Angelus mucro! Offendo meus hostilis verus! The Pit True Combo Compendium

[Maharba the Mystic]

Spoiler

ptzr (and others but i know you know a lot of this stuff) im gonna update my cg thread to a cg/ combo thread and i need to know if you would test and tell me who else besides kirby we can bthrow>dsmash. also if anything else is true out of bthrow (including aerials, AR, pivot jab, try it all.)

also if someone could tell me who we CANT bthrow>dash attack i would appreciate it

i would also appreciate it if someone could test all of the combos we can get out of back hit dsmash because i know that combos into fsmash but what else can we combo it into (including aerials, AR, pivot jab, i need info guys)

does anyone know if we have true combos out of an auto cancelled nair? all i know is at 5%-8% if we hit with just the last hit and they don't tech we can do ftilt>jab lock animation>dash attack (the lock animation unfortunately doesn't do forced get up)

when we fall on someone with an "auto cancelled" AR does that combo into anything at all?

what are all of the true combos out of a weak bair? also does weak bair give us enough frames to footstool (on the ground or aerial i need to know both)

now i DO NOT want ANYTHING that isn't GUARANTEED (unless it's something that involves them missing a tech>lock as it can at the very least set up a tech chase).

yall know i would test these myself if i had access to a wii but i don't and it's honestly time we looked into stuff like this. marth boards had this done and done ages ago. we need to step this up and start getting hard core with our gameplay. when i have access to a wii i will test some of these myself but until i have access i am incapable. free damage is free damage.

so to make sure we don't get a bunch of people working on the same stuff this is gonna be a first come first serve on testing choice. so pick a category to test and state that you are testing it. to make it simple for you all the categories of interest are

Bthrow> regrabs (aside from the PS1 grab), grounded attacks and AR, aerials moves, and who we cant dash attack

auto cancelled nair> ANYTHING

"auto cancelled" AR> ANYTHING

back hit dsmash> ANYTHING

weak bair aerial combos + footstool

ff weak bair autocancel> ANYTHING


throw me a bone on this guys and ill throw you back a better overall character





please start signing up as soon as you read this. also, im fine with one person doing up to 2 categories max. i don't want one person doing everything because then it will never get done. that's how it always ends up and im not gonna stand for it this time

just submit all findings to this thread

edit:

kuro, think of a flashy title for this. eventually ill copy over the CG thread to this and make all of this stuff available in one thread

also ill start off with just the stuff i know that is guaranteed on everybody or things that i just happen to know

[collapse=Pit's Chaingrab Ratios; click to open]Pit Chaingrab Ratio

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
COMPLETE!!!!!!!

All of these were tested by myself and my partners Blaze and Green. Also Dskank contributed to the follow ups and throws.

The following percents/combos are proven true with methods of video frame testing and actual gameplay application. If for some reason in the future one of these is found false it will be changed only after proof is shown.
COMING SOON MORE FOLLOW UPS. HOWEVER THE ACTUAL CHAINGRABBING PART IS COMPLETED

WHY/HOW THE DACG works the way it does:
the button imput that goes to the wii when you grab with Z is sheild>attack. which is why the only movement you can get with a sheild grab is based on your traction. however if you enter attack then sheild wat you are doing is keeping the momentum of the initial movement that you made before you cancelled said attack with sheild and keeping that momentum when grab comes out. when you DACG you are cancelling a dash attack by imputing sheild immediately afterwords so you are keeping both the boost of the dash and the dash attack so that you arejust that much farther forwards.

here is the uncomplete video of all the chaingrabs starting with DK and CF.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guBEY9viYhQ

this thread and the work to obtain its contents is credited to:

Maharba The Mystic (starter of thread)
DSkank
Blaze
Green
Pulse131
Luckay4Lyphe (found out we can grab>jab dk, snake, and samus at 0%. best used if near the edge to set up an early gimp.)

Legend:
w=walk
g=grab
f=forward throw
r=run
ss=stutter step
DAC=dash attack cancel
DACG=dash attack cancel grab (performed: dash>down c-stick>sheild. you cannot use z to do it)
Characters Tested Thus Far (all starting at zero percent):

Chaingrabs and Follow Ups
------------------------------
(note we can fthrow>dash attack anyone we can cg for most of the early percents ranges. however if done to early you can be nair'd by most chars)

Bowser
f-throw>wg>47%+regrab
f-throw>DACG>58%+regrab
fthrow>ss fsmash

Captain falcon
f-throw>DACG>41%+regrab

Charizard
f-throw>ss fsmash

DDD:
f-throw>DACG or rg> 47%+regrab must slowly extend dash after each grab
fthrow>ss fsmash up till about 30%

Diddy
fthrow>ss fsmash

Donkey Kong
f-throw>jab>jab third hit or infinite
f-throw>wg>wg>wg>wg=34%
f-throw>wg>rg>DACG till finish at 62%
f-throw>wg>rg>wg>rg> at 41%
f-throw>wg>wg>DACG 62%
best follow up at the edge is dash attack or another f-throw>eat jumps with arrows>mirror the DK.

Falco
fthrow>fthrow>fthrow>dash attack
fthrow>ss fsmash up to 15%
fthrow>fthrow> ss or walking fsmash
fthrow>dtilt

Fox
f-throw>wg>10%+regrab
f-throw>DACG>34%+regrab
fthrow>dtilt

Game and Watch
f-throw>ss fsmash

Ganon
f-throw>wg>19%+regrab
f-throw>DACG>47%+regrab
fthrow>ss fsmash up till 25%

Ice Climbers
f-throw>ss fsmash
can't finish testing on them w/o a wii.....

Ike
f-throw x2>walking fsmash

Ivysaur
fthrow>sliding usmash

Jiggly Puff
fthrow>sliding usmash

Kirby
nothing out of fthrow

Link
f-throw>ss fsmash
f-throw>19%+regrab

Lucario
fthrow>ss fsmash

Lucas
none out of fthrow
gr> regrab (needs DACG), ss fsmash, walking fsmash, dash attack, walking dsmash (hard to do for strong spot, weak hit is easy tho), dtilt

Luigi
fthrow>19%+regrab
fthrow>ss fsmash

Mario
fthrow>ss fsmash

Marth
fthrow>ss fsmash 0% only

Metaknight
fthrow> ss fsmash
grab release> dash attack
fthrow>ss fsmash

Ness
gr> regrab (doesn't need DACG), ss fsmash, walking fsmash, dash attack, walking dsmash, dtilt

Olimar
none

Peach
fthrow>ss fsmash

Pikachu
none

Pit
fthrow>ss fsmash
f-throw x2>ss fsmash

ROB
fthrow>ss fsmash

Samus
f-throw>jab>jab third hit or infinite
f-throw>walking or ss fsmash
f-throw>DACG 19% + regrab>

Sheik
f-throw>19%+regrab
f-throw>ss fsmash

Snake:
f-throw>jab>jab third hit or infinite
f-throw>rg> 27%.
f-throw>DACG> 41% plus regrab CONFIRMED!
fthrow>fthrow> walking fsmash up to 15%
fthrow>ss fsmash

Sonic
f-throw>ss fsmash

Squirtle
none

Toon Link
fthrow>sliding usmash

Wario
can't be chaingrabbed by f-throw.
can't be stutter smashed.
i hate wario so much.....

Wolf
f-throw>wg>19+regrab
f-throw>DACG>41+regrab
fthrow>ss fsmash up till 20%
fthrow>dtilt

Yoshi
f-throw>ss fsmash

Zelda
none

Zero Suit Samus
don't mess with zero if you f-throw. her u-tilt jacks up anything you could ever think of trying out of it.

on most characters grounded grab release into d-smash can be sheilded sometimes but this works at any percent and is great for the suprise kill since it hits on frame 5 so buffer that shiz.
[/collapse]

back hit dsmash>

Spoiler

-fsmash 0%-20%ish

out of grounded dtilt spike (that rare moment when they are standing inside you and you dtilt and it pops them up at low-mid/mid high percents)

Spoiler

-crit bair
-weak bair
-fsmash (may not work on light/floaties)
-hyphen usmash (may not work on light/floaties)
-utilt (this is if they pop up literally right above you. the move is weird when the spike box hits)

back throw

Spoiler

-buffered dash attack (works until mid percents)
-semi delayed dash attack (basically just long enough in order to get the spacing for tipper dash attack on certain characters. it's still gotta be really fast just not buffered. however this may not work on light/floaties)
-On PS1 in that mining pit we have a bthrow cg that can work up to 82% on some characters (i've only done this to like DDD and snake in game so idk how long this works on anyone really. it lasts a long time)
-down smash on kirby (this may work on others but it is untested)

weak bair in the air>

Spoiler

-another weak bair
-crit bair (at really high percents this may not work on light/floaties like pika or kirby or some ****)

fast falled auto cancelled weak hit bair

Spoiler

hitting on the back hitbox (the easy one to land):
-fsmash
-standing buffered pivot grab
-standing buffered pivot dsmash
-Angel Ring
-utilt (based on placement)
-and if you get really luckay with their DI or whatever leads to this every great once in a while this will combo into the spike dtilt which can combo into into a strong bair

hitting with that hitbox that is kinda in front but more inside pit (the really hard one to land):
-utilt
-jab
-fsmash
-dsmash
-usmash
-grab
-AR
-dtilt (every great once in a while this will combo into the spike dtilt which can combo into jumping kinda through them into a strong bair and nair)
-nair

note there is a chance that these won't work at higher percents, but idk as i can't test it atm

specific characters that can be bthrow>dsmash at 0% that we don't have something better with fthrow guaranteed on

Spoiler

kirby
wario
olimar

lagless glide attack combos

Spoiler

utilt at low-mid low percents

maybe jab (it works for me usually but idk if it's true)

Here is the generic this worked on mario testing for yall.

Spoiler

Back throw>dash attack:
mario up to 15%

back hit of dsmash>fsmash
mario up to 34% without stutter step
with buffer stutterstep up to 40%

back hit of dsmash>pivot jab
on mario up to 34%

back hit of dsmash>pivot dsmash
on mario up to 25%

back hit of dsmash>hyphen usmash
on mario up to 47%

back hit of dsmash> utilt and pivot utilt
on mario up to 15% (must pivot at 14%)

back hit of dsmash>standing pivot grab
on mario up 30%

weak bair in the air>footstool works

weak bair in the air>crit bair works

fast falled weak bair on mario> (the back part)
fsmash
pivot dsmash
pivot jab
hyphen usmash
standing pivot grab
utilt

Front part
all of the above without pivot
nair
mayb dtilt (can't tell without a person)

out of dtilt spike on mario (all done at 0%)
fsmash
crit bair
dair
nair
grab (only if he pops in front of you)
hyphen
barley step forward utilt only if he pops in front of you






none of this is confirmed without an actual person to test it on but these all seem incredibly legit

alright guys. i just need to know character specific stuff that you don't see listed here and such. k? (also i don't know what percents these stop working so your gonna have to figure that out yourselves fools)

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

hell i even listed all the stuff that i happen to know just from experience and such

edit:

also when we think we have all of these done it would be cool someone could either make one youtube video with everything in it or a youtube video for each combo category displaying which combos are general true combos and the character specific ones in said video(s)

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

Back throw>dash attack:
mario up to 15%

back hit of dsmash>fsmash
mario up to 34% without stutter step
with buffer stutterstep up to 40%

back hit of dsmash>pivot jab
on mario up to 34%

back hit of dsmash>pivot dsmash
on mario up to 25%

back hit of dsmash>hyphen usmash
on mario up to 47%

back hit of dsmash> utilt and pivot utilt
on mario up to 15% (must pivot at 14%)

back hit of dsmash>standing pivot grab
on mario up 30%

weak bair in the air>footstool works

weak bair in the air>crit bair works

fast falled weak bair on mario> (the back part)
fsmash
pivot dsmash
pivot jab
hyphen usmash
standing pivot grab
utilt

Front part
all of the above without pivot
nair
mayb dtilt (can't tell without a person)

out of dtilt spike on mario (all done at 0%)
fsmash
crit bair
dair
nair
grab (only if he pops in front of you)
hyphen
barley step forward utilt only if he pops in front of you






none of this is confirmed without an actual person to test it on so it's not going in the OP but these all seem incredibly legit

 

[Kuro~]

I can help with this.

But only in training =/

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

cool kuro. i eventually wanna be character AND percent specific so this is long term and would love the help.

also i tested on lvl 9 coms the bthrow>dsmash thing. kirby WARIO and OLIMAR. weird and not test with humans but it's all i got atm so i added it to the OP

 

[Admiral Pit]

Well normally I wouldn't be able to contribute, but I tend to like using the B-throw CG on the PS1 rock place whenever the opportunity strikes. As with many CG-type stuff, the timing and % range changes depending on the character and their weight. I tend to use U-smash to finish things up, though haven't tried against most chars, I believe you should use said U-smash on lightweights at 55-60% and heavyweights just about 70%. Don't expect this to be dead on either, as I'm assuming.
And make sure not to pummel, for staling the B-throw is what makes this effective.

Honestly, use your judgment depending on how high they're going up as you rack up damage with the B-throw CG. Opponents may DI up during this, so keep an eye out so they won't be out of your grab range, and you may choose to either finish it off with a U-throw or U-smash. For some of the larger heavier chars, you might be able to use F-smash instead for a quick +19% damage, but again, keep an eye on how high they go so they don't DI away.
I wouldn't say that I'm right, as I haven't tested it on everyone, not that everyone would fall for it anyways, but I just went with what my instinct told me. It shouldn't matter too much since how often are you gonna get such an opportunity? That doesn't mean that you shouldn't know though.

At the same time, I want to be shown a bit of what you mentioned bout the B-throw and 2nd D-smash hit thing, and maybe I can make use of it.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

I'm pretty sure Sdi could mess with most of this.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

jimmy for one you cant sdi a throw. second of all sdi affects every true combo in the game that isn't throw based so you cant take it into account. regular DI sure but not sdi. hell i've SDI'd falco's jab trying to go behind like i usually do and on accident it pop me up onto the down tilted side of the platform at YIB. SDI can't be taken into account for the same reason that pit mains still use fsmash and for the same reason falco's use jab. it's more rewarding to assume they will mess up their chance to sdi since they usually will as they probably don't study pit's true combos (seeing as how we didn't for a long time either) than it is to not go for them


also i just realized i need a section for lagless glide attack combos as well. time to edit the OP and add something else to be studied.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

so wait all of these things are stuff you can do after a throw? (I know you can't SDI throws)

 

[Luckay4Lyphe]

Is it really a true combo if people can escape via sdi

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

well is marth's first hit nair>dtilt really a true combo if you can sdi it? technically no but you what it works so much more than it doesn't that it is still good to use. same with this stuff.

i know for a fact that most people never sdi when i do back hit of dsmash>fsmash at the lower percents. free damage is free damage guys

@jimmy

no. only the stuff listed under a section that says it is out of a throw are out of a throw 0.o

also idr if i mentioned it already but im pretty sure we can bthrow>dsmash kirby oli and wario if that matters to anyone seeing as how we have nothing out of fthrow on those guys. would like it tested on people but like i said all i got is lvl 9 coms

 

[Kuro~]

I wouldn't really suggest doing that against wario but i'll check it out after mid-terms.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

well if you get the grab at 0 and he aint on a slant why wouldn't you take free damage? also yes human testing is a must! coms aren't smart enough to be consistent.

 

[Kuro~]

Upthrow to cover landing would be better. Or dthrow for the same effect. Or fthrow to upsmash. Still gonna test it.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

added the cg ratio stuff

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

this is a bump

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

i added generic mario testing to the OP

 

[Jimmyfosho]

where the hell do you guys get these title names... LOL

edit: should probably start with characters that are viable.. just saiyan

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

1

i had kuro edit in the title. the original title was "kuro give this a fancy name, the pit true combo compendium

2. mario is considered the overall average for weight, fall speed, and size. so it's easy too assume if it works on him it works on most characters lighter than him and all characters heavier than him for the most part.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

bump dat *** and remind kuro to put this in the one stop pit thread and to take out the CG thread since this has it in here as well

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

giga bump nnnn

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

yo guys can someone test some combos on characters not named mario plz?

 

[Kuro~]

How should we test? I don't have anybody to help me so if u know a way i can do it w/o that lemme know.

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

i just did it in training mode and assumed no DI-through moderate-DI and recorded as such. if you can get a partner tho more power to you. if someone could record everything WOI-OOS cancels ill add that too.

 

[Luckay4Lyphe]

theoretically Woi-oos can cancel any ground move as long as the hit box frames line up with the windbox frames. I've seen it cancel Snake ftilt1 to Angel Ring to Tornado to Marth's fsmash. There is usually nothing guaranteed to cancel (that I know of) except on our own Angel Ring because that has continuous hitbox properties that grind shields. It works on grounded nado guaranteed too, but Mk users won't use a grounded nado lol.