BBR Weekly Character Discussion #18: Peach

[C.S. Dinah]

Natural talent....

Peach is somewhat conprehensive to use effectively, we just need to work harder into getting more this character.

 

[LanceStern]

Triple checked, and it's completely random once it gets to an item pull. Each chance has a scalar multiplier of 1, which means it has a 1/X chance of happening, and since there are 4 items, each item has a 1/4 chance of being pulled.

Your luck streak just so happens to be that Stitches and Saturns are more common.

It's odd because the numbers say completely random if you triple checked it, but what happens in every one of my matchups is that stitchfaces and mr. saturns are 100% more common than beamsword and bobomb.

100% more common

he question is - are these characters simply more viable than Peach because Person A have proven they can beat MK with Character X/does this mean that Peach isn't winning because she is unviable because her match up with MK is actually so much more dreadful than people say or does it mean that Peach does not have a player of a similar skill to Person A/have a player who is skilled enough to take out these top MK's, which has been done by other characters? You could argue it both ways I guess

That's a good question. Are these crazy good players placing high because their characters are more viable (have a better matchup than Peach vs. MK), or because the players are better? Honestly I think they are still better than us Peach players (Edreese was our "hero" no over-flattery intended).

At the same time you can ask another question: are those characters less common/underestimated so top MKs don't understand the matchup enough to win? Not to mention the traits KBizzle mentioned (fastfalling, even an average airdodge, reliable KO power) that Peach misses dearly?

 

[z00ted]

We don't suck, noone has just got on that "level" yet.

 

[deepseadiva]

...because we suck.

Lol. "We don't suck! We just don't win anything or do anything notable!"

 

[Xyless]

We don't suck, noone has just got on that "level" yet.

That's...the equivalent of sucking, isn't it?

 

[Nicole]

meno, i entirely agree with you. however, certain people can't be told that they suck...egos are too big.

also, yeah, NO ONE who plays peach is on the level of the top mks. we have NO m2k, anti, dsf, etc etc. and NO ONE can claim otherwise. if -you- think you're as good as one of those guys....wow. i know we have some cocky peach players, but thinking you're that good would be crossing the line of common sense.

 

[C.S. Dinah]

Anyone know how we can get to that level?

Or is Peach doomed to the likes of MK?

 

[z00ted]

It's not like we haven't been "talking" about it.
I'm done with talk though, I think we just need to get out and play top players more often.

 

[Eddie G]

Disregard this post please.

 

[lloDownedu74]

I think Peach has a lot of potential, but she is limited by the abundance of MK's, Snakes, Falcos, and other bad matchups. If someone can completely revolutionize Peach's style enough so that her bad MUs are less horrible for her, then we should start seeing some results soon. However, until then, everyone still has a lot to improve on =/

 

[Dark 3nergy]

having talked to a peach main about some of her AT's...lol i got pretty over whelmed. Potential yea i think she has plenty. But her inability to kill is such n eye sore -_-

when it comes to a character like peach, esp at high level play gotta have that undying love in devotion to her to keep her going. Thats something i can respect to, peach mains that keep playn and fighting the good fight

I wanna point out that how skilled the Peach player is is important. as with the skill of the meta player does not matter to much since it is meta.

heheheheh @ dis

thx for keepn me entertained at apex by showing your turnip off infront of da live stream camera

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I wanna point out that how skilled the Peach player is is important. as with the skill of the meta player does not matter to much since it is meta.

Peach players not doing anything in big tournies, placing high in tournies in thier area but not beating anyone note worthy. Or losing to people/characters that they should be beating.

And the reason for this is cause Peach players are not that good as players. You can have a knife and I have a gun. If I have no clue how to shoot, You are beating me with a knife.

Ganon Vs Meta. Even with how meta carries people (Read Kzissles blog on AiB on this, lot of truth in it) If the meta does not know how to use him and the ganon is a beast of a player in general, Ganon is gonna be all over meta.

No Peach player right now is on a level of the pro players we have today. No one. They can get close to winning but does not happen cause

- It's meta knight (oh winning with meta, who cares really......it's freaking meta) or any other hard match up

- Emeny is pro status or just plain better

- Peach players have yet to achive that level

- And to be they way people play her now, they limit themselves hard.

So if you think. I dont care how one can know thier character, if you are not as good as the enemy, all you gonna get is "almost won, cant win"

Character match ups are not the only part of it. Player skills takes into account. and it seems alot of people tend to forget this so much. I have been through stuff where a person would go meta on me cause it is meta and he knows he won't beat me with others. Yet I still win. Cause I am smarter, and all this dude did was rely on tiers to beat me.

Peach players now are like medicore at best. None are on pro level. None abuse and master all she can do, which needs to happen, thus I say they limit themselves.

X, San, Fow, Sharky. They place well and high at big tournies with thier character. Reguardless of dumb *** match ups. Why, cause they are on pro status as players. And just applied that to thier characters. And abuse fully what they can do. Peach has more options then these characters and is better. yet Peach players cant even make it out of bracket in big tournies. The skill of the player also players a big part. nit just tier whoring and things that is all it takes. Thinking like that is straight dumb. And something people need to realize already. The names I gave are a prime example of this.

So in short, yea the fact that Peach players are not on the same level of thought and skill actually plays a big part to her performance and how she is seen as a character. And people tend to ignore this so they come out on stop and seem like they are write about stuff they say. Think people need to understand the true meaning of the word skills. And what it takes to be good with a character. And as a player in general

meno, i entirely agree with you. however, certain people can't be told that they suck...egos are too big.

also, yeah, NO ONE who plays peach is on the level of the top mks. we have NO m2k, anti, dsf, etc etc. and NO ONE can claim otherwise. if -you- think you're as good as one of those guys....wow. i know we have some cocky peach players, but thinking you're that good would be crossing the line of common sense.

I can't disagree more strongly with you guys. Lots of Peach players have been as good as players like Boss, Shakey, etc on a "skill" level with the game sort of base.

It's funny you guys come to that conclusion. It's based completely off opinion. For example, I can point to tournament results, that suggest since more top level Ness, Luigi, DK, and Ike mains can beat top levle MK mains, it suggests, with real results, that Peach has a worse matchup vs MK compared to these characaters.

When you guys say that Peach mains don't have players who are as skilled as characters of these mains, it's honestly just pulled out of your ***. Do you have any data, reasoning to support this? There have been plenty of Peach mains who have been highly skilled. I find it offensive that you guys would say this is the reason.

When I was playing this game, I would consistently beat a lot of players in tournament who WERE able to beat players like M2K That suggests that I was on a high enough skill level as these other character mains yet these character mains could beat MK which I couldn't really do.

The same applies now. A lot of Peach mains can beat players like Boss, Shakey etc. Yet Peach mains can never beat MK players like M2K, Dojo, Tyrant. yet Boss and Shakey type players can. Do you see what the actual evidence suggests?

Put your emotions and heart aside and look at the reality of what is happening in tournaments all across the world. Peach mains are good enough to beat highly skilled players, but not highly skilled MKs, and yet, these other highly skilled players can beat those same MK's. There is a reason for this, and that reason is that her matchup with MK is a much more up hill battle than it is for most characters who are around her position on the tier list.

 

[Eddie G]

THANK YOU, Edrees. I couldn't have said it any better myself, although I'm glad you did since people would actually take your post seriously as an objective post.

Yes, to the people who've assumed the current Peach players "just suck": you're ignoring the actuality of it all. The only thing that has been shown recently is the uphill battle Peach has against MK as opposed to other characters (who have been previously stated to do better vs MK because they have important attributes that Peach doesn't possess). WE, as players however, are certainly skilled enough to go toe-to-toe with some of the best mains of other characters out there, and have repeatedly shown it in tournament (Me beating Blue Rogue/Malcolm, Kyon beating C@ndy among others, Illmatic beating Trela among others, etc.). The conclusion of our skill level that you guys are coming up with is false. This is part of the lack of a realistic competitive perspective around here that Kyle, Illmatic, and myself have been disgruntled with lately.

Thanks again Reeses cups, I appreciate that post.

 

[Razmakazi]

I kind of think the Peaches can be a lot better but what Edress said does make a lot of sense. I always just kinda felt that the Peaches and people in general don't practice enough and I still do to an extent but I never looked at it this way. I always looked at it as the other mains of other chars are better than the peaches atm rather than the peaches can beat those guys and MK is just dumb. I do think MK is pretty broken as evidenced by the rules we always have to make to restrict his dumbness but it's alright I guess. I just want to master the match-up b/c it's still practical to know in tourney. It'll still make my spacing, my smarts, my mix-ups, my reads and everything a ton more precise and it's rly pushing me to get my ATs down so I know I'm doing everything I can to win. It's alright though.

That being said. I don't think that the current Peaches simply being worse than the better mains of other characters is completely false and that's coz I don't think we rly use all she has to offer. I say we could eaaasily become better with a little more thought and practice. MK is a haaaard MU though but it is what it is I guess, I'm still gonna try to learn it and play it in tourney when I have to.

But honestly though if you guys really think the MU is that bad then just use a secondary. I practice my Snake and I have a pocket pika/fox. I don't rly hear about you guys using your secondaries in tournament and then go on making posts like this. I know that when I post tourney results I specifically state when I gave someone my big heavy snake (hardy har har). But yeah, are there any Peaches that really use their secondaries in tournament? I know Edrees did sometimes (yoshi). Idk if he used Bowser though outside of funsies after ****** pools and to Razer at genesis. It's just that I'm rly a bit tired of hearing about ooooh MK is too hard for Peach and it is a gay MU but wow, then use another character, duh >______<

 

[Meru.]

I somewhat agree with Raz. Im a bit neutral on this matter. What I find is that while we're not bad, we might not be good enough. Like Raz said, we can be better.

This is part of the lack of a realistic competitive perspective around here that Kyle, Illmatic, and myself have been disgruntled with lately.

Not really, that's a whole different thing.

 

[Marc]

I think Peach suffers in a metagame where MK is overrepresented (AKA the American metagame). She's a lot more viable in Europe where MK is used about as much as every other top tier character, at least among the good players. On the other hand the only person close to a "champion" for the character is probably Leon, who tends to use Marth against good MKs and Falcos and might even be more of a Marth main these days.

So yeah, MK screws Peach over a lot, but there are breakout performances for characters who have it a lot worse and secondaries go a long way in compensating for matchup weaknesses.

 

[Eddie G]

Not really, that's a whole different thing.

No, it's not. I'd elaborate on it now but this isn't really the thread to discuss it.

@ Marc- Well said. I've always wondered how the European metagame compares to the character usage of the American metagame but I couldn't exactly tell from just videos alone. Thanks for the insight. I've actually been working really hard on the Marth vs MK matchup because of Mr. R's Marth being my inspiration. The way he just breaks the matchup down in a match is phenomenal.

 

[z00ted]

I totally agree with what Edreese and King Beef are getting at.

I just got into the tournament scene about two months ago and I've constantly been improving so I'll see whether or not later I will want to pick up another character for Metaknight.

I most likely won't though.

 

[Nicole]

i'll never use a secondary for mk, or any other character for that matter. i have tried that route and it only ended with me being a worse -peach- player. now that i've decided to use only her, i feel like i've gotten much better and more confident with her.

of course i see no problem with anyone using secondaries. i just dont feel that peach is inviable in any matchup. i think i can win a tournament with her if i improve more, and i think i will win one eventually (and not a small tournament, or one with not-that-notable of players). i dont think anything is wrong with peach...or wrong -enough- with her to hold back someone who really understands all her ins-and-outs and knows all her matchups very well.

 

[Queen B. Kyon]

I feel see where everyone is coming from. My problem is stamina. Peach gets me so tired XD

 

[Razmakazi]

my problem is idk. i haven't rly had enough tourneys this summer to rly say. i haven't had a chance to test my new style or anything =(

peach doesn't rly get me tired though or anything. i can play her all day just coz she's so fun haha.

and in regards to MK it'd be cool if someone like took down the kill percents + DI for our aerials or sumtin.

it'd make it easier to gameplan for the little ****er if we cud know wut fresh moves will kill and when.

 

[Eddie G]

I feel see where everyone is coming from. My problem is stamina. Peach gets me so tired XD

This.

Nicole, I don't disagree with you on Peach having what it takes to win a decent sized tournament (not a national or anything, and a regional is stretching it LOL), but Kyon is right. I'm sure all of us have had our "in the zone" moments where we would be playing so absolutely well and using just about every option that would benefit us in different situations; but it can be rather mentally exhausting to try and maintain that level of consistency with Peach. It's still possible, but I personally believe that some other characters make it a little easier on the mind to play consistently well with.

I suppose a good example would be Rain occasionally switching from his Falco to his MK just to take a mental break every once in a while (or so many had claimed). Now if a top Falco player finds it necessary to take a break every now and then considering how absolutely strong of a character Falco is, wouldn't that say something about the potential strain that trying to play Peach consistently on a high/near flawless level would have? Have you ever come out of a match against say: a Toon Link, Snake, or MK (or insert tough character for you) that knows the matchup and have felt a little bushed from it, win or lose? I know I have, because Peach has a lot of details to pay attention to, a LOT. Lots of random factors. Lots of spacing (equivalent to the demand that Marth players face imo). Just lots of minimal room for error on everything. It can be tough.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I've always wondered how the European metagame compares to the character usage of the American metagame but I couldn't exactly tell from just videos alone.

The character usage and success in europe is often based on the skill of individual players. Marth isn't a very common character in european tournaments - much less so than in the USA. He is still one of the most successful characters in europe but that's entirely based on the skill of Leon and Mr.R. Overall he is not a common or popular character in european tournaments.

Meta Knight is more succesful and popular than Marc's post implies. More often than not people will claim that Kaos is our only top-level Meta Knight player. This may or may not be the case but that doesn't change the fact that Meta Knight is still overplayed and placing well virually eveywhere except England.
Falco and Diddy Kong are very common and successful in Europe. Almost every country's Power Rankings have one player for each character in the top 5.

All other character's performance are based on the skill of individual players, including Snake, Wario and the Ice Climbers. I could tell you a lot more about character usage here but that would be too much off-topic^^

 

[-Cross-]

The character usage and success in europe is often based on the skill of individual players. Marth isn't a very common character in european tournaments - much less so than in the USA. He is still one of the most successful characters in europe but that's entirely based on the skill of Leon and Mr.R. Overall he is not a common or popular character in european tournaments.

Meta Knight is more succesful and popular than Marc's post implies. More often than not people will claim that Kaos is our only top-level Meta Knight player. This may or may not be the case but that doesn't change the fact that Meta Knight is still overplayed and placing well virually eveywhere except England.
Falco and Diddy Kong are very common and successful in Europe. Almost every country's Power Rankings have one player for each character in the top 5.

All other character's performance are based on the skill of individual players, including Snake, Wario and the Ice Climbers. I could tell you a lot more about character usage here but that would be too much off-topic^^

Who are the good Peach players beside Leon? And which countries are they from? I'm actually interested if you guys have something similar to stereotypes for each country, because Americans tend to group Europeans as just Europe, but what do the individual countries themselves look like from the eyes of a European player?

 

[Meru.]

Who are the good Peach players beside Leon? And which countries are they from? I'm actually interested if you guys have something similar to stereotypes for each country, because Americans tend to group Europeans as just Europe, but what do the individual countries themselves look like from the eyes of a European player?

Zudenka (Austria? Not sure) and Siri (UK) are other notable Peach mains.

About country stereotypes... not really. It is believed that France is the best. After that The Netherlands, Germany, England probably come in no particular order. As far as I know, we accept our metagame as European and not French or Dutch or German etc. Our community is not quite seperated from each other and many players from different countries know each other and get along with each other very well. Our rulesets might have some differences though.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

This may or may not be the case but that doesn't change the fact that Meta Knight is still overplayed and placing well virually eveywhere except England

I've always thought Europe has a much more agressive style of play...well, Leon has a fairly agressive Peach imo
And apart from the 3 Peach's mentioned, there aren't really that any other Euro Peach's to speak of...well, there's you Yaaay

And Gheb, I would be interested to hear about the character usage in Europe (although it would be offtopic I guess)

 

[Meru.]

Im not notable . There are probably very few other Peaches but Leon, Zudenka and Siri pretty much are the notable ones.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I hope you guys don't interpret my post to say that Peach can't beat MK at all. I think if someone out there got really good with Peach, they can beat MK players like M2K and the like. I just think they have to be that much better to do it - ie, it's an uphill matchup. I don't think it's impossible, I just think it's unlikely. There is a world of difference between impossible and unlikely, and that huge difference is the reason we should all train much harder to break out and be good enough. I don't mean to discourage, but rather to encourage - ie, if it's that much of a downhill matchup, we should all train much harder. If it wasn't that hard, we wouldn't have to train that hard. But since it's super super hard, we have to try super super hard. At least that's how I see it (=

Raz - I would use Ness against MK's who took me to weird stages like Rainbow cruise and Delfino. Much later on I tried using Yoshi, but I quickly went back to using Peach. The yoshi thing was because I had fun using him, not because I thought he does better against MK.

 

[Praxis]

Edrees basically said everything I think on the matter.

i'll never use a secondary for mk, or any other character for that matter. i have tried that route and it only ended with me being a worse -peach- player. now that i've decided to use only her, i feel like i've gotten much better and more confident with her.
.

Just throwing in my two cents- learning to play other characters made my Peach significantly better. Other characters require you to develop other skills to survive. Olimar taught me to manage my jumps better, Wario/Marth helped me have better air control, Diddy taught me better item control/instant throwing/item management. In fact, playing Diddy taught me how to fight Diddy.

 

[Nicole]

^ well i definitely know how to play a handful of other characters. i just meant i would never use any of them in tournament. my diddy and zamus are both pretty decent, and my zelda, shiek, and mk are acceptable.

i definitely agree with kyon & kb that peach takes alot of energy and leaves you drained. i was dumb and made that mistake at apex, i played friendlies as my 2nd pool was going on to keep my hands warmed up and moving right, but i think that just made me play more aggressively, which wasn't the best thing to do. i dont get tired with her that quickly, but she definitely takes a good deal out of me, especially against fat chars that dont die.

 

[Razmakazi]

well, if it's that then nicole you don't need to actually play to keep your hands warm. all ya gotta do is just press buttons and dash dance with your unplugged controller n stuff. or at least i hope that works for u in the future.

but yeah edrees i kind of believe a bit of the opposite that none of us are as good as the mains of other chars but what you said pretty much proves it wrong to an extent. but at least it gets to the same **** about having to just try much harder. i know i've been practicing and improving a lot and trying to be good but socal lacks tourneys =(

oh well, i believe XD

 

[LanceStern]

SoCal DOES lack tournies

You going to San Diego 9?

 

[Razmakazi]

nah, gotta celebrate my bday that day lol

 

[Marc]

Meta Knight is more succesful and popular than Marc's post implies. More often than not people will claim that Kaos is our only top-level Meta Knight player. This may or may not be the case but that doesn't change the fact that Meta Knight is still overplayed and placing well virually eveywhere except England.
Falco and Diddy Kong are very common and successful in Europe. Almost every country's Power Rankings have one player for each character in the top 5.

I don't think MK is overplayed for being the single best character. He *might* be in France, but still doesn't get consistent top placings other than K@0s. In the Netherlands there's only one good MK main (Jumpman) and some people who use him as a secondary. The difference in perspective might be because I'm used to Melee where the amount of space animal users (Falco especially) is insane, but whatever the case, our top level metagame is very diverse. I agree with the Falco and Diddy comment, which might very well be why MKs have trouble breaking into the top spots as both of those characters can hold their own against him. I've kept track of the MK debate for a long time and it's a fact he's simply not nearly as dominant over here.

Who are the good Peach players beside Leon? And which countries are they from? I'm actually interested if you guys have something similar to stereotypes for each country, because Americans tend to group Europeans as just Europe, but what do the individual countries themselves look like from the eyes of a European player?

I think it's more clear cut for Melee because there have been a lot more international encounters. The individual countries are kind of isolated for the most part, much moreso than American regions because we also have different languages and people don't travel as much as you guys do. From what I know Americans are much more easygoing about driving a long distance, but the internet at least lets us keep in touch. I think stereotypes mostly pertain to how "gay" the top players of a given country play and there might be some regarding character usage. Curiously, European countries have always been very like-minded regarding rulesets and do look at each other. When compared to the US as a whole, we speak of a European metagame. Europe plays more aggressively I suppose, but it's all relative as Brawl is a very defensive game.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

I don't post my opinions here very often because my Peach is still largely a work in progress, but people
have said encouraging things about it recently so I'm going to offer this: I don't think any match-up with Peach is any worse than 4/6, with the possible exception of MK (which I am still working on; I play Snakeee's MK a lot though and tend to either win or get very close).

I dunno, I think Peach gets ***** hard in the air but is actually pretty OK against MK on the ground and I feel that nado sucks vs Peach. Are the MKs I've vsed not doing it right?

Grounded shuttle loop seems to **** me though. =/

 

[Mikey Lenetia]

I hope you guys don't interpret my post to say that Peach can't beat MK at all. I think if someone out there got really good with Peach, they can beat MK players like M2K and the like. I just think they have to be that much better to do it - ie, it's an uphill matchup. I don't think it's impossible, I just think it's unlikely. There is a world of difference between impossible and unlikely, and that huge difference is the reason we should all train much harder to break out and be good enough. I don't mean to discourage, but rather to encourage - ie, if it's that much of a downhill matchup, we should all train much harder. If it wasn't that hard, we wouldn't have to train that hard. But since it's super super hard, we have to try super super hard. At least that's how I see it (=

This, I agree with, but on the same level I disagree with. There are some breakout Peach players, and more and more frequently others are being added to that list. It's somewhat encouraging to know that we don't have a 'that player' just yet because it makes all of us try that much harder collectively.

HOWEVER. I don't like seeing people saying that there are any. There's a very, VERY good reason behind this, however. Look at all the Peach players. Okay. Now look at the top representatives for most of the others that do have those outstanding players. What we don't have in common with them, especially those in the top spots(tier or otherwise) is that Peach players tend to not travel outside of their region. This means that these stand-out players are putting more time, money, and effort into being as good as they currently are. Until we get someone that can and will do this for Peach, we probably never will have a 'hero' among us. I expected this from the beginning, though. I've said time and again that Peach is most likely the character with the highest learning curve for a reason, and I described that earlier when this was in the back room.

This does not allow us a right to be complacent, though. It just means we'll all have to try that much harder. I, for instance, will have to go to more tournaments again(when I get my car back ;.; ). I'll also have to go to more smashfests again, too. This is just stuff for me. We all have stuff we can and should be doing if we're going to be serious about getting better, and a good amount of us like KB, Illm, Nicole, and Kyon are trying to do this. What time will give to us eventually is anyone's guess, but basically, both sides to the 'do we have outstanding players' stance agree with one another.

We as a community need to try harder to get to where we want to be. ^_^

 

[Nicole]

^ <3 mikey. well said.

 

[Pierce7d]

Eh, I've always thought that Peach was an extremely impressive character, and I have merely one piece of advice for Peach players.

Don't be afraid to make hard reads, just because your character has safe options. A lot of Marth players make this mistake, and it prevents them from evolving.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Don't be afraid to make hard reads, just because your character has safe options. A lot of Marth players make this mistake, and it prevents them from evolving.

This is great advice. Since you mentioned Peach and Marth I'd like to add that both Leon and Mr.R - in my opinion - often go far a "hard" read for many reasons and often successfully so. Relying only on a character's safeness [which seems to be the prefered playstyle in the USA] is never enough to actually beat your opponent. You may be able to keep up with him because you're good at avoiding punishment but at the same time you will never be able to put the opponent in an uncomfortable position, where you can actually put out some major damage. I honestly believe that the japanese, mexicans and europeans are ahead of the majority of the USA [although their top players also understand this concept, obviously] in that regard.
Quite simply, you will not beat a character that surpasses yours in terms of safeness, damage output or punishment if safeness is all you rely on.

I still don't see how Peach is supposed to be impressive - with or without hard reads. If you get a hard read successfully any character can be impressive regardless of his inherent quality [a successfull read from a Ganondorf is a lot more devastating than that of many other characters but that doesn't make him a better character]. I still consider Leon the best Peach even though he rarely uses her in tournament anymore and next to Glutonny he is the master of the "hard read" in europe. Despite all this, he finds increasingly less application for his Peach simply because the character is limited and not very good. He doesn't even use Peach for Diddy Kong anymore after Luigi Player beat him at Bushido [Diddy Kong actually ***** Peach] and that's like the key match-up in Peach's current metagame [in europe at least].

I'm not convinced that Peach is better than C-Tier.

 

[Meru.]

He doesn't even use Peach for Diddy Kong anymore after Luigi Player beat him at Bushido [Diddy Kong actually ***** Peach] and that's like the key match-up in Peach's current metagame [in europe at least].

Lol. I can live with everything else you have said but not this. Peach beats Diddy Kong and Diddy Kong does not **** Peach at all. Peach - Diddy Kong is a 60-40 which is just a slight advantage and far from unwinnable. Just because Leon losed to Luigi Player once doesnt mean Diddy ***** Peach, nor does it mean he has the advantage. Not to mention Leon has beat all of the other Diddys.