are on the subject of infinites, what is the most one sided match in the game?

 

[brinboy789]

and now that we are on the subject of infinites, what is the most one sided match in the game?

pit spamming arrows

you just cant beat that

 

[ThaRoy]

Bum wins tournies
Azen wins tournies
Chu wins tournies
Chillin wins tournies
M2k wins tournies (with ddd)
Futile wins tournies
sk92 wins tournies

i can make a list of elite players and say they win tournies too, even if they dont use MK

good job, great logic

So in a tournament with those people only MK will be allowed.

That accomplishes nothing.

 

[homicidalrapist]

and now that we are on the subject of infinites, what is the most one sided match in the game?

Fox vs. pikachu, or Cap't falcon vs. MK

 

[da K.I.D.]

holy crap i just looked at who made that not MK list

lol @ plank... youre on my list
go back to zelda if MK is not broken

 

[Overswarm]

Bum wins tournies, but beaten by two MKs at the last tournamnet
Azen wins tournies, but goes MK in the end
Chu wins tournies... in Melee. Regardless, I believe he agrees with Chillin.
Chillin wins tournies, but wants MK banned.
M2k wins tournies (with ddd)... like 3 months into the game's lifespan.
Futile wins tournies, but only when DSF and his MK don't show up
sk92 wins tournies.... NOT! He also got beat by Lee Harris' MK, I believe.

 

[Ussi]

I have video prove on Bum losing to the two MKs...as they are uploading...

 

[da K.I.D.]

OS is too good...
lolnopolejockingKID

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

Are we really argueing with a guy who thinks pit's arrows are broken?

 

[brinboy789]

Are we really argueing with a guy who thinks pit's arrows are broken?

who me? i said that a pit spamming arrows is a one-sided match not that theyre broken

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

If you can't beat something it makes it broken.

That has to be something everyone agrees on.

 

[da K.I.D.]

dude, it wasnt even that serious of a question
your just being biased cause its brinboy
get over your grudges...

 

[Skink]

Should probably be banned. How is opening a whole new set of characters up to the tournament at the sacrifice of one character no one really likes except the people who use him not a good idea? Could we do a temporary ban or something? MK is the only character in Smash history that has ever really broken the game to this degree, (I think..) and it is seriously messed up when you have to use MK to get an even matchup vs MK. I'm suprised he doesn't have stretchy arms.

 

[Tenki]

pit spamming arrows

you just cant beat that

lol guysz i found a counter to pit's arrows.

it's called SHIELD.






...anyone get the reference?

edit/spoiler:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=196054 <-- this.

 

[brinboy789]

Should probably be banned. How is opening a whole new set of characters up to the tournament at the sacrifice of one character no one really likes except the people who use him not a good idea? Could we do a temporary ban or something? MK is the only character in Smash history that has ever really broken the game to this degree, (I think..) and it is seriously messed up when you have to use MK to get an even matchup vs MK. I'm suprised he doesn't have stretchy arms.

lol. too good

 

[brinboy789]

lol guysz i found a counter to pit's arrows.

it's called SHIELD.






...anyone get the reference?

sorry for double post if it is

 

[salaboB]

sorry for double post if it is

When it's a non-critical response that doesn't need people to reply to it, you should just edit whether someone may have posted after you or not.

 

[infomon]

I think the no-parrying projectile is like Mk's low air speed; it can get covered up by his specials easily, so it becomes a techinical weakness, but not a practical one.

It is a genuine weakness, even if he seems to make up for it.. Most people I talk to don't even know about this, let alone have thought about ways to use it to their advantage. (Most people don't bother hitting projectiles to destroy them, even though this changes the way I play a lot of fights. *shrug*)

I wonder about this community sometimes. Why are we giving people free wins?

We're not. The game design is. Seriously, blame Sakurai, he did a bad job. It's incredibly difficult and arbitrary for the SBR to say "No grabbing more than three times in a row!".... why three, why not seven? Why some infinites, not others? Why allow grabs at all? Even if this weren't miserably arbitrary, it's extremely difficult for TO's to monitor this effectively. It's just a dumb part of the game.

Bum wins tournies, but beaten by two MKs at the last tournamnet
Azen wins tournies, but goes MK in the end
(...)

But if they're winning any tournies, it means (presumably) that they're able to defeat a bunch of MK's in each (given how popular he supposedly is). So I have trouble concluding that MK is really ruining the tournament scene to the point that's been suggested.

But my mind could be changed. I'll come back later with more specific questions about OS' ban criteria.

 

[XienZo]

Anyone wanna organize and post the NEW set of arguments for and against banning? That way, we can see where we're going with this.

 

[LSDX]

Quoted as fact good samaritan.

 

[Overswarm]

But if they're winning any tournies, it means (presumably) that they're able to defeat a bunch of MK's in each (given how popular he supposedly is). So I have trouble concluding that MK is really ruining the tournament scene to the point that's been suggested.

The MKs just don't show up and these are small local tournaments. Each and every one. >_>