Meta Knight Q&A Thread

K@0S · May 18, 2009

Up-b out of shield.

CaliburChamp · May 18, 2009

I don't know, tap jump on seems to mess up my aerial combo's and up-tilts. I tried using it, but instead I end up doing worse in the match, then when I put it to tap jump off, I do much better.

I can do up-air strings just fine. The only slight advantage is to up+b out of shield right away, but in my opinion it sacrifices my aerial combo ability. I rather have aerial combos that I won't accidentally mess up with a jump than up+b out of shield.

oOJaseOo · May 19, 2009

-Affinity- said:
What a vague question lol

^^ yea was vague sorry

I ment to say are there any new combo's or techs stuff like that cause i think the only combo i fully know is the upair string to a special ^^

noodles · May 20, 2009

what do i do against the ic's blizzard?

Crizthakidd · May 20, 2009

u DI out and Dair him. u can angle dairs so u wont get hit and also try to nado over it.

noodles · May 20, 2009

good to know

what should i do before i get hit with it but see it coming?

brinboy789 · May 20, 2009

noodles416 said:
good to know

what should i do before i get hit with it but see it coming?

well if you see it coming, obv avoid it? :laugh:

or get ready to punish i suppose

noodles · May 20, 2009

i mean like what would be the best way to do that

-Kiros- · May 20, 2009

Shield maybe? Or will it wear down the shield too much?

Question: How good does MK do against ZSS? Any tips for the matchup? I looked at the matchup thread but there wasn't any discussion about it.

noodles · May 20, 2009

shielding it isnt a good idea

earla · May 21, 2009

questions:

1. does mk shuttle loop outprioritize lucario's dair?

2. Can you nado, DC, shuttle loop or drill rush and end with no lag?

3. vs GaW if they Dtilt spam on the edge. how do you get back on.

4. Can MK grab release combo anyone?

5. does dair out prioritize shuttle loop or is it useful to use above another mk?

6. when is backwards shuttle loop useful?

7. I've seen M2K try drill rush opponent off the top of stage. which is better nado or drill rush off the top.

8. How can you make GaW players recovery low to then set them up to land on lip of stage so you can jump up and nair?

9. After you grab release snake off the edge whats the best way to edge guard then while they're blowing themselves back up?

10. How do you make nado hard for opponent to DI?

11. What are the most important things to remember as an MK player, general important tips?

12. What are some hip new combos going round that mk players are doing. (affinity vid outdated)

cheers from melb aus

TP · May 21, 2009

I have a question:

Will someone play me online?

MK is the only hard matchup for Ganon that my secondary (ROB) won't help me on, so I need to know the matchup very well. Especially since I was one spot away from getting money at my last tournament and an MK beat my Ganon and my ROB.

brinboy789 · May 21, 2009

sooo...

it appears that shiek has an infinite on us.

good part: proban side for mk ban is dead

bad part: well, its an infinite.

Kamikaze* · May 21, 2009

brinboy789 said:
sooo...

it appears that shiek has an infinite on us.

good part: proban side for mk ban is dead

bad part: well, its an infinite.

The combo was done on a "human" with nobody behind it.

We have to test it on someone with good DI and then we can celebrate.

Popertop · May 21, 2009

I'm pretty sure you will be able to smash DI/ jump out of it.

Gates · May 22, 2009

What exactly is the combo?

Nic64 · May 22, 2009

I think if there's any way out of it's more likely that you can uair before the footstool than DIing it, but who knows, you could probably SDI it to at least shorten it, that and smart stage positioning should make it somewhat less effective anyway...and it only really works on FD, which MK's will ban a lot as it is.

the combo is ftilt, footstool, weak bair, repeat. 37% and above to death.

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmsrrBDfTXc

double edit: ftilt stuns too long to uair, you can only uair if the sheik messes up, but, the bair may actually be avoidable. guess we'll see. ban FD in any case lol

Kamikaze* · May 22, 2009

Hm, so I figured I'd get a bit of frame data on this.

Frame advatnage after hitting MK with a fresh ftilt @ 40%: +8

This advantage is really +10 when you take into consideration that his fastest option (airdodging) takes 3 frames to come out. So the ftilt -> footstool seems to be guaranteed. If MK ASDI's away though you'll have to dash for one or two frames before you jump to get in footstool range. I wonder if ASDIing away and jumping could mess this up? Things could get pretty tight here frame wise.

Now for the rest of this string. Let's look into MK's "stun time":

-Time spent falling after footstool: 10 frames (this is variable of course, and depends on how high he is off the ground when footstooled. )

-Stun time on the ground: 26 frames (on the 27th frame he can perform one of his tech options, which gives him immediate invulnerability)

Total time stunned: ~36 frames.

So MK is made immobile for ~36 frames. This will once again be more or less, depending on how high off the ground he is when he's footstooled.

And finally the last piece:

The time it takes sheik to footstool and fastfall to hit with a bair:
~42 frames. (this is will change slightly depending on how high she is when she footstools MK).

So MK is stunned for ~36 frames and it takes shiek ~42 frames to hit with the bair.... Yeah, I don't see how this works . In fact I couldn't get it to work a single time, even at varying percents. Sometimes Sheik would be within 1 frame of hitting MK, but then he would use a tech option and gain instant invulnerability. And yes, I was fastfalling at the right time.

To sum this up: from what I've seen MK can simply hold left or right to get out of this. Granted if done perfectly at a certain percent this may work, but it's far too finicky to be of use in a tournament setting. Even if this did work though the fact that it relies on a hit that can both be SDI'd and ASDI's makes it kinda bunk :/.

Of course I may be missing something here; if I am please correct me . On that note I'd encourage others to dink around with this and see if they get the same results I have. Also sorry for the bluntness of this post, I'm tired :C

Hotgarbage tested this. It's escapable. no party for us.

Yumewomiteru · May 26, 2009

I've recently started using metaknight, I find that I'm using RAR as a approach alot (habit from maining falco and kirby), is there any use for this or should I use fair instead

Affinity · May 26, 2009

Yumewomiteru said:
I've recently started using metaknight, I find that I'm using RAR as a approach alot (habit from maining falco and kirby), is there any use for this or should I use fair instead

F-airrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

PrinceRamen · May 26, 2009

Just out of the blue, has this happened to you?

When your playing as meta knight on halberd, and after you land on the actual halberd,(the part with the lazer, claw, and cannon.) You know how the lower platform goes into this gate on the floor and it closes and doesn't open until it's time for take off again, well you can actually get in there when using meta knight. All you got to do is use drill rush from really low of the stage, and if you angle it right and do it on one exact spot a little lower from the ledge, you can jump into the area where the platform went into. Best part you can still attack people using up tilts and stuff. It's almost impossible for them to attack you. It's funny!

I'm pretty sure i'm not the only person who has done it. I couldn't find it anywhere else so i just asked it here, seemed like the proper place. Ignore me if this was found a loooooong time ago, if it was, sorry for your time.

Gates · May 26, 2009

PrinceRamen, that sounds hilarious. Do you have vids of this?

I hope it doesn't make people want to ban Halberd though, I love that stage.

stingers · May 26, 2009

Why is ROB/MK so badly in MK's favor? What can MK do that ROB has absolutely no counter for?

PrinceRamen · May 26, 2009

Gates said:
PrinceRamen, that sounds hilarious. Do you have vids of this?

I hope it doesn't make people want to ban Halberd though, I love that stage.

No sorry.

I have replays but never recorded with camera or anything. I'll probably will in the near future. Try it your selves, it's not really that hard really. But if you do do it wrong, you might die.

... Haha!!! I said dodo! :laugh:

Affinity · May 26, 2009

PrinceRamen said:
Just out of the blue, has this happened to you?

When your playing as meta knight on halberd, and after you land on the actual halberd,(the part with the lazer, claw, and cannon.) You know how the lower platform goes into this gate on the floor and it closes and doesn't open until it's time for take off again, well you can actually get in there when using meta knight. All you got to do is use drill rush from really low of the stage, and if you angle it right and do it on one exact spot a little lower from the ledge, you can jump into the area where the platform went into. Best part you can still attack people using up tilts and stuff. It's almost impossible for them to attack you. It's funny!

I'm pretty sure i'm not the only person who has done it. I couldn't find it anywhere else so i just asked it here, seemed like the proper place. Ignore me if this was found a loooooong time ago, if it was, sorry for your time.

MK's DR does weird things like that. He's able to enter the safety capsules on Norfair by drill rushing through the bottom too if you do it right.

stingers135 said:
Why is ROB/MK so badly in MK's favor? What can MK do that ROB has absolutely no counter for?

ROB has a huge weak spot below him.

PrinceRamen · May 26, 2009

MK's DR does weird things like that. He's able to enter the safety capsules on Norfair by drill rushing through the bottom too if you do it right.

Wowzerz! I gotta try that out later.

One down side on halberd though, people can stand on the floating platform and you wont be able to reach them, but it could be used for a set up for a surprise attack with shuttle loop or something. Oh, and you can still get hit by the lazer, but the claw and cannon can not attack you.

A home stage advantage maybe?

earla · May 27, 2009

hey whatsup. If a lucario is spamming aura sqheres how do you approach.

What are some tips on really shutting down lucario?

Also i had a bunch of questions a page or 2 ago. If anyones got time to answer that'd be much appreciated.

cheers

Affinity · May 27, 2009

If his aura spheres are uncharged, you can tornado through them. Otherwise, just powershield them.

Teh_Chef · May 27, 2009

earla said:
hey whatsup. If a lucario is spamming aura sqheres how do you approach.

What are some tips on really shutting down lucario?

Also i had a bunch of questions a page or 2 ago. If anyones got time to answer that'd be much appreciated.

cheers

Lucario players that like to roll a lot hate dsmash, if that helps at all.

PrinceRamen · May 27, 2009

Gates said:
PrinceRamen, that sounds hilarious. Do you have vids of this?

I hope it doesn't make people want to ban Halberd though, I love that stage.

Here's to you Gates, and everyone else who probably had no idea what i was talking about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQl2stlhp9M

btw, i was the meta knight, and the only reason i was fighting a cpu was because my brother wouldn't play. Anyways, now you know what im talkin about right?

earla · May 28, 2009

as there isn't a matchup thread for mk vs pit has anyone got any tips or summaries?

thx.

Nic64 · May 28, 2009

Pit is mostly about having strong basics. You outrange him on sword attacks so just spacing well works to your favor. Either power shield the arrow spam or you can tornado through it, most Pit's I've played are also pretty predictable about going for kill moves because Pit's KO attacks can mostly be seen coming from a mile away, don't roll into him and you shouldn't get smashed much(more basics, don't do this at low % either, his fsmash does 19% damage and is fast enough to punish a mistake like this), and if he glides at you or flies around with his back to you it should be obvious what's coming. If Pit has jumped around a few times on stage if you can shuttle loop him off he'll be forced to use his up B which can be gimped with a single hit. For that reason you should also edge guard him tenaciously. Pit can also reflect your shuttle loop and drill rush when you're recovering so don't be too hasty to use the B attacks off stage if you think this could happen, you usually don't need them and he can't really edge guard you otherwise. But yeah, mostly just good spacing, zoning, and minimizing risks pays off against Pit IMO

Sorto · May 29, 2009

how do you approach a good olimar? Fair dair? Ofther options? I no dont be predictable. But what is safe?

noodles · May 29, 2009

jump. get within grab range then jump he wont be able to do much. most olimars are scared to throw pikmin at you if your that close. but your too far for anything else to hit you so long as you watch him.(most people would try to run under you and upsmash). but yea dairs are really good.

Sorto · May 30, 2009

what about olimars pivot grabbing and stuff. A good olimar wouldnt sit there if u approach. they would be pivot grabbing and retreating... u no? Is there any more advice? or is it just get in close??

noodles · May 30, 2009

just keep that same space away and watch where you land. theres only so much room on the stage and itd be a bad idea for olimar to get close to the edge

Sushi-Man · May 30, 2009

Sorto: You can dair camp then air dodge behind him and then reverse grab.

Affinity · May 30, 2009

Sorto said:
how do you approach a good olimar? Fair dair? Ofther options? I no dont be predictable. But what is safe?

Just slowly approach him with F-air, F-tilt, D-tilt to create a wall against his pikmin while forcing him to the ledge. At that point he can't pivot grab you and his options are limited. Then get him offstage and go for the gimp.

Here's a trick that I came up with a while ago and do lot against Olimar's:

When you see the chance, dash grab him near the ledge and force a ground break while he's hanging over the ledge. 99% of the time he will immediately jump after ground breaking. If you D-tilt him and immediately edgehog, you've taken a stock.

I did this at least 4 times to Fino at Kahoka Me Your Moves. You'd be surprised how often this works.

Hope I helped.

noodles · May 30, 2009

if your gonna fair i think you should full hop it

Dojo · May 30, 2009

Full hopping is good b you don't have to. Just be cautious of him reacting with grab. Most MK's aren't aware of how much they retreat their fairs. If the opponent powershields and rushes, they can punish you. Don't be afraid to commit to your fair all the way through to mix it up.

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