Tips and Tactics to know as Samus Players *Work in Progress*

Hey Samus Board. This is my attempt to be productive and help out the Samus players have a little "heads up" in matchups.

The purpose of this guide is to provide small tips that you may or may not know when fighting other characters. Some of the tips are already known, some of the "tips" are found by looking at other boards and seeing a characters glitches/weaknesses and some of the tips are not specific to Samus only. I just put them there so that for those who did not know them can have a reference to quickly check out whatever advantage or tactic they can use to get ahead in a match.

I created this topic because sometimes these small tips and things to know about other characters can get lost in detailed matchup guides, or ignored in general. Like I didn't know about Olimar's ledge deficiency and the Donkey kong holding Up was just discovered a few days ago.

These tips come from my own small experience, please feel free to contribute any tips or things you know about other characters that we as Samuses can use, or that's good to know in general. I don't know them all

New Additions
- Ganondorf, Falco, Wario, Lucas, Ness



THE OPPONENTS


Bowser

+ He can use side B to suicide both of you. Stay away from the edges when he's at high percentages.
+ If you are at a higher percentage than Bowser, YOU control the side B's direction. ~ Awesome info by CPU?
NEW + SDI the Bowser breath up and towards his body. Then you can uair him to punish


Diddy Kong

+ If you shoot his peanuts with your regular missile, they break in half and you can eat them to regain health.
+ Diddy Kong's barrels can spike you if you are under them. Be careful
+ Diddy Kong can use his side+B when off the stage to gimp you, follow him off cautiously with a zair.


Donkey Kong

+ To prevent a stage spike, when Donkey Kong grabs you, rather than button mashing, hold up. It will get you out of his grab faster. *this is not Samus-specific*
+ If you are still able to be stage spiked... Press L (or R) right as he releases you to tech his back throw stage spike.
+ If Donkey Kong uses his Up B off of a ledge or onto the stage, get away from him, because he probably has Super Armor, a new technique found by the DK board.


Falco

NEW + SDI his mutihit jab towards his body and up. Mash cstick up while doing it to uair him in the middle of his string.
NEW + If Falco forward-throws or down throws and you DI down you are able to zair him.
+ Falco cannot chain grab Samus.
+ Falco has a reflector with a strange/lasting hitbox! Plasma Shot with lots of caution or don't use it at all.
+ If Falco is off the stage and you don't have time to dair... nair is an effective gimp.


Fox

+ See Falco


Game and Watch

NEW + Mash up on the cstick and diagonal up towards his body when he multijabs you. You'll break it with uair.
+ If Game and Watch UP b's and overshoots the ledge, GRAB him and don't hit him. Just like snake he'll fly off and be unable to UP B again.
+ Learn to tech his d-throw or else he can combo it into a down smash. Hit L (or R) after the final ball juggle, roll away.


Ganondorf

+ At about 100% and up, if he catches you in the Up B continuously mash z. When it releases you will immediately zair him and space backwards.
+ Do NOT get caught in his side-B. He can suicide you with it.


Ice Climbers

+ Morph Ball bombs reflect their icicles without detonating the bomb itself. Very useful shield if they spam icicles. It will not hurt the ICs though.
+ Nana (the AI controlled partner) is really dumb at dodging Zair. Run (space properly) and zair until she's desynched and kill her.


Ivysaur

+ Ivysaur takes double knockback from fire moves. D-tilt kills him earlier than anything else (109%). ~ thanks to SuSa



Jigglypuff

+ Bait a rollout. Any of your projectiles out-prioritize it. Especially nice to use plasma shot.



King Dedede

+ Can chain grab Samus


Kirby

+ Kirby has a combo: Forward throw -> Side B Hammer. It is deceptively powerful. If Kirby grabs you and throws you forward, watch out to airdodge immediately.
+ Morph ball bombs disrupt Kirby's approach.



Lucario

+ Lucario's UP b can't hit you, Edgehog him if he's out of range. If he recovers onto the stage, take advantage of the lag with either fair or plasma shot
+ To get him out of range, try to missile/zair him when he's horizontally off the stage. Keep him low rather than knocking him up in the air.
+ Lucario gets stronger when his percentage is higher (attacks have more range and more knockback).
+ Lucario also gets stronger if he is multiple stocks behind.



Lucas
+ You can air release -> zair Lucas. It is very tight timing though.
+ DO NOT hold onto the ledge for too long. Lucas PK thunder will stage spike you.




Mario

+ Morph Ball bombs stop Marios' fireballs. It will detonate the morph bomb.
+ If Mario ever uses his Up B, he has landing lag. Even if he uses Up B to grab a ledge, the very next time he lands on the stage, he will have lag as if he used the Up B. Have your plasma shot ready, test it out in training mode ~ Thanks to Throwback



Meta Knight

+ If Metaknight down throws you, DI down and mash the z button continuously. If he chases you, you will immediately zair him. ~ thanks to Xyro77 and NO-IDea
+ You can force an air release at around 40% by either dash grabbing him or grabbing and pummeling. Out of the air release there are two options:
1) Your opponent won't know, but you can chain grab. Just double tap run and dash-grab him. Then air release again.
2) MK is able to jump out of the cg if they mash the jump button. Once they catch on, you can just plasma shot out of the air release. Good for kills at high percentages.
+ Well timed morph ball bombs can break the B-Tornado. You can also come with an aerial from above.
+ To prevent the tornado from shield poking, put on your shield and tilt it UP. *NEW*
+ Missiles are useful to keep him from gliding. See Peach for frame trap.
+ MetaKnights often try to get above you, punish with screw attack OoS.


Ness

NEW + You can air release -> zair Ness. It is very tight timing.

Olimar

+ If Olimar is off the stage, just hold onto the ledge. His Up B can knock you off and maybe even stage spike you, but it will NOT latch on so he falls to his death. *Not samus-specific*
+ Entire game should be about knocking him horizontally off the stage as low as possible (up tilts aren't really good for this) then missile spam to get rid of his second jump. Hog the edge.


Pikachu

+ If you are in the air, morph ball bombs are an excellent way to dodge Pikachus' thunder (if spotdodging is out of the question). Use MBB and hold the cstick right or left. Extra mobility.


Peach

NEW + SDI her dair up or be prepared to take a lot of damage
+ Zair is a must. Get her out of the air.
+ Regular missiles can knock her out of the air if she is close to the ground. Follow up with a plasma shot, it has a chance to be a frame trap.


Snake

+ If Snake uses his down smash (lays a mine in the floor), jump over it and lay a morph ball bomb. It will destroy it.
+ If Snake sets a C4 on the ledge, your super missile can destroy it. Do at your own risk.
+ If you grab snake when he is doing his up B to recovery, he cannot use it again. Do not throw him if you grab him while he's off the stage, let him fall off.
+ You can also attack the helicopter itself without hitting snake to gimp him. Dsmash is useful in this situation.
+ You can outcamp snake with missile spamming. If he gets cheap, get cheap right back.
+ When on the ledge, if you ledgehop to a fair, Samus is invincible to some of his c4/grenade explosions. (Further testing?)


Sonic

+ If you grab Sonic out of his Up + B over the ledge, do not hit him. Instead, air release him and he will air trip.
+ If Sonic is out of range and attempts to Up B, grab the ledge, he can hit you but he cannot use Up B again unless you hit him.
+ Sonics' trampoline can stage spike you if you are under it. Watch out.
+ Uncharged plasma shots, lazy missiles, zairs, super missiles, fully plasma shots outprioritize his B attacks. Annoy him.


Squirtle

+ Squirtle's Side B (Withdraw) has the most bizzare priority ever. If you hit him in it, he'll simply be knocked the other way.
+ Shoot squirtle's side B with a plasma shot to shoot him away from you very fast.
+ If you footstool Squirtle during his Side B, he flips over and wriggles around. He is helpless and can't do anything until he flips himself back over

Wario


NEW + *KO* Air release -> Buffered Grab (frame perfect) -> Air Release -> Grab repeat -> Air release -> dair
+ Air release -> Ftilt (tilted up)
+ Air release -> Fair or Uair
+ Air release -> Screw Attack
+ Air release -> Dash Attack -> Screw Attack
+ Air release -> Medium Charge chot -> zair
*KO* Air release -> Full Charge Shot
*KO* Air release -> Up tilt
*KO* Air release -> Fsmash (tilted up)
*KO* Air release -> Dtilt (Wario can mash jump frantically to escape)
*KO* Air release -> Bair *
*KO* Air release -> Dair *

+ To set up air releases, use the non-sweetspot zair -> grab frame trap. It's up to the opponent to mash out to air release though.

+ All of these air releases provide dozens of opportunities to KO Wario. Mix up these Air releases to get wario to DI the wrong direction and die early (ie they may hold up to DI your Air release -> plasma shot, so instead AirRelease -> dtilt or fair or fsmash. They are now DIing the wrong direction = pwnage)


Yoshi
+ Yoshi can be air-released. Grab him, hit him once or twice and if he air-release. Spam the jump button, hit zair immediately when you jump.






Anybody
+ At Luigi's Mansion. Use Up throw to hit their head on one of the mansions' bottom floor ceilings. Then you can jab lock them.
+ Nair is an effective gimp for Samus. Learn to time it.
+ Samus can cross from one side of the stage to the other from UNDER the stage (one ledge to the other) with the help of morph ball bombs. From the ledge, morph ball and hold in the direction you're trying to go, then morph ball bomb again, then jump and up B to reach the other ledge. Great if the opponent is trapping you on a ledge or guarding one particular side. Here are the stages it can be done:

Final Destination
Battlefield
Smashville
Frigate
Lylat Ship
Rainbow Cruise

Warning - This is unsafe to use on fast runners, they may edge-hog you.




If this topic isn't helpful or may be redundant, you can close it.

sweet.

*summons OMEGA DRYN*

I like it!

Mario - if he uses his upB to return to stage/edge he will experience the landing lag of his upB when he lands on the stage, no matter how he does it.

Xyro77 said:

sweet.

*summons OMEGA DRYN*

Click to expand...

Omega Dryn? What does that mean?

That "To prevent a stage spike, when Donkey Kong grabs you, rather than button mashing, hold
up. It will get you out of his grab faster" tip, is that Samus-specific or does it apply to all characters?

(Great thread by the way, looks like it'll be really helpful)

The stage spike Up thing is not Samus-specific.

A lot of the tips are not Samus-specific, but rather weaknesses in a character that I learned about by just asking and looking them up.

Throwback, could you tell me a little more about that? I don't fully understand

this thread has some intresting stuff in it, though a lot of it is known. Do Samus mains just sit at home wondering whether to make a combo video or a guide?

MRS1 said:

this thread has some intresting stuff in it, though a lot of it is known. Do Samus mains just sit at home wondering whether to make a combo video or a guide?

Click to expand...

I sit home thinking about making a guide. I'm working on one, but I'm not letting anything out. Not yet, anyway. I'll probably choose a select few Samus mains, because I can't have it being leaked out where our opponents will find out.

Add air grab release to utilt KO on wario plz

good work

I sit at home in training mode trying to find anything to break Samus or her opponents. Anything to give her an advantage in a fight. I have no means to do combo videos.

I want Samus moving up in the tiers.

^ yo just note that training mode has different properties regarding stale moves and CPUs air release when they shouldn't, etc.. just keep that in mind before you slave over something that wouldn't be applicable against a human. keep it up lance :]

King Dedede has an infinite chaingrab on Samus, but if that is banned then he can still Dthrow chaingrab to the end of the stage

=/

=/

Don't joke with me about that, man

Thank you for that tip n00b and DelxDoom.

I don't know who I was thinking of with Dedede

Use pivot grabs vs g&w's key. Shield grab g&w's fair. You can uair through the key if you space it slightly behind him (same with upB). G&W's dash attack will wall spike you if you hold the edge.

That's all I feel like typing right now.

Ness may use double aerials on your shield as a mix up. I would nair out of shield and DI backwards after the first hit (maybe powershield jab?) to avoid the pressure and maybe get a free hit. As for edgeguarding ness, Tudor's not fair...dair vid does a good job.

keep bombs around and dair your space when youre over 100%...he's gonna b-throw you.

hmm don't know how to explain it lance. Basically if Mario uses his upB to return to stage, he has significant recovery time from the move, if he lands on-stage.

If he grabs the edge, the landing lag never occurs, correct?

However, the very next time he lands on the stage (not the edge), he will be unable to do anything for the same duration as his usual upB recovery. This will occur after any time he used his upB to return to stage, I *think*. I know it is true for Ganon and I know it happens at least sometimes with Mario.

I sat down in training mode and tried it out. It's just as you said throwback, which is very nice to know.

They could use an aerial to reduce some of that lag, just before they hit the ground, but still that's awesome. And it will be added.

if i remember correct, it takes 7.9% damage to knock snake out of his cypher

About bowser he can only control his side be if he has a lower percent than you.
so theres no need to watch out for it on ledges unless u want an easy kill when your about to die anyway.

CPU? said:

About bowser he can only control his side be if he has a lower percent than you.
so theres no need to watch out for it on ledges unless u want an easy kill when your about to die anyway.

Click to expand...

HOLY ****!

now thats some tasty info!!!!!!

Throwback said:

hmm don't know how to explain it lance. Basically if Mario uses his upB to return to stage, he has significant recovery time from the move, if he lands on-stage.

If he grabs the edge, the landing lag never occurs, correct?

However, the very next time he lands on the stage (not the edge), he will be unable to do anything for the same duration as his usual upB recovery. This will occur after any time he used his upB to return to stage, I *think*. I know it is true for Ganon and I know it happens at least sometimes with Mario.

Click to expand...

Basically yeah, some up b's side b's and etc will have landing lag the next time you land, no matter if you caught the ledge with it or not. You can stop this phantom lag with any other method of landing, and that "cancels" it. It's really stupid that they programmed that into Brawl imo though.


Bowser's side b: Player with lower percent has priority controlling the horizontal movement. If you're down a stock and have higher percent, this is when Bowsercide is most dangerous.
Or if you're both on last stocks and have higher percent, if the Bowser wins due to Bowsercide. (I think technically Bowsercide can always end in Bowser's favor because the opponent dies first and Bowser can then immediately jump at the bottom of the screen, not resulting in Sudden Death)

Added some new stuff, mainly

Metaknight
- If Metaknight down throws you, mash z and you can immediately zair him if he chases the throw
- You can force an air release at around 25% (make it 30% to be safe). Either use the running grab, or grab and pummel him.
- With the air release there are two options:
1) For the first few times in the match, you can chain grab Metaknight by double tapping a dash grab
2) After they catch on and mash the jump button, you won't always chain grab. You can plasma shot them though. Good to finish metaknight at high percentages.


You pretty much have to predict if they will try to jump or not, because the cg takes immediate dash grab out of the air release.


New things for today, May 26, 2009

ice climbers
- Morph Ball bombs deflect their icicles without detonating. You can lay one, sit behind it, and icicles will bounch off the still-laid bomb.


ivysaur
- Takes double knockback from fire moves, so down tilt kills at low percentages (109%)

Mario
- Morph Ball bombs stop his fireballs but will detonate

Ganondorf
- Starting at around 100%, if Ganon catches you in his Up B, just keep pressing Z. Once he releases you Samus will immediately zair him and space backwards.


Samus can cross from one side of the stage to the other from UNDER the stage (one ledge to the other) with the help of morph ball bombs. From the ledge, morph ball and hold in the direction you're trying to go, then morph ball bomb again, then jump and up B to reach the other ledge. Great if the opponent is trapping you on a ledge or guarding one particular side. Here are the stages it can be done:

Battlefield
Smashville
Frigate
Lylat Ship
Rainbow Cruise


Xyro is it 100% true I can zair out of Metaknights down throw? You said it in your video topic vs. M2k

LanceStern said:

ice climbers
- Morph Ball bombs deflect their icicles without detonating. You can lay one, sit behind it, and icicles will bounch off the still-laid bomb.

Click to expand...

Wow nice. Congrats on finding a really sweet straight forward use for bombs.

For z-airing out of MK's down throw, also make sure you DI down. If you don't, MK can still dash at you while the z-air goes above him.

NEVER DI UP after a down throw or MK can up+b Samus's cute... rear.

Rohins said:

Wow nice. Congrats on finding a really sweet straight forward use for bombs.

Click to expand...

I had been doing it a while (like a few months ago). I just decided to put it on. I didn't know it wasn't known haha.

It shuts down their icicles and chain grabs if done right

Added Lucas and NOID's tip.

If there's one thing I need more of it's match experience. That no good Lucas stage spiked me three times because I had no idea of the pK Thunder Stage spike.

Meta Knight and other close combat-oriented characters need to get within grabbing range of Samus to do decent damage. Running away and pivot grabbing to punish chasing is a viable tactic.

Remember to add Final Destination to the list of maps that can be gone under through the use of bombs.

Can she make it under FD? Walk me through the steps, is it the same as smashville/battlefield? Cause I tried and failed

LanceStern said:

Can she make it under FD? Walk me through the steps, is it the same as smashville/battlefield? Cause I tried and failed

Click to expand...

I posted in http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=216390&highlight=final+destination about it a long time ago. It's possible not only with bomb dropping, but bomb jumping also. She can just barely make it, but it's do-able. Not as useful and safe as in the other stages, but again, do-able.

Here's one version of getting to the other side with Samus. Watch at 6:45 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AtcdkDIp6g

New air release on Wario::

+ FSMASH titled up. This is perfect tbqh. If we don't have plasma shot charged this is the next best killer.
+ Ftilt tilted up. I wanna see if you can combo out of this. Will check into it
+ Fair or uair. Nice for racking up damage
+ This is advanced. Air release -> bair. You have to pivot and input the jump + bair very fast or Wario can react. Not sure the reward is worth the risk especially if uair and fsmash tilted up can get the job done. Still looks cool

This is great stuff LanceStern. Thanks for sharing, it will totally help my game. But can some one tell me what zair, nair and...all that stuff means?

Space-knight said:

This is great stuff LanceStern. Thanks for sharing, it will totally help my game. But can some one tell me what zair, nair and...all that stuff means?

Click to expand...

Zair = Z-air, Nair = Neutral Air, etc.

Good stuff indeed. I never knew Ivysaur takes double knockback for fire moves. Does electricity moves apply to squirtle too? Mmmm, there's a lot of good info I never even imagined, especially the mario lag upB thing, as strange as it is.

Darkshadow7827 said:

Zair = Z-air, Nair = Neutral Air, etc.

Good stuff indeed. I never knew Ivysaur takes double knockback for fire moves. Does electricity moves apply to squirtle too? Mmmm, there's a lot of good info I never even imagined, especially the mario lag upB thing, as strange as it is.

Click to expand...

oh ok think I got it.

I think MC -> buffered dash grab is guaranteed if you cancel the missile late enough, and you are close enough to your opponent.

i think you guys are over estimating Diddy.
i have to deal with a banana ***** on a regular bases, what i have learned is that the bananas can be just as harmful as they are helpful.
for example

when diddy is charging at you with a banana more than likely they are going to throw the banana.

if so than just shoot a plasma shot fully charged or uncharged, a full charge plasma shot is in exchange of a hit by a banana is worth the hit. just learn how to time it and getting hit with a banana doesnt seem as bad when you can land a plasma shot at the same time.

if they decide to jump rather than throw the banana and use an air attack just grab them.

due to the lag of diddy's recovery it really easy to just spam homing missiles to constantly interupt his recovery to push him back further.

another thin usual when diddy players are running towards a banana they are probably going to grab the banana via a dash attack which leaves them open for an attack.

you should try it nothing pisses of a diddy player more than using their own bananas against them.


its a lot of fun

New possible KO/gimp on Wario:
Air release -> Dair

If you can successfully AR him to where he floats off the edge you can Dair him. But the timing is so strict. It's just like the AR -> Bair... it is very rewarding and can KO, but the timing might not be worth it.

The timing is ridiculous, so you might be better off with Air release to Utilt/Fsmash tilted up... these will kill at the edge too.

For IC I have a new one!


- Use the morph ball when you're thinking they will grab you, and just lay allot of morph balls, they desync IC somewhat at around 60%!

This thread shouldn't die! It was a greast help in my last tourney, please don't let this die.

I also have something for Wario new:
- Wario can crouch under your spam, be aware that good wario player won't be affected by spam so it's Zair only.

It's not dead, they have it in the compendium.

But yes, I love this thread. It's just not much new things have been found yet.