Ever wonder if Sakurai's seen this stuff?

[Eldiran]

Pretty positive Sakurai doesn't know English.

http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/info/info06.html

 

[leafbarrett]

Pretty positive Sakurai doesn't know English.

http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/info/info06.html

My guess is that he does KNOW it, but he isn't 100% fluent, so there would be grammar problems or awkward-sounding results, plus it would take him way longer than a professional translator. Japanese in particular is a hard language to translate into English because it's just SO different.

Maybe both.... Or maybe jealous because some people on the internet have better ideas than him >_>, seriously I read an interview where he said he wouldn't know what to do with the next SSB game if there is gonna be one.

Gee, I don't know, maybe customizable moves, as in more than 4 special attacks for each character, and let the player decide which ones they want to use. Do the same thing for regular attacks. Have you unlock them by playing online games, story/arcade mode. Change some physics, like making the hookshot like it's supposed to be and used it as a recovery item. Be more **** creative.

Then we could get Link using multiple swords with different advantages, disadvantages, and tactics for each, and Samus with different weaponry availabilities.

My God, the SSB series can really go places if the creator put more time into the gameplay creativity rather than making a story mode which IMO was boring and repatative, and making things like stickers, photo albums and such. He put too much thought into little things rather than the main focus.

But the higher-ups don't want a game to take that long, because the longer it takes, the more money they have to spend paying the developers and the longer it takes for them to get the money from the game's sales. That's one of the major reasons games get rushed out.

You know, I don't understand all the Sakurai-hating that goes on about how he hates Melee's competitiveness and fun; people need to remember he made Melee.

People also forget that this "unbalanced game" with all these problems we're fixing? He made it, as in he's the only reason we have anything to FIX. This entire section of the forum wouldn't exist, and none of the work we've done would have ever been started, if he hadn't made the game... come to think of it, it wouldn't have happened if the game hadn't had its FLAWS. Maybe we should be grateful for how he made the game, if for no other reason than for prompting the creation of all the amazing hacks and such that we have.

 

[Eldiran]

My guess is that he does KNOW it, but he isn't 100% fluent, so there would be grammar problems or awkward-sounding results, plus it would take him way longer than a professional translator. Japanese in particular is a hard language to translate into English because it's just SO different.

Well, he also had to be translated when IGN interviewed him. So, *shrug* Either way is possible.

People also forget that this "unbalanced game" with all these problems we're fixing? He made it, as in he's the only reason we have anything to FIX. This entire section of the forum wouldn't exist, and none of the work we've done would have ever been started, if he hadn't made the game... come to think of it, it wouldn't have happened if the game hadn't had its FLAWS. Maybe we should be grateful for how he made the game, if for no other reason than for prompting the creation of all the amazing hacks and such that we have.

Well, sure. Melee was also a rather unbalanced game. As are most all fighters. Every game has flaws... though I think that we would still hack Brawl even if it were flawlessly balanced, if only to add more content. In fact, that is what happened; the first hacks/codes were not designed with the intent to rebalance anything.

So, yeah, if you're blaming Sakurai for making an imperfect game... you're totally right, because nobody can do that, especially with all the pressure from higher ups. But it was anything but apathy that made the flaws in Brawl -- he's said himself that even if he had an extra two years to work on it, he still wouldn't be finished.

My guess is the imbalance in Brawl mainly comes from a) Sakurai and company didn't know you could cancel Snake's dash attack into upsmash in that manner, and b) they probably made some buffs to Metaknight at the last minute after finding him too weak, and they way overdid it. With those two characters fixed the remaining imbalance is something small enough that it would likely take far beyond any development cycle to catch and fix.

I've probably drifted way off-topic at this point... but I just had to get some o' this off my chest after all the years of excessive Sakurai-bashing.

 

[bobson]

People also forget that this "unbalanced game" with all these problems we're fixing? He made it, as in he's the only reason we have anything to FIX. This entire section of the forum wouldn't exist, and none of the work we've done would have ever been started, if he hadn't made the game... come to think of it, it wouldn't have happened if the game hadn't had its FLAWS. Maybe we should be grateful for how he made the game, if for no other reason than for prompting the creation of all the amazing hacks and such that we have.

Actually, I'd chalk up this section of the forum more to the fault of the designers for the Wii than Sakurai. Even if the game was perfect, Brawl would've had extensive hacking done to it just because it's so popular and has such a large community; Melee had tons of hacks, and the GC was much more locked down than the Wii.

We probably wouldn't have Brawl+ or other campaigns like that to make the game "better," but I wouldn't doubt that things like music and texture hacking would still be around.

 

[brawlshifter]

Fix'd. :3

No offense to Dant, but I doubt it. And Vile? Hell no. XD

Well, if Sakurai is on the site, he wouldn't necessarily be the best, fastest, etc hacker, considering he could do anything he wants to the game because he knows exactly how it works, and he wouldn't want to give away all of his secrets. He could be making a challenge for us to find out exactly how it works on our own, with him only coming in every once in a while with some piece of golden information. *Cough*Phantom Wings*cough*. Think about it, he made the File Patch Code, perhaps he didn't want us to use ISOs...

 

[Eldiran]

Strictly speaking, making the File Patch Code is probably the most effective way to prevent the hacking community from burning ISOs... ;P

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

No Eldiran, that would be the USB Loader. XD

 

[brawlshifter]

Strictly speaking, making the File Patch Code is probably the most effective way to prevent the hacking community from burning ISOs... ;P

That's what I was saying. PW (Sakurai) could have been using us when he made that...of course, only if he is Sakurai...only Sakurai knows...

 

[Meccs]

hurry paint!
and sorry that it stretches the page, I'm not sure how to resize it...

 

[brawlshifter]

Is that really what Sakurai looks like, or did you just find a picture of a random Japanese person and paste it on there?

 

[Meccs]

yeah that's him, I just googled Masahiro Sakurai. The picture is from the IGN interview page with him about Brawl.

 

[Stoney]

It's great to see that absolutely no-one read the interview I linked. Yes, that's Sakurai; I'd recognize that hairdo anywhere.

EDIT: Beaten by almost fifteen minutes. I'M TOO SLOOOOW.

 

[Brickbox]

Yep gotta love that hairdo

 

[brawlshifter]

It's great to see that absolutely no-one read the interview I linked. Yes, that's Sakurai; I'd recognize that hairdo anywhere.

EDIT: Beaten by almost fifteen minutes. I'M TOO SLOOOOW.

I read it.

 

[smashmaniac2008]

Phantom Wings IS Sakurai

 

[Pokechao]

Sakurai probably won't give a crap about all these hacks unless we sell them for profit.

 

[Oni K4ge]

Interesting analogy about PW = Sakurai. I found myself thinking the exact same thing. Sakurai could be sharing an account with one of the game's major programmers, as I don't think Sakurai actually programmed Brawl. Or did he? Anyway, very interesting analogy. It makes sense. I'd lol if someone made an account named with Sakurai, but backward, and was working on projects with PW. THAT would be weird... and a bit obvious to those who pay attention to detail

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

Uh, PW is in no way Sakurai.

Seeing as Sakurai took a steaming **** and it spelled Brawl out in his toilet.

And then he tripped and felt it should be in.

This is not how PW operates.

 

[darksamus77]

^Best thing I've heard on the Smashboards in my short time here

 

[brawlshifter]

Uh, PW is in no way Sakurai.

Seeing as Sakurai took a steaming **** and it spelled Brawl out in his toilet.

And then he tripped and felt it should be in.

This is not how PW operates.

Why does everyone give Sakurai crap about tripping? Seriously, its not that bad. I kind of like it, but, of course, I don't care much for Brawl+ or "balance" so...

 

[darksamus77]

Why does everyone give Sakurai crap about tripping? Seriously, its not that bad. I kind of like it, but, of course, I don't care much for Brawl+ or "balance" so...

It's retarted and a dumb addition, there was no need of it. That's why tripping's so hated, it's annoying and stupid

 

[ph00tbag]

Sakurai doesn't seem like the vindictive type in his interviews. Nor does he seem very quick to anger. He has too much of a neutral party attitude. When the rest of Japan was QQing over Japan's loss to China in the World Cup qualifiers, Sakurai was smiling and saying just how wonderful it is that everyone had a good time.

That said, he'd probably be a bit taken aback that people were so averse to his game that they reverse engineered it and made their own based on the engine. Such knowledge would have to be somewhat upsetting, given the time he put into making it something everyone could enjoy.

Of course, I couldn't really say whether he knows about the hacks. Nintendo's asset protection division certainly knows, and from that, Iwata definitely knows that the HBC exists, and possibly some uses of it. Then again, he probably is far more concerned with the utilization of the HBC to play illegally downloaded games. As to whether the knowledge would reach Sakurai, it's harder to tell.

 

[brawlshifter]

It's retarted and a dumb addition, there was no need of it. That's why tripping's so hated, it's annoying and stupid

And its funny as ****. Perhaps he knew people would hate it and make jokes about him with it, and maybe he wanted that.

You know, no one give other games' developers any crap about their games. You don't see people slamming Infinity Ward or Insomniac, Sakurai must be special.

 

[Darkurai]

It's retarted and a dumb addition, there was no need of it. That's why tripping's so hated, it's annoying and stupid

Sakurai:
...You might say I like surprises, or even more appropriately, you might say I love a good prank. That’s why I feel compelled to do the things I do.

Iwata:
I see. You can’t deny that Smash Bros. is a game that is filled with pranks.

Sakurai:
Clearly. (laughs) That’s why it’s fun to make, and fun to watch people playing.

Case in point.

 

[Shinobi_3]

he visits this site everyday unregistered and he downloaded roy and waluigi already.

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

vBrawl just represents another way to **** up a fighter, even past tripping. The Smash games are much different compared to most fighters though, but that's no excuse.

 

[Alphatron]

He'd probably be pretty upset and to be honest, I wouldn't blame him. He put his time into brawl in order to make it a game that everyone could enjoy in general. He thought he succeeded, and he put a lot of work into the game to make it a generally rich experience beyond melee and 64.

But then people take his creation and start putting their own moves on it and calling what they do, "better". Who wouldn't be annoyed?

Perhaps he simply didn't understand that this game was played competitively or misunderstood that they casual and competitive fans were fine with being seperated(>___>). Either way, he wanted to unite the two bases and this is how he did it.

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

It didn't work. =/

At least, it shouldn't have. I think the only reason vBrawl lives today as a popular competitive game is only because of the competitive players backing it up (and vBrawl is easy money too). If they weren't so clingy to the smash games (and didn't bother with easy money ), vBrawl wouldn't live as long as it has, since I think most of us can tell when a game just isn't built well, especially when it's gambled over. Melee lived for a long time (imbalanced in some cases, yet still a great fast paced fighter). MvC2 did too (extremely unbalanced), it had a great fanbase. Both are dying extremely slow due to the people feeding off of the scraps we left behind. Course we don't want them to die, but w/e, newgen ftw imo. :3

Even though Ninty likes to corkscrew people who care with a wooden stick of shame, considering money = power in this world, and Ninty does like money. =/ Too bad innocent families can't realize what's going on behind the front lines. D:

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

You know, no one give other games' developers any crap about their games. You don't see people slamming Infinity Ward or Insomniac, Sakurai must be special.

You clearly have never set foot on the Steam forums. xD

Gamers in general are whiny, petty, and scared of change. They will whine about everything, and they will lash out at the developers. The only difference is that Sakurai gave us a scapegoat in himself. He put himself in such a position that he's the only name you recognize out of the design team, so you instantly forward all faults with Brawl (a very long list, mind you) towards Sakurai.

Where as say...the TF2 forums rage at an unfeeling entity known as "Valve".

Same thing. One just has a more precise target.



And towards the actual topic, I think he'd be both displeased and pleased with himself rather than angry at anyone.

Okay, you've made a game. You think it's quite good. It goes to stores, and it sells well, further cementing your sense of satisfaction.

A few months later, you begin to hear that a small niche market prefers the games you made previous. You feel saddened that they don't have fun with it, but figure the mass appeal is a tad more important. You still believe you have done well.

Then you happen to stumble across a community for your game such as this. You find your code cracked and a staggering amount of user made content available. Your game has been completely changed, many of the things you put in have been since removed or tweaked to more suit this small niche market.

For the life of you, you cannot figure out why. Why did they put so much work into this? Why did they not go back to the games they preferred? What drives them to reverse engineer the game to this extent? With the amount of time put into these changes, they could have very well made a new game.

You reach a conclusion. Because even though these fans disagree with what you have done with your latest installment, they want to like it. They wanted your game to be just as good as its predecessors, and they wanted to spend the countless hours playing it as they had the titles previous

I don't know about anyone else, but that would be pretty much the biggest honor imaginable. You made two masterpieces and one stinker. The masterpieces were so amazing, however that your fans actually cracked the game and fixed it for you.

So in my opinion, everyone that hates Sakurai and also plays Brawl+ or is hyped for project M...gave Sakurai mad props.

 

[Andarel]

Good post, Tatsu.

Guy, not so much. Melee was highly technical largely by accident - while I'm sure they had an idea of how L-canceling and wavedashing worked, I don't think the developers could consistently work it into their game and see the results. The dev team just wasn't tech-skill focused enough. MvC2 has a different thing entirely, where there is not much balance but the amount of skill needed (and the reward for it) keeps it going.

And you need to realize - I don't think you were the intended target for Brawl. Brawl is a party fighter that was made tournament-worthy by fans, not a tournament fighter. It's not what a lot of us wanted, but Nintendo put a hell of a lot of effort into making it something, and it's a solid entry-level fighter.

 

[DarkDragoon]

Good post, Tatsu.

Guy, not so much. Melee was highly technical largely by accident - while I'm sure they had an idea of how L-canceling and wavedashing worked, I don't think the developers could consistently work it into their game and see the results. The dev team just wasn't tech-skill focused enough. MvC2 has a different thing entirely, where there is not much balance but the amount of skill needed (and the reward for it) keeps it going.

And you need to realize - I don't think you were the intended target for Brawl. Brawl is a party fighter that was made tournament-worthy by fans, not a tournament fighter. It's not what a lot of us wanted, but Nintendo put a hell of a lot of effort into making it something, and it's a solid entry-level fighter.

LCancels were a legitimate addition to Melee, as ZCancels were in 64. In an interview years ago in Nintendo Power, Sakurai claimed everyone on the dev team knew about wavedashing, so by them keeping it in, they purposely added that as well.

Everything else, like JCGrabs, JCShines, CCs, Float Cancels, Perfect Shields, ledge hopping, chain grabs, techs, walltechs, walljumps, ledgetechs, stitchfaces, and almost all other things melee players do all the time except maybe the IC's freeze glitch, YoYo Glitch, and probably a couple of other really stupid things, were all purposely added. They didn't intend for a national circuit or inter-continental rivalries, but that is what happened because players found the game so deep and appealing, all over the world. Why on earth Nintendo would want to erase that from the planet is beyond me, but still.

I think Sakurai would be angry with all this, but I'm sure he'd come to understand it. I'm a [much smaller LOL] game developer myself, and if I saw the hard work I poured hours and hours into be undone and changed because the gamers couldn't deal with what I thought was a good idea, then I'd be pissed. I'd come to understand too, however, that if my second and first were better than my Third, then whatever changes I made were probably the wrong ones.

Also, if Brawl is your entry-level tournament fighter, you're not getting off the doormat LOL.
-DD

 

[brawlshifter]

It didn't work. =/

At least, it shouldn't have. I think the only reason vBrawl lives today as a popular competitive game is only because of the competitive players backing it up (and vBrawl is easy money too). If they weren't so clingy to the smash games (and didn't bother with easy money ), vBrawl wouldn't live as long as it has, since I think most of us can tell when a game just isn't built well, especially when it's gambled over.

I don't see the faults everyone sees in vBrawl, which is the only thing I play. I don't care if the game is perfectly "balanced" or not. In my opinion, even a completely unhacked Brawl is one of the best games out there, and a hacked vBrawl is pretty much number one in my opinion. I see almost no faults in vBrawl, nor do I see why people hate it so much.

You clearly have never set foot on the Steam forums. xD

No I haven't. Okay then, you don't see anyone slamming Insomniac or...................wow, I don't know what companies make other games. Anyone know what company makes makes the Bad Co. series?

Gamers in general are whiny, petty, and scared of change. They will whine about everything, and they will lash out at the developers. The only difference is that Sakurai gave us a scapegoat in himself. He put himself in such a position that he's the only name you recognize out of the design team, so you instantly forward all faults with Brawl (a very short list, mind you) towards Sakurai.

Fixed.

 

[Alphatron]

Fixed.

It's really subjective though. As much as I like vbrawl, I can name tons of faults I had with the game and things in general that could have legitimately been better. You can argue for that being subjective as well.

I'm a little peeved at Insomniac myself since Spyro is no longer a good series. Well actually, I'm over that. I'm more upset at the removal of multiplayer in the Ratchet and Clank future games. I'm annoyed at Arenanet and their plans to ruin Guild Wars PvP. I don't actively bash...but you see where I'm going.

It didn't work. =/

Maybe, but it was still his intention nonetheless. People play vbrawl competitively because they've actually come to enjoy it. Some players favor melee, some players favor vbrawl, and some make money off of both.

 

[Seikishidan Soru]

I don't see the faults everyone sees in vBrawl, which is the only thing I play.

Well if you played anything else you would probably see them.

To address the point made earlier about companies, Namco gets **** about SoulCalibur 4 because of the Hilde nonsense, likewise with Capcom with SF4 (Sagat, large reversal window among other things). So yeah, it happens.

Anyway, I'm not sure if this is directly related to the topic, but the shocked reactions at game modding/hacking in Brawl's case baffle me. "OMG SO DISRESPECTFUL HOW DARE YOU TOUCH THEIR WORK". What the hell. Way too much focus on alleged developer's intent there.

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

And you need to realize - I don't think you were the intended target for Brawl. Brawl is a party fighter that was made tournament-worthy by fans, not a tournament fighter. It's not what a lot of us wanted, but Nintendo put a hell of a lot of effort into making it something, and it's a solid entry-level fighter.

That's what I said D:

And also, guys, I recall Sakurai saying DIRECTLY that Brawl was not made to be a competitive game. (At least not in that wording, but w/e)

That puts up the thought that its fanbase is holding it up there. But how we can tell if a game was built for **** like this, we can't. Unless they make some effort to say so.

Well, there's Poker.

 

[brawlshifter]

I'm a little peeved at Insomniac myself since Spyro is no longer a good series. Well actually, I'm over that. I'm more upset at the removal of multiplayer in the Ratchet and Clank future games. I'm annoyed at Arenanet and their plans to ruin Guild Wars PvP. I don't actively bash...but you see where I'm going.

Well, you can't blame Insomniac for the Spyro series, they sold it, unless you're mad at them for that. I can't complain much about the removal of multiplayer because I can't go online on any game anyways (which sucks). Unless you mean a two-player mode, which I'm a little upset at too.

Everyone has to admit though, Sakurai is the most bashed.

Well if you played anything else you would probably see them.

I just don't see how changing a little direction and power and messing with some stages makes the game so much better, especially when I can completely customize normal Brawl without the restrictions of the Brawl+ codeset thing.

 

[Andarel]

Also, if Brawl is your entry-level tournament fighter, you're not getting off the doormat LOL.
-DD

I think you fail to see the difference between entry-level fighter and entry-level tournament fighter. It's extremely important for this discussion. Please go back and re-read.


Guy, I was referring to this.

Also, I'm not sure why people seem to think that developers are necessarily good at balancing games. That's usually not true, especially in cases like Smash where they have no history to go off - Brawl runs on a different engine than Melee and 64, has a different focus, and completely different physics. This is in stark contrast to games like Street Fighter or Guilty Gear where the engines and physics are often similar and balancing can happen in Guilty Gear +++++++ (a.k.a. whatever the seventh game in the series is; the difference is essentially irrelevant after the foundation mechanics have been laid out).

EDIT:

Re: Brawlshifter -

Brawl+ isn't simply changes to direction and power, though you can go pretty far with just that. It's inherently a change to physics, which means that the game actually feels different from regular Brawl. That's the main thing. Changes to individual moves vary - you'll get open-ended things like Lucario's upB that play well with the character, or you'll just get things sorted out to make a character play better with the cast (hitstun goes a long way, but things like the reduction of the aura hitboxes on Snake's tilts help quite a bit).

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

I don't see the faults everyone sees in vBrawl, which is the only thing I play. I don't care if the game is perfectly "balanced" or not. In my opinion, even a completely unhacked Brawl is one of the best games out there, and a hacked vBrawl is pretty much number one in my opinion. I see almost no faults in vBrawl, nor do I see why people hate it so much.

And if you are not a tournament player, you are right. Brawl is an amazingly fun casual game. Diverse selection of characters, fun moves, and completely unpredictable. Add in the hacked characters, textures, and stages and you've got a **** fun game to play against your friends.

Simply put, Mario Party is fun. But there's a reason why people don't play Mario Party in tournaments.

No I haven't. Okay then, you don't see anyone slamming Insomniac or...................wow, I don't know what companies make other games. Anyone know what company makes makes the Bad Co. series?

Nintendo gets slammed constantly. Valve gets *****ed at. Ubisoft(Assassin's Creed 1), THQ (every wrestling game they've made since the N64), Rockstar (GTAIV), Capcom(everything they make), basically any game developer will get flack from their unpleasable fan base.

Fixed.

Cute.

 

[Andarel]

Over its history, Capcom has gotten more flak for stupid things (MM Battle Network translation failures, anyone?) than Sakurai has gotten for legitimate issues in Brawl. Gotta love Capcom.

I've put over 800 hours into a party fighter (Jump! Ultimate Stars), but everyone who plays the game with any sort of seriousness knows that competitive J!US is an oxymoron. Amazing combos and a massive cast with interesting movesets is the upside of the game...but it's one of those cases where the game's engine just flat-out makes tournament play impossible. That doesn't mean the game isn't fun as hell, though. Just because a game is inherently flawed doesn't mean that it has to be discredited and brushed under the rug...it's just that there won't be any tournament play. I mean, I've had fun with Brawl on occasion. Mainly in 2v2, where its issues don't show as much. But it's inherently a party fighter, and people are always disappointed that it's not the competitive fighter Melee was. And with the number of Smash fans in general, it's no surprise that the vocal minority enjoys complaining.

 

[brawlshifter]

EDIT:

Re: Brawlshifter -

Brawl+ isn't simply changes to direction and power, though you can go pretty far with just that. It's inherently a change to physics, which means that the game actually feels different from regular Brawl. That's the main thing. Changes to individual moves vary - you'll get open-ended things like Lucario's upB that play well with the character, or you'll just get things sorted out to make a character play better with the cast (hitstun goes a long way, but things like the reduction of the aura hitboxes on Snake's tilts help quite a bit).

I was underexaggerating when I said direction and power, I understand it is more than that. But still, I don't see how it makes the game that much better. Of course, that is my personal opinion, one that I'm sure almost everyone else on this board would debate with me.

And if you are not a tournament player, you are right. Brawl is an amazingly fun casual game. Diverse selection of characters, fun moves, and completely unpredictable. Add in the hacked characters, textures, and stages and you've got a **** fun game to play against your friends.

Exactly! I do not have wifi, so I am not a tournament player. I only play the offline modes, so I guess I don't know "competitive" gameplay.

Nintendo gets slammed constantly. Valve gets *****ed at. Ubisoft(Assassin's Creed 1), THQ (every wrestling game they've made since the N64), Rockstar (GTAIV), Capcom(everything they make), basically any game developer will get flack from their unpleasable fan base.

Well, then I guess Sakurai isn't special. Poor Sakurai.