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The Zelda Critique Thread

Tsuteto

Tsuteto

火事で死ね
Joined
Oct 24, 2005
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Sandy, UT
I think I'll record video and comment with the video. But that'll have to wait a small bit. Tourney tomorrow and need sleep ^^

Overall though, your Zelda is pretty good. Just a set-up you should realize here and there.
 
A

Arashi

Smash Cadet
Joined
Dec 3, 2007
Messages
49
I have no clue how to record a match and get it to the computer, so it may be a while before I do so. I enjoyed watching Nakayorz's video, though. My youtube account name is Yoruketseki, by the way.
 
N

Nakayorz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
122
Location
New York
calicocal said:
I think that the ledges on FD kill me almsot as much as people do :laugh: I liked the spike in the begining. I need to do it but am too scard because of those ****ed ledges. Overall nice match.
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hehe thanks I actually sourspotted that spike but it worked out I guess.. Yeah I'm having some problems identifying setups sometimes in the heat of battle if you guys could tell me time stamps of where and what setup I missed that would be really helpful.
 
Luthien

Luthien

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
792
Location
Victoria, British Columbia
Nakayorz said:
hehe thanks I actually sourspotted that spike but it worked out I guess.. Yeah I'm having some problems identifying setups sometimes in the heat of battle if you guys could tell me time stamps of where and what setup I missed that would be really helpful.
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Well, I'm not sure if I can help you with setups and stuff, but there are a couple of things I know against Ike matchups thanks to Spazn...

First of all: 3:27. Beautiful. That is my favourite use of Din's Fire. Make Ike airdodge or counter and dash-attack, usmash, or utilt. :]

I'm just gonna go with S2 here and say that you don't need to approach Ike. Make him come to you with Din's Fire, and he's bound to make a mistake at some point. For example, that Ike walked straight into your side-tilt in the middle of that match. Make that happen again. Also, if he mistimes an airdodge, more power to you.

However, at 4:02 I couldn't help but think "Don't try it." And you did. That's the problem with Din's Fire; try to discern whether or not Ike is close enough to you to airdodge -> jab combo. This problem got you throughout the match: take a look at 4:25. Sometimes he punished you, sometimes he didn't. But eventually it'll get to the point where he will every time.

3:34. You missed a great Uair oppurtunity. Remember: Zelda's Uair > Ike's Dair. Don't be afraid to come up from under Ike and try to hit him with Uair, or trick him into airdodging so you can Usmash/Dsmash him when you both land. Just watch out: he might trick you into falling for a bair, nair, of fair. If you do jump up, make sure you are going to stay underneath him, not go to his side.

Be careful when Ike uses his side-b. Try to resist the urge to use Din's Fire when he does. If you start you Din's Fire right when he starts charging his attack, you might get away with it. But generally, you'll have more to lose than he will. See 0:23, 5:02 and 5:11.

You can punish it, but it's tricky. See if you can beat it with a fsmash or maybe a well timed dsmash (never tested dsmash). Also, I've beaten it with a usmash too, but that doesn't always seem to work. I've found that a good counter for when he uses this move on the ground is jumping (to avoid it if he releases) and Farore's Wind to him. This ends two ways: he either lets go and flies across the stage, resetting the game, of you hit him and all is well in the world. It's win/win either way.

Don't try to Dair Ike close to the stage. You get aether'd in the face.

[nitpicking]4:49-4:51: Lovely. Sadly, you didn't follow up with Din's Fire mindgame -> usmash/utilt for the KO, but you could have. Were you trying to trick him into airdodgeing into you upcoming dash-attack, or what? You could have made it if you didn't pull back right after the Uair. Anyway, try to use the DF air momentum trick to lead into more rewarding moves than the dash attack. You got lucky he didn't jab combo when he landed.[/nitpicking]
 
Tsuteto

Tsuteto

火事で死ね
Joined
Oct 24, 2005
Messages
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I'll give my input about the video probably tomorrow or something. Tired from the tournament today. And speaking of that, I should have some videos of mine up soon ^^ Then again, I may not post, because I don't like people learning my style without playing me >.>
 
N

Nyagamun

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 25, 2008
Messages
10
Luthien said:
Be careful when Ike uses his side-b. Try to resist the urge to use Din's Fire when he does. If you start you Din's Fire right when he starts charging his attack, you might get away with it. But generally, you'll have more to lose than he will. See 0:23, 5:02 and 5:11.

You can punish it, but it's tricky. See if you can beat it with a fsmash or maybe a well timed dsmash (never tested dsmash). Also, I've beaten it with a usmash too, but that doesn't always seem to work. I've found that a good counter for when he uses this move on the ground is jumping (to avoid it if he releases) and Farore's Wind to him. This ends two ways: he either lets go and flies across the stage, resetting the game, of you hit him and all is well in the world. It's win/win either way.
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pretty sure you can punish side b if blocked...the problem is if he whiffs it he can go to his jab combo faster than you can react. If you anticipate the whiff and combo you can block THAT and attempt to punish with a run attack or fsmash
 
Luthien

Luthien

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
792
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Victoria, British Columbia
Nyagamun said:
pretty sure you can punish side b if blocked...the problem is if he whiffs it he can go to his jab combo faster than you can react. If you anticipate the whiff and combo you can block THAT and attempt to punish with a run attack or fsmash
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Really? I can't quite do it. I've tried to shield grab, but the attack pushes you too far back for the grab to connect.

I have yet to try fairing out of shield though. That might work... if it sweetspots. >.<
 
N

Nakayorz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
122
Location
New York
okay lots of questions now

it appears that spot dodging and power shielding the QD leaves you close to punish ike after it but is it better to grab instead of say f-tilt?

also I've been eating eruption now cuz ike is using the super armor frames of it to blow through my u-air and even fair/bair sweet spots and it's mad annoying cuz you see the sweetspot freeze frame and then end up getting star KO'ed if higher than 70% yourself.

been trying baiting him into using it without being in range so I can come up after.. sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't but I'm starting to have doubts about how 'safe' being directly underneath ike is when attacking with u-air.

thoughts, comments, suggestions?
 
Tsuteto

Tsuteto

火事で死ね
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1) If the match is just starting, then you should be able to dash forward a small amount and do a sliding u-smash, followed by another one right after to deal a fair amount of starting damage. If you're near an edge, I find pulling out a d-smash is good to send them a low distance to make it hard to recover.

2) The person that I've fought who uses Ike doesn't really use that move, so this is all theory based. But I'm assuming that it takes a small bit of post lag, so you can short hop (and air dodge for good measure) so he starts it, uses it, and then you can punish him with whatever you feel according to his percentage.
 
R

RedMage8BT

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
1,994
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Princess Peach's Castle
I just had the most epic Zelda experience.

In All-Star I used a stopwatch to slow down time, and then I got a quintuple thunder kick on Donkey Kong.

Sry if that was off-topic, but I just had to share that.
 
F

FadingWings

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 15, 2008
Messages
28
Location
TN
I think that the ledges on FD kill me almsot as much as people do :laugh: I liked the spike in the begining. I need to do it but am too scard because of those ****ed ledges. Overall nice match.
Click to expand...
I hate those horrible ledges of death ;~;
 
Tsuteto

Tsuteto

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With the current ruleset we have here in Utah, that's one of the two stages I ban in touneys ^^
 
Tsuteto

Tsuteto

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Yeah. The characters I fought mainly in the tournament would have the advantage on FD, so I got rid of it. I don't have too much practice right now up my sleeves, so I'd rather play it safe ATM.
 
Tsuteto

Tsuteto

火事で死ね
Joined
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Messages
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You act like it's a bad thing. Last I checked, you throw out stages you can't use to your advantage. That was one stage that I knew others would pick, and didn't want to risk such a chance.

Once I get used to it, it'll be back in the norms for me, but for now, it's out.
 
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