ZSS vs Little Mac - Dealing with jabs and super armor.

[BoGardFurY]

Hello I'm having a lot of trouble fighting Little Macs.

My two major problems are his super armor moves, and strangely his jabs...

How do I approach LM (Little Mac)? It seems silly to have so much trouble with jabs lol.

Scenarios i'm struggling with:

• I rush in, get jabbed. Oh snap I'm being punched in the face!
• Oh you jabbin'? Lets jump over! LM to down smash, or read jump and up b, or tilt.
• Oh You Jabbin'? Let me roll behind... nope stops my roll! >.<

Obviously its not really likely a smash player online can cover all options so i think i may be coming at the match up wrong. I've always had trouble with LM (or any lol) player that have some patients which may be part of it. Also I'm not good lol.

So..
How do other ZSS approach LM matchup?

Thanks!

 

[David Viran]

The first thing you should ask yourself is, "why am I approaching?"

 

[andrebound]

The first thing you should ask yourself is, "why am I approaching?"

I have seen the truth

 

[BoGardFurY]

Thanks for replying. I appreciate any feedback!

Why am I approaching? Good philosophical question. Why is any one approaching anything? Who am I? What is the meaning of life? What came first, the chicken or the egg? etc. lol

Please make me aware of any ignorance on my part in this simplification of your statement. But lets play this mind set out? If I should wait for Mac to approach, shouldn't Mac wait for ZSS to approach?

Meaning...

• I SHOULD sit and wait for Mac's approach instead.
• Mac in turn SHOULD sit and wait for my approach.

Then we are two people doing what we think we are suppose to do and watching a clock timer tick down. This seems counter productive to the goal of improving. Not winning games, but improving.

As far as improving the understanding of a matchup, or improving a specific skill, or learning to punish a specific mistake this doesn't really help me with my issue.

Though it may make sense in a broad meaning to let your opponent make a mistake and you to wait to punish. But In lieu of my mention of patients. The fundamental problem remains. Of all the stuff ZSS can do (and its awesome stuffs!), waiting to do nothing doesn't seem to make sense... To highlight more the goal is to improve the understand of the match up. i.e. I just want to learn the match up and i'm seeking tips on the matchup and a mindset to engage in this matchup.

So... If i'm not approaching. What am i learning?

Thank you!

 

[David Viran]

You outrange Mac. Abuse that. Make him feel like he has to approach with your range and disjoint or, if on a stage with platforms, get percent lead and platform camp him if you really have to. The type of situation you're talking about is theoretical not exactly what will happen in real matches. If you hold your ground chances are he will approach.

 

[BoGardFurY]

Thanks for reply David,

I'll try playing some more matches and work on spacing. Thanks.

 

[free33]

By not approaching i don't think he means standing in one spot and waiting for the opponent to make the first move. The way I interpret it is that you are the one with a projectile. run and jump around the opponent, shoot your projectile at him. It's not so much you not approaching as you making him approach you. you want to always be moving in order to be unpredictable or give your opponent time to catch his breath. What you want to do is move around them without committing to things like grabs (especially with ZSS) or smash attacks. From these positions you can bait the opponent into overcommitting (landing on your shield without spacing, using a laggy move, or in the case of little mac, hopefully side B off the stage if both players have a projectile, the one with the faster, more versatile projectile kit usually can force the other to approach. however, if you do hit the opponent with something non committal like a Nair or paralyzer shot, go after them! that is what ZSS is all about. capitalizing on those moments. She is a punish character like ganon, zelda etc. (lacking in neutral game, making up for it with strong punishes) only in her case, she punishes with crazy combos instead of a couple big hits. remember that. anyway, hope this helped! you can check out my guide to ZSS here: http://smashboards.com/guides/full-guide-to-everything-zero-suit-samus.602/

Good luck

 

[Zelbur]

I agree with the people above.
In that scenario, I would go more campy with zss. That means poking him with your Zair or Nair, and shooting paralyzer shots. Side-B is good too. Also since your grab has extra range you can just grab him out of jab.

Additionally one other thing that really helps me against LM is when you shield any of his dash-attacks, just respond with Up-B out of shield.

 

[theyellowflash26]

Honestly, I wouldn't try using zair against mac. He can just go under it and punish. I have a lot of trouble with this MU too, but I think throwing out moves is a bad idea here. You'll most likely get hard punished for it. Movement is however a good option, and moving around and baiting him to do stuff is good too.