Brawl+ Stage Legality Discussion: Brawl+ 7.0 Gold Discussion (Go Discuss Everything!)

[FrozenHobo]

The rain should be constant. Why the h*** remove the bulborb?! If you get eaten by it, 1... rofl, 2... no Johns. You practically have to try to get eaten by it. Its much less dangerous than most of the hazards on pictochat. The items really aren't a problem. They're bottle caps, you have to use attacks to access them, and they can't really be called random. They only pop up in a few spots and they don't break the game in any way. its not like pokeballs and bobombs are just dropping from the sky. The bottle caps are fine.

I love Distant Planet. CP if the rain gets fixed. Its definitely one of the coolest stages in the game.

i mistyped there. i MEANT keep the bulborb but make it so it doesn't randomly kill people for standing on it. i had a train of thought that didn't quite make it into my post....

 

[Veril]

I'm having trouble understanding why in this list that Jungle Japes is a counter pick while Pirate Ship (frozen) is banned. There is nothing competitive about getting trapped in fast moving water. Any smashfests that I've played Brawl+ in have had Jungle Japes turned off for this reason. Unless they find a way to deactivate swimming, I would have to say that Jungle Japes should be banned. At least the water in pirate ship isn't so fast-moving that you can't escape it.

Seriously? DI right... jump... momentum cancel and return to the stage. Beyond the obvious fact that it isn't inescapable, its always there, nothing random about it. Nothing random about the klaptrap either (it comes every 10 seconds on the 7).

Japes is a-ok.

Pirate ship has the death side of the ship, and combined with water... its pretty silly in B+

i mistyped there. i MEANT keep the bulborb but make it so it doesn't randomly kill people for standing on it. i had a train of thought that didn't quite make it into my post....

Don't stand on the bulborb and wait for it to eat you. Besides that's just about the funniest way to get KO'd in the game.

 

[FrozenHobo]

Don't stand on the bulborb and wait for it to eat you. Besides that's just about the funniest way to get KO'd in the game.

i just see having a harmless bulborb as a way to increase the size of the stage (seeing as how the constant waterfall eliminates a good portion of it).

 

[GHNeko]

I'd prefer Pirate ship to be reversed imo.

Also, Distant planet? Always raining, but slow the stage down by like 30% so that the rain speed is actually manageable.

Big Blue is already slowed down 50% and is definatly CP material.


WW Frozen is WAAAY too small to be a start. It's seriously a CP. Getting killed at 60-70% by a knee WITH GOOD DI is not for starter stages unless you make the stage bigiger.

 

[Sukai]

Is it possible to keep the platforms in Skyworld from breaking? If so, I hope it's implemented, Skyworld would make a charming starter.

Green Hill Zone should be counter pick if Eldin is.
The only reason for it not to be is the checkpoint doing damage, but that's not even a lethal stage hazard. It should be counter pick for at least doubles if nothing else.

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

A few things:

Big Blue reacts weird to being slowed down, does it not? The gravity is absolutely screwy on that stage at half speed.

Doesn't Distant Planet react weirdly to speed changes as well? Or was that just freezing it?

Unbreakable Skyworld arguably has a better cave of immortality than Hyrule.
And the platforms would still be attackable. Toon Link would bounce on a whiffed dair, for instance

Same scenario with GHZ's floor, but add in an awful stage design and campy hazard.

WarioWare's boundaries need a little work on the sides or it needs to be a CP. They are pretty ridiculous.

Norfair is CP material as is.

 

[Asdioh]

BoE is one of my favorite stages so I'm interested in what you think of my idea of opening it up to CP for doubles if the no goblins code is implemented. Even though its a walk off I do see some doubles CP potential.

I mean its not to big for doubles and without CG's there really isn't any gay **** that can go on there except for camping on the edge of the stage which is dangerous in itself.

I remember when I was a n00b at my first tourney, I chose Bridge of Eldin against someone in pools, because I love that stage. People who saw the match were like "lolwut" and I didn't realize it was banned, or why it was banned

Anyway, I agree with you, except for one thing. What exactly is wrong with leaving the stage as-is? I mean, the goblin hazard is very obvious and easy to avoid. It also doesn't do that much knockback or damage, from what I remember. The bomb in the middle is dangerous...so don't stand there.

Is there something wrong with having that big hole in the stage? I don't see it as a problem.

This stage would be amazing in doubles, if Brawl+ has nothing lame that's equivelant to Dedede's chaingrab.

It could also work for singles, but like you said, it's big.

I'd prefer Pirate ship to be reversed imo.

Also, Distant planet? Always raining, but slow the stage down by like 30% so that the rain speed is actually manageable.

Big Blue is already slowed down 50% and is definatly CP material.


WW Frozen is WAAAY too small to be a start. It's seriously a CP. Getting killed at 60-70% by a knee WITH GOOD DI is not for starter stages unless you make the stage bigiger.

When a stage is "reversed" that just means the hazards don't appear, right? I don't really understand why the term is "reversed" since that would make me think the stage is "flipped" but whatever.

Pirate Ship is fun because of the hazards. A guy CPed it against me in pools at my last tourney, and 2 of his 3 stocks were taken from pirate bombs :]

Anyway, I'm undecided on whether or not the Pirate Ship hazards should be taken away.

You can do that with the rain on Distant Planet? That would be really cool. If there's a way to make the Bulborb or whatever it's called not eat people, I think that would make for a really interesting stage. Makes me think of Poke Floats for some reason.

Here's the list of neutrals:

Starter
Battlefield
Final Destination
Luigi's Mansion (Deadlands)
Smashville
Pokémon Stadium 2 (Reversed)
Warioware (Frozen)
Yoshi's Island - Wii

I honestly think Warioware is fine as a neutral, because of the stage striking system.

Is it possible to keep the platforms in Skyworld from breaking? If so, I hope it's implemented, Skyworld would make a charming starter.

Green Hill Zone should be counter pick if Eldin is.
The only reason for it not to be is the checkpoint doing damage, but that's not even a lethal stage hazard. It should be counter pick for at least doubles if nothing else.

I don't know about making Skyworld a starter, but if they make the platforms invincible, I don't understand why it wouldn't make a good counterpick.

I'm not too sure about Green Hill Zone. I'm probably biased because I just dislike that stage -_-


edit:

A few things:

Big Blue reacts weird to being slowed down, does it not? The gravity is absolutely screwy on that stage at half speed.

Doesn't Distant Planet react weirdly to speed changes as well? Or was that just freezing it?

Unbreakable Skyworld arguably has a better cave of immortality than Hyrule.
And the platforms would still be attackable. Toon Link would bounce on a whiffed dair, for instance

Same scenario with GHZ's floor, but add in an awful stage design and campy hazard.

WarioWare's boundaries need a little work on the sides or it needs to be a CP. They are pretty ridiculous.

Norfair is CP material as is.

I agree with most of this.

I haven't heard about the weirdness involved with Big Blue and Distant Planet, but I can imagine. I now remember how the gravity changes a little bit sometimes in Brawl Big Blue.

I don't really understand "cave of immortality" problems, but then again I've never seen it used in a tournament setting.

I agree with you on GHZ ^_^

Again, I don't see what's wrong with a small stage if you can simply stage strike it (WW)

Norfair's fine, yeah.

 

[Sukai]

How would Green Hill Zone be a cave of immorality? The level design isn't the best, but it certainly isn't unplayable. There isn't a plausible reason to ban it from my perspective.

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

How would Green Hill Zone be a cave of immorality? The level design isn't the best, but it certainly isn't unplayable. There isn't a plausible reason to ban it from my perspective.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough, I meant that GHZ's floor will still be attackable if it's frozen or not. Didn't mean to say that it had an immortality cave, although DIing downwards and teching attacks close to the ground in the dip of the stage could prove effective.

Attackable floors are quite bothersome, and tack a tiny bit of extra lag onto any attack when hit. Not a lot, but multihit dsmashes (Peach and Sheik come to mind) and bouncing dairs like Link and Tink's will suffer extra lag for no real reason.

The Checkpoint personally annoys me, as fights on Green Hill seem to be more about racing to hit the checkpoint than fights. The KB on that thing is a bit ridiculous (enough to kill at around 80% next to the edge if I recall) and it's just all around a bad stage for tournaments in my opinion.

EDIT: [My bad, didn't see the other reply >_>; ]

I don't really understand "cave of immortality" problems, but then again I've never seen it used in a tournament setting.

Again, I don't see what's wrong with a small stage if you can simply stage strike it (WW)

Just quickly addressing these points:

It was named for the little cave at the bottom of Hyrule Temple. Basically, you can just DI into the walls/ceiling and tech off of them to ridiculous percentages. This causes matches to go on for a stupid amount of time, and be generally annoying.
Just in case you didn't know.

A badly designed stage is still a badly designed stage if it's stricken. If a stage can be fixed...why not fix it?
This is of course assuming we can reliably adjust the blastlines.

 

[Sukai]

So....are you cool with Green Hill Zone counter pick?

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

So....are you cool with Green Hill Zone counter pick?

I could deal with it. Cool with it I wouldn't say. xD

 

[CloneHat]

Green Greens is a good stage IMO!
It's fun! You can see the bomb blocks coming, so it's your fault if you attack them.

 

[JCaesar]

Green Greens, Corneria, and Yoshi's Island (Melee) would be fine if they were bigger.

Distant Planet would be fine with permanent rain.

Green Hill Zone would be fine without checkpoints.

Wario Ware would be better with wider boundaries.

Pictochat would be better if you could remove a few of the more dangerous transformations.

Jungle Japes would be better without the Klaptrap and Norfair would be better without the fireballs, but they are fine as is.

Bridge of Eldin is fine as is for doubles. It's too big for singles though.

Port Town Aero Dive would be fine with weaker cars.

Skyworld would be fine with a permanent bottom platform and permanently destroyed top platforms.

Hanenbow, Hyrule Temple, Summit, New Pork City, and Spear Pillar will never be ok for competitive play, no matter how you try to fix them, because they promote circle camping by design.

Pirate Ship will never be ok for competitive play because water camping IS a real problem.

This is all IMO of course.

 

[GHNeko]

Green Greens, Corneria, and Yoshi's Island (Melee) would be fine if they were bigger. Agreed.

Distant Planet would be fine with permanent rain. This, but slow the rain down to a manageable speed.

Green Hill Zone would be fine without checkpoints. I'm impartial about the checkpoints, though I am leaning a bit towards this.

Wario Ware would be better with wider boundaries. True, but it's fine CP Material as it is.

Pictochat would be better if you could remove a few of the more dangerous transformations. Pictochat is perfectly fine. It doesnt need any changes.

Jungle Japes would be better without the Klaptrap and Norfair would be better without the fireballs, but they are fine as is. They are fine as they are <3

Bridge of Eldin is fine as is for doubles. It's too big for singles though. BoE is counter/ban material for singles imo. More so banned than anything.

Port Town Aero Dive would be fine with weaker cars. This like 1000 times.

Skyworld would be fine with a permanent bottom platform and permanently destroyed top platforms. This once more time.

Hanenbow, Hyrule Temple, Summit, New Pork City, and Spear Pillar will never be ok for competitive play, no matter how you try to fix them, because they promote circle camping by design.

Pirate Ship will never be ok for competitive play because water camping IS a real problem. ...lolwut

This is all IMO of course.

10igavemyresponceinquotes

 

[FrozenHobo]

the only problem with the current bridge of eldin i can see is when it breaks it could encourage camping (nobody wants to be the one to have to approach the other side).

with GHZ maybe remove the checkpoints (or make it so you can disable them at the start by holding R).

i can agree with WW needing to have wider boundaries (but thats easily fixed)

PTAD weaker cars, Skyworld bottom platform invincible/platforms gone on the top and left, DP, blah, blah, blah....



i DO feel that PS should be a CP stage if we can do something about the water camping (i know that alloys can't swim. could we just remove the whole swming ability all together?)

 

[BEES]

Corneria - needs bigger death boundaries.
Green Greens - needs to be physically bigger, and have bigger death boundaries.
WarioWare - bigger death boundaries
Skyworld - agreed with hard bottom platform, soft upper platforms for this one. This could be a really good stage if it has that.
Onett - the cars should come less frequently, and the stage needs to be bigger.
Big Blue - I'm opposed to any attempts to make this a competitive stage. I actually like having it available as a chaotic stage for casuals.

 

[Plum]

I love Wario Ware the way it is.
I don't see why we need another neutral. Really, we have plenty as it stands. That's all bigger boundaries would accomplish anyways.

As it stands, it makes a great counterpick. Nothing is competitively wrong with the stage; no hazards and a neutral stage layout. The boundaries as it is make it a counterpick and again, I don't see why we need another neutral.

 

[Asdioh]

Just quickly addressing these points:

It was named for the little cave at the bottom of Hyrule Temple. Basically, you can just DI into the walls/ceiling and tech off of them to ridiculous percentages. This causes matches to go on for a stupid amount of time, and be generally annoying.
Just in case you didn't know.

I knew, I just didn't see it being a problem since both players could do it, and the Hyrule Temple example seems more extreme than anywhere else. There are so many ways to DI to survive down there, but on Spear Pillar, it's only up. And if it's permanently broken in the middle, then there is less surface area to bounce off and tech. I guess it can still encourage "circle camping."

I still think it's sad that people do that. There is a difference between "playing to win" and "wasting my time."

Green Greens, Corneria, and Yoshi's Island (Melee) would be fine if they were bigger.

Wario Ware would be better with wider boundaries.

Pictochat would be better if you could remove a few of the more dangerous transformations.

Skyworld would be fine with a permanent bottom platform and permanently destroyed top platforms.

Pirate Ship will never be ok for competitive play because water camping IS a real problem.

This is all IMO of course.

What exactly is wrong with close blastzones? I would hate to fight G&W there, but at the same time, he'd die earlier as well. I seem to be missing something...small boundaries affect every player and character. I suppose it gives some advantage to characters with really strong attacks...but they also die earlier... @_@

That's a brilliant idea with Skyworld. Or you can make it so that once you destroy the top platforms, they don't respawn. I guess. Still, it would be a great stage without the 2 platforms on the top.

Can you show me an example of water camping? Is it truly broken? Obviously characters with spikes have the advantage there, but maybe I've never seen it abused to its fullest extent.

 

[nevershootme]

I think luigi's mansion shouldn't be a neutral in teams due to a 1st cheap hit potential from either players? unless they're positioned accordingly by team in either side. I mean shouldn't the players be spaced out evenly as oppose to mansion piling in front of you when the game starts.

 

[FrozenHobo]

just to clarify, whats the difference between frozen and reversed? because when i play PS2 it seems like its been frozen (stage doesn't change/the 'GO!' is there the entire match)?

 

[GHNeko]

just to clarify, whats the difference between frozen and reversed? because when i play PS2 it seems like its been frozen (stage doesn't change/the 'GO!' is there the entire match)?

Frozen = Stage does not change in anyway.

Reversed = Hazards are eliminated.

 

[FrozenHobo]

Frozen = Stage does not change in anyway.

Reversed = Hazards are eliminated.

alright. thanks.

 

[MK26]

I'm having trouble understanding why in this list that Jungle Japes is a counter pick while Pirate Ship (frozen) is banned. There is nothing competitive about getting trapped in fast moving water. Any smashfests that I've played Brawl+ in have had Jungle Japes turned off for this reason. Unless they find a way to deactivate swimming, I would have to say that Jungle Japes should be banned. At least the water in pirate ship isn't so fast-moving that you can't escape it.

Also, with larger stage/death boundaries codes coming out, I'm voting for the larger Corneria as CP borderline neutral. Corneria is way too small otherwise.

Does pirate Ship have a (frozen) sign beside it?

And the problem with corneria isnt with the small blastzones, it's the walls and ease of camping on the back

*snip*

Hivemind? Or do great minds think alike? I was just about to post a list of the borderline stages and what we can do to fix them...

Stage - Problems
If _____, the verdict (IMO) is _____ because _____
(Remember, small blastzones are not a problem at all - Flat Zone 2 is an exception)

Bridge of Eldin - walkoffs, hazards (whatever it's called, bomb), camping when bridge is broken
Frozen - banned - freezing can't get rid of walkoffs

Corneria - hazards (lazers), camping below fin
Frozen - iffy - the wall is still a problem

Distant Planet - walkoff, hazards (bulborb)
The rain can be made permanent - iffy - the stage is very small and there's really only one ledge

Green Greens - hazards (apples, bomb blocks, wind), camping on small platforms
The hazards are removed without affecting regular blocks - cp - camping is weakened because bomb blocka aren't in the way any more

Green Hill Zone - walkoffs, hazards (checkpoints), checkpoint camping, breakable stage
See BoE

Jungle Japes - hazards (klaptrap)
Unchanged - cp - it's already perfectly legal

Norfair - hazards (lava), promotes circle camping
Unchanged - iffy - the lava sort of cancels out camping, but not for long periods of time

Pirate Ship - hazards (tons of stuff), water camping
Frozen - banned - see BoE, but replace 'walkoffs' with 'water camping'

PTAD - temp walkoffs, hazards (cars, that wall that hurts you)
The cars are weakened substantially - cp - even though temp walkoffs are campy, they are temporary

Skyworld - breakable stage, promotes circle camping
The bottom platform is unbreakable and the top platform is a permanent cloud - cp - the problems are solved

just to clarify, whats the difference between frozen and reversed? because when i play PS2 it seems like its been frozen (stage doesn't change/the 'GO!' is there the entire match)?

afaik frozen means everything stops while revesed means the effects still happen though no hazards appear. However, in the new Level Freezer code, there are 4 different categories of freezing/reversing, and i do not know the specifics of each

 

[Swordplay]

I remember when I was a n00b at my first tourney, I chose Bridge of Eldin against someone in pools, because I love that stage. People who saw the match were like "lolwut" and I didn't realize it was banned, or why it was banned

Anyway, I agree with you, except for one thing. What exactly is wrong with leaving the stage as-is? I mean, the goblin hazard is very obvious and easy to avoid. It also doesn't do that much knockback or damage, from what I remember. The bomb in the middle is dangerous...so don't stand there.

Is there something wrong with having that big hole in the stage? I don't see it as a problem.

This stage would be amazing in doubles, if Brawl+ has nothing lame that's equivelant to Dedede's chaingrab.

It could also work for singles, but like you said, it's big.

All true.

Let me say 2 things though

1. It takes away a hazard. (goblin and bomb) And the goblin isn't that hard to see coming. It can just come barreling out of the side if your near there. That in itself is a good argument.

2. Just keeping the bridge in tact will reduce this and emphasize more doubles rather than singles (2 singles matches one on each side of the bridge)

It should also reduce walk off camping quite a bit and people........

Then there are other character specific things that are much more fair like (falcos lasers)

Blowing up the bridge promotes a lot of camping and some characters would have trouble getting accross the gap in the bridge. (Olimar, Ivy?)


I defiantly think it has potential doubles CP material but whether we want this code or not is another story.

(I'll look for the code/ask leafgreen for it so you all can try it)

 

[FrozenHobo]

All true.

Let me say 2 things though

1. It takes away a hazard. (goblin and bomb) And the goblin isn't that hard to see coming. It can just come barreling out of the side if your near there. That in itself is a good argument.

2. Just keeping the bridge in tact will reduce this and emphasize more doubles rather than singles (2 singles matches one on each side of the bridge)

It should also reduce walk off camping quite a bit and people........

Then there are other character specific things that are much more fair like (falcos lasers)

Blowing up the bridge promotes a lot of camping and some characters would have trouble getting accross the gap in the bridge. (Olimar, Ivy?)


I defiantly think it has potential doubles CP material but whether we want this code or not is another story.

(I'll look for the code/ask leafgreen for it so you all can try it)

i agree with this. my only concern are the walk-off sides but even then in a doubles match thats not nearly as big of an issue. take out the goblin/bomb and i feel it would make an excellent CP.

 

[CloneHat]

How is water a problem? When you enter the water, there's about a second of lag where people can spike you, and all you and do is jump out of the water.

 

[JCaesar]

You can up-B out of the water too. Characters like Ike and G&W are nigh untouchable in the water. On Pirate Ship they can stay far enough away from the ship that you won't be able to catch them in that one second of water lag.

Oh and I almost forgot to mention, unpunishable Rest spamming...

 

[Zodac]

you can make green greens, castle seige 2 and green hill zone without the hazards and walkoffs in the stage builder..........................................

 

[Kei_Takaro]

THIS THREAD IS BUMPED, CONTINUED DISCUSSION PERMITTED BY MOD.

So anyway, we should update the OP for the latest codeset [B+ 5.0] and lets see if we can make this work again. :V

 

[Rikana]

Here’s what I think:

Neutral/Starter:

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokémon Stadium 2
Warioware
Yoshi's Island (Wii)

Counterpicks:

Luigi's Mansion (2v2 only)
Brinstar
Castle Siege
Delfino Square
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Jungle Japes
Lylat Cruise
Pictochat
Pokémon Stadium 1
Rainbow Cruise
SSE Jungle (Hyrule)
Wifi Training Room (Rumble Falls)
Skyworld
----
Corneria (?)
Green Green (?)

Edit: Wario Ware and Lylat Cruise can be switched depending on some people. I just think WW is more of a neutral, although it can be a CP since it has so many platforms, because the stage doesn't move at all like Lylat Cruise. Yoshi's Island (Wii) have motion but the main fighting area is quite neutral.

 

[Kei_Takaro]

Should be in OP:

Ooh ooh new stage list

What do you all think?

Neutral
Battlefield
Final Destination
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Lylat Cruise
Pokemon Stadium 2
Smashville
WarioWare (singles)/Wifi Waiting Room (doubles)

Counterpick
Delfino Plaza
Rainbow Cruise
Frigate Orpheon
Brinstar
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium
Castle Siege
Wifi Waiting Room (singles)/WarioWare (doubles)

Counterpick/Banned
Luigi's Mansion
PictoChat
Jungle Japes
Norfair
Green Greens
Distant Planet
Yoshi's Island (Melee)
Onett
Corneria
Pirate Ship

Banned
Mushroomy Kingdom
Mario Circuit
Mario Bros.
75m
Rumble Falls
Bridge of Eldin
Temple
Spear Pillar
Port Town Aero Dive
Big Blue
New Pork City
Summit
Flat Zone 2
Skyworld
Shadow Moses Island
Green Hill Zone
Hanenbow

(Note: the C/B section is intended to be in order, meaning that you pick a cutoff between two stages, and above that cutoff are the counterpicks and below are the banned stages. If anybody disagrees with my sliding scale of legality, explain why.)

EDIT: colour cuz it looks good and to visually explain the above.

 

[FrozenHobo]

Should be in OP:

but that list isn't necessarily correct. we recently got a fix for skyworld and it doesn't include the SSE Jungle stage either.

 

[MK26]

k fine. skyworld in c/b and sse jungle in not applicable. done.

EDIT: not really...where in c/b would it go?

and its n/a because you cant put the custom icons on the first page of the sss, so you wont see it anyways...

DELAYED EDIT: 2000th post
Smash Champion time!

 

[FrozenHobo]

its also not universally agreed that lylat or WW are full neutrals. same goes for the legality of pirate ship and picto chat. on top of that you have some places that allow hanenbow in doubles. we also have an eventual fix for spear pillar and MK 1-2 planned.

 

[MK26]

i havent seen a single reason why either of those cant be neutral...
pirate ship and picto are in counter/banned for a reason...
And i'd love to see a tournament video of a match being playd on hanenbow.

 

[FrozenHobo]

i'm just pointing out things i've heard. its not like any of this is new.

lylat is weird because of the tilting and the ledges which is why most regions have it in CP. WW heavily favors characters with a strong juggle game.

having hannenbow doubles legal has been in for a while now even if its rarely played on.

 

[Kei_Takaro]

i havent seen a single reason why either of those cant be neutral...
pirate ship and picto are in counter/banned for a reason...
And i'd love to see a tournament video of a match being playd on hanenbow.

I'm pretty sure Picto doesn't have enough Hazard power to kill and make the game unbalanced.

Hanen- RAAAAAGGGGGGGEEEEEEEE!!!!!

 

[FrozenHobo]

Skyworld - breakable stage, promotes circle camping
The bottom platform is unbreakable and the top platform is a permanent cloud - cp - the problems are solved

just gonna bring this back up for establishing skyworld's position. full cp should be fine.

and SSE Jungle is still a cp (at least in doubles). i'm not entirely sure what you mean by

and its n/a because you cant put the custom icons on the first page of the sss, so you wont see it anyways...

you can still select the stage.

 

[Kei_Takaro]

hmm, I think I'm new to this "SSE Jungle" I didn't know anyone added that in B+ (officially i mean)

Oh and this:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9011922&postcount=36

 

[FrozenHobo]

GHNeko had it included in his stage list for the last B+ official online tourney.

plus, its included in the download for the GSH1 Download along with a common5.pac that changes the image of rumble falls and temple to WWR and SSE Jungle respectively.