What do you do in an anti-AT environment?

[Aveean]

Hi guys,
So obviously I'm new. I have been lurking around and reading this forum for quite some time though, since I mained Pokemon Trainer the moment I picked up Brawl.

Only reason I haven't posted sooner is I have a problem...
So I'm in college and I have two roommates I play Brawl with almost daily. They are the kind of people who are really against AT's though. I have no problem playing with people like that, because I used to be that way too.

But then in a recent match against one of them, he straight out told me he doesn't want me to go on Smashboards anymore because I was already good enough at the game and now I'm unbeatable (to them at least). I can also tell he is fearful of me starting to use any AT's (yeah, so far I haven't ever used any).

So what should I do? I'm really determined to get better at the game, and maybe participate in the Smash club at my school, but if I show the slightest signs of using AT's I'm sure my roommates would be quite mad at me. I also invited over a few people from my school who said they liked to play Smash but they didn't use any AT's themselves (and I beat them all). Should I keep searching for more people to play with and try to get better? Should I learn AT's secretly and not use them unless I'm playing without my roommates? Or what? What would you do?

I hope this sparks some kind of discussion. =P

 

[Retro Gaming]

keep searching for more people to play with and try to get better.

It sounds like your friends don't want to develop like you. That's fine, but you'll probably have to give up playing them often if you want to keep moving forward.

Or you can make your friends get better. That works out nicely in the long-run but some people are stubborn about investing a lot of time into a game like that.

 

[Aveean]

Thanks for the quick response. I've been diving into the competitive side of smash ever since Melee, and they are more casual gamers (in terms of Smash at least) and they are VERY against Smashboards and competitive play - sooo, no hope there.

I just wish they they could accept it/me and put up with how I want to play though. When I was making my signature at school today, one of my roommates actually made fun of me for joining/posting on this board.

 

[Retro Gaming]

I hate people like that. Tough luck. Some people just don't make the connection between "video games" and "mediums of competition" in the same way that they would make for other outlets. They see it as strictly casual, even when you don't treat it as such.

 

[Fearmy]

same, ppl are like, OMG YOU GRABBED THE EDGE, YOU CHEATED. funny how you three stock them though >:D

 

[DUB]

Yeah, I wouldn't limit myself to not using AT's and just playing friends. Sux you might not be able to play them frequently, but can't teach those who don't want to learn.

How can you play Smash and not want to learn more?

 

[mr_kennedy44]

I'd say that for just playing friendly matches with friends that maybe you should not use AT's and the like (chaingrabs etc) if your friends complain. If your friends improve than sure use them but it they can't than don't.

Continue to learn AT's for serious matches though.

 

[Aveean]

Yeah my problem is finding practice against people who DO use AT's, since most of my practice comes from my roommates (or being alone, but that isn't productive), and online is, of course, laggy.

But thanks guys! =)

 

[infernovia]

lol, I have a friend who refuses to chaingrab with falco. Because its gay apparently.

Of course he laser spams like a *****. So I have been taking up metaknight to out ***** him. Thats usually how it works with my friends anyway.

And if your friends don't like you being too good, turn items on or something. PT isn't THAT tough to counterpick... my friends do it all the time.

 

[E.G.G.M.A.N.]

Yeah my problem is finding practice against people who DO use AT's, since most of my practice comes from my roommates (or being alone, but that isn't productive), and online is, of course, laggy.

But thanks guys! =)

Just take it for what it's worth. Brainless fun. Other than that, go to the regional zones forums and try to find tournaments/players near you.

 

[Miles.]

Get friends that dont suck.

or

Teach them to read.

*Looks at forums for teh chars they play.

 

[zeta]

i find myself dumbing myself down to play with my brother imo smash should be fun for all. its fun to just play random characters with items sometimes.

if you dont like your anti at environment find a new place to play!

 

[BlackWaltzX]

I am in a way anti AT myself, which sits fine in Brawl anyway.
Continue getting better, use things that are ATs but not blatantly obvious like 'dacus' or 'glide tossing'.

Venture out of your room and play others in secret.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

same, ppl are like, OMG YOU GRABBED THE EDGE, YOU CHEATED. funny how you three stock them though >:D

LOL... my friends are like that, but its more like a common rule that prevents edgehogging because killing your oponent when its at high percents is always funnier, 130% squirtle + ikes fsmash= LOL for a good while
Anyway back on topic:
I play to have fun, but im not totally against any ATs, unlike your friends, just play with them without any advanced tecniches, or do it without hurting them(shellshifting over and over without doing nothing, i call it the squirtle dance) or only when the are already losing by much
You can also learn advanced techniches for your friends characters, show them, and they will see how coll is it.
And dont argue about a videogame with your roommates, brawl is all about having multiplayer fun ( ok its not all, but its sooo good on that )
Your sig is awesome dude

 

[blazefox]

Kick their butts and tell them if they were man enough they might be able to beat you lol.

But seriously, try to find people who are in your skill level or wouldnt mind if you use AT's. There's nothing worse then trying to limit yourself in a game like smash. If anything, keep 2/3 stocking them until they get sick of it and finally decide to imprve their game.

The only changes to my playstyle when I play people like that is no-edgegaurding lol. They;ll learn fast.

 

[Aveean]

And dont argue about a videogame with your roommates, brawl is all about having multiplayer fun ( ok its not all, but its sooo good on that )
Your sig is awesome dude

I'm a girl btw, but thanks for the compliment =D

And yeah I'm all about having fun. When I end up beating them too badly too often I'll switch and play with items for a bit or choose a really random stage to mix things up for them.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

LOL... then sorry about "dude"... welcome to the PT boards, and btw, your avatar cant be seen, i think its a problem here in smashboards about the avatars you upload form your computer :/... and yes, if its not that funny then its like the videogame loses some of his value, and as advice : dont be too obvious giving advantages to your friends because if you do they will get mad ... just mix it up, chances are they are gonna get better sometime... it worked for my friends

 

[Aveean]

LOL... then sorry about "dude"... welcome to the PT boards, and btw, your avatar cant be seen, i think its a problem here in smashboards about the avatars you upload form your computer :/... and yes, if its not that funny then its like the videogame loses some of his value, and as advice : dont be too obvious giving advantages to your friends because if you do they will get mad ... just mix it up, chances are they are gonna get better sometime... it worked for my friends

Of course, it's always fun to have some variety. And no problem about the dude thing - thanks for the welcome!

I noticed that problem with my avatar, so instead I uploaded it to my own site but I guess it still uploaded it here when I entered the URL or something. Oh well. At least my signature works ;D.

 

[PkTrainerCris]

I can see your avatar now
Its a fun fact i joined after you and already have 412 posts more ( even charizard92, who joined the same day i did is already a smash lord with over 1000 posts), will you be here usually from now?

 

[Steeler]

eevzy you should try and find better competition. nothing wrong with playing with casual friends either, but you might have to sandbag a bit to not anger them.

and welcome to the pt community!

 

[Aveean]

I can see your avatar now
Its a fun fact i joined after you and already have 412 posts more ( even charizard92, who joined the same day i did is already a smash lord with over 1000 posts), will you be here usually from now?

I hope so. I'm enjoying posting so far. Reason I've never posted before is I just like to get a good sense of the community and style of a place before joining. Plus...there are plenty of great things to read here regardless of whether you post or not.
Actually today at school my roommate snuck on here because he saw me replying to posts. He read what I posted and read the responses, and...at first he sorta freaked, but I discussed it with him and offered to help him learn some AT's for his characters too. He accepted it =). He said in 3 person free for alls (aka when my other roommate joins in too) they'll get upset if I use AT's, but in 1v1 matches against him we'll both (me probably more than him) use AT's and have some fun adding more of a challenge to our matches.

I'm very happy with the outcome, and thanks for the welcome everyone!

 

[Natch]

Hey Eevzy, don't worry about not being able to beat people who DO use ATs. ATs in general are not required in order to be good at brawl. Your time can be spent equally as well learning how to play your character better. While ATs do provide an advantage, it is quite possible to win against someone who does use ATs while you don't use any.

Try new moves with your character you don't usually use, try Shield Grabbing more-Hit Shield then A. Stuff like that. There are a myriad of ways you can get better outside of using ATs.

 

[Aveean]

Hey Eevzy, don't worry about not being able to beat people who DO use ATs. ATs in general are not required in order to be good at brawl. Your time can be spent equally as well learning how to play your character better. While ATs do provide an advantage, it is quite possible to win against someone who does use ATs while you don't use any.

Try new moves with your character you don't usually use, try Shield Grabbing more-Hit Shield then A. Stuff like that. There are a myriad of ways you can get better outside of using ATs.

Oh of course =). I don't consider using AT's the only way to be good. On the contrary, I didn't use them at all in Melee and I would rip up winners brackets at the tournaments I would go to. I only placed first once, but I also never got below 8th before I switched to Brawl.

Still, even when I didn't use AT's in Melee, when I played against the people who used them like crazy in the tournaments I would lose, because I haven't had practice with them or had even seen them outside of the tournaments. I got really confused when I was up against people like that, so I believe, even if I wont use them that often at home, that they are still good to know.

 

[iRjOn]

I'll say alittle I use to be like you anti-AT...back in melee... wavedashing was and partially is lame to me but...its a game its there so use what you got to survive; if survival is the point...
AT's are part of the game no matter how you look at it...even if they were not intentionally added >_> Snake dashing...(I use to main him too lol), hyphen smashes are the sizz great kill moves...but just learn AT's if you want eventually your friends will be like hey I wanna get better to stop loosing...
Samething happened to me in melee...only reason I picked up wavedashing so thus I cant complain about it any more cause I use to use it...
Now people bringing it back in brawl is like kinda bull but ehh idc...
So learn what you want one day if your friends want too they'll open thier eyes towards smash bros brawl or just remain blinded by the light...

As for getting better try to get to some tournaments around your area if there are any I'm gonna start doing this to get better myself...gotta learn the PT frist though lol and critique my Toon Link alittle lol.

 

[kingofping4]

Long post is long. If you don't care about my smash history, skip to the yellow line for the more relevant info.

Ah, the old "my roommates have a different gaming philosophy" story. I know this one well.

I've been playing since 64, and I play to have fun, and also to make myself better with the characters I like. I read the forums here, and I practice some of the cool things I see. I like all the stages and all the items, and like finding stuff to laugh about during a fight. I'd say I have fun when I play smash 99% of the time.

Roommate A has played since 64, and plays to win. If we have an epic fight that was back and forth, wire to wire, and he loses... he won't acknowledge it when I say "wow man great fight." He just goes "hmmph" and starts the next fight. He plays with mid to low tier characters, and plays them well. He gets pissed when he loses, and hates "random" stages and items. He's probably the best technical player of the three of us.

Roommate B started smash when he moved in with me and my wii six months ago. He knows he's not as good as me and A, but likes to talk trash when he does well. He plays high tier characters, and mostly gets by on their strong points but is predictable and easy to punish. He is getting better, but at the same time is beginning to john a lot more when he loses because of items or stage stuff. He likes to have fun playing, but really wants to win because he knows he's the worst of the three of us.

Our play sessions usually last thirty minutes to an hour, depending on how the matches turn out. If B is winning, he quits early because he doesn't want us to make the comeback. In this case, A is usually pretty pissed. So if A and I keep playing it's not fun for me because once he's in a bad mood I make it worse with all my laughing and shenanigans.

If A is winning, he lightens up a little and it's more fun for everyone. At this point B will usually start whining that A is picking on him, and they start arguing. Then we all just stop playing.

If I'm winning, then A will gradually start getting pissed until he just quits, and B never wants to play me one on one.

Man, this is turning into a long post...

So now that you all know where I'm coming from, I can come back around to the point at hand: the anti-AT environment. I never play at high levels or go to tournaments because I would be totally clueless at that level. I don't know how to edgeguard properly, how to recover against an edgeguard, hell I'm not even sure I know how to DI properly/effectively. I'm just now becoming familiar with timing my characters' spikes because even that is frowned upon by my playmates.

So what do I do? I handicap myself. I practice some things when I'm home alone (I'm a nerd and I love this game. What can I say?) and then I use them sparingly in my matches. I don't spike someone even though he's wide open for it at 40%, but once he hits like 105% and is off the edge BOOM -1. I'll chain grab with Falco a few times, but I never do it all the way across the stage and then spike, even though I can and they know it.

So my advice to you would be to keep improving your skills, and make those skills known to your playmates. Play at their level, and if you get in trouble bust out one of your ATs to turn the match. Odds are that they'll cry about it at first, and you can even humor them with something like "well if I didn't I would have lost." But if they keep getting better so that you have to use them more and more, then they might consider learning a few to beat you. You need to step YOUR game up as well at that point, because they're gaining on you

 

[Charizard92]

I actually find this very interesting. I myself have had experiences with limited competitive players out there. In the melee tournament at my school, the most comon characters used (well, what I saw) was C. Falcon and Link (and this is melee, neither of these are top tier [I lost the first round, Darn Pichu]). The person who actually won the tournament (the guy who directed it [I saw, he won his own tournament fair and square]) was the only person to use shiek or Fox, and Falco and Marth were rarely used. More recently (and Brawl related), I was facing one of my friends with his game. Items were turned on (despite my dismay) and illegal & custom stages were on (to my further dismay). He uses Wolf (and spams things like Fsmash [which I doubt you're supposed to]) and I played PT (much lower tier and with more of the recommended stuff like shield grab and stuff) We were around even in the total number of victories so he used a higher tier character in a more familiar environment (and with Items) and I used more technical skill (and still had my ability to use items). Yep, it's just to show that even among those who play video games, only a fraction of those play them competitively (Heck, I take around six hours to finish Metroid Prime 3).

 

[Aveean]

Thanks for the story Kingofping, I don't mind long posts ;D. I could see a few similarities with my roommates, although one of them is starting to get really good now because he learned about me going here. He's actually a challenge for me in one-on-one matches now, and he even randomly started edgeguarding me too (which surprised me and I died the first two times of him doing it while I was Ivysaur).

And lol Charizard92, I remember the very first Melee tournament I went to at a local library. It actually had a pretty big turnout (70+ people) and plenty of high tier characters, but only one person used AT's. I got 3rd place back then...without even blocking once. (I used to play Melee reaaaaally weird until I learned to block, and I think that is what caused me to win stuff). I have greatly improved since then ;D.

But overall now that one of my roommates has improved significantly I'm thinking of maybe posting a few replays of our battles. I have a TV tuner on my pc so I'm sure it's not too much of a problem, and I feel that the PT boards lack videos (even though mine might stink anyway).