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[bubbaking]

Thanks! Yes, I have a roll/spot-dodge habit that I need to break. It was actually mentioned on the stream for that tournament.

 

[Ithra]

I was looking at the MU chart and saw that DDD's matchup against wolf is +3.

why is this and whats a good way to handle this matchup? and how do i handle a campy wolf?

 

[bubbaking]

Wolf get's CG'd pretty hard. Not only is he CG'd easily regularly, but we have an infinite on him if we space ourselves from the ledge correctly. On top of that, Wolf is fairly easy to gimp. I don't think campy wolf is too bad. PS the lasers.

 

[Ithra]

i haven't gotten to play a wolf with my D3 yet. at my last tournament i did i was still maining MK i lost to one because i didn't know the match up.

but now i'm dropping MK and picking up some new characters. and D3 has the best matchup against wolf so i thought i'd learn why for next time

 

[bubbaking]

Wolf is kind of a weird char for you to pick up D3 just to fight against him. If you really want a good char that can take out Wolf, you should try Pika. He's top tier and he also has a +3 on Wolf. CGs and the like. Of course, I main DDD so I'm always happy to see new D3 players, whatever the reason.

 

[Ithra]

Wolf is kind of a weird char for you to pick up D3 just to fight against him. If you really want a good char that can take out Wolf, you should try Pika. He's top tier and he also has a +3 on Wolf. CGs and the like. Of course, I main DDD so I'm always happy to see new D3 players, whatever the reason.

no i wasn't picking up D3 for wolf. i picked him up because he is a manly fat penguin of pure AWESOME!

i just noticed of the 3 Characters i'm learning (Marth, Falco, and D3) he has the best matchup against wolf

 

[bubbaking]

He probably has better MUs than Marth and Falco against a lot of chars, but he also has a few much worse MUs.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I'll try and get some videos of my D3 up, I do play Wifi, so, I apologise for dropping a CG.
I don't do it often, I'm not using him in Tourney yet.

But, I'd still like to make him ready for when I need him.

Sorry for posting this in the wrong thread, it was just easier, because I'm asking you to critique.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

lol Wi-Fi. I drop CG's on Wi-Fi all the time. In fact, I don't bother chain grabbing half the time when I play Wi-Fi. >____>

 

[bubbaking]

AT's on Wi-Fi? Good luck! XD

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Wolf get's CG'd pretty hard. Not only is he CG'd easily regularly, but we have an infinite on him if we space ourselves from the ledge correctly. On top of that, Wolf is fairly easy to gimp. I don't think campy wolf is too bad. PS the lasers.

I'm curious how that infinite on Wolf works. I use Wolf a lot, and one of the people I play against often uses D3, but he doesn't know the infinite. Is the spacing very strict? Is there maybe a video he could look at?

I'm not thrilled with the idea of teaching him how to **** me, but I want him to improve.

 

[1PokeMastr]

AT's on Wi-Fi? Good luck! XD

Wifi is where I taught myself the Exact frame to buffer a grab for the Infinite.

 

[Fizzle_Boy]

I'm curious how that infinite on Wolf works. I use Wolf a lot, and one of the people I play against often uses D3, but he doesn't know the infinite. Is the spacing very strict? Is there maybe a video he could look at?

I'm not thrilled with the idea of teaching him how to **** me, but I want him to improve.

If it's the same one D3 does in the ditto, the spacings not strict at all, it's the same as the spacing for buffed dtilt because it's the same concept with a grab substituted for dtilt. He just has to be sent far enough off the edge that he doesn't wind on the ledge. If you have him grabbed on the very edge of the stage, it doesn't work either because of the weird trajectory it gives DDD's dthrow.

Unless you really want to win DDD dittos, I don't think it's worth learning because he destroys every character he can infinite without it.

 

[infiniteV115]

What is the frame (dis)advantage for landing bair on shield? (ie hitting their shield with a bair as you land on the ground)

And on powershield?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=314753&highlight=frame+data

^ Frame data thread, that-a-way.

The disadvantages assume the hitbox hits on the frame before landing.

 

[allshort17]

How long does it take to get to the run animation from the dash?

What's the earliest frame I can shield when I get to the run animation?

What's the earliest frame I can shield from a skid?

How long does the skid animation last?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

For you, I will look up anything~

Gimme a few minutes and I'll have this info up.

How long does it take to get to the run animation from the dash?

What's the earliest frame I can shield when I get to the run animation?

What's the earliest frame I can shield from a skid?

How long does the skid animation last?

~11

Immediately.

Immediately.

~29

 

[allshort17]

I assume then that the second the run animation starts, then I can go into skid if I stop?

Also, technically this means we can skid cancel CG all the characters we CG because at the least, it takes 17 frame to get the skid cancel grab and the lowest advantage we have on the CGables is 20. Is this correct or are there some exceptions?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Go through the inputs for skid canceled CG for me plox?

 

[allshort17]

Dthrow -> Buffered dash -> run animation starts -> Stop running/skid -> Shield -> Standing grab

 

[KuroganeHammer]

k so,

Run for 11 frames
Shield for 1 frame
Grab takes 5 frames before a hitbox is out

11+1+5 = 17 with the grab box out on 18, so yeah, theoretically skid canceled chaingrab is possible on every chaingrabbable.

 

[allshort17]

Ok. Thank you

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

k so,

Run for 11 frames
Shield for 1 frame
Grab takes 5 frames before a hitbox is out

11+1+5 = 17 with the grab box out on 18, so yeah, theoretically skid canceled chaingrab is possible on every chaingrabbable.

Wow.

That's ridiculous.

I will master this.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Pretty neat stuff, hey~

Iunno if I'll bother learning it; maybe if I get time to bother.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I never bothered to learn how to do this technique consistently.

But I'm putting everything I can into this character so it going down. I'm super motivated to do more Dedede stuff again.

 

[Bobwithlobsters]

Don't you have to run for a certain number of frames before letting go to get a skid? When you just tap dash you get a fox trot animation with no skid correct?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Yes; Eleven frames.

 

[BadKarma]

So I'm having trouble with the snake MU. It seems like all of the snakes in my region camp realllly hard. What are some good ways to approach a really campy snake? I know alot of it is situational but does anybody have anything that works for them?

Also is there any recent videos of ddd vs. snake? The only ones I'm able to find are early 2011 videos.

Thanks

 

[allshort17]

Dtilt. I can't say it enough. It the go to option to beat all of Snake's good options except shield/great timed spotdodge/or a grenade in front of him.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

What's happening forum.

I like DDD, and I want to get to use him better, but beyond the chaingrab and B-Air usage, I don't really know anything else about it. I'd like to be able to use him to be a solid fighter without the chaingrab, and not just the CG and B-Air walls. Anything you can recommend me for the mixup game?

 

[allshort17]

Upsmash. I've been experimenting with it recently. I know everyone is going to say "Oh. Why Upsmash when Utilt is stronger, faster, and reaches higher up?" I'm not saying don't. Use uptilt over Upsmash every time you can a chance. However, you will see that in terms of Dedede, Upsmash will probably be the better choice.

Grounded, there are only four moves that reach over Dedede's head. Waddle dee toss, Jab 2, uptilt, and upsmash. We all know how situational jab 2 is, so let's cross that out (although it's one of the best moves that lead to grab if you get it.) Waddle dee toss doesn't have a hitbox right in front of Dedede. Check it out because it's pretty cool. If someone thin is standing right next to you, it will whiff. Anyway, that makes it pretty bad to block deep jump-ins. Also, the slow start-up, cooldown, and lack of reward makes it a bad option anyway (sometimes.) Now, with uptilt, it's great for very deep anti-airs (like right above your head), comboing, and killing. However, it has little horizontal range, leaving a gap in front of Dedede's head. Oh no! Dedede has a weak spot he can't cover that's right in front of his head at a 45 degree angle. Whatever will we do if we are grounded and they apporoach at us at that angle?

Oh wait, Upsmash covers it perfectly. It's the only grounded move that covers that angle. Sure, you can just short hop bair and cover it, but that's obvious and you want a mix-up. Know it or not, players approach at that angle more often that not because they are trying to avoid being grabbed. So, when they see you on the ground all they think you can do it shield. But, bam! No one will be expecting a retreating upsmash. Unlike bair, it doesn't cause you to be in the air or put a hurtbox out very far. So, moves with low downward vertical range (Snake's nair) or move that people generally want to do early (Marth's fair) can easily be gotten under. It kills or sets up for juggles. Also, it covers Dedede's whole body. Meaning, if they whiff a cross-up the upsmash will still work. It's still a hard move to use, but combine it with jump canceling or reverse jump canceling and you got yourself a real threat.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

If only my Dedede pac files weren't corrupted.

And my ctrl buttons worked. ;____;

I've been using up smash on aerial characters. Seems to work a charm when I throw it out every once in a while.

 

[Bobwithlobsters]

How does one do the b reversal inhale with ddd?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Press B and press the opposite direction you're facing within 4 frames.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Upsmash. I've been experimenting with it recently. I know everyone is going to say "Oh. Why Upsmash when Utilt is stronger, faster, and reaches higher up?" I'm not saying don't. Use uptilt over Upsmash every time you can a chance. However, you will see that in terms of Dedede, Upsmash will probably be the better choice.

Grounded, there are only four moves that reach over Dedede's head. Waddle dee toss, Jab 2, uptilt, and upsmash. We all know how situational jab 2 is, so let's cross that out (although it's one of the best moves that lead to grab if you get it.) Waddle dee toss doesn't have a hitbox right in front of Dedede. Check it out because it's pretty cool. If someone thin is standing right next to you, it will whiff. Anyway, that makes it pretty bad to block deep jump-ins. Also, the slow start-up, cooldown, and lack of reward makes it a bad option anyway (sometimes.) Now, with uptilt, it's great for very deep anti-airs (like right above your head), comboing, and killing. However, it has little horizontal range, leaving a gap in front of Dedede's head. Oh no! Dedede has a weak spot he can't cover that's right in front of his head at a 45 degree angle. Whatever will we do if we are grounded and they apporoach at us at that angle?

Oh wait, Upsmash covers it perfectly. It's the only grounded move that covers that angle. Sure, you can just short hop bair and cover it, but that's obvious and you want a mix-up. Know it or not, players approach at that angle more often that not because they are trying to avoid being grabbed. So, when they see you on the ground all they think you can do it shield. But, bam! No one will be expecting a retreating upsmash. Unlike bair, it doesn't cause you to be in the air or put a hurtbox out very far. So, moves with low downward vertical range (Snake's nair) or move that people generally want to do early (Marth's fair) can easily be gotten under. It kills or sets up for juggles. Also, it covers Dedede's whole body. Meaning, if they whiff a cross-up the upsmash will still work. It's still a hard move to use, but combine it with jump canceling or reverse jump canceling and you got yourself a real threat.

Hey thanks.
But I would like to know a few moves that are considered good for melee combat. You know, moves that aren't too laggy, that you could fight at close-range with without relying too much on the chaingrab. Jab 2 to Grab seems pretty legit for that- Anything else?

 

[allshort17]

There's really nothing that Dedede has up close that not grabs. Dedede is never meant to be played up close. If you are, you've messed up. He's a mid-range zoning character. The only up close fighting Dedede will be doing is off a smart read, and that's rare. Mainly, your goal is to stick mid-range and knock them away with the correct move. Afterwards, you take stage control by slowly moving forward and because they are scared, they shield. That's where you get your free grabs and inhales. Sure, you can bair, jab, dtilt, fair, and dair up-close, but none it is safe. However, half of those options are safe at mid-range.

Instead of looking for other up-close moves, why don't you just figure out ways to refine your grabbing game? It will usually always be the best option, so abuse it. Learn what makes your opponent shield, how to set it up, and the proper times to grab and your grabbing won't be "spamming" anymore because all the grabs you do are proper punishes and reads.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Oh, I see. I'll practice a bit of Jab canceling to a grab or F-Tilt then.
I'd like to play like this DDD player here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVnmhN9gvW8&feature=relmfu

 

[| Big D |]

^ That was godly. Get exposed much.

Still his reads were on point, love how he read the double jump and punished with upair.

 

[Deleted member 189823]

What is a kill setup for U-Tilt? It seems I just can't go up to them and U-Tilt them like Snake does.

 

[Skinutski]

What is a kill setup for U-Tilt? It seems I just can't go up to them and U-Tilt them like Snake does.

Thus, there really isn't much to rely on other than positioning and reacting. Badly spaced aerials come to mind. Aerials, or something else that leaves the guy close to you.

There are some gimmick setups like inhale releasing or something I did a while ago and I'm not sure if it's legit: Spit towards PS1 tree (or some other wall I dunno) -> turnaround utilt

Edit: Now that I take a look at that old video, I should probably tell you to JUST DO IT. Me and my fraudulent roll utilts.