Match-Up Rediscussion: Samus

[KillerJawz]

I was clearing up fallacies in your statement. Peach's NAir can outprioritize a full charged CS. Fact. You can SDI the UAir combo, but it wont save you because we can follow you. Fact.

That isn't a fact because it just does not happen, the strong hit of your nair although I've never seen this happen, may beat it out, the whole move in general doesn't. Also, unlike you, we can air dodge :/

As far as the instafloat SDI groundtech. That was basically to put your statement in reference. "SDI saves me from DAir/UAir strings" and I followed with "I can SDI out of an instafloat and tech the ground and never die" for the lulz (upping the ante in someone else's game is fun.) It was sarcasm, which is why I said your (and my) SDI isn't perfect. You took it too seriously. That being said, I do groundtech a lot while instafloating as an old melee crouch-cancelling habit that now has a similar feel to taking a hit while performing an UAir string. The fingers go through the same motion, left index tries to tech, while the thumb is down (and alternating with neutral position) when performing the UAir string. The instafloat SDI groundtech is built in! :D

That sounds very interesting actually. Would you say it's practical in the MU?

 

[Xyro77]

KJ, its cool. He just thinks than when we fully CS he can just nair it. In all my time playing peachs, not ONE has done that. Theres a reason why. We just dont stand there and shoot it. We send things in front of it like missles or Zair to take care of the nair. Hes not played a good samus so he does not realize this yet. Its not his fault.



also, that instafloat sdi ground tech is NOT practical......lol next to NO peach does it on command with good accuracy

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I've never seen/experienced Peachs Nair beating out a full charged shot but if it does, it would make the match up less stressful for Peach. Isn't there the problem of other stuff such as missiles which she'll be firing before she fires the charge shot? Most Samus's I've fought do that anyway

Edit: Xyro beat me to it lol

If you're really not happy about airdodging, you could always Toad the charge shot I guess

And the insta Float SDI ground tech is ridiculously unrealistic and unpractical to do in a real match on purpose, but props to anyone who has pulled it off I can't see why Peach would be ground Floating near towards an opponent who is grounded

 

[Xyro77]

yea, if u KNOW a fully CS is coming....run up as close as u can and toad it. Try not to air dodge it cause peach air dodge is horrible

 

[KillerJawz]

Ah okay Xyro, thanks for clearing that up <3.

If you're really not happy about airdodging, you could always Toad the charge shot I guess

And the insta Float SDI ground tech is ridiculously unrealistic and unpractical to do in a real match on purpose, but props to anyone who has pulled it off I can't see why Peach would be ground Floating near towards an opponent who is grounded

For some reason, the toad thing made me laugh really hard lolol.

Also im looking for that zair to bomb thing on yoshi's island, that video was just too hilarious.

EDIT: GOT IT HAHA! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Q4QncSgOT8&feature=related

 

[Metatitan]

So...many peach mains...theorycrafting. If Xyro says it's even then just let it be even, he's played the top peach mains in the past and I doubt anyone's practiced the MU since.

I wanna go to london (like really bad) so if that ever happens I'll hit you up KJ

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I'm only mentioning Toad because Samus is a bit slow, I'm not sure if she'd be fast enough to actually punish a whiffed Toad if Peach is far away or without endangering herself from spores if shes that close. Toad is an extremely haphazard response to almost anything though because it requires you really predict/hope that something is actually going to hit and set the counter off - I wouldn't really recommend it unless you're really clueless

Lmao that was the video I was only about xD Brilliant

I wanna go to london (like really bad) so if that ever happens I'll hit you up KJ

London smells, the North is where its at

 

[KillerJawz]

@Meta, ofc <333333. Sorry im not on aim, my computer died on me recently, I'll get on ebuddy.

@Rick, I was not insulting the idea, my apologies, I just found it hilarious, I have no idea why though.

London does smell, but, when you're from the north, you really cannot say ANYTHING.

 

[White-Peach]

That isn't a fact because it just does not happen, the strong hit of your nair although I've never seen this happen, may beat it out, the whole move in general doesn't. Also, unlike you, we can air dodge :/



That sounds very interesting actually. Would you say it's practical in the MU?

The strong hit beats it out if you use her hands. I was clarifying what Xyro said because it isnt true (then he went crazy.) I'm all for having more information, because blanket statements are usually inaccurate. We all know MK's tornado doesnt go through everything, for example, it has it's weak points.

The Groundfloat SDI groundtech is UNREALISTIC, just like Rickerdy says. But so is believing that you can SDI every DAir/UAir String (you can't SDI the UAir string to escape anyways, you can move, but you can't escape.) You might as well have perfect DI/SDI and powershield everything, then pick Jigglypuff and Rest KO. I just countered unrealistic with unrealistic and nothing more lol~

KJ, its cool. He just thinks than when we fully CS he can just nair it. In all my time playing peachs, not ONE has done that. Theres a reason why. We just dont stand there and shoot it. We send things in front of it like missles or Zair to take care of the nair. Hes not played a good samus so he does not realize this yet. Its not his fault.



also, that instafloat sdi ground tech is NOT practical......lol next to NO peach does it on command with good accuracy

I corrected the statement that "CS goes through all her aerials" and then qualified it with "But of course I know you mean that Samus sets up the CS to come behind something that we're currently preoccupied with, but still" because I'm not stupid about basic setups. Which you acknowledged, then went back to "hurr durr NAir lol".

I've never seen/experienced Peachs Nair beating out a full charged shot but if it does, it would make the match up less stressful for Peach. Isn't there the problem of other stuff such as missiles which she'll be firing before she fires the charge shot? Most Samus's I've fought do that anyway

Edit: Xyro beat me to it lol

If you're really not happy about airdodging, you could always Toad the charge shot I guess

And the insta Float SDI ground tech is ridiculously unrealistic and unpractical to do in a real match on purpose, but props to anyone who has pulled it off I can't see why Peach would be ground Floating near towards an opponent who is grounded

Try it~ It doesnt make things easier because it's unlikely that they're just going to fire it willy-nilly, they're going to send something out in front to lock us into an option, and either hit us during an attack animation or hitstun. For missles though, if they're grounded, you can just dash attack them, which clanks and leaves you in the standing position. Any CS that follows can be (power)shielded and you can still go about your merry way, getting closer and closer. (Just an option if you dont have a turnip to toss at the missle.)

You could be setting up the UAir string (unsuccessfully) and be hit while you try to perform that first UAir (assuming you aren't using the SH DAir way), thereby already trying to fastfall the UAir for SDI during the hit and reactively teching. That part isn't unrealistic if you've been practicing your UAir string English muffin~

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

@Rick, I was not insulting the idea, my apologies, I just found it hilarious, I have no idea why though.

London does smell, but, when you're from the north, you really cannot say ANYTHING.

Oh no none offense taken xD I just thought I'd throw why I mentioned Toad. BLERGUGHGLELE

Ooooooooo. Yorkshire does not smell
Well...country farms do xD

 

[KillerJawz]

To be quite honest, Peach's dair is extremely easy to SDI :/, and you can quite honestly see it coming from a mile away, to compare the two is pretty..... strange tbh :/

@Rick, I lived in Yorkshire for a little while, it smells like tar, which I actually LOVE the smell of :3

 

[White-Peach]

Idk. When someone SDI's out, we usually end the chain early (dropping the float during the DAir to get away), either completing it with UAir>UTilt, or just NAir. You can SDI and save yourself from subsequent DAirs, but I really can't say that many people avoid the followup (at least not much of anyone that I've had the pleasure of playing.)

I guess I equate SDI to escaping, but idk if there's escaping without marth-like invincibility frames~

 

[Purple]

So...many peach mains...theorycrafting. If Xyro says it's even then just let it be even, he's played the top peach mains in the past and I doubt anyone's practiced the MU since.

Well with all the information they gave, I really don't mind stopping here and starting a summary with it.

However, what would Samus ban against Peach? Peach would ban BF, who has better chance of getting a good stage in the initial match?

 

[C.S. Dinah]

Thats called theorycrafting. On paper, peach/samus/superman/joe bob can do ANYTHING with perfect accuracy. I can list 1000000 billion things samus can do to peach and im sure u can list ways to counter it and then i can list ways to counter that and then u list ways to counter my count......see? It goes in circles. Unless you have TRUE exp in a MU its just speculating or frame data comparing or w/e which is wrong in the long term. I am speaking from exp and i am requesting that you ask fellow peach mains(prax/kos) who have a good amount of samus exp to back it up. Plus, im sure you would believe thier word over mine. After all, they understand YOUR character better than i do.




C spyker, come to hobo 25 on june 12th. I will sit down with you for over an hour and lets play. I want you to understand what im trying to talk about. Hell, im even will to play wifi to show u what im trying to convey to these cats.

June12th? I'll try to be there. You'd wifi play to show me the match-up full on? Most appreciated Xyro that'd be awesome

 

[Moozle]

I wouldn't ban BF against Samus. It may be a good stage for Samus, but (at least in my case) the platforms help a ton while fighting her.

I had something to say about Peach's airdodge but I forgot what it was :embarrass

 

[Purple]

I don't see how it'd help. I can only see how samus could use it to her advantage . Does samus have any better stages to use besides BF?

 

[LanceStern]

I disagree that you're safe on a whiffed upB at battlefield killer jaws. We are ALMOST safe, but as a peach secondary I would throw out my own up B to punish the screw attack lag on the top platform.

Other than that the write up is correct

 

[Purple]

you would throw out your own up-b?

but what does that do? It has no (substantial by peach standards) damage output and has cool down lag when you hit the floor, by hitting samus with that, and considering peach is floatier than samus, samus could probably come back and hit with a falling dair, or even worse a d-tilt if she can hit the ground around the time we do.

It's a matter of risk:reward in that scenario, high risk in my opinion, and low reward.

 

[C.S. Dinah]

I wonder if anyone is going to add all of this to the match-up thread......

 

[Purple]

I'll add it all if it's direly needed, I'll just have to re-write it nice and neat

 

[Meru.]

Lol, I should do the write-ups, but I'm very lazy. They will all come in time, it's not even so hard and it doesn't take so much time, but still... I'm lazy xD.

About the stages, BF is not a stage to ban. I for some reason don't like SV vs Samus, but that's probable just me.

So...many peach mains...theorycrafting. If Xyro says it's even then just let it be even, he's played the top peach mains in the past and I doubt anyone's practiced the MU since.

That's a horrible argument... This is called a discussion and thus, people can discuss stuff. I dislike it if people say 'this match-up is a 100-0 (just an example), because I've played X and Y and they agreed too. One should at least give some reasons why he thinks it's the given ratio and then give his/her credentials of beating X and Y, so that others understand that he knows what he's talking about. But even then he/she could be wrong.

 

[Purple]

>.<. if you really want to do it I don't mind letting you..

< subject change >

I actually just posted a read on the doubles board if you're interested in reading, I think I'll do GnW next since he seems to be a very huge character on the double's list.

< / subject change >

 

[KillerJawz]

I disagree that you're safe on a whiffed upB at battlefield killer jaws. We are ALMOST safe, but as a peach secondary I would throw out my own up B to punish the screw attack lag on the top platform.

Other than that the write up is correct

Just when I thought you were cool :/, also, my name has a z in it, and there is no space.

I said literally safe, there is the chance we can get punished, but to throw out your own upb is SUICIDE, and a Samus really isn't going to miss an UpB anyway :/.

Roxy has it right, you are indeed floatier then us, and we WILL punish you for doing such a... well... stupid move :/. If your gonna punish, use Uair or perhaps a turnip if you don't believe you can get to us intime.

You can use my writeup if you wish, it's all been double checked and is pretty much standard. Jesus christ ban Battlefield, I'm not going to say it again after this BAN THE **** STAGE. If your going to take us somewhere.... then let it be.... Castle Siege. If you really want me to explain why, then feel free to ask, and I shall give you every single reason under the sun. If you honestly believe you can take us on Battlefield, then be my guest to try, but I assure you, unless this Samus likes to dair instead of uair, you are not winning.

 

[C.S. Dinah]

I'd go Brinstar just to have an easier/alt way to get by the armed fort and actually KO a bit early.

 

[Purple]

Just when I thought you were cool :/, also, my name has a z in it, and there is no space.

I said literally safe, there is the chance we can get punished, but to throw out your own upb is SUICIDE, and a Samus really isn't going to miss an UpB anyway :/.

Roxy has it right, you are indeed floatier then us, and we WILL punish you for doing such a... well... stupid move :/. If your gonna punish, use Uair or perhaps a turnip if you don't believe you can get to us intime.

You can use my writeup if you wish, it's all been double checked and is pretty much standard. Jesus christ ban Battlefield, I'm not going to say it again after this BAN THE **** STAGE. If your going to take us somewhere.... then let it be.... Castle Siege. If you really want me to explain why, then feel free to ask, and I shall give you every single reason under the sun. If you honestly believe you can take us on Battlefield, then be my guest to try, but I assure you, unless this Samus likes to dair instead of uair, you are not winning.

As much as I feel it's a lot of work on you, I really would like for you to explain why Castle Siege is a good stage for us. I will use your write-up with some changes if you don't mind. I'd like our character boards to be on the same page anyways

 

[Purple]

[Introduction]
I'd like to do shoutouts to people who made the Match-Up write-up possible. The names are written in Alphabetical order (it's actually just everyone who took the time and posted in this thread.) I gave hearts to people I felt helped an awful lot :D

[shout outs!]

Airgemini
C Spyker
Metatitan
Moozle
1 Lucky Pikachu
Rickerdy-doo-da-day
Roxy
White-Peach
Yaaay

:random:
NO-IDea


Killerjawz
LanceStern
Xyro




The Match-Up information is derived from this very thread, as well as Samus' Log Book: Creature Morphology. This matchup will explain Samus' Point of View, along with Peach's. Giving us a basic idea of how the match-up would be played, what to look out for, what to not do, and what steps you can take to the make the matchup that much easier for you!.

We will play through the entire match-up, piece by piece..




[Stage Selection]

If you use stage striking in your tournament, I'd recommend banning Battlefield, as well as Final Destination as your two strikes. While Battlefield in most matchups is an acceptable place to go to for Peach. Samus does far better than you on it. Samus can use extremely small stages and platforms to her advantage much better than you can. Your turnip pulls can be quickly punished by missles or z-airs since the stage is so small, so your turnip game is greatly disadvantaged. Final Destination is a good choice for strike because of the fact that most Samus players are extremely campy, final destination being the camping godsend of all neutrals, this would be the obvious choice for striking.

In the situation that you are not allowed to strike, and can only ban. I feel your best choices are Final Destination and BF still. While Pokemon Stadium 1 is also a good stage for Samus, what's more important is gaining the lead early (by winning the first match), then (sometimes even purposely) losing the counterpick, in order to have the advantage on the third match (your counterpick that expands your strengths, and expands on your opponents weaknesses). Banning a neutral is much better than banning a CP with Samus. Doing this limits her ability to camp you efficiently, and puts you in a better situation for winning the first game.

Now, this help you for the first game and the first game only. But what about if you lose the second match or the get unlucky and lose the first? What's a good stage to use? Well thanks to KillerJawz, we have a definitive answer to that as well




[Castle Siege : Why it's bad for Samus and how to use it]

* - I put stars to show that the wording of a certain statement was either incorrect, or the spelling of a word was incorrect and i changed it accordingly

"This stage has always been a bad one for Samus, regardless of who her opponent is, this is mainly because every single stage that comes up out of the three, are theoretically BAD for Samus. On the first part of the stage, you are entered onto a cramped area with two very low platforms, we cannot camp AT ALL here, so *effectively, you are already in, and you can start wracking up that damage asap. We can use the platforms well, but thats it. You can duck down in that small gap to avoid alot of the rubbish we throw out at you.

On the second part of the stage, you are lowered into a MASSIVE room where there are some statues, each of them carrying a flat platform and two flags at the very top corners of the room. Those statues are the death of Samus. They nerf zair's reach, blow up our missles early and make our moves LINGER (this is better for you, trust me). We cannot spam you here, so once again, you can get in, and wrack up the damage, the platforms at the top are pretty useless to us both unless one of us is attempting to stall the clock, but I guarantee you WE cannot do that on this level, also, you guys can abuse the throw > death thing off the sides better then us because Samus has a whopping frame 17 standing/running and frame 19 pivot grabs.

The final part of the stage brings you onto a small tilting rock, surrounded by lava. This stage is like a smaller final destination, granted, we can keep you out REALLY well here, but when the stage starts to tilt, we struggle to keep up, it effects our spacing significantly and it completely destroys our recovery after we have bomb stalled (you guys can float, so it's easier for you). You guys will beat us on parts 1 and 2, we may win on part 3, but thats really just a matter of spacing."

-KillerJawz

TL;DR - If you can strike, strike BF and FD, if you can only ban, ban one of the two neutral, to increase your chance of not getting one of samus' better stages. When it comes to CPs, along with stages that you enjoy, take the time to practice using Castle Siege, for it is a great stage for you in this matchup.




[The Heat of Battle: What to look for in Samus]

For starters, you need to know how most Samus' will play this Match-Up. Samus is a campy character, using z-airs and missles in order to mask their actual attack. They will take advantage of you having to pull turnips, as well as having to get in, in order to increase their percentage lead as you get hit between scary z-airs, wandering missles, and other problems. In this MU, when you get in on Samus, you need to stay in, and do significant damage. There is a lot of risk pushing yourself into Samus' bubble, however there is no other way (or at least, the chances of you winning is minimal) if you decide to play this MU by staying away: by staying away, you're making Samus' job much easier. Samus' jab is horrible, and outside of her Up-B OoS being a nuisance, you definitely have the advantage in a close-up display of fisticuffs.

You will have a few problems, unless you can air dodge on reaction, z-airs will destroy your floating capabilities entirely. Even if you can air dodge it, please pay close attention to this.

Peach's Airdodge is horrible

You heard it here Peach mains, her air dodge is extremely easy to punish, among the three worst air dodges in the game. You should work your way around missles and z-airs carefully, and refrain from using airdodges when Samus has her CS fully charged. Samus' will take advantage of this GREATLY hitting you with a full CS after a z-air for an easy 25% in their favor. You don't like this fact, and I don't like this fact. So for the best of both of us, we should not float in this MU.

Now let's say you get in on Samus via float, and begin your D-airing frenzy. This can be Screw Attacked (up-b'd) OoS by Samus, and since it sucks you in, even pulling away can be punished in some scenarios. If you get hit by this, at low percentages you 'might' be able to come back and punish with a d-air (even though Peach is floatier than Samus, your D-air can make up for that distance away). At high percentages this is nearly impossible for Peach to punish.**

** - If you'd like, however it's only relatively acceptable at low percentages. You may Up-B Samus' Up-B for quick damage. However note that the damage is minimal, and since samus is heavier than Peach, she can easily come back and hit you with a falling d-air, or worse, a d-tilt. This is a high risk: low reward attack, therefore isn't recommended.

So, in summary, Samus will spam and space z-airs in order to prevent you from pulling turnips or floating to use your aerials. Samus has almost guaranteed setups against Peach with her Zair to CS. Samus can also throw small energy shots to test your reactions, and punish accordingly. All of this makes Peach horrible in this MU right?

Wrong.

Let's discuss What makes Peach good in this Matchup, and what YOU should look for to punish.




[The Heat of Battle Part 2 : Using Peach Effectively]

For starters, knowing how to glide toss is extremely helpful, and almost necessary in this match-up. Please know that the farther you can glide-toss, the better. Remember how we striked and/or banned BF and FD? This increases your chances of picking turnips by a good deal, considering Yoshi's Story's platforms slightly shift as time goes by, making missles potentially fly past you, and Smashville's moving platform is great to pick a turnip and assess the situation (and close enough to the ground where you can safely reach the floor). But back to glide tossing, you can shield Samus' missles, and then glide toss towards her while she's in cool down. This allows you the ability to get in, while not having to rely on the benefits of floating. Remember what we said before: when Peach gets in on Samus, Peach wins very heavily and needs to take advantage of it by dealing large amounts of damage. By decreasing the risk of taking idle damage, while still getting the reward of getting in on your opponent, you can easily steer the match into your favor. Using basic Peach methods work very well on Samus (save a few floating techniques).

• Jab To Grab
• Spaced Fair to Jab
• Spaced Fair to lol Spaced Fair
• Nair OoS

Mix it up, the more you mix up your strengths, the better chance you have of them connecting and dealing good damage.

When Samus is in the air, she has minimal ways of safely attacking from above (save d-air, which is while an effective move, is laggy enough to be punished). U-tilt is a great, 'large' hotbox move to use to do extremely good (by peach standards) damage on Samus. You can also use Up-smash which sucks your opponent in slightly, and hope for a quick kill. Your Turnips come into great play to set you up for more damage and more juggles, you can use your turnips as a reaction test, to see how your opponent will react and punish accordingly, or just toss them up there for damage in general.

Tl;DR - Getting in, and either keep Samus high in the air (not short hop distance) or close to you can make racking up damage easy, along with making your kill moves more accessible to use.




[In Conclusion]

This matchup is extremely fun in my opinion for Peach as well as Samus. The MU generally goes like this..

1. Samus outspaces Peach
2. Peach takes significant damage
3. Peach gets in
4. Samus takes significant damage
5. They both reach high percentages, then either character dies.
6. Dying character comes back, and uses invincibility to position themselves to their advantage (even potentially killing their opponent).
7. Next character dies. Rinse and repeat from step one.

Samus gets to really take advantage of their spacing tools against Peach. While Peach gets to use her jabs, safe F-air's, etc. more than she would in High-Top tier matchups. It's a matter of which player is smarter than the other, and if they played the entire game correctly (banning the correct stages, playing the MU correctly, mindgames, etc.)

50:50 Even

Tell me if I said anything wrong!! Or if I forgot anything!

 

[Meru.]

Omg, that's a great write-up, seriously great job @_@. Here, some hearts for you:

I should really start working on my own write-ups...

 

[KillerJawz]

That was without a doubt, the sexiest write up I have ever seen. Also <3.

Heres the Castle Siege writeup:

This stage has always been a bad one for Samus, regardless of who her opponent is, this is mainly because every single stage that comes up out of the three, are theoretically BAD for Samus. On the first part of the stage, you are entered onto a cramped area with two very low platforms, we cannot camp AT ALL here, so effectivly, you are already in, and you can start wracking up that damage asap. We can use the platforms well, but thats it. You can duck down in that small gap to avoid alot of the rubbish we throw out at you.

On the second part of the stage, you are lowered into a MASSIVE room where there are some statues, each of them carrying a flat platform and two flags at the very top corners of the room. Those statues are the death of Samus. They nerf zair's reach, blow up our missles early and make our moves LINGER (this is better for you, trust me). We cannot spam you here, so once again, you can get in, and wrack up the damage, the platforms at the top are pretty useless to us both unless one of us is attempting to stall the clock, but I guarantee you WE cannot do that on this level, also, you guys can abuse the throw > death thing off the sides better then us because Samus has a whopping frame 17 standing/running and frame 19 pivot grabs.

The final part of the stage brings you onto a small tilting rock, surrounded by lava. This stage is like a smaller final destination, granted, we can keep you out REALLY well here, but when the stage starts to tilt, we struggle to keep up, it effects our spacing significantly and it completely destroys our recovery after we have bomb stalled (you guys can float, so it's easier for you). You guys will beat us on parts 1 and 2, we may win on part 3, but thats really just a matter of spacing.

Hope that was of some use.

 

[Purple]

It definitely was, I inputted it into the overall re-write and gave proper credit to you. I hope you don't mind

 

[KillerJawz]

Oh no that's fine. Many thanks <3.

 

[LanceStern]

Just when I thought you were cool :/, also, my name has a z in it, and there is no space.

I said literally safe, there is the chance we can get punished, but to throw out your own upb is SUICIDE, and a Samus really isn't going to miss an UpB anyway :/.

Roxy has it right, you are indeed floatier then us, and we WILL punish you for doing such a... well... stupid move :/. If your gonna punish, use Uair or perhaps a turnip if you don't believe you can get to us intime.

You can use my writeup if you wish, it's all been double checked and is pretty much standard. Jesus christ ban Battlefield, I'm not going to say it again after this BAN THE **** STAGE. If your going to take us somewhere.... then let it be.... Castle Siege. If you really want me to explain why, then feel free to ask, and I shall give you every single reason under the sun. If you honestly believe you can take us on Battlefield, then be my guest to try, but I assure you, unless this Samus likes to dair instead of uair, you are not winning.

Oh I didn't mean to offend you. Just I didn't think that part was correct or what I would do to punish a whiffed Samus Up B. I didn't recognize you said literally, my bad.

The write up was good though

 

[Eddie G]

Eh...I personally find BF to be one of my strongest stages against Samus. =/
FD I'll agree to being a tad difficult against a good Samus.

But amazing writeup nonetheless. The effort definitely paid off. :3

 

[Purple]

Eh...I personally find BF to be one of my strongest stages against Samus. =/
FD I'll agree to being a tad difficult against a good Samus.

But amazing writeup nonetheless. The effort definitely paid off. :3

Well, you can always ban FD against Samus instead of BF. I'm just saying what are the two best options.

 

[Eddie G]

Well, you can always ban FD against Samus instead of BF. I'm just saying what are the two best options.

Oh I know, I'm just saying I disagree with BF being the second best strike/ban option. What about Smashville? In this respective matchup, where both characters aren't as ridiculously good on it as any of the top tiers, why wasn't it mentioned as a borderline second FD option for Samus to use? Because it certainly is.

BF better serves Peach in closing the distance both horizontally and vertically, proper use of the platforms helps to defend against homing missile lead-ins and followups, and Zair isn't as pesky here as it would be on most horizontally expansive stages due to Peach being able to level her positioning based on the three platforms.

In short: it's less of a camp frenzy on BF and that takes away from Samus' main strength in this matchup.

I'm from the Midwest, wacky matchups are our forte. <3

 

[C.S. Dinah]

Awesome read! I feel that with this bit of insight I may prove to be a match for Samus now.

Roxy you're in charge of the match-ups as well as the whole thread. Make more evaulations. I think I need serious help against DK,

 

[KillerJawz]

Samus' main strength is camping on a stage like FD, correct, but you really can't handle uair pressure to well, seeing as your dair hits on frame 12. Once your above us, your not coming down. Also, you havn't played a good Samus if you think zair isn't as pesky here. It's at its BEST here. We can do it THROUGH THE STAGE, without even the risk of getting punished. We can platform missle cancel, allowing the spam to come out even FASTER. I understand where your coming from, the platforms will make it more bearable for you, but your looking at Samus as a camper, not as an aerial beast. She can hold herself in the air FAR better on battlefield then any other stage.

Smashville is really a mixed bag. That platform really can screw us over but we get beaten REALLY hard when it comes to an aerial game, because it is constantly moving, if we get trapped on that platform, you can easily fair us off it.

Believe me, take a GOOD Samus to BF, and you die.

 

[Eddie G]

I see. I suppose I'll reserve full judgment on it until after I've played Xyro or Sago. But as of now from the Samus players I've played a while back (since they're few and far in between...), I'd personally strike/ban Smashville over Battlefield in the matchup.

However, I never take credit from Samus' aerial pressure game, I know she can contend with Peach especially from below. But assuming that as the only case would also be discrediting the spacing of both players and is one main reason why I'm not a big fan of theorycraft in the first place. In theorycraft, both sides are assumed to do whatever is explained at 100% efficiency and that is never the case in actual tournament play.

 

[KillerJawz]

Yes you make a very valid point. Striking Smashville is fine with me. So basically, you have three stages which you can ban effectively.

Are you okay with that so we can finally end this discussion (which albeit, was actually fun)?

 

[Eddie G]

Sure, sounds good to me. :3

 

[Metatitan]

Uair pressure from Samus? Ehhhhhh this isn't ZSS we're talking about here, samus' uair is SDI'able and pretty easy to see coming since she's floaty. I've SDI'd it where I end up bellow samus and I hit her with my own Uair, guess it's opponent dependent with the factor being their SDI.