A Guide to Farore's Wind - Updated Teleport-Cancelling Section

[Zone]

Farore's wind comboing is hard enough to do on the sandbag while waiting for the wifi match to start. I doubt it's worth the effort to go through every character to find the percents you can do this, especially if they can just DI out of it. Sad to hear you aren't liking Brawl. If you ever feel differently, I'd love to go a few rounds with you on wifi. Thanks again for the compliments.

Well even if they DI it you can just tilt he teleport in their direction. You don't have to move straight up. Unless you feel your gonna fly off the edge and die :D. It's really not that hard to do. It just takes conscious effort to note their damage, DI, and where you'll end up being if you follow their DI. Then again, I don't think attacking with Up+B is all that useful.

I'm just waiting for some epic brawl technical break through. Hoping for something which will make the game more fast paced, and less camp oriented. (Wolf is gay)

 

[rampant_apart]

Fun fact that I learned from a recent match with my friends Olimar.

Because the hit box for when you reappear with Farore is a burning attack, it can be used to ignite exploding crates. Instant hilarity will ensue.

This is a great way to accidentally kill your face really hard if you aren't paying attention to things right as they spawn.

Just thought everyone could use a quick chuckle.

 

[Tyr_03]

Hmm I think I'm a bit confused on terms then. What I was trying to do was when you farore's wind to the very edge of a stage and it cancels allowing an immediate aerial. I can't get it to work on regular platforms like the ones on Battlefield. I end up with the usual lag following Farore's Wind. Am I just not doing it right or is it not possible?

 

[TheLake]

Those were some great matches, Lake. We need to do that again some time.

Agreed buddy, Great zelda...If I make a room your always welcome

 

[Luthien]

Hmm I think I'm a bit confused on terms then. What I was trying to do was when you farore's wind to the very edge of a stage and it cancels allowing an immediate aerial. I can't get it to work on regular platforms like the ones on Battlefield. I end up with the usual lag following Farore's Wind. Am I just not doing it right or is it not possible?

Soft platforms are tricky. There are some things to keep in mind:

1) When standing on a soft platform, teleporting any southern direction will send you THROUGH it, not along it. So, trying to ledgewarp short distances is out.

2) Teleporting directly horizontal will have Zelda's reappearing animation be the arial one (she spins in both animations, but her legs are bent when she reappears in the air). Even if you land on another platform, she won't ledgewarp because she won't slide along the ground.

However, there are some options. If you teleport downwards onto a soft platforms edge from in the air, you won't flythrough it and you'll reappear on the ground, sliding due to post-Farore's momentum. It's limiting and it's tricky, but it opens up a world of options on stages like battlefield if you can master it. Here's a vid of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GL-3bUS_PY

2:12-2:13. Enjoy.

 

[Lingy]

There's still one thing that annoys me... which is when I use FW a bit shy from the ledge, and just falling to my death when it's like an inch away from me. I've been falling to the left closer to the edge before using it, but sometimes I move more than I want to and get caught underneath the base platform.

I still have some practicing to do with that <_<

 

[Triforce_Chauzu]

There's still one thing that annoys me... which is when I use FW a bit shy from the ledge, and just falling to my death when it's like an inch away from me. I've been falling to the left closer to the edge before using it, but sometimes I move more than I want to and get caught underneath the base platform.

I still have some practicing to do with that <_<

True, that happens to me too sometimes... In general, her recovery's the toughest part of her to get down right.

The other day, I faced a really great Wolf player, and he complete crushed me - many thanks to the fact that I really hade problems to recover into the stage. I made some easy mistakes as well due to him pressuring me. Well, he would've won comfortably even if I could recover, but... I'll train a lot on that the coming weeks.

 

[Tyr_03]

Thanks for clearing that up for me Luthien. Great thread all around.

 

[PK-ow!]

These tricks with the tip of stage ledges seem to be cut from one and the same programming oddity (I'm not calling 'glitch' just yet).

Lucario's ExtremeSpeed
PKT2 weirdness

They all have the ability to erase lag yet preserve some move properties by aiming for that space just above the corner.

[/speculation]

Anyway, great guide. I wish there were some way of going through a soft platform from above, though. Maybe a double tap in the direction? Like for plain falling?

~ow

 

[Tsuteto]

Quick theory: When you get knocked back, we all know you can recover movement of your character fairly fast. However, how well would using FW as soon as you can work? I would attempt this myself, but I lack the peeps to do so XD I'm wondering if the momentum would still carry you after you have teleported, assuming you've done so before you've flown off the side of the stage.

 

[Lingy]

Quick theory: When you get knocked back, we all know you can recover movement of your character fairly fast. However, how well would using FW as soon as you can work? I would attempt this myself, but I lack the peeps to do so XD I'm wondering if the momentum would still carry you after you have teleported, assuming you've done so before you've flown off the side of the stage.

Hey I don't think this is terribly important but something to keep in mind as far as the random specifics of Farore's Wind. If you use Farore's Wind at the peak of your knockback you get a small upward boost. It's easiest to see if you try it on spikes. Maybe an anti-juggling technique? Or just to space yourself better for a sweetspot maybe. I dunno. Also I was wondering why sometimes using farore's wind in the air seems to halt my momentum and other times it continues until the point that I teleport?

I think that's what you're talking about?

 

[Tsuteto]

10% yes, 90% no. That talks more as a means of an escape or set-up. I'm talking more as a means of a recovery. Let's say you're at 60% and Ike fsmashes you. You're screwed practically, right? Though you can recover animation, you can't recovermomentum. I'm wondering if you use FW as soon as you can (in other words, once you regain your animations), and teleport before you go off the side, if when you reappear you stop moving, or if you're continually moving during the teleport, etc etc.

 

[sFoster]

Doesn't nayru's love halt momentum better than FW?

 

[Luthien]

10% yes, 90% no. That talks more as a means of an escape or set-up. I'm talking more as a means of a recovery. Let's say you're at 60% and Ike fsmashes you. You're screwed practically, right? Though you can recover animation, you can't recovermomentum. I'm wondering if you use FW as soon as you can (in other words, once you regain your animations), and teleport before you go off the side, if when you reappear you stop moving, or if you're continually moving during the teleport, etc etc.

I'm not sure. At 60%, teleporting should be able to work. In theory.

All I know is that in Melee, if you went into training mode, selected Hyrule Temple, put Zelda at 999% and shot her straight up in the valley of life, she would hit the ceiling and keep her "just jumped" animation. She'll keep her momentum, so it'll look like she's stuck to the ceiling, but she can perform arials, specials, etc. If you try to FW south, she won't leave the ceiling. She'll just disappear and reappear where she was. What I'm trying to say is, I think that the momentum Zelda is sent flying at takes priority to Farore's Wind, depending on how much there was.

Oh, and I'm sure that sometimes you can't use this theory because FW has so much start-up time anyway. >.<

 

[sFoster]

Luthien have you noticed FW blindspots yet?

Check this out .. go to a level like sonics ..
Stand on the far right of the level by the edge, and teleport directly left.

You actually teleport SW even thought you're not pressing down.
It's impossible to teleport just west, because FW actually follows the curved landscape.

Kind of interesting, but it won't follow the landscape if you're standing on a slope. (such as in the middle of the level where it it forms a 'U'

You can get around these blind spots by jumping, but if you touch the ground before you warp then it won't get around the blind spot.

 

[S2]

So has anyone incorporated Ledgewarping/stealing into their game yet?

I've been practicing, but still don't feel confident enough in it to use it in a match (although I'm getting there).

Just figured I'd ask, since it does have cool potential.

 

[Triforce_Chauzu]

I use it in Training sometimes for fun... But I've never ever used it in a real match. Maybe when I get a little better and gain some more confidence, I'll try it out for real.

Also, a thing about FW and Halberd, when the stage is up in the air.... When I FW horizontally exactly over the edge - you could say that I'm trying to sweetspot but miss by a centimeter or something - it often ends with a SD for me. Instead of landing on the lower platform, I just fall through it... Anyone else that has experienced it?

Halberd's one of my current stage bans, btw... Never won there because of this. Always SD.

 

[S2]

Yes, Halberd is tricky because most Zelda's are used to sweetspotting with the top of Zelda (like they should), but in order to land on the lower platform you need to have your feet completely above it. Which leads to a lot of times where a small misjudge in spacing can get you killed even when a big chunk of Zelda is on the stage.

Anyways, its not a good stage really at all for Zelda... so I'd say your justified in using your stage ban on it if the tournament is letting you do stage bans.

 

[Triforce_Chauzu]

I'm happy that you agree. Makes me feel knowledgable. It's sad though, I really like the music on that stage... The main theme's so awesome.

I must say that I've gotten a lot better at sweetspotting ledges with Zelda now, btw. Before when I faced the best smasher I know I felt so pressured that I barely ever sweetspotted, so I was completely destroyed in all our matches. But when I face him now, I'm able to return safely to the stage very quickly so that he doesn't get time to even edgeguard me, which has resulted in me winning a couple of matches against him, even though he's still on a higher level than me. The only problem I still got is that I sometimes try to sweetspot the edges and the opponent then grabs it and gains invicibilty frames... Have to train on reading those.

Well, enough about talking about me. About another stage and FW - Yoshi's Island. I really love that stage, but I've managed to get unnescessary killed a couple of times when I'm trying to teleport directly above me when I'm falling down. Sometimes I just hit something of the stages design on the way, and SD. Is this disturbing anyone else? My guess is that I have to keep a little bit more space between me and the stage when I FW upwards, so I'll be training on that in the future.

 

[PK-ow!]

Luthien have you noticed FW blindspots yet?

Check this out .. go to a level like sonics ..
Stand on the far right of the level by the edge, and teleport directly left.

You actually teleport SW even thought you're not pressing down.
It's impossible to teleport just west, because FW actually follows the curved landscape.

This, and the facts about teleporting "into" a hard platform, make me convinced that the game really is just pushing Zelda along the trajectory you input for a set time.

You may notice that the Sonic level has similar "cling" properties in that U - all kinds of moves will catch to it: PKT2, for example.

So what Farore's Wind does, I think, is give you invincibility frames and removes your control state, while removing your sprite. It then moves your character (in whatever sense it's still there) deterministically toward the destination, probably at constant velocity.


This leads me to conjecture the following: I think we can cut the teleporting short on a soft platform. That is, I think we can teleport up to a soft platform which exists closer than the full distance, and that we do this by inputting the same command as to cancel a jump to a soft platform.

I can't find the thread, but you should recall/know that in Brawl you can tap down when passing through a platform and you will land on the platform - I think you actually cut all the lag.

If this is possible, one of three things will be true. Either (1) the Farore's damage animation will occur, in which case Development either put this in, or had good "all cases" programming; (2) we will appear without a Farore's damage animation, in which case Development didn't see this, and we'll have a nice surprise teleport ability; or (3) we will glitch the game to kingdom come, possibly in making our sprite invisible forever.

I seriously hope we have (1).

Can anyone try this?

Also, if anyone can find out conditions under which the normal platform trick won't work, that might make this easier to disprove.

 

[SheikahBlood]

Two thumbs up!

 

[S2]

Surprised no one has posted here in a while.

Anyway, has anyone added ledgestealing into their game yet?

I've got a question about it (that I'm too lazy to test), what is the effect if you do this when someone is already hanging on the edge, does the technique still go off as normal?

 

[Tsuteto]

It'll still go off as normal. You don't actually steal the ledge. What happens is that you land on the ground and there's a very VERY fine slide (I think that can be enhanced if you hold directly towards the ledge once you reappear), and you go off the edge. So if someone is holding the ledge, you could actually use that and follow up with a bair, making it even more effective.

For me: It's too risky to actually incorporate.

 

[Luthien]

It'll still go off as normal. You don't actually steal the ledge. What happens is that you land on the ground and there's a very VERY fine slide (I think that can be enhanced if you hold directly towards the ledge once you reappear), and you go off the edge. So if someone is holding the ledge, you could actually use that and follow up with a bair, making it even more effective.

For me: It's too risky to actually incorporate.

Yes and no.

Depending on what character is holding the ledge, you will either hit them off and steal the ledge or not hit them and be able to bair. Or maybe you could hit them off and follow up with a Fair. [:< I dunno, haven't tested ledgestealing for a while.

At any rate, ledgeWARPING is possible in all matchups. LedgeSTEALING is only possible against characters who hang over the ledge with their head/other body part actually abover the ledge, where the reappearing animation hitbox can make contact. If a character is hanging below the ledge with their arms (i.e. Zelda), reappearing will not hit them.

I made a list of what happens with which characters, but I think most people missed it. Gimme a minute to post it again.

EDIT: Here we go --

Ledgestealing is REAL. I've done it, and I've discovered the trick to it. It's character specific. I'll make a list:

Vulnerable to Ledgestealing:
Mario
Bowser
Donkey Kong
Dedede
Metaknight
Olimar
Pikachu
Charizard
Squirtle
Ivysaur
Ness
Lucas
G&W
Yoshi

*At low percents, ledgestealing can lead into a Dair or Footstool jump if you choose not to grab the ledge.

Immune to ledgestealing:
Luigi
Peach
Diddy
Wario
Link
Zelda
Sheik
Ganondorf
Samus
Pit
Ice Climbers (WHY?! IT SHOULD WORK!!)
ROB
Kirby (WHY?!)
Fox
Falco
Wolf
C. Falcon
Lucario
Jiggs
Ike
Marth
Snake
Sonic

*You'd think this was bad, but they're worse off due to you being able to Bair right after reappearance. Suckers...

I wasn't really all that thorough. If someone wants to test the immune list, please feel free.

I posted this way back, a day before the April Fool's joke. So when most people read the list, they must have thought I was crazy...

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Farore's wind seems to occasionally move (sometimes a good deal) during the startup animation... I haven't quite figured out what causes this yet.

 

[xjellyfishx]

I tried this in Training Mode. No way I can pull this off in a real match rofl. I'd die right away
It's a very neat trick though :O

 

[PriMaDonna]

Is teleporting in 16 directions possible with the Wiimote?

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

oh... that;s a good point... if they ARE then they would certainly be MUCH more difficult.

 

[Luthien]

Farore's wind seems to occasionally move (sometimes a good deal) during the startup animation... I haven't quite figured out what causes this yet.

In the air or on the ground? Because if it's in the air, we already talked about this on page, like, two or three. Meaning...

... I need to take all the info we've collected since my latest update and actually update the first post. I promise I will soon so that new readers won't get confused (like the FW more than 16 directions? thread).

Also, I'm pretty sure you can go all of the directions on the wiimote, but I'm just as sure it's WAY harder. I use the GC controller, so it's all been pretty easy for me.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

In the air or on the ground? Because if it's in the air, we already talked about this on page, like, two or three. Meaning...

... I need to take all the info we've collected since my latest update and actually update the first post. I promise I will soon so that new readers won't get confused (like the FW more than 16 directions? thread).

Also, I'm pretty sure you can go all of the directions on the wiimote, but I'm just as sure it's WAY harder. I use the GC controller, so it's all been pretty easy for me.

in the air... but I can't find mention of it on pages 2,3,4 or 5

... it's been substantial sometimes when it happens to me (once, on yoshi's stage I moved from off the stage, right next to the edge to the other side of the stage a few feet above the platform. I teleported straight down... but it didn't teleport down from where she was before she dissapeared, it teleported down from a few feet behind that )

 

[sFoster]

Sonic your momentum influences the teleport direction.
This is evenm ore noticable if you jump right as you teleport, and even MORE noticable if you're in a tumble animation after being hit..

In that sense it's kind of like pikachu's up+b
You can tap right, and hit teleport, and zelda will fly to the right.. then you can hold left and zelda will teleport to the left.. very easy way to fool some people.

Also - Luthien, here is another little update for FW ..
Ledgewarping is possiblefrom southern directions as well.

I have ledge warped from BENEATH the ledge on final destination now 3 times, one of them on purpose.
I have a replay or could do some screen shots but this is arugably the hardest move to do in the entire game lol. Ledge warping w/o lag from underneath of the ledge in the air.

 

[XFadingNirvanaX]

Very helpful guide. Surprisingly, I knew a lot of this. lol. But still learned a lot more.

 

[PriMaDonna]

I've been trying on a Wiimote, and I really think that only 8 directions are possible.
Sucks for those who don't have a GC controller... (probably just me)

 

[Luthien]

Also - Luthien, here is another little update for FW ..
Ledgewarping is possiblefrom southern directions as well.

I have ledge warped from BENEATH the ledge on final destination now 3 times, one of them on purpose.
I have a replay or could do some screen shots but this is arugably the hardest move to do in the entire game lol. Ledge warping w/o lag from underneath of the ledge in the air.

Woah, didn't know that. I knew that you could ledgewarp by teleporting directly south, but I didn't think it was possible to do from beneath the stage (as opposed to directly above the ledge). I suppose I'll update that as well when I have time next week.

 

[SinkingHigher]

Just wanted to check. You guys know FW attacks at the beginning and end, right?

 

[Tsuteto]

No, we didn't.

</sarcasm>

 

[SinkingHigher]

No, we didn't.

</sarcasm>

lol, whatever.

 

[sFoster]

Just wanted to check. You guys know FW attacks at the beginning and end, right?

Yes, the beginning has a smaller hitbox and vertical knockback, the end has a larger hitbox and horizontal knockback.

 

[Amide]

That was awesome... I didn't know FW was that complex of a move.

 

[Luthien]

BUMP​

The thread's updated now, so that new readers can go through it and not have to read through 8 pages of replies to find any extra information.

If there's anything I forgot to edit/add in there, let me know.