Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

General question. Who feels that Falco's Bair is his best KO move. Even more so than Usmash? I feel it's so easy to hit people with the move. If only it was never so staled or actually connected with the strongest hit.

 

[-DR3W-]

Spelled "question" wrong in the title...

 

[-DR3W-]

General question. Who feels that Falco's Bair is his best KO move. Even more so than Usmash? I feel it's so easy to hit people with the move. If only it was never so staled or actually connected with the strongest hit.

I wouldn't say best but not a bad choice vs some characters. It's better imo to just use it as a damage-racking move than depending on it for the kill.

 

[Ares]

Spelled "question" wrong in the title...

no, "qusestion" is spelled right in the title.

 

[Vlade]

The great thing about bair is that it can be thrown out quite safely, very unlike usmash and fsmash. It's still kind of hard to hit with any of falco's kill moves but just requires a bit of prediction usually.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Spelled "question" wrong in the title...

Excuse me? I don't see anything wrong with the title.

 

[-DR3W-]

Excuse me? I don't see anything wrong with the title.

I'm sorry miss, I must be mistaken.

 

[The_SMILE]

I was just wondering if we have a nice little nest of information about Falco's jab cancel around the boards somewhere? Like things to cancel into, and if it's a true combo or not? It'd be nice to see more Falco's using it as beautifully as Dehf does.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

nothing is true combo except into jab 3, snake can utilt falco out of any attempts to cancel.

 

[DEHF]

Snake can't utilt you out of jab cancels if done perfectly. No one has done frame data on it, but the frame disadvantage that Falco has from it is probably very small.

 

[The_SMILE]

So is the input just A, A, down repeat? As fast as possible? And why aren't more Falco's using it?

 

[Ares]

I think many people get in the habbit of Jab>Grab or AAA..but canceling is a very good mixup.

 

[teluoborg]

Jab>Ftilt>Jab>Ftilt is a very funny thing to do at low %.

Also qusestion : I've been playing a MK the other day and when he went Dair camping over my head I could FHNair OOS between his Dairs. Consistently. Is it legit or was the MK doin it rong ?

 

[Choice]

Snake can't utilt you out of jab cancels if done perfectly. No one has done frame data on it, but the frame disadvantage that Falco has from it is probably very small.

someone should examine the frame data so we can milk it for all its worth.

 

[Ares]

Snake Utilt: Hitbox comes out at frame - 6

Falco Jab:

Hits on: 2
Shield hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
1st jab total: 16
1st jab advantage: -13
2nd jab hits on: 10 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -7 (opponent has 7 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)



​

 

[da K.I.D.]

that list does not have hitstun frames on it...

@teluoborg, i nair bair and even some times upair mk inbetween dairs, its hard but Im pretty sure its possibly consistently even when the mk isnt doing it wrong. Falco jumps really high, really fast.

 

[DEHF]

bair is much better vs. MK's dair camping. Nair is okay if you only hit with one or two hits, you tr y to hit with all of them MK might SDI out and dair them.

 

[Ares]

Yeah well that's the only frame data I could find on falcos jab

 

[DC.Eden]

Snake Ftilt: Hitbox comes out at frame - 6

Falco Jab:

Hits on: 2
Shield hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
1st jab total: 16
1st jab advantage: -13
2nd jab hits on: 10 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -7 (opponent has 7 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)

​

Snake's ftilt comes out on frame 4.

Unless you meant utilt, which is 6.

 

[Ares]

Snake's ftilt comes out on frame 4.

Unless you meant utilt, which is 6.

Yeah fixed.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I believe I recall there being many mechanical aspects of Brawl that Falcos are quiet ignorant in.

The technology exists to map out our hitbubbles and hurtbubbles. We can even rip out frame data and knockback values from the game. However, I have come to the conclusion that either all Falco mains are either too lazy, or not tech savvy enough operate anything more than a shiny ball of blue sparks and a little BB gun that shoots pretty blue colors.

Where are our tech savvy people when you need them ;_;

 

[Ares]

If i knew how, i'd prolly gather some data.

 

[AndGravy]

Tommy G seems to be the most tech savvy person who frequents the falco boards.

How do you charge Bdacus? Instead of c-stick up twice, c-stick once and then up control stick + attack/grab?

I'm probably going to dive into the horrors of learning it sometime soon so I can show off to my buddies. Maybe attempt it after dthrow when messing up won't be too serious.

 

[Vlade]

I'm not a huge fan of the science of the game, I just play

The only reason I look at frame data is to see if certain moves CAN be punished by 'x' attack. Sometimes it isn't practical though (i.e. you have to be frame perfect) and it's better to opt for a punish like ftilt/jab.

 

[dainbramage]

Snake Utilt: Hitbox comes out at frame - 6

Falco Jab:

Hits on: 2
Shield hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
1st jab total: 16
1st jab advantage: -13
2nd jab hits on: 10 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -7 (opponent has 7 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)



​

That is advantage ON SHIELD.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

That is advantage ON SHIELD.

This.

Also, if any character DI's/SDI's down, they pretty much can break free of our jab cancels, but if we do the full jab it takes longer to get out.

Additionally, we do have our hitbubbles up.

 

[Ares]

Yeah well that's the only frame data I could find on falcos jab

This.
10lackofdata

 

[hippiedude92]

how do you get fight against a smart MK who knows how to tornado spam smartly?

luigi has like no options against it and is completely shut down by it

so i always have falco for when the situation arises

esp hard when they tornado and then cover themselves with a shuttle loop =(

halp pl0xersz

 

[Excellence]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=285659

It's more of just centering your game around a few things. There is a lot involved with a competitive mindset, for example, predictions, conditioning, how to punish certain things, when to punish, when to bait, when to attack, when to retreat, how to punish, how to follow up, etc.

PM me if you want to see my mixup chart to help get your mind started in the right direction(page 3 I left a post saying that everyone that wanted to take a look at it to PM me, check it out.)

I know all this. I'm pretty experienced player-wise but as far as Falco experience, I don't have much. I'm asking how to apply these things to Falco.

 

[Tommy_G]

Snake Utilt: Hitbox comes out at frame - 6
+7 shield drop frames=13 frames OoS
Falco Jab:

Hits on: 2
Shield hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
1st jab total: 16
1st jab advantage: -13
2nd jab hits on: 10 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -7 (opponent has 7 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)

You forgot shield drop frames. ;-)

To charge the bdacus, hold Z at the same time as the second hit on the Cstick or hold L/R if you have one of those set to attack.

Excellence, I'll post a response to that later(I'm in class. lolz.) I don't mean to insult your intelligence if it's what it seems like. Just looking out for anything to help.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I have been thinking of stealing some ideas from other boards, improving upon them and posting them on the falco boards (i.e. interview thread. Maybe some of the older threads like counterpicks, etc.). We had a lot of community projects going on back in the day. Since I do not really have access to play someone except a couple times a week, I have a lot more free time to be able to manage all this little community projects. I was just wondering if how interested people would be in starting these? The question board sort of tanked it seems. I could revive it, but...

This.

Also, if any character DI's/SDI's down, they pretty much can break free of our jab cancels, but if we do the full jab it takes longer to get out.

Additionally, we do have our hitbubbles up.

Where do we have the hitbubbles up?

That's the case with all of falco's cancels. They are all punishable in someway. I have been running into the problem of people smartening up to mash jabs as soon as they are in front of Falco. They expect the jab cancels all the time, I need to start mixing up other things apart from jab cancels.

 

[Omni]

how do you get fight against a smart MK who knows how to tornado spam smartly?

luigi has like no options against it and is completely shut down by it

so i always have falco for when the situation arises

esp hard when they tornado and then cover themselves with a shuttle loop =(

halp pl0xersz

edit: oh i thought u were asking for luigi advice.

im a smart mk that uses tornado. what pisses me off when i play Falco's is when they stick to their guns and choose not to approach with anything other than lasers and well placed full hop aerials (b-air usually) to stop my air camping. so keep a few things in mind:

- when u see a MK d-air camping and he's starting to run out of jumps ALOT of MK's end their last jump with tornado. make sure you're positioned somewhere on the stage where you can punish tornado during this time i.e. don't stand right near the ledge or nado will push you off

- if an MK nado's and runs away with the nado to do a safe landing CHASE them even if you can't safely punish them. watch how MK's react when they come out of tornado and you're chasing. do they roll? sidestep? up+b? pay attention to this and respond accordingly after conditioning them into showing their habits once or twice.

- pay attention to %'s. when MK isn't in cg range anymore he'll opt to be more grounded. even tho he's out of cg % he's still at a disadvantage so dont let MK's feel comfortable with keeping their feet planted

- if you sense a tornado coming be prepared to shoot the nado. usually causes most MK's to overb but if you're dealing with a vet MK then he should be making sure not to angle his nado when a laser is coming so that he goes right back into another nado

thats all i can think of for now

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Best sig everrrrrrr


Use search~

 

[Choice]

if nado is too close to laser just jump over it or reflector.

 

[Tommy_G]

or shield it.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

or qcdi up and towards the center of nado and mash air dodge.

 

[Excellence]

You forgot shield drop frames. ;-)

To charge the bdacus, hold Z at the same time as the second hit on the Cstick or hold L/R if you have one of those set to attack.

Excellence, I'll post a response to that later(I'm in class. lolz.) I don't mean to insult your intelligence if it's what it seems like. Just looking out for anything to help.

Thanks Tommy. I really didn't take it that way. I know you're trying to help me.

 

[hippiedude92]

waaaaaaaaah.

thanks omni

u da bomb =D

and homies to :D

 

[Player-1]

does falco have a windbox on his jab? I have never heard of that until someone told me that they thought he did, but I haven't ever heard of it.

 

[clowsui]

@p1 yeah he does