Dodge/Roll Frame Data now with air dodge!

J4pu · Mar 16, 2009

MK's AD is broken
his roll is also faster than Lucario's (not better though)

what was Sakurai/game designers thinking when making MK's stats?

EDIT- nvm it's just his forward roll.

Cherry64 · Mar 16, 2009

Yay! Good stuff K Prime

sonic 12111 · Mar 16, 2009

wow i always thought g@w had a longer than usual lag after the invincibility frames.

Elyssa Xey Hexen · Mar 16, 2009

Lucario's rolls are like the best. That explains so much why I have problems punishing lucarios that roll so much.

Cherry64 · Mar 16, 2009

__crystal____ said:
Lucario's rolls are like the best. That explains so much why I have problems punishing lucarios that roll so much.

fire Lazr's while they are rolling and your bound to hit them and stun them a few times.

Basically spam B when they roll and you'll be better off than normal.

Elyssa Xey Hexen · Mar 16, 2009

Cherry64 said:
fire Lazr's while they are rolling and your bound to hit them and stun them a few times.

Basically spam B when they roll and you'll be better off than normal.

You spam B in close range and you'll get punished so bad it's not even funny.

bobson · Mar 16, 2009

J4pu said:
what was Sakurai/game designers thinking when making MK's stats?

"Let's make Metaknight the best character in the game?"

Amazing Ampharos · Mar 16, 2009

Wow, every single character with the superior air dodge is new to brawl, and the only characters new to brawl who don't have it are Sonic, Toon Link, Lucas, and Wolf. Meta Knight even claims an extra invincibility frame over everyone else. I've known for a while that a big focus of brawl's design was encouraging the use of the new characters, but I didn't realize there was something this blatantly stacked in their favor. Of course, I also didn't realize 3d attacking was a real mechanic; it makes me wonder what other things I didn't realize.

Elyssa Xey Hexen · Mar 16, 2009

How does this data compare to there melee counterparts? If that data is similar they might have just copied over the melee data to use for brawl.

The Truth! · Mar 16, 2009

__crystal____ said:
How does this data compare to there melee counterparts? If that data is similar they might have just copied over the melee data to use for brawl.

Rofl thats what I was thinking. They were so lazy in designing other aspects, why not this?

Levitas · Mar 16, 2009

This is 100% on with everything I've tested (only a couple characters).

Looks like quality data.

SamuraiPanda · Mar 16, 2009

Just out of curiosity, are the "total frames" for spotdodges the total frames of the animation, or does it end at the IASA frame? I've seen a shift towards people referring to the "total frames" as the IASA frame, because that is far more important than the total frames of the animation itself.

Pikabunz · Mar 16, 2009

It ends at the IASA frame. So for like the good spot dodges (2-20/22), you can act on the 23rd frame.

Ryusuta · Mar 16, 2009

Holy cow, I had no idea Peach's air dodge was so terrible. She's vulnerable for half of the animation. Yikes.

B!squick · Mar 16, 2009

Bowser's Air Dodge is 1 frame better than about half the cast. O.o Madness!

EDIT: Wait, hang on. When 3GOD did the frame data for Bowser he came up with 4-31 invincible. :/
EDIT2: As well he has 5-22 invincible for the forward roll.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=206219

Pikabunz · Mar 16, 2009

I'm pretty sure my info on Bowser is correct.

B!squick · Mar 16, 2009

Then clearly something does not compute. Has 3GOD seen this yet?

Pikabunz · Mar 16, 2009

What method did 3GOD use to find his data?

To everyone: If anything looks wrong, let me know and I will give it a double check.

Tristan_win · Mar 16, 2009

huh...more proof that Sakurai wanted Meta knight to be good if not better then everyone else.

I'm just glad sheik pretty normal.

B!squick · Mar 16, 2009

K Prime said:
What method did 3GOD use to find his data?

To everyone: If anything looks wrong, let me know and I will give it a double check.

I have no clue. He never mentioned his processs.

Orion* · Mar 17, 2009

bludhoundz said:
Though I don't have any way of testing for frame data, I'm fairly certain ROB's spotdodge has to be one of the better ones.

i have to agree with this. that spot dodge is obnoxious >_<

edit: thanks allot for all the awesome hard work though. this will help allot =]

Flayl · Mar 17, 2009

Wow Peach's airdodge is that horrible? I never knew.

illinialex24 · Mar 17, 2009

I can say one thing that Jigglypuff's forward roll goes on 3 and her backward on 4 for first invincibility frame. I tested this with Pikachu's D-smash.

Badjuju · Mar 17, 2009

<3 yayyyy thank you

Pikabunz · Mar 17, 2009

illinialex24 said:
I can say one thing that Jigglypuff's forward roll goes on 3 and her backward on 4 for first invincibility frame. I tested this with Pikachu's D-smash.

You are correct, sir.

Crow! · Mar 17, 2009

Very good and useful thread. Thanks for the effort.

And apparently Peach's air dodge is made of epic fail. Never would have figured that out on my own.

Remzi · Mar 17, 2009

I knew Marth's AD was bad, but 2nd worst?

wow..

Corrupted · Mar 17, 2009

BengalsRZ said:
I knew Marth's AD was bad, but 2nd worst?

wow..

Marth doesn't have to airdodge often anyway.
Lol @ metaknight's airdodge.

ZHMT · Mar 17, 2009

Thanks for this, now I know to just uthrow Peach and she basically is screwed

Rickerdy-doo-da-day · Mar 17, 2009

Rofl at Peach's airdodge. I knew it was really bad but...dang, the worst one? That sucks :/

Blad01 · Mar 17, 2009

Lol, it probably because of her Dair and his floating abilities ^^

BentoBox · Mar 17, 2009

Lingering hitboxes

[SupaDupaCario]

> Peach in the air.

GHNeko · Mar 17, 2009

Augh. Now it makes sense why I get hit with smashes all the **** time when I AD with Marth. That's pretty gaay. Especially when I have a shield buffering during AD.

Also, lol @ peach. Turnipdaisy is going to **** bricks.

PhantomX · Mar 17, 2009

I'm surprised people ***** about Wario's airdodge being so good when there's a bunch of other characters with the same thing, lol.

Maybe it just has to do with a combination of air speed + air dodge.

GHNeko · Mar 17, 2009

Maybe its just the visual effect, because the ending frames on this list is IASA, not the last frame of the animation. Eyes deceive all the time.

B!squick · Mar 17, 2009

3GOD still a no show? I messaged him, what more does it take? :/

BentoBox · Mar 19, 2009

Marth's airdodge isn't the 2nd worse. His inv. frames just start one frame later, he still gets a full 25. Peach on the other hand ah-hem.

Irsic · Mar 19, 2009

Know what would be pretty helpful?

How long your invincibility frames when hanging on a ledge last, in time, and in frames.

Levitas · Mar 19, 2009

One frame on startup can be a big deal. Especially for defensive techniques.

Cherry64 · Mar 19, 2009

That's true. Defencesive chars should have a bit better invincibility frames IMO but they are all even it seems.

Dodge/Roll Frame Data *now with air dodge!*

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Dodge/Roll Frame Data now with air dodge!