Moveset changes?

[Morbi]

What? I don't follow this logic at all.

The logic is that if Toon Link is a port from Brawl or a clone of Link (or both) that he is a wasted slot simply because this roster is supposed to be more refined. Sakurai said that Brawls roster was about as feasible as it could be, he wants the characters to feel unique and it is troublesome to develop a huge roster. Meaning for Smash 4 we wont be seeing all Melee and Brawl veterans return and that Smash 4 will have about the size of Brawl (obviously a few more, but not significantly more). With this in mind, many wanted Toon Link cut, or at least they thought he was the most likely to be cut based on his role in the game.

Essentially he wants the roster to not have "wasted" character slots. He views Toon Link as a waste because we already have Link. However, he wouldn't view Toon Link as a waste if Sakurai implemented interesting moves that only Toon Link possess. He believes that a character more interesting or unique would be cut because Toon Link was added.

I actually do agree with him to an extent. If someone like Ike gets cut, but someone like Toon Link stays... I would be upset. However, I view Toon Link as good news. News that Sakurai will not have to cut as many characters as some are anticipating.

 

[Sonsa]

Absolutely! There is absolutely no reason they couldn't imagine some unique moves for this guy, he has no reason to be a clone! It's not as though they love the character but he's got nothing going for him. Hopefully they change his UP-B to Deku Leaf, grounded UP-B to spin attack that can travel but leaves you dizzy if you go for too long, forward smash to Skull Hammer, his grappling hook for something, maybe manipulating the wind, and plenty more!

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

New shield design looks nice too.

 

[DownWitDaWaveDash]

Would appreciate if they just gave Link Toon Links mobility as a boost. I smell a wasted char slot... New trend of smash games- must have a good link and a sucky link.

 

[PlayerOneTyler]

Since the Deku Leaf isn't his Up Special, I'm kinda hoping the implement it as a glide, like Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard had in Brawl.

 

[Sonsa]

Since the Deku Leaf isn't his Up Special, I'm kinda hoping the implement it as a glide, like Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard had in Brawl.

Oh hey, that wouldn't be too bad!

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

Since the Deku Leaf isn't his Up Special, I'm kinda hoping the implement it as a glide, like Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard had in Brawl.

Is it still Spin Attack/Hurricane Spin?

 

[PlayerOneTyler]

Is it still Spin Attack/Hurricane Spin?

Yep, it's in one of the pictures on the Dojo.

 

[Toon link04]

my speculated moveset:
Foward B

creates a mini shock wave around link and if link hits someone with the sweet spot(the middle of the hammer)he will deal 27%,if they get hit by the shock wave then they take 5% and if they get hit in the air it will smash them down dealing 6% digging them into the ground and if toon link hit the with the sweet spot the add 27%(only possible to get the sweet spot on ground)on the air he dives down(like if he did a jump slash)and if he hits the stage itll stun opponets for 3 seconds

Method of grabing

Down throw(no pick)
Smashes his enemie down to the ground 4 time dealing 5%per hit and the enemie can excape while being smashed to the ground
Pressing A while holding an enemie
He will hit them whith his sword(3% per hit)
Foward throw
He will rap his enemie up and the will throw him/her spinning like a top(4% and reverses controls for 5 seconds)
Up throw
The same as brawl

aditions to the bow

(yes that is how the light arrow in the wind waker looks like)
While using the bow press the down taunt,side taunt or normal taunt to switch arrows while using the bow(once you use it the next time you use the bow youll still be using that arrow
Uses/effects:
Ice arrows:
Freezes enemies upon contact and does 16%(5secs and spaming buttons helps getting out) when it falls on the ground itll stay for 10 seconds if a character steps on it they will be frozen(2 secs and does 5%)
Fire arrows:
Burns opponets upon contect(20%)and if steped on while on the ground it deals 3%
Light arrows:
Shocks oppenets upon contact for 6 secs and deals 27% if steped on shocks the enemie for 3 secs but you cant use more than 2 at a time

 

[DakotaBonez]

Crawling! Cmon that was a big deal in Wind Waker! Let Toon link Crawl!

 

[Sonsa]

Crawling! Cmon that was a big deal in Wind Waker! Let Toon link Crawl!

Yeah! With ya 100% Make the squeaky noise too!

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

He should use the Spirit Flute in some way.

 

[greenluigiman2]

The logic is that if Toon Link is a port from Brawl or a clone of Link (or both) that he is a wasted slot simply because this roster is supposed to be more refined. Sakurai said that Brawls roster was about as feasible as it could be, he wants the characters to feel unique and it is troublesome to develop a huge roster. Meaning for Smash 4 we wont be seeing all Melee and Brawl veterans return and that Smash 4 will have about the size of Brawl (obviously a few more, but not significantly more). With this in mind, many wanted Toon Link cut, or at least they thought he was the most likely to be cut based on his role in the game.

Essentially he wants the roster to not have "wasted" character slots. He views Toon Link as a waste because we already have Link. However, he wouldn't view Toon Link as a waste if Sakurai implemented interesting moves that only Toon Link possess. He believes that a character more interesting or unique would be cut because Toon Link was added.

I actually do agree with him to an extent. If someone like Ike gets cut, but someone like Toon Link stays... I would be upset. However, I view Toon Link as good news. News that Sakurai will not have to cut as many characters as some are anticipating.

You must have misunderstood my post.

 

[Morbi]

You must have misunderstood my post.

Was it sarcasm? A little hard to detect on the internet.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Was it sarcasm? A little hard to detect on the internet.

Look at the underlined words. How can you go from "IF" and "RUMOR" to "I can safely say"?

 

[Oniric Spriter]

Since the Deku Leaf isn't his Up Special, I'm kinda hoping the implement it as a glide, like Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard had in Brawl.

Sounds even better than just having the Deku Leaf.

 

[Eagle]

I don't think he'll get a big moveset overhaul, nor do I think he needs one.
Tink feels so drastically different than Link without needing different moves.

That's bull. It doesn't matter how different he feels, if he uses a bow, boomerang, bombs and a spin attack same as regular link when he has access to a slew of unique weapons and items that could make both Link's different and better representing their individual games Sakurai is being lazy and it's unfortunate he was given this role again.

 

[Knight Dude]

It's possible that he'll keep his Brawl moveset. When playing as him he is different enough from Adult Link. But I'd like to see the Skull Hammer and Deku Leaf implemented somehow. Like Using the Deku Leaf to glide slowly like Pit or Meta-Knight. And using the Skull Hammer for his Down Smash and Forward Smash.

 

[Curious Villager]

To be honest, all I really want to see implemented on Toon Link are the elemental arrows, the Hurricane Spin, the after mid air spin attack Deku Leaf, crawling, maybe some different sword swings and perhaps some bombchu's that can be used along with his regular bombs. I'm not really sure I would like to see any drastic changes on him like a random deku leaf, Skull Hammer or Metal Boots just for the sake of it. (I guess I would need to play it for myself how well they have been implemented and all) But I suppose that's just my opinion as a Toon Link main and the fact he already plays great enough as he his...

 

[Moon Monkey]

Posted is in the Toon Link Thread. Some changes I hope Toon Link will receive (Note: Not all of these changes at once, but some):

• Deku Leaf Glide
• Deku Leaf Gust
• Hurricane Spin Attack (Toon Link now can move while doing Spin Attack (Think DK's grounded recovery))
• Crawling
• Wind's Requiem (Similar to FLUDD but with air currents)
• Ballad of Gales stage entrance. (Way better than emerging from a bomb explosion)

I just want Toon Link to do SOMETHING dealing with wind. He is the Wind Waker after all.

 

[GodOfSocks]

I'd like to see fire and ice arrows, but overall I'm just happy he's in the game.

 

[Tepig2000]

If I was Sakurai, I would make him like that:

Keep his up smash, neutral aerial, forward aerial, back aerial, forward throw, back throw, down aerial, forward smash, down tilt, dash attack and down smash the same because they are different enough from Link's.

For his specials:

He can switch between fire and ice arrows;

His Boomerang is the same;

His up special, when fully charged in the ground, turns into the hurricane spin.

His down special is the same;

His Final Smash is summoning a tornado with the Wind Waker.

 

[ryuu seika]

I'll admit I'd like to see some change to Toon Link to make him more unique but the only specific ones I really think are needed are to his Up B:

-Move comes out quicker.
-Move is shorter.
-Slightly higher upward momentum when used in the air to account for this.
-No upward momentum at all if used on the ground.
-Shorter ending lag.
-Long dizzy state if used 3 times in a row.

In other words, it becomes far more spammable at the cost of a small amount of recovery height and a punish if you really do spam it.

 

[Curious Villager]

Well guess the Bombchu's are out of the question, wouldn't have minded them as a grounded way of using the bombs for Toon Link....

 

[BigHairyFart]

Well guess the Bombchu's are out of the question, wouldn't have minded them as a grounded way of using the bombs for Toon Link....

That wouldn't really make sense since bombchu didn't appear in Wind Waker. I forget about PH, so I could be wrong on this.

 

[Mota]

Disappointed his moveset hasn't gone any big changes, most likely I won't main him in Smash 4 then.

At least he still has his godly Bair

 

[Curious Villager]

That wouldn't really make sense since bombchu didn't appear in Wind Waker. I forget about PH, so I could be wrong on this.

He had the ability to use them in Phantom Hourglass yes, hence why I thought that it would have been a nice additional option for him.

Oh well, with customization being a bigger thing than we though. I would at least hope that Toon Link will at least get the ability to use the Fire and Ice arrows as well as the Hurricane Spin among other things now.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Did we see his boomerang in the Direct, or is it still possible that's changed?

 

[BigHairyFart]

Did we see his boomerang in the Direct, or is it still possible that's changed?

He used it briefly on FD, and it still had the wind effect. He hit Marth at like, 30% from about three feet away, and the knockback has clearly been increased drastically. However, we did not see if it still just pulls people/items on the way back or hurts them like it should.

 

[Curious Villager]

He used it briefly on FD, and it still had the wind effect. He hit Marth at like, 30% from about three feet away, and the knockback has clearly been increased drastically. However, we did not see if it still just pulls people/items on the way back or hurts them like it should.

Wind effect? Since when could Toon Link's boomerang do that? Are you perhaps thinking of Link and his Gale Boomerang?

 

[BigHairyFart]

Wind effect? Since when could Toon Link's boomerang do that? Are you perhaps thinking of Link and his Gale Boomerang?

****, my bad, I posted this in the wrong thread. Yes, I was talking about Link, silly me.

 

[fenyx4]

Did we see his boomerang in the Direct, or is it still possible that's changed?

Here's a GIF of the Super Smash Bros. 4 Gale Boomerang that I found in another thread that hails its return..

 

[BigHairyFart]

Yes, that's exactly what I was talking about, and as you can see, Marth goes flying much farther than we would have thought he should at that percentage.
Anyway, back on Toon Link, it seems odd that we haven't seen his boomerang in action yet, but this is the first we saw Link's boomerang, and we knew about Link far longer than we knew about Toon Link.

 

[Curious Villager]

He still has his Boomerang too.

 

[CURRY]

Well... someone told me to post this. This is like my third time. ^-^;;

So... wow, boomerangs are in. >.> That's... so awesome! (disappointing)
Definitely my main until people get better.

http://youtu.be/7xUWnQu2Grs?t=20m24s
ZSuit deflected a Gordo with what seemed like an ftilt.
If this applies to all projectiles, and to many attacks, TL is kinda screwed.

http://youtu.be/7xUWnQu2Grs?t=6m58s
TL's Fair, Bair, and Nair seem relatively the same. Fair seems significantly faster, and nair is a *little* faster. I don't know about Bair. Then again, this game is supposed to be in between the speed of Melee and Brawl.

http://youtu.be/7xUWnQu2Grs?t=12m48s
Jab and Ftilt look the same.

I literally copy/pasted a few of my past words. -_-

Now the only thing we need is the clawshot, and the ability to Zair out of airdodge.
And ibombs.
B-reversals are in though! I remember someone mentioning that somewhere....

 

[Curious Villager]

Ah well. I guess his default moveset might still be the same. I'll still be looking forward to his costumizable moveset though and see how far one can differentiate Toon Link and Link from each other from there.

Hopefully we can give him the Fire and Ice Arrows and the Hurricane Spin from there...

 

[BigHairyFart]

Hopefully we can give him the Fire and Ice Arrows and the Hurricane Spin from there...

I would be appalled if we can't do that.

 

[CURRY]

Lel. I don't know much about PM because really. I play Brawl because that's what my friends play, and I want to beat my friends.

Also wow, dat knockback on the Gale Boomerang....
Yeah, so I looked back in the thread and saw that thread about Link's boomerang. >.>
Well, but maybe knockback has different mechanics than in the other games. Weren't there a LOT of moves with pretty nice knockback that seemed like it didn't fit?
Well, maybe like, there's just a lot of moves like that, or maybe something like the knockback not changing much at higher percentages because the base knockback is already pretty high at the beginning.

I don't know. The only thing I watched for in that Nintendo Direct was TL's moveset, and a few other things.
Welp. I guess it's already mentioned, but since TL's boomerang, bombs, arrows, and up special are covered, I'm guessing that these two weird pictures
http://www.smashbros.com/images/character/toon_link/screen-4.jpg
http://www.smashbros.com/images/character/toon_link/screen-8.jpg
are either just taunts or idle animations.
If that's the only difference, then, welp.
But lel TL's Dair hasn't been shown yet. In my nub days, Dair was the cheapest thing ever. It was the reason I mained TL as a nub, and when I joined the Smash scene, I mained TL just because he used to be my nub main, and so I thought I knew his moveset already (HA)
I mean, Sakurai did something to Pika's thunder.... maybe he did something to the Dair.
So pretty much, I really hope TL still has a spike. -_-

EDIT:

Wait a minute. Maybe Sakurai included TL as a "clone" BECAUSE he was such a popular nub main!!!
I've never thought of this.
Poor Sakurai. Getting a ton of hate for including TL. :<

 

[BigHairyFart]

That second picture is a smash charge.

 

[CURRY]

Ahhhhhhhhhh. That makes a TON of sense.