Rematch - A hypothetical remake discussion.

ryuu seika · Oct 30, 2010

Lets say SSB64 was getting a remake. Obviously none of us want drastic changes but increasing the stage and character rosters would surely be an obvious thing to do to it.

For the sake of this topic, I am going to throw in restrictions. All characters must have made an appearance on a nintendo console and said appearance must have been before the release of the gamecube (though not necessarily before SSB64's release).

The obvious stages to make playable would be Metallic Mine (the metal Mario stage) and the two SSB specific stages, BF and FD.

The obvious characters to add would be Bowser, Mewtwo and King Dedede as they were cut from SSB64 in the first place but this does not necessarily mean they are the right choices.

What are your thoughts on this and what characters and stages would you go for?

EDIT: So far we have (question marked objects are subject to change):

Modes:
1P
Training
Mini Games
Replica Combat(?)
VS

Characters:
Luigi
Mario
DK
Link
Samus
Captain Falcon
Ness
Yoshi
Kirby
Fox
Pikachu
Jigglypuff
Giant DK (AI only)
Metal Mario (AI only)
Polygons (AI only)
Master Hand (AI only)
Master Polygon (AI only)(?)
Bowser (?)
Mewtwo (?)
Megaman (?)
Zero (?)
Peach (?)
Metaknight (?)
King Dedede (?)
Pit (?)
Meowth (?)
Marth (?)
Banjo (?)

Stages:
Peach's Castle 64 (Peach?)
Kongo Jungle 64 (DK)
Hyrule Castle (Link)
Planet Zebes (Samus)
Mushroom Kingdom 64 (Luigi)
Yoshi's Island 64 (Yoshi)
Dreamland 64 (Kirby)
Sector Z (Fox)
Saffron City (Pikachu)
Meta Crystal (Metal Mario)(1p only)
Battlefield (Polygons)
Final Destination (Master Hand)
Smashville (Special)(?)
Onett (Ness)(?)
Pokemon Stadium 1 (Jigglypuff)(?)
Fountain of Dreams (Metaknight)(?)
Big Blue (Captain Falcon)(?)
Forest Temple (Young Link?)(?)
Gravityman's Domain (Megaman)(?)
Yoshi's Story melee (Yoshi 2nd?)(?)
Proto Rainbow Ride (Mario)(?)
Showdown Arena (Bowser)(?)
Replica World (Master Polygon)(1p only)(?)

dandan · Oct 30, 2010

metal mario's stage is way too small :S

ryuu seika · Oct 30, 2010

Replayed it and you're right. Maybe a bit of widening would be required.

I'd just heard it suggested too often I guess.

SuPeRbOoM · Oct 30, 2010

kirby beta 2 should be in

Kuraudo · Oct 30, 2010

What's Kirby beta 2?

ballin4life · Oct 30, 2010

banjo kazooie

Dsc · Oct 30, 2010

What ballin said.

And a banjo kazooie stage.
Banjo kazooie is like the most perfect smash character with his recovery already being the jump jump b move in the actual game, and he has a three punch combo and heaps of other smash bros like attacks. I dont get why he didnt make it into smash. Anyone know whyy?

felipe_9595 · Oct 30, 2010

Microsoft

aasdasdasdsadasddas

Korrupshen · Oct 30, 2010

Kuraudo said:
What's Kirby beta 2?

A U-tilt hitbox SO BIG that melee players wouldn't complain about jigglys B-air no more

Grim Tuesday · Oct 30, 2010

Stages: Final Destination, Battlefield.
Characters: Bowser, King Dedede, Pit and Peach.
Features: Online Play and Home-Run Contest.

This would make Smash 64 perfect imo.

EDIT: Bowser would have Fire Breath, Dedede would have Inhale, Pit would have Palutena's Arrows and Peach would have Toad.

EDIT 2: Also, name tags would be awesome.

Dsc · Oct 30, 2010

GrimFandango said:
Stages: Final Destination, Battlefield.
Characters: Bowser, King Dedede, Pit and Peach.
Features: Online Play and Home-Run Contest.

This would make Smash 64 perfect imo.

EDIT: Bowser would have Fire Breath, Dedede would have Inhale, Pit would have Palutena's Arrows and Peach would have Toad.

Um.
Are you trying to make this more brawl like or something?
No need for dedede and bowser imo. Were looking for new characters, i mean dedede is like dk with a hammer and inhale. Bowser is dk with firebreath. This game would be more grab fest.

Pit? We have link

Peach? I like that idea.

Grim Tuesday · Oct 30, 2010

Dsc said:
Um.
Are you trying to make this more brawl like or something?
No need for dedede and bowser imo. Were looking for new characters, i mean dedede is like dk with a hammer and inhale. Bowser is dk with firebreath. This game would be more grab fest.

Pit? We have link

Peach? I like that idea.

All those characters (along with Meowth and Mewtwo) were planned to be in the game originally, but weren't added due to limitations.

Bowser, DK and D3 are very different. That was a terrible comparison. As is the Pit and Link comparison.

I was being realistic with my choices, we are talking about a remake here, not a whole new game. That is why I didn't add in any non-smash characters.

Dsc · Oct 30, 2010

Yeah of course theyre different but theyre too similar for my liking anyways. Specifically grabs. But its all opinions. And the pit and link was a joke.

The Star King · Oct 30, 2010

I've always been extremely curious about the kind of moveset Sakurai had in mind for Meowth lol

asianaussie · Oct 31, 2010

well pika is known for his karate and ability to generate huge deadly plasma balls of course

if it was a remake retain physics, retain everything, maybe make pika's recovery shorter and kirby's u-tilt as little less fast/huge, *maybe* add one or two characters so long as they aren't broken or trash...

Surri-Sama · Oct 31, 2010

Reduce pikas recovery

Reduce crazy hit boxes (kirbys Utilt is obviously the worst but there are many)

Add more stages (we really need a balanced one)

Add air speed and recovery to Link

Add power to ness' Smashes and Uair

Add "damage factor" to DKs UpB (meaning the more % you have the further you'll be sent after being hit)

This is what pops into my head as things 'd like to see done to Smash64 if remade

asianaussie · Oct 31, 2010

a damage factor to DK's Up-B would have to be along the lines of pika's thunder aura though, because losing it as a low-damage repulsion would suck majorly

can we really 'balance' a stage? flat stages would favour campers, platformed stages would favour falcon, etc

Grim Tuesday · Oct 31, 2010

How about Smashville from Brawl for a balanced stage?

asianaussie · Oct 31, 2010

oh look you're from adelaide

the almost-concave ledges would make ledge DI a semi-stage spike (lol...not actually sure about this) and smash 64 doesn't automatically turn you around to grab the ledge or let you hug the stage, but rectify that and it could be cool

Grim Tuesday · Oct 31, 2010

Well I just meant the general idea of a medium sized platform and moving platform above it.

EDIT: Did you go to Robocop?

Korrupshen · Oct 31, 2010

I hate to say it, but I think we wont see have a remake or new sequel in a long time. Blame the brawl n00bs who hacked the game to the point where u can do almost anything on the game depending the disc size and what the brawl engine allows you to do. Nintendo probably saw it already and I guarantee they were mad because they messed up there "masterpiece". If you wanna game worth hacking why wont they just hack the old versions of Smash like 64 and melee. I mean why **** with Nintendo latest smash game. Hack a prequel of the game, I'm sure Nintendo won't really give a **** if you was hacking a game released 9 years ago.

ryuu seika · Oct 31, 2010

ballin4life said:
banjo kazooie

Dsc said:
I dont get why he didnt make it into smash.

felipe_9595 said:
Microsoft

That's why they weren't in Brawl and their lack of inclusion in the earlier ones was possibly because they weren't nintendo enough. This suggestion will never happen, much as I wish otherwise. Nintendo missed their chance at this awesome addition to smash, as is evident from the mess up with ~~Banjo~~ Diddy Kong Racing.

Dsc said:
No need for dedede and bowser imo. Were looking for new characters

All plausible suggestions are fine, especially as it was already stated that Dedede and Bowser were possabilities in post one.

Dsc said:
Peach? I like that idea.

Agreed. I thought about Peach but didn't want to influence peoples choices by mentioning her at the start.

Dsc · Oct 31, 2010

Id like either peach or zelda because theres not one girly fighter in 64. Yeah samus fights like a man

Battlecow · Oct 31, 2010

GrimFandango said:
Stages: Final Destination, Battlefield.
Characters: Bowser, King Dedede, Pit and Peach.
Features: Online Play and Home-Run Contest.

This would make Smash 64 perfect imo.

EDIT: Bowser would have Fire Breath, Dedede would have Inhale, Pit would have Palutena's Arrows and Peach would have Toad.

EDIT 2: Also, name tags would be awesome.

FD and battlefield as playables w/o gamesharking would be nice. Tags would too, although that's a fairly minor thing IMO.

Eh, we don't reallly need more superheavies like bowser/DK/I think D3 is heavy too right?, no one knows who pit is so I don't feel like he should be included because it's all people we know in 64, which is nice, and Peach is a girl and no one likes to hit girls. I actually cringe when I have to fight peaches in Melee. Samus is different for obvious reasons. As far as characters, I'd honestly like megaman (perhaps as a samus clone in the mario/weegee sense?) Mewtwo, Banjo Kazooie, and Hector from FE.

Online play would probably be a joke considering the online play that we already have. HRC- sure, I guess.

To be perfectly frank, though, I don't think that more stages/chars would be a good thing. More chars means it's harder to play everyone, you have to learn more matchups, etc.; Any new stages would run into the same problems as the olds, and I've yet to see anyone propose something that would be considered truly neutral.

ballin4life · Oct 31, 2010

While we are dreaming, options to turn the tornado on and off

asianaussie · Oct 31, 2010

FD would be cool, as would a Pokemon Stadium-esque stage.

Why Hector? He's pretty ******, sure (check that prettyboy hair lol), but he's from FE7, which is pretty disjointed considering each smash game had Marth and the latest protagonist (FE6 hadn't actually been released but anyway...)...

I did not go to robocop, I don't have that sort of free time atm and I'm basically 64-only...

Battlecow · Oct 31, 2010

I like Hector. He's my main man whenever I play that game. I didn't really see why I had to follow the example of the other smashes. I don't think it's a good idea marketing-wise or anything, but I personally would be tickled pink about it and main him or at least secondary him.

Actually, Matthew the thief from FE7 would be even better.

Dsc · Nov 1, 2010

FD in the stage selection screen would be sooo good.
Getting rid of the stupid stars would be good too.

And yes, a feature to turn the tornados off would be leet

Skrlx · Nov 1, 2010

those stars are for CHAMPS

Grim Tuesday · Nov 1, 2010

cheeseball341 said:
I did not go to robocop, I don't have that sort of free time atm and I'm basically 64-only...

Ah yeah, I play all 3 games. I was a bit disappointed when I saw there was no Smash 64 set-up

asianaussie · Nov 1, 2010

chances are if you're in australia and don't play online you're not very good :\

hit us up online on desiree's

Grim Tuesday · Nov 1, 2010

cheeseball341 said:
chances are if you're in australia and don't play online you're not very good :\

hit us up online on desiree's

Well, I'm the best in SA.

I tried to get online set-up but it crashed every time.

ciaza · Nov 1, 2010

I don't know. BlackShadow is quite alright. Regardless try again at p64k. It's not hard to set-up at all and you'd be able to play a more diverse range of players.

asianaussie · Nov 1, 2010

talking the talk is fine

but until you actually show how good you are (post a vid or something) that's all it is, talk :3

Grim Tuesday · Nov 1, 2010

That is entirely true.

And it is for that exact reason that you can't say that I'm "not very good" without me having shown how good I am.

@Ciaza
I got it all set-up fine as far as I could tell, as soon as I tried to play a match against someone, PJ64K crashed. I tried with Mupen and got the same result.

blaze3927 · Nov 1, 2010

^^ obvious checkilst:
rom not in same directory as exe file
can play offline
using latest kaillera client from ownasauras
not trying to play fullscreen or anything over 800x600

Grim Tuesday · Nov 1, 2010

Check for all of them. The Kaillera client is probably out-dated now, but it was the latest when I first tried this.

Skrlx · Nov 1, 2010

GrimFandago is thinking of joining the kaillera community? Looks like Grimfandago is my new lover.

Grim Tuesday · Nov 1, 2010

<3
I've always been your lover, it's just taken you a while to realise it.

asianaussie · Nov 1, 2010

near has something for australians in general :|

get pj64k working plz, we will eclipse europe in terms of smash players and then move onto america

jk america's total smasher count is about the same as our population :\

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