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Alabama Thread! (10/26/2016 update)
- Thread starter moogle
- Start date
*Cam*
Smash Lord
I don't think you can consider G&W on Brinstar or Rainbow Cruise a free or illegitimate win. To me, a win is a win is a win. I don't think we can just say "Oh, he used G&W on RC, so we can't say he really took a game off of so-and-so." There's no wrong way to win within the ruleset, so I don't see that as a problem with the current ELO system.
DeLux
Player that used to be Lux
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2010
- Messages
- 9,302
What's wrong with picking MK again?
Pr0t0
Smash Rookie
So who else plays LoL and what are your usernames?
All I have are duchok and will_.
Also did i mention how shocked I am that you guys still play brawl after all this time?
Are there any melee smashing situations that go down in bham? Sorta want to play that again.
All I have are duchok and will_.
Also did i mention how shocked I am that you guys still play brawl after all this time?
Are there any melee smashing situations that go down in bham? Sorta want to play that again.
Well, the metagame is still changing, and that's reason enough to stay entertained. Plus, the Melee players around here don't do much to make people want to start playing or keep playing Melee.
Been banned in AL since about a few weeks before the Unity Announcement.
www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=307742
Good read ^^^
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
well Cheap Peach is your best bet on finding someone to play melee, me too i guess.
what part of B'ham are you in again?
_Keno_
Smash Lord
I'd totally quit brawl again if even one melee player appeared in Birmingham.
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
Bro if you're seriously arguing that A. being grabbed is equally as hard to avoid is BB and SF as it is in Brawl and B. Any move that Tager or Zangief have in their entire moveset is as devastating overall as an ICs CG. I'm just going to give you a silly look and agree to disagree.
Being grabbed in Brawl is much easier to avoid than in Street Fighter, at least. You have to make a guess any time a grapple character does a standard blockstring, and there are platforms in Brawl.
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
Honestly T1J, when you know they're going to grab you can get away. You just have to be like 3 steps ahead of yourself so you don't make a bad choice.
T1J. It's a fact.
Tager's super does 3 quarters of every character's health. ICs CG, should they land it, is one third of your life. Both match-ups revolve around not letting that happen.
Tager's super does 3 quarters of every character's health. ICs CG, should they land it, is one third of your life. Both match-ups revolve around not letting that happen.
Saki-
Reset Project
ForeverSaki is mine
Others could be found in this thread
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=310714
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
And I'm Mahgnificent in LoL
Pr0t0
Smash Rookie
I'm in Hoover, on Lorna Road.
I'm probably really bad but I played a little and my tech skill is almost the same.
What's the deal with project M, did that ever catch on? I got the demo forev ago and it was pretty kew.
Hah I had no idea there was a LoL thread. I shall add everyone in AL.
Wouldn't he have to build meter, though? I don't know if there is the equivalent of EX moves in BB or not, but, is that meter used for more than supers?
To be fair, though, the Ice Climbers chaingrab doesn't exist once Nana is gone, so there are stipulations for that, too.
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
you have to have meter. you can't grab people out of the air, or on the ground. you can't grab people in blockstun (or at least it can be broken). if you whiff it, you have to wait until you have meter again. you can't shield grab, dash grab, or pivot grab. Since you have to input a jump to do it, you are limited in the situations in which you could reasonably pull it off. Also Tager is bad in general.
In Brawl, you can change direction in mid-air, both normally and via B-Reversals. You also get a double-jump, platforms, and the ability to perform multiple attacks in mid-air. Ice Climbers also have among the worst grab range in the game, and their approach game is mediocre overall. They have to worry about what will happen six frames after every move they do, since Nana will be late and is necessary to make the chaingrab work.
TheSaintKai
Smash Ace
You also have footstooling as an option, and multiple escape options in your shield.
And none of this is getting into character specific options. x)
popsofctown
Smash Champion
You're totally missing the point. Practicing G&W to win single games on Rainbow Cruise is an effective strategy for winning games. That doesn't have a 1:1 correlation with winning you sets.
You've built an ELO system that tells you how good people are at winning games. We decide tournaments with sets. So if you say "I'm 1450, you're 1400, therefore when we go to a tournament I'm more likely to make first than you are," I can answer you, "No. You are more likely to win more games than I am. I predict something like this: I'll 2-1 three times, then 3-2 winner's finals. I predict you'll 2-0, 2-0, 1-2, 1-2. I'll be 9-5 on games, you'll be 6-2. I have as much evidence to say I'll win this tournament as you do."
And that would be a statistically valid rebuttal.
You know that I believe a win is a win more than anyone else does. I took Ryker to a wall stage with D3 and ShaSlam to PS2 to win sets. That was part of a strategy of practicing I used to try to prepare for game ones, game twos, and game threes.
When I played against Saint and his partner in doubles, I had little to no doubles preparation, and primarily recent doubles experience with aerial characters. I had no plan for winning game 1 or a game 3 under my opponent's control, just game 2. I played game 2 on Rainbow Cruise and won a game using Toon Link. But that game two didn't do anything help me win because I can only play aerially in doubles, and I have to win at least one other game of the set. Yet the current ELO system makes a judgment that I'm better than John Doe who can play every stage and matchup equally well but just barely loses to Saint twice in a row as being an inferior player to me, one less likely to succeed if we tried it again. The conclusion is a non-sequitir.
The counterpick system might be a small enough stir on things that this isn't a huge deal. I wish you at least understood how using games to judge set performance is a non-sequitir though. If you just don't want to twiddle with the system that's been set up or want the addition slightly tarnished data that's fine.
@DeLux: You BANNED MY CHARACTER.
popsofctown
Smash Champion
I just broke into latin
where is munkus
where is munkus
*Cam*
Smash Lord
I didn't design the elo, but I'm pretty sure set wins matter much more than game wins. That being said, game wins aren't completely discounted either.
popsofctown
Smash Champion
Ok, hope so.
popsofctown
Smash Champion
You would if you could.
The Unity precedent makes reversing the ban in Alabama more impossibler than before.
The Unity precedent makes reversing the ban in Alabama more impossibler than before.
no one has any control over it here, except the ASL members.
like 4 people i think? but whatever im not getting back into that discussion.
i feel like fighters are more broken than smash so i could see it if zangiefs grabs were similar to ics.
only thing is that you can do the same amount of damage that a zangief grab does with a simple bread and butter combo im fairly sure, so i dont see why that kind of stuff is relevant at all in a fairly aggresive game with combos in it and easy damage dealing devices and no real timeouts ever lol. ( plus some other silly brawl stuff im forgetting to mention oh yeah the inability to approach ever especially when the main thing approaches are stopped by is graaaaaaaabbbbsss )
also im gonna start watching WWE again. that **** is entertaining as **** dude i dont give a **** if most of the fan base is either 4 year olds who live with their grandma or drunk *** hicks. that **** is waaayyy tooo damn hype yalll!!!
like 4 people i think? but whatever im not getting back into that discussion.
i feel like fighters are more broken than smash so i could see it if zangiefs grabs were similar to ics.
only thing is that you can do the same amount of damage that a zangief grab does with a simple bread and butter combo im fairly sure, so i dont see why that kind of stuff is relevant at all in a fairly aggresive game with combos in it and easy damage dealing devices and no real timeouts ever lol. ( plus some other silly brawl stuff im forgetting to mention oh yeah the inability to approach ever especially when the main thing approaches are stopped by is graaaaaaaabbbbsss )
also im gonna start watching WWE again. that **** is entertaining as **** dude i dont give a **** if most of the fan base is either 4 year olds who live with their grandma or drunk *** hicks. that **** is waaayyy tooo damn hype yalll!!!
Mahgnittoc
Smash Ace
What's going on in WWE right now? I want to get into it cause I want a WWE game but I feel the story is gonna be too stupid with too many new people and John Cena. it makes me not want to get back into to it because I had to see everyone leave like The Rock and Stone Cold.
*Cam*
Smash Lord
It's 12 people currently, which includes Pops. In May, the rest of the community gets to vote on 10 people to make the major ASL decisions (like a MK ban or the season budget). Those 10 will elect (or re-elect) from their ranks a President, VP, and Treasurer in June.
I'm not trying to spark a discussion, just making a clarification.
yeah i know what you mean. like, The Miz is WWE champion right now >_> and there is just so many new people that can never fill the shoes of old wrestling greats but at the very least its interesting to see the WWE try to hype the new people and watch how they do it. right now Kane is feuding with John Cena and thats about all i know. this guy named Alberto Rio Del Verde or some **** is the world heavyweight champion which really sucks also because that guy has NO hype factor whatsoever. wrestlemania is coming up in march though so that should be cool. its sad but i think the side stories are more interesting than the championship stories atm. its like you said. lame new guys the WWE is trying to hype up and kind of failing at.
also WWE games are the **** lmao. i just got smackdown vs raw 2011 for like 5 dollars. if i cant get into the storyline they have this new addition to the games where you can make your own rivalries and kind of manage the WWE from an outside perspective but you are in control of building hype and all that plus you can jump in and control any match you want.
The only character with EX moves is Jin. Rapid cancels also use super meter, but Tager doesn't rapid cancel.
Yes, he has to have meter, but he doesn't have to input anything after he grabs you, nor does he have to have a second character in the correct range and condition after his opponent ****s up.
Yep, I do have to have meter. That's my limitation.
Nope, I can't grab people out of the air, but I can sure grab them as they land. I can also force a landing via magnetism. I can tick grab and I can also throw a gimmicky purple grab.
Oh, seriously? People can stop me from landing a grab? Holy ****. This is news! Stop the presses! This means that any grabcentric character that you can keep from grabbing you doesn't automatically mean god tier.
I can shield grab just fine. I can essentially cancel a dash attack with a grab. Pivot grabbing is a worse option in general than having an invincible backdash that I can buffer a grab that has reversal properties.
Also, yes, that's my point, Tager is a bad character. The thing that you are complaining about is present in more games than Brawl. It's actually much more devestating in most games. However, it's not a broken gimmick.
theONEjanitor
Smash Champion
Ice Climbers are a high tier, good placing character based almost SOLELY on their ability to CG people to death. Tager remains garbage. I didn't say "people can stop you from landing a grab, therefore tager is not broken". if i did, please show me where. the only thing similar to that I've said was that people could break grabs in certain situations, like grabbing someone in block stun, which any half-decent player should break everytime. my argument presumes that you can't break out of ICs chaingrabs, when they are performed correctly. Which may be something that requires more discussion. You're definitely exaggerating the ease at which Tager can land his 720 on people though. I suppose we can both come up with stipulation after stipulation for each characters move, but in the end, I defer to match evidence. I'm having a hard time seeing whats hard to understand about the fact that when an ICs grabs you (which happens, all time. in the highest level of gameplay. watch match videos.), he has a 100% opportunity to take a stock at any percent. and nearly every match that includes the Ice Climbers losing, there are spots where you can literally see where he could have 100% taken a stock, not 'maybe i dunno if he lol spaced better he could have possibly put himself in a better position', no absolutely 100% no questions asked, would have taken a stock. And how thats different from just general spacing and move selection. If 720s happened as often as ICs chaingrabs, Tager wouldn't be a bad character. He'd probably be broken.
Match evidence doesn't back you T1J.
The ICs would have to PERFECT reaction time in order to punish everything they could get a grab off of. It's why you see Kismet throw FSmashes. It's punishable, but it's a read that you won't be able to do it.
Past that, ICs thrives on you making mistakes. They're going to do their best to force those mistakes, but they still have to punish you for it or lose. For most of the cast, the fault lies just as much with their bad read as with the IC capitalizing. That is what prevents it from being ********. It's what keeps every grappler from being ********.
If you get grabbed, it's on you.
The ICs would have to PERFECT reaction time in order to punish everything they could get a grab off of. It's why you see Kismet throw FSmashes. It's punishable, but it's a read that you won't be able to do it.
Past that, ICs thrives on you making mistakes. They're going to do their best to force those mistakes, but they still have to punish you for it or lose. For most of the cast, the fault lies just as much with their bad read as with the IC capitalizing. That is what prevents it from being ********. It's what keeps every grappler from being ********.
If you get grabbed, it's on you.
*Cam*
Smash Lord
I think ICs are tougher at mid-level of play because we are used to making more mistakes.