General ICs Q&A Thread

[EverAlert]

Blizzard is useless for the same reason. Theoretically.


Also, turning Tap Jump off gives you no clear disadvantage, if anything the reverse is true. It's not silly at all.

 

[r3d d09]

what if they just spam the whole time and avoid you at all costs?

 

[J4pu]

that's where the PS'ing and spam of your own comes in.

 

[hough123]

Could some of your players with match-up experience help the Lucario boards discuss stages?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=226651

Thank you in advance.

 

[r3d d09]

What do you mean by PS'ing? I'm brain dead at the moment.

 

[Rubberbandman]

Power/Perfect Shielding.

 

[r3d d09]

oh. lol. can't believe i couldn't remember that.

 

[X-FACTOR]

I'm surprised there hasn't been much talk about our placing in the new tier list.

 

[J4pu]

meh, I think it was pretty expected to be somewhere between 3rd and 6th

 

[theunabletable]

Blizzard is useless for the same reason. Theoretically.

Why are you using blizzard when in Super Theory Bros. Brawl ICs should just be shielding > SDI > grabbing, amirite?

what if they just spam the whole time and avoid you at all costs?

Then it goes to tie, but if they ever attack your shield, you take their stock with perfect shield SDI.

 

[ch33s3]

Being lower is better, people.

Oh and yea, ICs shouldn't ever get timed out. They win the camping fight with every character except MK. ICs should be timing their opponent out.

 

[Hylian]

do you DACUS with normal controls without using the grab button?
if so, props for fast fingers

Yes, I use Cstick and A.

I can do Sheiks dacus about 90% of the time having never practiced it. It's really not hard. Especially if you played melee lol.

 

[Smoom77]

With Z for attack DACUS is much easier.

 

[J4pu]

but I like my Z for grab, ive gotten used to CG timing with it
so I have R as attack

 

[ch33s3]

I use R attack, Y grab and z jump with tap off. Yes, I'm weird like that.

 

[r3d d09]

Being lower is better, people.

Oh and yea, ICs shouldn't ever get timed out. They win the camping fight with every character except MK. ICs should be timing their opponent out.

what about snake on jungle japes xD

 

[ch33s3]

what about snake on jungle japes xD

What is this Japes you speak of? I'm from a region that doesn't have an absurd stage list.

On the off chance someone did ever CP Japes when I was OOS, I'd just go Falco, I have one.

Oh, and I forfeit game 2 like half the time anyway, bad stages and such.

 

[J4pu]

might as well play the 2nd game for lulz with some random character, or even maybe just try and improve your synced IC game or something you don't normally use.
unless you really hate this game that much.

 

[r3d d09]

@ j4pu. that's what i did during the whole match. ha.

 

[ch33s3]

might as well play the 2nd game for lulz with some random character, or even maybe just try and improve your synced IC game or something you don't normally use.
unless you really hate this game that much.

Well what actually usually happens is I pull out my mediocre MK, lose 2 stocks quickly because compared to the rest of NY/NJ I'm awful at the ditto, and just quit. Then I go to a neutral and grab them and feel better.

 

[EverAlert]

Why are you using blizzard when in Super Theory Bros. Brawl ICs should just be shielding > SDI > grabbing, amirite?

lololol

Moreover, in Super Theory Bros. Brawl, why are they even attacking ICs shield? lulz

 

[Guilhe]

How long would it take to raise your opponent percentage to 250% through infinite chain grabbing in the fastest possible scenario? And in the most realistic one?

 

[J4pu]

... why?
go check the frame data for yourself
I'm sure the dmg output of each of IC's moves are also somewhere in the stickies or at least linked to.
Popo's throw will get progressively more stale over time assuming you use the same one and Nana's moves don't stale.
go do the math, all the information you need is available

I could somewhat understand asking a question like this if it made sense, but getting them to 250%??!? wtf, don't waste anybody else's time

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Uhhhh just like...usmash them at 120 or so. :/

 

[J4pu]

did you guys know there's a way to get desynced Nana to do forward blizzard other than jumping?
when popo is using blizzard, walk forward a few steps with nana, then use blizzard, it will go forward.
You don't have to walk very far forward, if popo is using blizzard you don't even need to go halfway through the hitbox and it will work and the magnet pull will pull Nana back to popo while her blizzard is going.

I realize jumping is also useful for the added temporary height but I just thought I'd let you guys know in case it wasn't known

 

[Guilhe]

It was a stalling related question. Sorry for asking... geez.

 

[Sieguest]

It was a stalling related question. Sorry for asking... geez.

If you wanted to stall, wouldn't you want to use slower, and not faster grabs? x.x

 

[xExile]

So I read somewhere that your controller ports can actually effect some things in your matches. I heard it before and thought it was complete nonsense. Is it true though? Like apparently port 4 doesn't allow you to get knockbacked from Snake's nades or something. Am I just too gullible or does this really exist?

 

[Sieguest]

So I read somewhere that your controller ports can actually effect some things in your matches. I heard it before and thought it was complete nonsense. Is it true though? Like apparently port 4 doesn't allow you to get knockbacked from Snake's nades or something. Am I just too gullible or does this really exist?

It's something called port priority.

Say for example you're playing a Snake and you have port 4 while the Snake has port 1.

If Snake grabs you, and there is a nade near ya'll that blows up, you both take damage, but you experience no knock back, you only go into your GR animation while Snake gets knocked into the air.

If the Snake had port 4 and you had port 1 and the same situation ensued, then you would experience knock back into the air while snake does his GR animation.

Or say in teams you have port 3, your partner has port 1, and your opponents have ports 2 and 4.

Say you grabbed the opponent who has port 4, and your partner in a moment of blondeness hits you both, you would experience knockback while your opponent goes into their GR. But if you grabbed the opponent who has port 1, and the same thing happened, you would do your GR animation while the opponent experiences knockback.

iirc the higher ports (port 4) out prioritize the lower ports.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

In the case of a nade being at your feet when you get grabbed whoever is closer to 4 doesn't get knockback yes. The same holds true for his mortar. However that CAN'T hit Snake(unless reflected) so some Snakes will use ports closer to 1 to launch a mortar and hold you there, pummel, let you get hit and throw you. You should still try to be port 4 vs a Snake though.

 

[00-Zero]

did you guys know there's a way to get desynced Nana to do forward blizzard other than jumping?
when popo is using blizzard or any other move that takes a fair amount of time to finish, walk forward a few steps with nana, then use blizzard, it will go forward.
You don't have to walk very far forward, if popo is using blizzard you don't even need to go halfway through the hitbox and it will work and the magnet pull will pull Nana back to popo while her blizzard is going.

I realize jumping is also useful for the added temporary height but I just thought I'd let you guys know in case it wasn't known

This is good. It's more so one of those things that you just should know but isn't written anywhere. Well nowhere that I looked. She'll do it forward also if she walks backwards and blizzards or popo uses an ice block first.
Also double grounded blizzard is the pivot desync with a blizzard at the end of it when nana gets close if this hasn't already been cleared up. That's probably late as hell though. I just don't remember if it was cleared up or not.

 

[J4pu]

If two characters grab each other at the same time the lower port will get the grab

 

[EverAlert]

Speaking of which, does anyone know how Nana works in relation to port priority vs Popo?

eg if both their grabs come out on exactly the same frame, which one grabs? Same for attacks etc., obv they will both connect but which one will connect first (since you can't be hit by two separate hitboxes on the same frame)?

I'm also curious whether she has higher or lower priority than -other- players' ports, but I always assumed she was on the same basic level/port as Popo. But it'd be nice to know for certain.

 

[Sieguest]

Speaking of which, does anyone know how Nana works in relation to port priority vs Popo?

eg if both their grabs come out on exactly the same frame, which one grabs? Same for attacks etc., obv they will both connect but which one will connect first (since you can't be hit by two separate hitboxes on the same frame)?

I'm also curious whether she has higher or lower priority than -other- players' ports, but I always assumed she was on the same basic level/port as Popo. But it'd be nice to know for certain.

That's a good thought... I always thought it would be Popo (as in referencing the lead climber) because he carries more of the weight on the damage output, attack wise, but I'm not sure about grabs. I've never run into that situation.

 

[EverAlert]

Popo only has a higher basic damage output because he stales the move 5 frames before Nana hits them, though. Just saying.

 

[J4pu]

huh, I never knew that, I just heard Popo was slightly stronger and never questioned it, somebody failed in their testing method to come up with that information

 

[toobusytocare]

i dont think popo's moves are stronger due to staleness
try breaking popo's sheild then attacking an opponent with nana and then come tell us the results, because im not sure haha

 

[Rubberbandman]

Popo only has a higher basic damage output because he stales the move 5 frames before Nana hits them, though. Just saying.

But in training mode where no attacks stale, I've seen the moves do odd numbered amounts of damage from the aerials. So this really is weird.

 

[Sieguest]

But in training mode where no attacks stale, I've seen the moves do odd numbered amounts of damage from the aerials. So this really is weird.

Well, some damage has a decimal to it, it just doesn't show whenever you do it though.

So like if we had a move that shows up as 13% on the hit per climber (Not saying we do, just pulling numbers >.>) it may actually be 13.5 and then having Nana match it the game will put the damage at 27%

Kind of like how two consecutive Jigglypuff fthrows add together (assuming you go into training mode to negate stale). I can't remember damage right now, but I know it has a decimal that doesn't show on the first throw, but after the second throw the .5s make one so it seems like she did 1% more damage.

Popo only has a higher basic damage output because he stales the move 5 frames before Nana hits them, though. Just saying.

X________________X never thought of that, but it makes total sense.

 

[J4pu]

Training mode using running Usmash on a human control MK with no DI at FD
Popo: 11 dmg, kills at 101
Nana: 9 dmg, kills at 112

desynced so the other IC did not distort values

on another note:
ISSDI, scary or a hilarious joke of somebody just waiting to be grabbed?
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=267261