BBR Recommended Rule List v2.0 & General Ruleset Discussion

[John12346]

My taste for banning MK or the community switching to Balanced Brawl are almost equal, but I still would take Balanced Brawl anyday.

Rationale Behind BBrawl
Because core mechanics are still in place, such as hitstun, gravity, etc, it's still essentially Brawl at its heart. A very generous amount of work went into balancing all of the matchups, AND it removes things like chaingrabs, jab locks, dumb grab release things on Wario, Squirtle, Ness and Lucas and PLANKING is removed. YES, PLANKING IS DEALT WITH IN BALANCED BRAWL; you automatically get back up on the stage after 5 ledgegrabs.

Removal of Planking <-- This is important!
Removal of Jablocks
Grab release animations are sped up, so characters prone to grab release shenanigans are safe.
Chaingrabbers like Dedede set up tech chases on all characters, and SPIKE people at the ledge.
ICs have stronger throws, but no more infinite.
Falco's Dthrow puts the enemy far enough away to avoid regrabs, but close enough to get Usmashed.

And of course, MK's nerfed.

I'm sure you can appreciate my enthusiasm for Balanced Brawl, as it not only handles the MK problem, but also takes care of other dumb mechanics of the game.

Rationale Behind MK Ban
This almost favorable choice lags behind my BBrawl suggestion by just a little. VERY LITTLE. With obscene tourney results, horridly skewed matchup ratios, very safe ingame options, planking, and only ONE bad stage in FD(which gets stricken/banned by him anyway), flat out removal of him is also a legit choice. I'm not really sure about what the vote is on him in the BBR, and I don't think we're gonna be seeing results anytime soon. Anyway...

On that note, I'd like to know the BBR's current stance on switching to Balanced Brawl as the competitive standard of the game. Also about the MK ban and ISP. Info like that would prove useful.

 

[-Vocal-]

I don't like a lot of what you just said. Falco and DDD without chaingrabs? ****, ICE CLIMBERS without chain grabs!? Why on Earth would we nerf these characters when they're fine as is!? Not to mention Ice Climbers without chain grabs puts them in E tier guaranteed, and they don't deserve that.

I do get what you're saying though; you prefer BBrawl. I do not think the benefits outweigh the negatives.

 

[Spelt]

hacked versions of brawl will never become the standard, people should stop whining about it because it's wasted energy.

Not to mention Ice Climbers without chain grabs puts them in E tier guaranteed

hardly.

 

[-Vocal-]

Ok, I exaggerated, but without chain throws they definitely aren't top tier anymore. And yes, I agree about hacked Brawl versions.

 

[John12346]

Actually, ya'll are prolly right about hacked Brawl not becoming the standard... that might've been a bit naive of me. The only reason I suggested it was due to it's ease of application; just insert SD card, go to Stage Builder, and you're ready to go. I guess... that is a bit too drastic of a change.

Anyway, I can still imagine an MK ban or ISP happening, but there are far too many extremists out there who think Brawl is currently fine as it is and doesn't need change.

 

[-Vocal-]

Where are BPC and Jack at? Neither of you has responded to my last response to you two; I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

 

[John12346]

I'd be interested to hear from a representative about the entire BBR's stances on the MK ban, ISP, or even induction of a hacked version of Brawl(Plus, Minus, or Balanced).

I'd be really interested to see what the concentrated lump sum of TOs' opinions on all three matters are.

 

[-Vocal-]

I can tell you that the Backroom will never support hacked Brawl; there's no need for it. I can also tell you that ISP will never (or at least not ANY time soon) become part of the standard ruleset. And no one in the backroom will ever tell you what the backroom members think of the MK ban; you can search the members separately and scour their posts if you really wanted to know each member's opinion.

But give up on hacked Brawl versions becoming standard and just play them for fun.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Where are BPC and Jack at? Neither of you has responded to my last response to you two; I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

At a party, getting stupidly drunk and disappointingly not-laid.

You mean this one? If my answer is subpar, it's because I still have a ****load of C2H5OH in me.

I should have worded my post better.

First, a side note: as far as your stage example, the game does offer a random stage switch that allows you to turn stages off. Why would the developers put anything more than that in? It's the same as the item switches.

That affects random stage selection. If you're going to select at random. We don't. Again, he's not giving us any options to say "here's your way to permanently turn this stupid stage off"; I still occasionally misclick onto summit or 75m.

Main point: I am not speaking about adding or removing anything to or from the game of Brawl. I am speaking about adding or removing things to and from the competitive Brawl scene. I don't care what's on the disc; I'm talking about what is currently used in competitive Brawl tournaments. That means that if Big Blue isn't a part of the tournament ruleset (it isn't) and we were to start using it in the future, we would have to ADD it to competitive Brawl. Now do you understand what I'm saying?

So competitive brawl is a far different game from normal brawl, and therefore it should not be related to what's on the disc beyond "don't use hacks"? Because brawl does not share the quality of many other fighters where you can just unwrap and play it competitively without changing anything, we should not follow the baseline of competitive gameplay of "remove as little as possible from the game"? I understand what you mean better when you say "add" but I disagree with it.

To quickly rehash my argument using this wording if you'd rather not read my earlier post in this light: competitive Brawl does not have items. You would like to make a drastic change to competitive Brawl by adding items to balance it. How is this any better than removing MK from competitive Brawl, which is another drastic change that would also achieve a greater level of balance in the game?

Makes sense. I think Jack will probably be able to answer this better though lol

 

[-Vocal-]

"Competitive Brawl" is a ruleset, more or less. It isn't the game being played; it is a ruleset applied to that game, to which rules can be added or removed. When you look at it this way, you can either add items to the ruleset or remove MK from it; both are a way of making the gameplay that arises from that ruleset more balanced, and my opinion is that it makes more sense to remove an aspect of gameplay than to force everyone to learn entirely new strategies for the sake of balance. I do have an amount of sympathy for MK mains in that if he ever is banned they will have to learn entirely new characters, but this would not be a good enough reason to keep him.

Then again, one could hypothesize that if MK was banned that a large part of the community would fall off and die, which is a valid concern. So the issue goes deeper than just balance, but still; I'd ban MK before adding items.

And maybe you'll have more to say once the hangover wears off; sorry to hear you didn't get any tonight, but that's life sometimes ^_^

 

[Jack Kieser]

Yeah, sorry I haven't posted, dude; I was taking a break from the boards due to some... family-crisis stuff. Suffice it to say, it's been a BAAAAD week IRL. T_T What post did you want me to respond to? You can just PM me a link to the post, instead of wasting a one-line post in here.

...bust since I don't want to waste a post, I'll try writing a little something here in response to your last post. I'd disagree with your premise that "Competitive Brawl" is a ruleset. It's MUCH more than a ruleset, and in fact, I'd wager that competitive Brawl, as a concept, doesn't even rely on our ruleset. Competitive Brawl essentially existed day one, because all you need from something to be competitive is for competition to be happening. It's kind of like saying that I'm a person because of my witty T-shirts. I may be defined in some peripheral way by the clothes I wear, but I was a person long before that, and I can be a person regardless of changes in my clothes.

EDIT: I feel your pain, BPC; thanks to my vacation, I haven't seen my GF in over a month. It sucks.

 

[-Vocal-]

T_T

Ok, then let me put it this way: our current ruleset is what I mean when I refer to "Competitive Brawl." Whenever I use the term "Competitive Brawl," I am referring to the standard ruleset. We could call it "Code Banana" if you like

I know that rules are tweaked and stage lists are changed due to TO preference. That withstanding, the majority of rules remain the same, and it is this core that is most important.

And I'm sorry to hear that you're going through some things right now. Take all the time you need; I'll still be here to debate whenever

 

[Pierce7d]

I have no official statement about the BBR's stance on alternative rulesets, but the BBR recommended ruleset is the one that we endorse for competitive play, so since we suggest that items are set to off and none, etc, you can assume that we don't endorse ISP, etc.

 

[Jack Kieser]

Hey, can we discuss the v3.0 ruleset yet? Because that would be awesome.

 

[-Vocal-]

When is it supposed to be released? Same time as the new tier list?

 

[T-block]

BBR Recommended Ruleset 3.0 released:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=282811