Tripping: Is it TRULY that annoying?

[shatoga]

This is why your rank of smash child really does link to your behavior so well.

I am guessing you're eleven.

It was joke dude calm yourself.I'm actually 15 and don't take the internet seriously enough to get worked up over someone saying "Shut Up." Jeez you act as if i went on a huge flaming tangent, learn to take a joke.

And sorry i can't accumulate you 400-something posts.

Just a little thing i like to say:

I don't care if you trip 30 times a game, there's nothing you can do about it, so stop your *****ing. We both own brawl, and you don't here me whining about it.

 

[ShadowLink84]

It was joke dude calm yourself.I'm actually 15 and don't take the internet seriously enough to get worked up over someone saying "Shut Up." Jeez you act as if i went on a huge flaming tangent, learn to take a joke.

Bad jokes are bad that is why I responded.

And sorry i can't accumulate you 400-something posts.

If you acquired 30 posts int his month alone you'll have more than I have which took me two years.

30 x 24 =720 posts.

Just a little thing i like to say:

I don't care if you trip 30 times a game, there's nothing you can do about it, so stop your *****ing. We both own brawl, and you don't here me whining about it.

you=/=me
Who are you to say that I shouldn't complain about something?
Know your place.

 

[King Zeal]

I know what you're saying. I suppose I wasn't entirely clear. It's just that 99% of the time, you opponent pulls a beam sword/stitchface and it turns into an "oh **** he's got a stitchface" moment-- that is, you can easily see what just happened and do your ****dest to stay out of the way of that turnip. YOU still have a say in whether or not you get hit or not. With tripping, sometimes you can react and not get hit, but sometimes you literally have NO say in whether or not you get punished.

I can concede to that. It hasn't happened in my experience, but as said before, that accounts to beans in this argument.

I explained in my post why tripping doesn't really work as a risk/reward system-- the risk of tripping is SO low that you should never, ever even take into account the chance of tripping when you are playing. If you have an opportunity, you should ALWAYS take it, because 99/100 times you will not trip. Poker is exactly the same. Imagine a poker game where every one of your hands had a 99% chance of winning. Would you EVER fold? At that point you are bound by a faulty system-- rationally, you should NEVER weigh in the 1% chance of losing into your decision. You are rationally bound to play the hand every single time, just as your are rationally bound to ignore the 1% chance in Brawl that your dash will turn into a trip. You are forced to just play normally, as if tripping did not exist, if you want to compete.

Okay, I think I misunderstood your earlier analogy. I understand what you mean about the poker hand, but the case in point isn't about the 99/100 times it goes right, but the time when it goes wrong. If my hand is guaranteed to win 99% of the time, I'm still not going to put my chips All In EVERY time. THAT'S the argument I was making, which isn't meant as a counter to yours, but more like an addendum.

You're right, it is an unfair disadvantage for doing something that's smart in every case. But my point is that the game requires that, during the 1% that it goes wrong, you have to deal with what you've got, even if it ain't much.

I'm trying to make as much sense as I can, but I think we've gone overboard with the analogies here. >_>

There is no adapting to a trip that guarantees your opponent a free hit. Please describe to me how you might adapt to that..

Not to be picky, but that's kind of a loaded question. Tripping doesn't in and of itself lead to free hits. Each player's individual skill and their ability to punish/anticipate come into play.

Although, I concede that if your opponent is that good at reaction and anticipation, you're basically ****ed.

 

[ninjakoala]

If you play like you assumed you would trip every time, you may as well unplug your controller.

lol i didnt literally mean "every" time that u moved. im sorry, i guess i didnt explain it well. i meant that everytime u r about to iniate a combo, think to urself, "what if i trip?" then always be ready for that and have a backup plan ready to evade your opponents counter.

i understand what some of you are saying about it being annoying and even detrimental to a player's game at tournament level. but seriously, there is nothing we can do about it. it was programmed into the game on a whim of the production team, and it is there to stay. while this complaining may be well deserved, our energy should be put to use elsewhere. instead of a thread about whether or not tripping is a big deal, we should have a thread forming strategies to remove tripping as a threat.

thats what the community is designed for. we can develop a meta game that overcomes the problems of tripping or even uses it to our advantage. or we can sit here and argue whether or not the problem exists.

 

[shatoga]

Bad jokes are bad that is why I responded.


If you acquired 30 posts int his month alone you'll have more than I have which took me two years.

30 x 24 =720 posts.


you=/=me
Who are you to say that I shouldn't complain about something?
Know your place.

Would you just be quiet lol, you're like fixated on the fact that i don't agree with you so you gatta turn it into a huge flamefest.

Firstly, you acted like i was serious,

Second, ok you can do basic multiplication, good for you.

Third, know your place big guy.Me and that guy were just debating tripping and you come in and call me an 11 year old which i find funny since you're the one acting like a big baby in all of this getting all moody over a stupid joke.

I'm ganna end it here, you can make another big long post calling me wrong and getting your panties in a bunch, but i'll ignore it. If you actually wanna get back onto the actual topic i'd be happy to respond.

 

[KratosAurion192]

just so you can learn to stuff a foot in your mouth.

you mentioned Final smashes in your earlier post and asked if it was unfair if a FS can KO you three times. This links to your earlier argument concerning tripping and therefore my reply was appopriate since FS are items that can be controlled and tripping cannot be controlled.
LRN2WRITE

I was using end of day as my example, as well as my biggest concern, because of the end of it doesn't kill me, it deals an obnoxious amount of damage, which lead to a death soon after. I was refering to the fact that if I remember correctly only one FS was supposed to appear in a match. It can be turned off, but when they're on, (which I already mentioned I do play with some casual players so obviously they will be on from time to time) it is no different than the topic at hand.

Well considering the fact that whenever you consider tripping you should look at it competitively during high level play because THAT is when tripping is going to be the most detrimental in your game.
Playing casually and competitively are entirely different.
This isn't to say casual are not extraordinarily skilled but during competitive play, all your strategies and motions are brought to play. During casual play there isn't so much of an emphasis and you won't be as quick to punish tripping.

Casual and competitve alike will all trip, and they all will have to deal with it, it will happen to you as well as your opponent, that's what I find funny about this whole thing. Complain about it all you want, call it a disadvantage but in the end, you and your opponent do have it to worry about it at least a little bit. Meh I've got nothing else...

Turn off smash balls.

Yes I will turn them off in mid game every **** time Olimar gets the ball...
Sorry but try again...

I main sonic.
Dashing is a MUST.
Sonic has very low pirority in the air meaning that his aerial game is crap if he tries to fight directly.
Not every character is suited for the air. you pit an MK against Snake in an aerial battle and he will get *****.
Marth against Samus, she gets slaughtered.
Luigi against Mario he gets murdered.
An aerial game is NOT the best for ALL characters and such a generalization is foolish since many characters do more poorly if you try to keep it mostly aerial.

TL has a lot less of a problem in the air as opposed to Sonic, and I can understand Sonic mains being pissed about it, I'm not sure how to aviod tripping with him (can you trip while in a ball?)

Besides some character need to keep their distance anyway (Samus is the best example) and even if they trip if they were close enough to be punished for it than they deserves the *** beating anyway.

As I mentioned in a post tripping can be detrimental depending on the character.
YOU need to get it out of your head that it is something you can adapt to.
Tell me if I am facing Ike and I use Sonic and I trip kindly tell me how I am NOT going to get punished.
Or even ebtter tell me how to play Sonic from a far distance so that I can actually ahve a chance at beating an Ike that is equally skilled, has better priority and range than me without making use of my speed and getting up close.
inf act tell me how soeone who has NO projectiles at all is going to be capable of camping effectively?
Yes you can avoid using dash but as I mentioned earlier this depends on individual characters.
Ike can do without dashing despite he gets to make use of his great range, Samus doesn't need to dash.
Mario? Stutter step=needs to dash
Sonic=needs to constantly be moving and stutter step.
Fox/Falco=Making use of that speed is a given you won't be using the character to their fullest if you are not using it.

I know how to avoid it with the character I use, which are the Links, Ike and Pkmn Trainer. None of which realy need dashing (I don't use squirtle often)

I rarly trip and when I do I actually kinda laugh it off, I don't know I guess I'm not as serious about it.

I love elitist behavior.
You're complaining about an FS and yet you're telling me to find a new game over something that has the POTENTIAL to ruin someone's gameplay?
Yea, way to go.

I'm "Complaining" about something that WILL end badly either way (as in end of day always leave you over 100% damage) but tripping is not always going to kill you, and like I said you CAN find ways around it, with Sonic I have no idea since I don't play him that much (but I wish you luck in trying to find it out)

Triping is potentially bad, end of day IS bad.... that's my point.

Casually you don't need to worry, during then its only an annoyance but when it comes to competitive and you LOSE because your character tripped into an Fsmash you should have been able to avoid, then there are issues. Heck that is only reason why people are concerned about tripping, because brawl WILL have a large competitive scene. People don'tcocnern themselves in considering casual play doesn't have such an issue.
Its only at high level play that those random occurences can be an issue, especially if you main a close range fighter without any projectiles.

Everyone has to put up with it. Casual or not, Casuals just don't complain about it nearly as much. It's all a massive dramatization IMO. I know there are ways around it, and since the game it still new we have time to figure it out....

 

[Deleted member]

Would you just be quiet lol, you're like fixated on the fact that i don't agree with you so you gatta turn it into a huge flamefest.

Firstly, you acted like i was serious,

Second, ok you can do basic multiplication, good for you.

Third, know your place big guy.Me and that guy were just debating tripping and you come in and call me an 11 year old which i find funny since you're the one acting like a big baby in all of this getting all moody over a stupid joke.

I'm ganna end it here, you can make another big long post calling me wrong and getting your panties in a bunch, but i'll ignore it. If you actually wanna get back onto the actual topic i'd be happy to respond.

the point of attacking your age was to show you that you are not considering the other side of the argument. If say you had my luck, or even worse luck, and you pick up the game for the first time, and you dash and trip more than you successfully dash and run, you might ask or find a way to negate it. Upon finding it to be random, even most casual gamers will write it off as ******** and never play it again. We're trying to base tournaments on it. OK, maybe if it wasn't random, no beef, it'd just be a matter of practice to avoid it. To have something entirely luck based that simply ****s on gameplay ruins it much harder than you think.

 

[ShadowLink84]

I was using end of day as my example, as well as my biggest concern, because of the end of it doesn't kill me, it deals an obnoxious amount of damage, which lead to a death soon after. I was refering to the fact that if I remember correctly only one FS was supposed to appear in a match. It can be turned off, but when they're on, (which I already mentioned I do play with some casual players so obviously they will be on from time to time) it is no different than the topic at hand.

I fail to see where something like tripping can be compared to FS.
Something that occurs entirely random compared to something that can be turned off isn't helpful to the discussiona t hand. Mainly since one can be controlled and the other is not.

Casual and competitve alike will all trip, and they all will have to deal with it, it will happen to you as well as your opponent, that's what I find funny about this whole thing. Complain about it all you want, call it a disadvantage but in the end, you and your opponent do have it to worry about it at least a little bit. Meh I've got nothing else...

Casual play=/= competitive. There is a lot more at stake in competitive than casual play. Usually money and prizes. Not to say casual play does not have that but it just isn't as much of an emphasis nor are you exactly placing yourself in a skill based environment where things should not randomly explode in front of you during a smash attack.

Yes I will turn them off in mid game every **** time Olimar gets the ball...
Sorry but try again...

Don't act stupid -_-;. You know full well what I mean by turning off the smash balls.

TL has a lot less of a problem in the air as opposed to Sonic, and I can understand Sonic mains being pissed about it, I'm not sure how to aviod tripping with him (can you trip while in a ball?)

In ball mode no but you can trip as you begin to initiate it.
You can trip almost doing anything except in midair (which I hear has to do with Olimar). It isn't only frustrating for Sonic mains but for characters whose killing blow is hinged on close combat.
Link for example doesn't need to worry too much about tripping. But god forbid he trips during an Ftilt he is definitely going to get boned.

Besides some character need to keep their distance anyway (Samus is the best example) and even if they trip if they were close enough to be punished for it than they deserves the *** beating anyway.

Yes which I mentioned in my argument.
I never said tripping is horrible and will always kill you, but that it has the potential to ruin gameplay depending on the character.
Samus and Link don't worry too much, but Ganandorf, Link, Sonic, anyone who lacks projectiles is going to have issues.

I know how to avoid it with the character I use, which are the Links, Ike and Pkmn Trainer. None of which realy need dashing (I don't use squirtle often)

True but we also have to remember about the other characters who utilize dashing or need it in their strategy.
Many characters do well without dashing since it rarely is needed, Link being the best case. Ike less so because he does need to dash in order to help his approach game.
Thats anothr thing, the approach game, for some characters with limited options of approach it can cause some issue.

I rarly trip and when I do I actually kinda laugh it off, I don't know I guess I'm not as serious about it.

Meh it doens't bother me too much when I am palying casually but if I am playing in a competition I don't like the idea that I lost because a random trip caused me to screw up and put the flow of the match in my opponents hands. Something you do not want to happen while using Link.

I'm "Complaining" about something that WILL end badly either way (as in end of day always leave you over 100% damage) but tripping is not always going to kill you, and like I said you CAN find ways around it, with Sonic I have no idea since I don't play him that much (but I wish you luck in trying to find it out)

Triping is potentially bad, end of day IS bad.... that's my point.

Tripping is potentially bad and ca lead to you getting killed.
End of day can lead to you getting killed but unlike tripping, isn;t going to affect you as greatly since from what I understand, both players are having to suffer the flow of the game being stopped, not just one.
While you do suffer that 40% damage you are still alive and you can still win.
With tripping while the same can be said for some close range characters it can practically be a free KO for your opponent a good amount of the time.

Everyone has to put up with it. Casual or not, Casuals just don't complain about it nearly as much. It's all a massive dramatization IMO. I know there are ways around it, and since the game it still new we have time to figure it out....

Yes there are ways around it but the ways given aren't going to work for the general gameplay. For characters like Sonic and Ganandorf and Captain Falcon tipping can grossly ruin their gameplan and give the opponent an advantage that they should normally work for.
yes casuals do deal with it too it would be stupid to say they do not, but they often do not have a large risk assosciate with tripping.

Would you just be quiet lol, you're like fixated on the fact that i don't agree with you so you gatta turn it into a huge flamefest.

If you disagree Ia m full within my rights to question your opinion and argue against it.
Waste not the right to speak.

Firstly, you acted like i was serious,

The internet is a really bad place to make jokes since tone of voice is lacking and second, I automatically dislike people who type lol constantly or are just a nuisance in general. You are both, and you're grammar is an annoyance to me.

Second, ok you can do basic multiplication, good for you.

Its kinda funny considering you do not realize what you had said earlier in referring to my post count.
I've heard about a short attention span but this is a first.

Third, know your place big guy.Me and that guy were just debating tripping and you come in and call me an 11 year old which i find funny since you're the one acting like a big baby in all of this getting all moody over a stupid joke.

Kindly refrain from reusing phrases I have used, it really shows your unoriginality.
To continue on when you were having a "discussion" (if you can call it that) all you did was basically go LOL tough luck. Discussion? It looked more like you were trying to incite a flamewar or simply be a douche.

I will pick apart anyone who acts foolish in the discussion. Call it what you will but stupid behavior like that is what caused the tier list discussion to be what it is now.

If you cannot have a proper discussion with someone or at least do not attempt to do so, I will shred you to pieces simply because of the fact such idiocy is befitting of Gamefaqs. So if you wish to simply continue on with your "discussion" as you put it kindly carry it on in gamefaqs or some other place that tolerates it. Not here.

I'm ganna end it here, you can make another big long post calling me wrong and getting your panties in a bunch, but i'll ignore it. If you actually wanna get back onto the actual topic i'd be happy to respond.

If you cannot tell from my other posts I am fully on topic. You can either respond to them (nothing is stopping you) or you can further waste my time with witless remarks, and bad grammar.
Seriously if you are going to use the slang term for going to at least spell it correctly.
G-O-N-N-A.
Have a nice day.

 

[RenX]

How about just being so good that when you Trip it doesnt matter cuz your still 3 stock ahead of them just shut up and get over it

 

[Deleted member]

I love blanket statements.

The game I worked on, Smash Bros.,
is a fighting game, but keeping in mind such reasoning, I set out to
make sure the game did not over-emphasize the notions of victory and
defeat. I won't go into too much detail, but the game was built so that
if a player is strong in combat, just doing the same thing over and
over again won't guarantee they'll always win over their opponents.
There is a mechanism of accidents occurring, balanced so that the
game's progress and results falter easily. Whether you win or lose, you
enjoy a hearty laugh, and move on to the next round. I think this makes
quite a good game.

http://www.allisbrawl.com/forum/topic.aspx?id=3966

edit: this effectively means that sakurai wants us all to lose and enjoy it.

 

[ShadowLink84]

How about just being so good that when you Trip it doesnt matter cuz your still 3 stock ahead of them just shut up and get over it

Tier list discussion is at the top of the board.

Sadly knowing you it won't end there soI shall put it simply as it is now.

The only time you will be ahead by 3 stocks is if you're playing with a n00b.

 

[RenX]

Heh What ever you say man If that helps you sleep at night

 

[bored]

It's not that annoying, actually, it doesn't happen that often with me anyway.


Umm.. I'm just curious, though, does anyone else notice that it happens to D3 more often? It might be just me, but I swear, everytime I use him, he trips.

 

[XHMI]

I would agree with the other majority of smashers on this thread who agree that Tripping is a gay factor that nintendo put into the game

the thing that i would disagree on however is that nintendo did not do this to us

we have done it to ourselves

in melee, dash dancing was a well used strategy,
so was wave dashing

Nintendo seeing this as an unfair advantage of skilled players over n00bs (like myself), and wanting to attract a larger audience into fighting games, implemented the trip to prevent experts from pwning.

so firstly, we need to suck it up
there is no way in **** that nintendo recalls every copy of brawl, get's rid of tripping and then returns them
we just have to learn to deal with it

the next thing, is that we need to stop comming up with at's and other really unfair glitches and tricks that might become frequently used later on.
the next game, nintendo might decide to make your sheild fail every once in a while
or to make your recovery move occasionaly backfire

just suck it up

 

[eyestrain92]

My view on tripping is this: Unpredictable things NEVER happen in real life competitions. It NEVER rains during a game, fans NEVER run onto the field, cars NEVER crash, and god knows runners NEVER trip. Everyone knows that competitions take place in controlled airtight environments, right?

It's not the unpredictable that makes winners, its how the competitors react to the unpredictable.
Tripping is in the game, deal with it.

Good sir, I think I might just have to sig that.

 

[ph00tbag]

I feel the need to interject one more point, because people seem to think that because real sports have random occurrences, so too should Brawl. There is a very simple reason that this does not apply to fighting games:

Fighting games are not real sports.

They are certainly sports, but the sport occurs on a completely abstract "non-real" level. Thus, we are not, or should not be limited by the flaws of the real world. Those limits can be removed, and I guarantee you that any competitive player of any sport wants as many limits and removed as possible.

An anecdote for you: When Roy Williams, coach of the Carolina Tar Heels first stepped on the floor of the RBC Center before the first round of the NCAA tournament this year, he complained to the NCAA rep that the decals the NCAA were using to cover up the NCSU logo were slippery, and would cause players, who were used to the stickier hardwood, to slip and fall.

This is the competitive mindset at work in a real life sport, and it shows that simply because tripping didn't have to be in Brawl, a competitive mindset demands that it not be there.

 

[WastingPenguins]

Plus the fact that, y'know... REAL LIFE PEOPLE DO NOT RANDOMLY TRIP. If you think they do you must have no idea what "random" means. Runners trip because they weren't careful with their foot placement, because they stepped on a slippery patch of field, etc. etc. When a runner trips, there was a CAUSE, and more importantly, a cause that could have been avoided. In Brawl, there is only one way to dash-- tap the control stick. You have zero control over whether or not your dash or smash or tilt or whatever turns into a trip. No amount of skill or care can help you. It has nothing to do with your input, it has nothing to do with your opponents input, it has nothing to do with the condition of your surroundings, it has nothing to do with ANYTHING. It is a virtual coin flip and nothing more, and I assure you that real life certainly doesn't work that way.

 

[kainsword]

Any and all random factors should be negated for a better competitive game. This excludes attack random factors, such as Judge and the expressions on Peach's Turnips, etc.

Movement randomness is unacceptable.

What if there was a 1% chance to be instantly shield-broken after shielding an attack? Yeah, it only happens 1% of the time, but being shield broken means your opponent can severely punish you for something you didn't purposely want or do.

Receiving punishment for the drawback of a movement mechanism is plainly stupid, no matter how small the chance.

 

[Vandom6]

Any and all random factors should be negated for a better competitive game. This excludes attack random factors, such as Judge and the expressions on Peach's Turnips, etc.

Movement randomness is unacceptable.

What if there was a 1% chance to be instantly shield-broken after shielding an attack? Yeah, it only happens 1% of the time, but being shield broken means your opponent can severely punish you for something you didn't purposely want or do.

Receiving punishment for the drawback of a movement mechanism is plainly stupid, no matter how small the chance.

Hmmm...
your opponent can severely punish you for something you didn't purposely want or do


Let's see. Sudden Death. The Peach player makes a conscious decision to pull a veg and RANDOMLY pulls stitched face and throws. Opponent catches and throws back. PUNISMENT and ko. Opponent wins for you for doing something you purposely wanted to do.

 

[WastingPenguins]

Hmmm...
your opponent can severely punish you for something you didn't purposely want or do


Let's see. Sudden Death. The Peach player makes a conscious decision to pull a veg and RANDOMLY pulls stitched face and throws. Opponent catches and throws back. PUNISMENT and ko. Opponent wins for you for doing something you purposely wanted to do.

Lol the situation you described, where one player skillfully defeats his opponent, isn't even remotely like tripping into your opponent's attack. Your analogy is broken, you can do better than that.

 

[shatoga]

I fail to see where something like tripping can be compared to FS.
Something that occurs entirely random compared to something that can be turned off isn't helpful to the discussiona t hand. Mainly since one can be controlled and the other is not.




Casual play=/= competitive. There is a lot more at stake in competitive than casual play. Usually money and prizes. Not to say casual play does not have that but it just isn't as much of an emphasis nor are you exactly placing yourself in a skill based environment where things should not randomly explode in front of you during a smash attack.


Don't act stupid -_-;. You know full well what I mean by turning off the smash balls.


In ball mode no but you can trip as you begin to initiate it.
You can trip almost doing anything except in midair (which I hear has to do with Olimar). It isn't only frustrating for Sonic mains but for characters whose killing blow is hinged on close combat.
Link for example doesn't need to worry too much about tripping. But god forbid he trips during an Ftilt he is definitely going to get boned.

Yes which I mentioned in my argument.
I never said tripping is horrible and will always kill you, but that it has the potential to ruin gameplay depending on the character.
Samus and Link don't worry too much, but Ganandorf, Link, Sonic, anyone who lacks projectiles is going to have issues.



True but we also have to remember about the other characters who utilize dashing or need it in their strategy.
Many characters do well without dashing since it rarely is needed, Link being the best case. Ike less so because he does need to dash in order to help his approach game.
Thats anothr thing, the approach game, for some characters with limited options of approach it can cause some issue.

Meh it doens't bother me too much when I am palying casually but if I am playing in a competition I don't like the idea that I lost because a random trip caused me to screw up and put the flow of the match in my opponents hands. Something you do not want to happen while using Link.




Tripping is potentially bad and ca lead to you getting killed.
End of day can lead to you getting killed but unlike tripping, isn;t going to affect you as greatly since from what I understand, both players are having to suffer the flow of the game being stopped, not just one.
While you do suffer that 40% damage you are still alive and you can still win.
With tripping while the same can be said for some close range characters it can practically be a free KO for your opponent a good amount of the time.




Yes there are ways around it but the ways given aren't going to work for the general gameplay. For characters like Sonic and Ganandorf and Captain Falcon tipping can grossly ruin their gameplan and give the opponent an advantage that they should normally work for.
yes casuals do deal with it too it would be stupid to say they do not, but they often do not have a large risk assosciate with tripping.



If you disagree Ia m full within my rights to question your opinion and argue against it.
Waste not the right to speak.

The internet is a really bad place to make jokes since tone of voice is lacking and second, I automatically dislike people who type lol constantly or are just a nuisance in general. You are both, and you're grammar is an annoyance to me.



Its kinda funny considering you do not realize what you had said earlier in referring to my post count.
I've heard about a short attention span but this is a first.

Kindly refrain from reusing phrases I have used, it really shows your unoriginality.
To continue on when you were having a "discussion" (if you can call it that) all you did was basically go LOL tough luck. Discussion? It looked more like you were trying to incite a flamewar or simply be a douche.

I will pick apart anyone who acts foolish in the discussion. Call it what you will but stupid behavior like that is what caused the tier list discussion to be what it is now.

If you cannot have a proper discussion with someone or at least do not attempt to do so, I will shred you to pieces simply because of the fact such idiocy is befitting of Gamefaqs. So if you wish to simply continue on with your "discussion" as you put it kindly carry it on in gamefaqs or some other place that tolerates it. Not here.



If you cannot tell from my other posts I am fully on topic. You can either respond to them (nothing is stopping you) or you can further waste my time with witless remarks, and bad grammar.
Seriously if you are going to use the slang term for going to at least spell it correctly.
G-O-N-N-A.
Have a nice day.

Uhh, ok have fun. Could you calm down maybe? You're really trying your hardest to prove me wrong on every single point aren't you? Sorry to say this, but i don't really care what you think anymore.And i wasn't inciting a flame war i was just saying tough luck.What am i supposed to say "Oh yeah i changed my mind, tripping is so horrible i'm ganna quit brawl now and kill myself" no it's luck and if you're unlucky enough to trip that many times there isn't jack **** me OR nintendo can do about it.

 

[RBinator]

Well, this topic has gotten quite large since I last posted not very long ago.

What's up with the "go back to Melee if you don't like Brawl" statements? Listen, the majority of the people here like Brawl as a whole, not just every little thing about Brawl, like tripping. What's so wrong with voicing an aspect of the game you don't like? So consumers who spent [normally] 50 bucks on the game are not allow to rate the experience they got from the product they paid for?

Someone also brought up if Brawl was a perfect game, people would still complain about it. What does that have to with what is going on now? First off, perfect would have to be an subjective view. How can something objective be perfect? If Brawl somehow was objective perfect, then there wouldn't be any complains, because something perfect couldn't have any flaws or something to complain about. With that said, there's likely many people who believe Brawl to be perfect. Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't mean everyone else will share the same opinion.

Thing is, many of the people in this topic who think people are overreacting to tripping don't understand the mind set of these people. If so many people are saying they lost matches because of tripping, then there must be at the very least some truth in tripping getting in the way of competitive play. Sooner or later, tournament matches will be won because someone tripped and got punished for it. Just because tripping has an 1% chance of happening doesn't mean it's gonna happen equally to everyone. Some people get more unlucky then others. So what are they suppose to do, avoid doing stuff on the ground and stick to the air? With the reports of tripping in mid air, that's not a safe way to avoid tripping either.

I would agree with the other majority of smashers on this thread who agree that Tripping is a gay factor that nintendo put into the game

the thing that i would disagree on however is that nintendo did not do this to us

we have done it to ourselves

in melee, dash dancing was a well used strategy,
so was wave dashing

Nintendo seeing this as an unfair advantage of skilled players over n00bs (like myself), and wanting to attract a larger audience into fighting games, implemented the trip to prevent experts from pwning.

so firstly, we need to suck it up
there is no way in **** that nintendo recalls every copy of brawl, get's rid of tripping and then returns them
we just have to learn to deal with it

the next thing, is that we need to stop comming up with at's and other really unfair glitches and tricks that might become frequently used later on.
the next game, nintendo might decide to make your sheild fail every once in a while
or to make your recovery move occasionaly backfire

just suck it up

You do realize experts will still pwn n00bs right, even with the chance to trip? What's so unfair about being good at the game and taking time to discover it's inner workings that wasn't explained in the manual? Looking at the words that I bolded, you sound like a scrub. So you're saying competitive players shouldn't be allowed to play the game the way they want, why? Brawl has already been made a lot easier then Melee, so why is there a reason to still complain about pros being better then casual players? It's always gonna be that way, even if there's a smaller gap between the skill levels. Scrubs complain about pros being too focused on winning, yet at the same time, they usually complain about losing and calling what the pros do unfair.

Adding in random luck factors like tripping with no way to disable it just leads to annoying factors for people who play the game competitively. If they were to add in those other luck factors you mentioned, it would just lead to competitive players finding even more fault with the game and harder to have pure skill based contests. If you don't understand the competitive mind set, you likely won't understand why these players have issues with tripping.

My view on tripping is this: Unpredictable things NEVER happen in real life competitions. It NEVER rains during a game, fans NEVER run onto the field, cars NEVER crash, and god knows runners NEVER trip. Everyone knows that competitions take place in controlled airtight environments, right?

It's not the unpredictable that makes winners, its how the competitors react to the unpredictable.
Tripping is in the game, deal with it.

I'm only bringing this up because the topic starter decided to bring it up.

There's a difference between real life and video games. In real life, there are certain things we can't control. In a video game however, everything can be controlled. Video games are not limited to real life flaws unless their programmed to be. Brawl is NOT real life. In a video game, competitions CAN take place in a controlled environment with no luck factors and focus on pure skill. With you comparing real life, to me, you almost make it sound like video games HAVE to be similar to real life. The beauty about video games is, they don't have to be. Otherwise, since the concept of Smash in real life would be impossible, we wouldn't have the Smash series of games.

With that said, people are looking into ways with dealing with tripping because it won't go away. It still doesn't mean people are not allow to not like it.

 

[WastingPenguins]

There's a difference between real life and video games. In real life, there are certain things we can't control. In a video game however, everything can be controlled. Video games are not limited to real life flaws unless their programmed to be. Brawl is NOT real life. In a video game, competitions CAN take place in a controlled environment with no luck factors and focus on pure skill. With you comparing real life, to me, you almost make it sound like video games HAVE to be similar to real life. The beauty about video games is, they don't have to be. Otherwise, since the concept of Smash in real life would be impossible, we wouldn't have the Smash series of games.

Haha yeah, people can't quite seem to grasp the difference between a game and real life. Imagine if someone made a virtual chess game where every time you moved a piece there was a small chance that the piece would move randomly to a different square than you intended... people wouldn't shrug and say "oh well, guess we'll have to adapt and deal with it!" they'd quit playing lol. That situation wouldn't be any more like random wind in sports than tripping is. Luckily Brawl has plenty of redeeming factors and is hugely fun, but people actively defending tripping boggles my mind.

Also there's all this talk about tourney play and money, but you know what? You don't have to be playing in the next MLG tournament for tripping to get on your nerves. I don't personally compete in tournaments, but my friends and I enjoy the competitive style of play and matching our skills against each other. Tripping can definitely get in the way of that. It doesn't take any money from us, but it might take away a bit of our competitive fun, and in my eyes that's just as bad. When I trip and get punished by my friends we both kind of roll our eyes at the situation and we're both willing to admit how dumb it is. Lol but of course we always do punish because we accept it as part of the gamem but that doesn't mean we have to like it! We still love the rest of the game but... okay I'm starting to sound like a broken record, I think I've made my point.

 

[Baky]

Tripping will cause a failed edgeguard, it will end effective camping, it will ruin chain-grabs, it will ruin perfectly executed aerial attacks...and the list goes on.

Tripping will overlap actual skill in many cases. Of course we can "deal with it" but ranting about it might stop the crappy concept of tripping from ever being implemented in any other game again. What do I say? Keep on ranting, thicken the internet even more. Developers listened when they put the new characters on the game. Surely they'll listen to this.

 

[ph00tbag]

Tripping will cause a failed edgeguard, it will end effective camping, it will ruin chain-grabs, it will ruin perfectly executed aerial attacks...and the list goes on.

Tripping will overlap actual skill in many cases. Of course we can "deal with it" but ranting about it might stop the crappy concept of tripping from ever being implemented in any other game again. What do I say? Keep on ranting, thicken the internet even more. Developers listened when they put the new characters on the game. Surely they'll listen to this.

I'm beginning to think they won't. Judging by Sakurai's comments brought to our attention earlier in the thread, if competitive smash totally crashes and burns in this edition, Sakurai will consider tripping to be a smashing (hurr hurr) success, and put it in each successive game, if he's involved in the process.

 

[Baky]

I'm beginning to think they won't. Judging by Sakurai's comments brought to our attention earlier in the thread, if competitive smash totally crashes and burns in this edition, Sakurai will consider tripping to be a smashing (hurr hurr) success, and put it in each successive game, if he's involved in the process.

Well, you do have a point. Apparently focusing on the 10 year olds that play the game for 30 minutes with their friends before playing hotwheels is apparently a better decision than focusing on the members who actually spend hours enjoying the game. I'm sure many casuals want it out as well. The other casuals who dont need to accept the issue as an issue rather than an opportunity for clearly one-sided strategy.

Sakurai can go make more Kirby games. Someone has to be victorious in a fighting game. Everyone cant be on teams in team battle.

 

[dinhotheone]

just wait till it costs you a high level match, you will shudder with rage and curse the gods.

@the guy above me
"Well, you do have a point. Apparently focusing on the 10 year olds that play the game for 30 minutes with their friends before playing hotwheels is apparently a better decision than focusing on the members who actually spend hours enjoying the game. I'm sure many casuals want it out as well. The other casuals who dont need to accept the issue as an issue rather than an opportunity for clearly one-sided strategy."

its not even a question of where to put your effort in neutral territory, assuming money is of any importance, these 10 year olds use and and are done with this game. at this point in time, i have convinced 10 people to buy this game. not to mention the fact that i own 6 smash bros games. 2 ssb64 3ssb melee 1 brawl (i cant handle leaving it at my friends house and not being able to play). why not focus on the people who love the game and promote the game? why not focus on people who are paying your paycheck?

as for that guy above whos talking about how all sorts of things happen in real life and the players have to cope: soccer is alot like ssb at its base. it requires amazing levels of controll, and creativity, just like ssb does. when a soccer ref makes a bad call , and the game is won and lost on that call, all hell breaks loose, people have died over such instances. its a terrible thing. so why take this terrible thing, and force feed the equivalent into a place where you have a choise? this is not real life. why add all the problems of real life to a game that doesnt need it: while your at it, why not make it so when one character is killed, you can never play that character ever again? because thatd be stupid, just like tripping

 

[Baky]

just wait till it costs you a high level match, you will shudder with rage and curse the gods.

@the guy above me
"Well, you do have a point. Apparently focusing on the 10 year olds that play the game for 30 minutes with their friends before playing hotwheels is apparently a better decision than focusing on the members who actually spend hours enjoying the game. I'm sure many casuals want it out as well. The other casuals who dont need to accept the issue as an issue rather than an opportunity for clearly one-sided strategy."

its not even a question of where to put your effort in neutral territory, assuming money is of any importance, these 10 year olds use and and are done with this game. at this point in time, i have convinced 10 people to buy this game. not to mention the fact that i own 6 smash bros games. 2 ssb64 3ssb melee 1 brawl (i cant handle leaving it at my friends house and not being able to play). why not focus on the people who love the game and promote the game? why not focus on people who are paying your paycheck?

as for that guy above whos talking about how all sorts of things happen in real life and the players have to cope: soccer is alot like ssb at its base. it requires amazing levels of controll, and creativity, just like ssb does. when a soccer ref makes a bad call , and the game is won and lost on that call, all hell breaks loose, people have died over such instances. its a terrible thing. so why take this terrible thing, and force feed the equivalent into a place where you have a choise? this is not real life. why add all the problems of real life to a game that doesnt need it: while your at it, why not make it so when one character is killed, you can never play that character ever again? because thatd be stupid, just like tripping

um.....



what?

 

[A man you'll ask her]

My opinion is that they just stuck tripping in Brawl to get discourage players from dash-dancing and foxtrotting. Those two techniques are still possible in Brawl but everytime you start a dash, you risk tripping, so using them is probably not a good idea at any level of play.

 

[KratosAurion192]

I fail to see where something like tripping can be compared to FS.
Something that occurs entirely random compared to something that can be turned off isn't helpful to the discussiona t hand. Mainly since one can be controlled and the other is not.

Not meaning this as an insult in anyway shape or form, but you are taking what I'm saying from such a competitive point of view. Yes you can turn FS's off, but when you play with some casual people and it IS ON IN A MATCH, it is the exact same senario.

Casual play=/= competitive. There is a lot more at stake in competitive than casual play. Usually money and prizes. Not to say casual play does not have that but it just isn't as much of an emphasis nor are you exactly placing yourself in a skill based environment where things should not randomly explode in front of you during a smash attack.

Honestly the only real difference I see is that casuals want to play with items sometimes, and they don't complain about much. Sometimes here we bet **** here, like (like classic controllers :D) and to humor them I let their items on from time to time, only thing I usually ever go for is the smash ball because like I said, End of day is a *****....

Don't act stupid -_-;. You know full well what I mean by turning off the smash balls.

I wasn't really being stupid, I was trying to get at that sometimes I do play with them on and for those specific matches that tends to be the way I lose.

In ball mode no but you can trip as you begin to initiate it.
You can trip almost doing anything except in midair (which I hear has to do with Olimar). It isn't only frustrating for Sonic mains but for characters whose killing blow is hinged on close combat.
Link for example doesn't need to worry too much about tripping. But god forbid he trips during an Ftilt he is definitely going to get boned.

Haha... Link ftilting deserves to trip :D

Yes which I mentioned in my argument.
I never said tripping is horrible and will always kill you, but that it has the potential to ruin gameplay depending on the character.
Samus and Link don't worry too much, but Ganandorf, Link, Sonic, anyone who lacks projectiles is going to have issues.

Link doesn't have projectiles what? j/k
I understand what you're saying, I don't play as a lot of people who need to be close, and even if I did I play a lot of cat and mouse games which means a lot of time spaced anyway.

True but we also have to remember about the other characters who utilize dashing or need it in their strategy.
Many characters do well without dashing since it rarely is needed, Link being the best case. Ike less so because he does need to dash in order to help his approach game.
Thats anothr thing, the approach game, for some characters with limited options of approach it can cause some issue.

At least we're starting to agree...

Meh it doens't bother me too much when I am palying casually but if I am playing in a competition I don't like the idea that I lost because a random trip caused me to screw up and put the flow of the match in my opponents hands. Something you do not want to happen while using Link.

That's part of why I use TL more, You kinda just stay in the air until they screw up.

Tripping is potentially bad and ca lead to you getting killed.
End of day can lead to you getting killed but unlike tripping, isn;t going to affect you as greatly since from what I understand, both players are having to suffer the flow of the game being stopped, not just one.
While you do suffer that 40% damage you are still alive and you can still win.
With tripping while the same can be said for some close range characters it can practically be a free KO for your opponent a good amount of the time.

People here have the tendency to pick small stages, which makes End of Day even worse.
And again this seems to just boil down to the character...

Yes there are ways around it but the ways given aren't going to work for the general gameplay. For characters like Sonic and Ganandorf and Captain Falcon tipping can grossly ruin their gameplan and give the opponent an advantage that they should normally work for.
yes casuals do deal with it too it would be stupid to say they do not, but they often do not have a large risk assosciate with tripping.

Meh we're been over it a few times now :D
At this point I'm just trying to get you to understand my comparions with the FS.

Now onto what was in the post but not aimed at me...

If you disagree Ia m full within my rights to question your opinion and argue against it.
Waste not the right to speak.

Agree 100%

The internet is a really bad place to make jokes since tone of voice is lacking and second, I automatically dislike people who type lol constantly or are just a nuisance in general. You are both, and you're grammar is an annoyance to me.

{sarcasm} tags are a good thing to learn....

Its kinda funny considering you do not realize what you had said earlier in referring to my post count.
I've heard about a short attention span but this is a first.

I'd be not to know you're going to hate this but I really did lol at this...

Kindly refrain from reusing phrases I have used, it really shows your unoriginality.
To continue on when you were having a "discussion" (if you can call it that) all you did was basically go LOL tough luck. Discussion? It looked more like you were trying to incite a flamewar or simply be a douche.

Haha... I do that when I troll the melee Link boards...

I will pick apart anyone who acts foolish in the discussion. Call it what you will but stupid behavior like that is what caused the tier list discussion to be what it is now.

Never read the teir list discussion but from your statement, I think the teir list isn't worth the effort...

If you cannot have a proper discussion with someone or at least do not attempt to do so, I will shred you to pieces simply because of the fact such idiocy is befitting of Gamefaqs. So if you wish to simply continue on with your "discussion" as you put it kindly carry it on in gamefaqs or some other place that tolerates it. Not here.

QFFT

 

[alcheato]

Someone really needs to close this and people need to stop making stupid threads.
Does tripping suck giant donkey balls? Yes.
Is there anything we can do about it? No.
It's good to see Sakurai has a sense a humor in creating games but tripping definitely sucks. Still, anyone who's still going to play the game and go to tournaments like myself will simply have to deal with it.

 

[Darkslash]

We still have to wait for Sakurai's official word on this issue really if he took a Screen shot, put it on the website AND in that picture had a guy tripping he's gonna tell us some day :/

 

[h1roshi]

yes, tripping should have never been in the game, but it ISNT that big of a deal that you need to complain about it. just get over it people.

-hiro

 

[Razorsaw]

If the Pokemon and RPG fans can put up and deal with this kind of thing, this fandom will too.

 

[MLG Masa]

I cant wait for the big thousands of dollars tournaments where it comes down to someone losing the tourny because of a trip. I will lol, and then still wonder why its in this game.

 

[Mario_ 101]

Well, tripping shouldn't be that big of a deal. It RARELY happens, and when it does, sure it can be a little annoying, but I never thought that a silly little thing could create such contreversey.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Well, tripping shouldn't be that big of a deal. It RARELY happens, and when it does, sure it can be a little annoying, but I never thought that a silly little thing could create such contreversey.

Everyone experiences tripping differently. For Sonic mains its an issue since you spend mostof your time dashing so you are more likely to trip.
There is also thef ac thtat because its random it doesn't mean you'll trip only once or twice.
I've tripped five times in a row one after the other. Quite frustrating to say the least.

 

[Starstriker]

Messes up my combos sometimes =( its gets quite aggravating after awhile

 

[Formless]

I don't find it THAT annoying. I've only gotten in a bad situation with it once or twice. Hell, it's actually served as a dodge a few times

I imagine the tourney people vehemently hate it, but it can't be helped.

 

[darkfox32]

Tripping is pretty annoying, especially when you're going to end the match with a final smash or smash attack or you're playing competitively with chaingrabs, RARs, or close combat chars like Marth.