Lucas or Ness?

[PCHU]

Im not so sure, they both work differently, Lucas` works well but it ussually hits once worth about 20% damage, while if you hit with Ness` it pops them up for more juggling, this way you can rack up damage by keeping them in the air with tailwhipping and all sorts of thunder skills. Plus its faster. Finally Ness` PKT2 is much better (as terms of an attack. Lucas wins for recovery.)

And by recovery I hope you include distance and Lucas's thunder ability to go through anyone in your way.

Also, I say Lucas's recovery in general is better.
You know PK WEEEEEEEEEEEE (The PK Fire to Magnet glitch)?
That's one for Lucas.
Also, his rope Snake grabs ledges.
That's two.
PK Thunder makes four.
And since PK Thunder is slow and travels in small circles, it's easier to correct a mistake you made (like totally missing yourself).
With Ness, make one mistake and you're gone.

 

[PKSkyler]

And by recovery I hope you include distance and Lucas's thunder ability to go through anyone in your way.

Also, I say Lucas's recovery in general is better.
You know PK WEEEEEEEEEEEE (The PK Fire to Magnet glitch)?
That's one for Lucas.
Also, his rope Snake grabs ledges.
That's two.
PK Thunder makes four.
And since PK Thunder is slow and travels in small circles, it's easier to correct a mistake you made (like totally missing yourself).
With Ness, make one mistake and you're gone.

yeah, I know Lucas` recovery is better. I was saying Ness` PK Thunder is better as an attack.

 

[PCHU]

yeah, I know Lucas` recovery is better. I was saying Ness` PK Thunder is better as an attack.

OH.
Okay.
I think if we really look at it, they're even.
I mean, sure it seems like Ness is better, but that's what we thought about Roy back then.
Look at where Marth is now.

 

[PKSkyler]

OH.
Okay.
I think if we really look at it, they're even.
I mean, sure it seems like Ness is better, but that's what we thought about Roy back then.
Look at where Marth is now.

ehhh...well it doesnt really matter to me, I still think Ness is better, and Ill continue to use him.

 

[Finding Waldo]

Ness is actually one of my least used characters in Brawl. Lucas works better for me, though I am curious; does anyone follow the PK Freeze for continued damage to a frozen opponent? It seems to me that the enemy always breaks out before I can get to them.

 

[SlickSlicer]

super saiyan ness is beter than ness everybody knows that if you don't you, sir, are and idiot.

 

[DAGanmanert]

Like Ness better but sooo much Better with Lucas...Prefer Lucas' moveset and ATs

 

[PKSkyler]

Ness is actually one of my least used characters in Brawl. Lucas works better for me, though I am curious; does anyone follow the PK Freeze for continued damage to a frozen opponent? It seems to me that the enemy always breaks out before I can get to them.

you can follow with PK Thunda.....


whats with all the Ness hate(moveset wise) Have you guys played a good Ness? Worse Recovery doesnt mean Worse Character.

 

[Finding Waldo]

super saiyan ness is beter than ness everybody knows that if you don't you, sir, are and idiot.

Ness is always worse than Ness too. But overall, I would say that Ness is equal to Ness.

 

[mariofanpm12]

Lucas wins tier list wise.

I still prefer Ness, though, due to speed, technicality, etc.

 

[KoJ]

Lucas wins tier list wise.

I still prefer Ness, though, due to speed, technicality, etc.

The official tiers are out? Link, please.

Why are Lucas fanboys always saying Lucas is better in every single way?

PCHU, the case with Marth and Roy is completely different. The metagame wasn't developed back then, and only people new to the competitive scene really thought that. Ness and Lucas are usually thought of as very close tier wise, without either one having a real advantage.

 

[Salty123]

lucas because he has tons of ways to recover and most of his attacks have more priority

 

[Levitas]

Ness has yet to do well in a tournament environment. At least lucas has gone far a couple times.

 

[Luigi player]

Ness. I just love his playing style... his dair, bat, fair... everything. Lucas is nice too though.

 

[Finding Waldo]

lucas because he has tons of ways to recover and most of his attacks have more priority

Does he not just have one more way to recover? Do his attacks really have more priority than Ness? I always just figured that they were the same.

 

[knightzy]

lucas has several jump,a hit of PK thunder and a teather which ness dose'nt have

 

[Finding Waldo]

What do you mean "Several jump"? Both have PK thunder, although they work in different ways. And I know that Lucas has tether. Is there anything else though?

 

[Greenstreet]

luacs has tether while ness can grab the edge from further out when comparin to lucas(obviously without tether use)

 

[Shy Guy 86]

Lucas, because his AT's make him fun to play with

 

[Levitas]

Lucas has momentum tricks that can be used to recover. Zap jump, wavezap, Wavezap to magnetpull, and magnet pull. He also has the tether.

then he has his normal recovery like Ness.

 

[.Marik]

They're both virtually the same, and I main or use neither...

But I would have to say Ness. I hate Lucas. XP

 

[panique365]

Ness all the way. I love his PK Fire, and Lucas' PK thunder is too slow for me

 

[Finding Waldo]

Could possibly the wavebounce be used as a recovery? I have not tried it yet...

 

[PKSkyler]

Could possibly the wavebounce be used as a recovery? I have not tried it yet...

yeah it can....its a little hard, but not too bad. Lucas has a really good recovery though.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Ness is a better fighter but Lucas has better properties (aside from that stupid 0 death release grab from Marth...)

 

[PKSkyler]

Ness is a better fighter but Lucas has better properties (aside from that stupid 0 death release grab from Marth...)

what do you mean properties? (The grab release from Marth effects both Ness and Lucas, but its actually semi-easy to break out of the grab now. its not a 0 death in my opinion.)

 

[Finding Waldo]

what do you mean properties? (The grab release from Marth effects both Ness and Lucas, but its actually semi-easy to break out of the grab now. its not a 0 death in my opinion.)

I guess that it depends on who is playing. But I also want to know what you mean by "properties".

 

[Draconian]

Apparently Ness has gotten better tournament results, but still, I'd take Lucas. I like his attacks better.

 

[Levitas]

...
Actually, Lucas has had a better run at tournaments, Ness has better properties (weight, aerial manuverability), and lucas is better overall.

 

[crewster]

I prefer lucas personaly

 

[Wavekirby]

Ness' dash attack, fair, bair, dair, fsmash, dsmash and bthrow make him awesome. Plus his PK fire is way better than Lucas'.

 

[Levitas]

Plus his PK fire is way better than Lucas'.

Except that it isn't...

 

[Thisisz]

Lucas' Diar, Nair, Fair, Bair

 

[mariofanpm12]

The official tiers are out? Link, please.

Why are Lucas fanboys always saying Lucas is better in every single way?

PCHU, the case with Marth and Roy is completely different. The metagame wasn't developed back then, and only people new to the competitive scene really thought that. Ness and Lucas are usually thought of as very close tier wise, without either one having a real advantage.

That's cuz Lucas mainers have to support their main with bias!

 

[Wavekirby]

Except that it isn't...

In your opinion.

 

[the Lexx]

In your opinion.

It's not "opinion" - Ness' PK Fire is really not a very good move.

 

[Neon Ness]

It's not "opinion" - Ness' PK Fire is really not a very good move.

The fact that the word "good" is included makes it opinion.

How is it not good? It traps opponents and sets you up for a grab and back throw, which is a good finisher at high percentages, a forward smash, or a barrage of down tilts. True, Ness will get punished if you miss with it... but that's why you should only use it sparingly, to surprise your opponent...

 

[PKSkyler]

It's not "opinion" - Ness' PK Fire is really not a very good move.

As for hitting an opponent, Lucas` is much easier and you will pull it off more....however, when you hit with Ness` PK Fire then the after effect you get is really good. also the diagnol way it travels can be helpful.

 

[Levitas]

Ness's pk fire is slower, hindered by any uneven ground, decreases in range in the air, is less safe to use, fails at trapping competent opponents (SDI gets out after 1, maybe 2 hits, and they have enough time to hit you while you're still lagging, even if it connected), and is in the wrong place to cancel other projectiles.

Lucas's pk fire is faster, is hindered only by massively uneven ground which doesn't exist in competitive play, is safer to use because of wavebouncing, does more damage to the competent opponent, is in the right place to cancel projectiles (such as missiles and even the majority of a needle storm), and works in tandem with the magnet pull to assist Lucas's recovery.

The only thing that I can think of that Ness's pk fire has over lucas's is the PK fire to spike combo. for edgeguarding.

 

[PKSkyler]

Ness's pk fire is slower, hindered by any uneven ground, decreases in range in the air, is less safe to use, fails at trapping competent opponents (SDI gets out after 1, maybe 2 hits, and they have enough time to hit you while you're still lagging, even if it connected), and is in the wrong place to cancel other projectiles.

The only thing that I can think of that Ness's pk fire has over lucas's is the PK fire to spike combo. for edgeguarding.

Youll be able to get a grab or some kind of hit in when you them with it. Everything eles you said is right though. I still prefer Ness` for its after effect though.It sets up grabs and against heavy opponents you can pk fire->pk fire->pk fire-> dtilt a bit-> grab-> pummel opponent while they are getting hit by fire-> Bthrow. however Lucas` is very good. Its better then Ness` in terms of range and it will hit much more.

But dont forget Ness` advanced PK Fire techniques to help Ness out.