Brawl+ Stage Legality Discussion: Brawl+ 7.0 Gold Discussion (Go Discuss Everything!)

[Revven]

The worse part of that wall is that not only does have a semi-spike angle but it does in fact trip you, which is a STUPID amount of punishment for not paying attention to when the wall is going to appear.

 

[FrozenHobo]

do you want the wall gone completely, or just moved farther away from the stage? (assuming i can move it at all)

 

[Revven]

Moving it would be pretty sweet, it would be SOOO much better if the worst amount of space it covered was just on the edge of the left side. Right now, it practically covers almost half of the left side. If you can't move it (and obv can't weaken it) removing it completely would be welcomed for me personally but, I only speak for myself atm.

 

[GHNeko]

Moving it would be better because it spawns over the actual main platform. If it didn't do that, it'd be fine as you wouldnt have to watch for it spawning, you'd just have to make sure your opponent doesnt knock you into it and the wall wouldnt be able to trip you.


EDIT: **** IT FALCO. FFFFFFF

 

[AMKalmar]

FroxenHobo, that's exactly what I did to pokemon stadium 1 weeks ago. Hah.

I've started removing stuff in NPC. It's a long process but it's coming along.

(that square on the right is bugging the **** out of me because i can't move the hinge to cover it up )

I think I can cover that up.

 

[FrozenHobo]

FroxenHobo, that's exactly what I did to pokemon stadium 1 weeks ago. Hah.

good ****, then. i can move on to other stages.

I've started removing stuff in NPC. It's a long process but it's coming along.

through BBox? have you found the bones for the platforms?

I think I can cover that up.

yay! new best friend right here.

 

[MK26]

Stage Hacking: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=260492

Stage Discussion: Here

This thread is about stage list discussion once more. Carry on.

 

[AMKalmar]

There aren't bones for any of the platforms in NPC, I'm hexing it all out. As for PS1, I did that but never uploaded it. I don't even remember if I tested it.

 

[Veril]

The existence of a CP/Banned category is something I've been pushing for. These new stages would likely fall into that category: experimental-competitive.

The way I've been conceptualizing stages lately is:

neutral...er: could be randomly picked for the first match of a set. Right now the most "neutral" stages is PSII, followed by SV.

starter: works fine as the first stage with stage striking.

competitive-conservative: stages that are clearly CP material: they don't overlap CP-wise and have no significant gameplay issues.

competitive-experimental: CP/banned basically, stages that would probably be CP with a more liberal TO or more casual setting (ie. smaller). New hacks generally will fall into this group.
-New Mansion
-Summit+
-future PTAD+

fixer-uppers: stages that I think could be CP with various changes that I've already discussed... Japes for example.

banned due to mu-overlap: see halberd vs. delfino or WWR vs. FD
banned due to mediocrity:
banned for being crap:

The CP/Banned category could potentially be fairly liberal. Thoughts?

 

[MK26]

Halberd vs. Orpheon? I thought it was Halberd vs. Delfino...and brinstar supports sharking, too

there really is no point in a competitive-experimental stage. We test them and either we've fixed tehm, or we haven't. And if we haven't, we'll fix them some more. And it seems to me that, for both Summit+ and Mansion+, they're good. So quitcher*****in and start liking our hacks.

<3 banned for being crap

<3 veril

As long as we don't have a Starter/Cp category (they're either starter or they aren't, people (see Lylat Cruise)) and the Cp/Banned category gets all the way to the end of the liberal side of the spectrum, it's all good.

I also don't think 'fixer-uppers' really has a place in a stage list - it should be based on the present, not the future.

 

[shanus]

Can someone make me a melee FD ;-)

 

[GHNeko]

Okay. Bear with me.

For Skyworld+, a possible remedy for the hitlag abuse. decrease the length of the platform and attach ledges to the clouds, and remove the ledges on the platform.

Thoughts?

 

[Isatis]

shanus, Neko: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=260492

 

[GHNeko]

kfien >:C

Summit+ for CP. >:C

 

[MK26]

summit+ for cp
mansion+ for cp
ptad+ for cp
bio for super mod

any questions?

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

summit+ for cp
mansion+ for cp
ptad+ for cp
bio for godmode admin

any questions?

fix'd
10fix'd

 

[MK26]

making a machine a godmode admin? im fairly sure several movies have been made on that premise. none ended well.

 

[RPGsFTW]

summit+ for cp
mansion+ for cp
ptad+ for cp
bio for super mod

any questions?

I like it.

Can there be a newly made Legal Stage List, please? One that gets updated with any possible good CPs that get made, like Summit+ and what not?

At the moment, my tournament is using 10 stages. 5 Neutrals and 5 CPs, selected by The Cape. I kinda think we need more stages in it.

We have:

Neutrals:
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokeman Stadium 2
Yoshi's Island Brawl

Counter Picks:
Lylat Cruise
Rainbow Cruise
Wario Ware
SSE Jungle
Brinstar

We need more for my stage list, please and thanks.

 

[FrozenHobo]

I like it.

Can there be a newly made Legal Stage List, please? One that gets updated with any possible good CPs that get made, like Summit+ and what not?

At the moment, my tournament is using 10 stages. 5 Neutrals and 5 CPs, selected by The Cape. I kinda think we need more stages in it.

We have:

Neutrals:
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokeman Stadium 2
Yoshi's Island Brawl

Counter Picks:
Lylat Cruise
Rainbow Cruise
Wario Ware
SSE Jungle
Brinstar

We need more for my stage list, please and thanks.

when is your tourney? you can probably add summit+ and PTAD+ to the list, as well as PS1+ v1 (all forms w/ tree/rock shortened and windmill fixed) since we should have it done fairly soon (thank god for hexing).

i've also finished big blue+, but its legality is still up for contention.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Well, I'd prefer it be more "Official"-esque, so no one *****es about it when I say: "Oh, and Summit is now a counter pick stage."

And every Sunday. I post about my experiences in the GSH2 thread.

I'm pretty consistent at getting third place. Second is almost always Fow, and first is SK92.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Sorry for the double post, but I kinda have to if I wanted this to be seen anytime soon.

I made this, in hopes for our new stage legality list, once it's done. I can change this at any time when necessary, but I'm hoping that this looks mostly correct.

Also, I'd like more discussion on what our stage list is gonna look like, because the more I know, the more likely I'll be able to make an accurate chart that I can use for tournaments.

Also, note that a lot of the stages are listed as their future forms, Ex: Summit as a Counter Pick. It can all be changed when necessary.

 

[MK26]

if you're posting that up at your tourney, you should have little '+' symbols beside the changed stages to denote that they're changed

also norfair picto and green greens

 

[Veril]

Nice chart RPG!

MK26: Norfair, Picto and green greens won't be legal without some major changes.

 

[FrozenHobo]

i'm looking at that banned list and i think we can adjust some of those to be more viable.

for instance, pirate ship: remove water, reverse stage, lower canon (for graphical purposes); Green greens: remove blocks/apples/wind, increase side boundaries; GHNeko's MK 1-2 idea; and maybe YI:M+ (i still have to get it working/test it out first).

we also have the possible FZ 2 fix, and if that works, we can move on to doing similar things to SMI and MK. i also have an idea for BoE, but, again, i need to test it.

for now, though, that list looks pretty legit to me.

edit: what edit of SP are you thinking of?

 

[Revven]

RPGs, you're missing WWR and SSE Jungle icons >_>

 

[MK26]

Nice chart RPG!

MK26: Norfair, Picto and green greens won't be legal without some major changes.

havent we had this discussion before?

 

[RPGsFTW]

RPGs, you're missing WWR and SSE Jungle icons >_>

Haha, I need those. Would you happen to have links to the pics? I'd add them.

And sorry for any incorrect things on the chart. I don't plan on using it just yet, as it's a rough draft of what will, hopefully, become the finished stage list.

But yeah, I put the stages where I thought they'd end up, so far anyway. But, of course, I said I'll be sure to change it when the + stages' legal positions are decided upon.

Be sure to use my final version when it's made!

Also, note, I'm no good with any form of art program besides MS Paint, haha. I just steal images and do what I can, in paint, to them myself. This is actually based off of the chart my friend made for Vegas' vBrawl legal stages. He also made a Power Rankings chart, and might make one for our Brawl+ soon!

 

[Deleted member]

Pictochat, Pirate Ship, Bridge of Eldin, Norfair, and Green Greens seem to be the next batch of most viable stages up for salvaging. Although they'd have to be different enough to seize position as a counterpick with unique stage factors...

And no glitches for my stages that havent already been reported as far as I know. :D

 

[RPGsFTW]

Besides me requesting little stage icons for Terrible Online Waiting Room and SSE Jungle, does anybody know if any other SSE stages are getting looked into for Brawl+, or would that not go too well, due to the various shapes and sizes of stages they'd have to cover?

 

[FrozenHobo]

edit: what edit of SP are you thinking of?

still wondering

 

[RPGsFTW]

Are you asking me about Spear Pillar? I don't think what version of it comes up matters, because it's planned to be a Counter Pick either way. So my opinion doesn't matter.

Now me again:

Besides me requesting little stage icons for Terrible Online Waiting Room and SSE Jungle, does anybody know if any other SSE stages are getting looked into for Brawl+, or would that not go too well, due to the various shapes and sizes of stages they'd have to cover?

 

[Alphatron]

^I've been pretty much ignored whenever I suggest SSE stages. But there are a few that I think could work really well.

Instead of removing all the cars from Big Blue and having to endure glitches, the Falcon Flyer SSE stage(where you fight Meta Ridley) works well, albeit being a tad bigger than the Big Blue Falcon flyer. The stage has already been made in Jack Kieser's stage collection topic, but it isn't in the OP.

Also, the grasslands stage made by Eternal Yoshi. Every one of E.Yoshi's stages are posted in the OP for that topic, so check them out. Boundaries have been edited to make more sense and so have spawn points.

The factory interior stage could be used too, as long as the right side was made grabbable. I can't supply any links to these for reference right now, due to the Wii browser not being able to copy/paste.

...Now then, I have to ask because I simply don't see it. What is it about Pirate Ship's layout that suggests it should be used in a competitive environment? What strategies can beperformed on this stage that cannot be performed on any other? Why, after removing pretty much everything about the stage, would the stage even be made counterpick? I personally think it doesn't need to be salvalged.

 

[Dantarion]

It should be salvaged to be playable imo.

If it ends up being another lylat(i.e. it tilts and thats about it) Then to me, thats fine.

 

[FrozenHobo]

pirate ship:

remove water, revers stage (tilts), lower catapult so it doesn't appear when reversed. i almost have this working but i'm still getting some frame skipping when it tilts.

 

[The Cape]

Hobo and MK26

Need those stage files plz

 

[FrozenHobo]

maestro made a pac for the grass PS1. its in the hack thread. unfortunately, mediafire is down so you'll have to wait.

 

[KOkingpin]

Dont you guys think that SSE Jungle is Waaaaaaay too big for 1v1? I think its amazing for a 2v2.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Dont you guys think that SSE Jungle is Waaaaaaay too big for 1v1? I think its amazing for a 2v2.

I do. I think, if anything, that stage just promotes camping in 1v1 due to the many platforms overhead, and the long horizontal distance that you can fly through before you die. I think that Terrible Online Waiting Room is equally bad as well. Stupid sandbad, big ceiling, big death boundaries in general. Neither of them are what I'd think should ever be considered a Counter Pick in a 1v1. As a 2v2 CP, I think they'd be better.

Also, I know that SSE Jungle is very campy because that's all that ever happened there last Sunday, at our Brawl+ tournaments. Since we were limited with a ****ty stage list, 10 stages via Cape's suggestions, one of m friends, a Lucario player, would CP that stage and aura sphere spam, as that's just some of the camping that that stage allows.

And, yes, I agree about some of those other SSE stages. The factory place looked pretty cool, last I checked. Maybe we should start bringing those up in this thread more often. I'm sure that parts of those stages can be removed, just like parts of any other stage. So we should be able to shrink them, and do whatever else, when necessary.

I mean really, some of the stages that are trying to be salvaged hold a LOT less potential than some of the SSE stages. Why aren't they getting looked more into?

 

[Deleted member]

Dont you guys think that SSE Jungle is Waaaaaaay too big for 1v1? I think its amazing for a 2v2.

Yes its too big, but its a counterpick due to its size- like Dreamland64. Jiggly, Samus, and Peach enjoy the stage due to their great recoveries and how hard they are to kill. And 2v2 there is great but I'm not sure how neutral the stage is for 2v2.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

Yes its too big, but its a counterpick due to its size- like Dreamland64. Jiggly, Samus, and Peach enjoy the stage due to their great recoveries and how hard they are to kill. And 2v2 there is great but I'm not sure how neutral the stage is for 2v2.

Except that Dreamland 64 is a neutral... ...making that statement a little of an oxymoron.
WWR is in the process of being shrunk, I believe; but is there anyone attempting to shrink SSE: Jungle by a bit? It doesn't have to be shrunk by too much, but something should be done.