Brawl+ Stage Legality Discussion: Brawl+ 7.0 Gold Discussion (Go Discuss Everything!)

[The_Guide]

Would Eldiran's PTAD w/o cars be a good enough fix to move the stage up to counterpick?

 

[MK26]

hmmm, good question...i havent tried it, but i think it might

anybody have any opinions on this matter?

 

[FrozenHobo]

from what i've seen it looks good for a CP.

 

[DUB]

Can someone explain why the sandbag is in the waiting room stage?

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

to add variety...please drop the subject... <.<
it's for the thread's own good

 

[Kei_Takaro]

Can someone explain why the sandbag is in the waiting room stage?

Because without it, would be a lowered FD with slightly more length.
Also Sandbag offers up a "anti-camper" aid which helps melee only characters gain an edge.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Why are people hatin on my lover? (sandbag)

all he wants to do is get hit...but he's not that much of a distraction.

you can WALK through him.

you can RUN through him.


I'm so sorry he always accidentally eats falco lasers. Spacies just aren't his type. That's why he's my lover <3

 

[FrozenHobo]

i hate that *******... but nobody here likes WWR either, so i just ignore it.

right now i'm enjoying playing on PTAD w/o cars. such a fantastic CP without the cars.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

People who hate sandbags are nubs!



*runs with pitchfork and torch*

 

[FrozenHobo]

i stated my problems with sandbag when he was first added back in. ha adds a player controlled obstacle that is infinitely and instantly reappearing.

i just really hate playing on the stage while he's on there. but it harley matters anymore as nobody in charge sees it from our side's point of view. if it was made to only respawn 45 seconds after its destroyed i would have less of an issue with it since as it is now you have 0 seconds in between destroying it and having it come back.

 

[Alphatron]

Port Town w/o cars would make a nice CP(though I can see the rage from adding it already). The problem is that the main moving platform has no ledges. At all. Screws over tethers and a multitude of other characters.

If this isn't a big problem then I'm officially texture hacking the trollface on sandbag and making that my avatar.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Yes because walking through Sandbag is so hard.



;_;


I mean, it's so much more of an obstable than the cave of life, or the low platforms on skyworld, or the platforms on battlefield...or the FD ledges, or the fish on summit...or the bombs and catapult on Pirate Ship....or the moving platform on Smashville...or the hittable blocks on YI Melee......or the middle tilting platform on YI Brawl....or the oscillating LC sides.....

yupyup

 

[Nerd With An Afro]

to add variety...please drop the subject... <.<
it's for the thread's own good

Alright you guys, lets completely disregard this statement and continue talking about the sandbag.

But time to get serious, why is the temple on the banned list? i really dont care much since i dont follow it but is it because its too big (be warned, i havent look through the thread, so i may have not noticed someone who said this)

 

[SymphonicSage12]

In the latest beta codelist, temple isn't even temple. It's the SSE Junglefield. Just putting that out there.

 

[Alphatron]

Yes because walking through it is so hard.



;_;

That alone has managed to annoy so many people though. But I would guess that the instant respawn time seals the deal. Even my casual friends want him gone. As far as camping goes, I main a character who benefits from his existence. <3

Ignoring the bias, only Falco is really affected by him.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Simple. Make him take a while to respawn. Then the haters could just fsmash him off the stage and be fine for a while.

Both parties will have to compromise, but yeah..

 

[Kei_Takaro]

I suggest maybe a 15 second gap between spawns?

 

[MK26]

I suggest maybe a 15 second gap between spawns?

would slowing the stage down 100x with level freezer have any effect?

 

[FrozenHobo]

45 second respawn time. as it is now, characters that use projectiles are permanently ****ed. you gain nothing from destroying the sandbag.

 

[MK26]

45 second respawn time. as it is now, characters that use projectiles are permanently ****ed. you gain nothing from destroying the sandbag.

ban it if you dont like it

i personally think projectile characters are more dangerous here than anywhere else

especially characters whose projectiles dont get destroyeed by good ol' S.B.

 

[FrozenHobo]

i do if the other person has ever shown any interest in it. but i hate having to waste a perfectly good ban on a stage that shouldn't be as stupid as it is.

 

[Alphatron]

Really though, how does PT without cars go by with no ledges?

Edit: Ness, Lucas, Zelda, ROB, Ivysaur, Pit, and Samus are just a few of the projectile characters who love sandbag and actually benefit from it being there.

 

[FrozenHobo]

how does samus benefit? her zair is the only thing that goes through it. everything else gets stopped. it completely crushes her projectile game.

 

[Alphatron]

^How is the enemy supposed to approach Samus easily if she camps?

 

[FrozenHobo]

how is she supposed to approach if her projectiles don't do anything? the same rule applies to pit. sure he can spam arrows, but he can't use them as a way to add pressure.

 

[Alphatron]

If she actually wants to approach, Samus still has a massive zair to play with. Seeing how WWR has that abnormal cieling, it should be easier for Pit players to drop arrows down(not exactly arrow looping).

But you're right on that not exactly adding pressure.

 

[mofo_]

Enough about wwr....
I remember spunit262 or someone changed the death boundaries of spear pillar and made it so that there was no underground cave....perhaps something similar could be done to other stages

 

[AMKalmar]

Wouldn't the constant rain on Distant Planet in effect make the stage extremely tiny? That would be...interesting...I guess.

What exactly about Skyworld makes it banned in regular barlw? I think it has potential to be a counterpick if you make the platforms..invincible? I'm sure that's possible...

I agree Norfair would be better without the pillars of fire that come from the background..those are ridiculous. If there's no way to remove those, then I'd rather see the stage stay as it is, rather than frozen. The lava is what makes it interesting.

Is the "cave of immortality" truly broken on Spear Pillar? I see it being annoying, but not game-breaking. Also, you know how sometimes part of the top level is broken off on that stage? Is there a way to make either the left, center, or right of that stage permanently broken off? That would reduce some of the cave of immortality problems.

A slowed down version of Big Blue...that would be pretty insane.

I personally believe the Klaptrap on Jungle Japes should not be as hazardous as it is. That will make the stage much more enjoyable for me. I know it's on a set timer, but still...

I don't really care much for Summit. It would be interesting to see I guess.

I've been working on modifying all the stages. In Jungle Japes I've removed the Klaptrap and I'm working on lowering &/or slowing down the water. I think you can remove the top part of Spear Pillar completely. For Skyworld I want to make the platforms have no hurtboxes. If they're invincible it's annoying because they still get hitstun. I might remove the top platforms so it's drop-through.

walk off stage and random chance of getting eaten by bublin.... both of which we can remove with B+ (permanent rain and bublin doesn't eat you)

You can probably remove the ground entirely but I don't remember if it's linked to the background... I think it is. The problem then is there's no ledge on the left side.

Remember, we can change the killzones on any stage (including custom) to make them more playable. Some stages can have some platforms repositioned but I haven't quite gotten that working.

 

[mofo_]

you can rearrange delfino plaza's platforms^

edit: heres the spear pillar mod

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzT7FNqD2qM

frozen + no cave-of-life


also, reversed pirate ship w/ no water might be good, if people don't like water camping

 

[MK26]

wow, i never thought of removing klaptrap...and if you want to slow it down, just use the level freezer

 

[FrozenHobo]

you can rearrange delfino plaza's platforms^

edit: heres the spear pillar mod

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzT7FNqD2qM

frozen + no cave-of-life


also, reversed pirate ship w/ no water might be good, if people don't like water camping

i like this SP idea better:

 

[Kei_Takaro]

you can rearrange delfino plaza's platforms^

edit: heres the spear pillar mod

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzT7FNqD2qM

frozen + no cave-of-life


also, reversed pirate ship w/ no water might be good, if people don't like water camping

I like that Spear Pillar Mod =D

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

will bowser be able to do that koopa hop or w/e its called with his side-B or another character do somthing similar? it would be broke if they can

 

[mofo_]

what are you talking about? ^

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

what are you talking about? ^

bowser uses his side-b before he reaches the ground and you press jump and you cancel into a double jump before you touch the ground, and you can keep doing it forever.

the ground is still there on the hack but its out of reach, unless you can hover under it,

sonic HA stall would be broke too?

 

[RPGsFTW]

Port Town w/o cars would make a nice CP(though I can see the rage from adding it already). The problem is that the main moving platform has no ledges. At all. Screws over tethers and a multitude of other characters.

If this isn't a big problem then I'm officially texture hacking the trollface on sandbag and making that my avatar.

More about this. Does it matter that much? Mute City didn't have ledges in Melee and plenty of characters were screwed, Ex: Yoshi, there plenty easily. I don't know if have a tether alone makes it un-viable for that character. That's also why it's be a counter pick. And if that is really a hassle, can't the stage be made so it loops faster, therefore landing on the ground, AND the area with ledges, more often?

It sounds like a really cool stage to me, if possible.

Oh, and Sky World is amazing. I hope more stages can be fixed like it too. Sky World makes an excellent CP at our tournaments. =]

 

[Deleted member]

Im gonna throw my ideas out there with explanations

Neutral Singles

Battlefield
Final Destination
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Pokemon Stadium 2
Smashville
WarioWare
Lylat Cruise
Skyworld+(Nice stage, seems neutral)


Counterpick Singles

Delfino Plaza
Rainbow Cruise
Frigate Orpheon
Brinstar
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium
Castle Siege
Wifi Waiting Room (CP due to size, but the stage is neutral due to Mr Sandbag eating projectile spam.)
SSE: Jungle (Large Stage)
Luigi's Mansion (Large stage)

All other stages banned for singles

Neutral Doubles

Battlefield
Final Destination
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Pokemon Stadium 2
Smashville
Lylat Cruise
Wifi Waiting Room
SSE: Jungle
Luigi's Mansion
Skyworld+

Counterpick Doubles

Delfino Plaza
Rainbow Cruise
Frigate Orpheon
Brinstar
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium
Castle Siege

All other stages banned for doubles

Ideas:

Luigi's Mansion
A: The stage is destroyed and then has a set period of time where it rebuilds. Time decided upon by WBR to make a good CP. (Good CP vs spammers due to pillars)
B: The Pillars take more dmg to destroy and have to divert your efforts in singles or doubles to change level and gameplay strategy. A dedication to break the pillars and camp them til they break for example. The level does not rebuild.

Pictochat could make a nice neutral if frozen, no lame FD edges to get stage gimped. Or, remove all hazards and any awful stage changes to make level change similar to pokemon stadium.

Spear Pillar would make a nice neutral in singles/doubles if one can find a way to eliminate the bottom portion of the level effectively.

Jungle Japes for CP in singles/doubles if water current and klaptrap can be frozen/removed.

Freezing Norfair might make it a nice doubles CP stage.

Corneria for doubles CP if hazards are removed and stage boundries are fixed.

I dont see Big Blue, Distant Planet, Pirate Ship, Bridge of Eldin, and Summit being suitable for tourney level play. The stages have too many hazards and stage gimps such as b-throw out of boundries on walk out stages. The lack of a stage to fall off from takes away what makes smash unique to other fighters and decreases skill needed and luck greater which tournaments should not be based from. =)

 

[MK26]

your counterpick list is no fun...like, madddd conservative
how would an even number of stages work for stage striking
corneria aint gonna happen
youre forgetting PTAD+
freezing norfair would make it bad
Japes+ (ie no klaptrap) would probably be for the best
Pictochat is fine the way it is

Your opinion sucks.

Not really.

Well, maybe a bit.

j/k

 

[RPGsFTW]

Why would Jungle Japes get it's water changed? Or why would Japes be changed at all? I thought that it was good how it was because it was a good CP. Bring an Olimar to that stage, have his pikmin die in the water, except the blue, and give him a huge ceiling preventing early vertical kills. Honestly though, why change the stage? If anything you could, maybe, get rid of klaptraps, but I think the moving water is important for the recovery CPing aspect.

If it isn't broke don't fix it. PTAD could be cool if fixed because it DID have a problem, unlike Japes, as far as I can see.

 

[Veril]

Actually, getting rid of the klaptrap is a bad idea. There are some pretty potent stalling techniques that you can use on the platform, and the klaptrap is the only thing that keeps me from exploiting the s*** out of that.

The Klaptrap damage should be reduced to 10 and it should have vastly reduced kb and kbg.

Japes is my favorite stage, and I'd love to see it made better.

You should discuss stage modifications here as opposed to stage legality, which is based on the competitive standard used at the time, not potential mods.