New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Conviction]

Whack as hell.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

-honks-

Anyway, as I said before, Bowser Jr. has as much chances of being a clone as Shadow Mario does. Albeit, there's no way for Shadow Mario to be exactly like Mario since he lacks a FLUDD. The thing is, what the hell does Bowser Jr. have besides one notable weapon that Bowser doesn't already have??

I could see Shadow Mario having similarities to Mario via his A moves, but only a few. He has an extendable weapon, that's variety alone.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

It would be a stupid move if Nintendo made Bowser Jr. a clone. He's nowhere near as strong as Bowser, and he has shown to be quick on his feet on a couple games.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sounds exactly like Young/Toon Link to me. Huh.

Once again, what seperates Bowser from Bowser Jr. besides a few gadgets like the paintbrush when it comes to moves?

 

[Oasis_S]

"Besides the thing that makes him unique, how is he unique?"

 

[yani_]

I can picture Jr. being a fire type squirtle with a paintbrush

 

[Shorts]

Even if Junior was a Semi clone, he would be the most interesting semi clone we have EVER had. Taking a large, slow, tall character, and making him a small, medium weight, quick character is something we have never seen. Besides, he wouldn't even be a TRUE clone. Let's remember true clones are, as far as I can tell, dead.

What about the links?

**** the Links. They're a disgrace. Well, Toon Link is. He has about 400000000000 times more weapons than Junior, and still manages to be a freaking clone. HOW MUCH different is Toon Links moveset when compared to regular Link?

 

[Disfunkshunal]

What about the links?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

What about the links?

They're about as different as Bowser Jr. is to Bowser. As in having a few different items and their ages. That's... it.

 

[Shorts]

They're about as different as Bowser Jr. is to Bowser. As in having a few different items and their ages. That's... it.

Stupidest thing I have heard you say, ever. I don't even want to go further than that.

"The only difference between Krystal and Fox is, their sex. That's it"

 

[Conviction]

I agree with Shortie on this one.

 

[Oasis_S]

Stupidest thing I have heard you say, ever. I don't even want to go further than that.

"The only difference between Krystal and Fox is, their sex. That's it"

"Besides Krystal's staff, how is she unique from Fox?"

 

[Disfunkshunal]

@shortie
I was referring to this


Taking a large, slow, tall character, and making him a small, medium weight, quick character is something we have never seen

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

disfunkshunal has it right. That's really the only differences between the Links in Smash. Their sizes. They have slightly different moves, but that's it.

There's really no way of saying that Bowser Jr. wouldn't get this fate either. Since his entire role is usually an expy of Bowser. Not that surprising, acting like his Dad and all.

 

[Shorts]

Hyperfalcon, you need to quote. You sounded like you just said "The only difference between Bowser and Bowser Jr. is their age and items" Totally disregaurding the fact that they are totally different individuals who are simply father and son of the same race. Pretty much, I'm my dad. You're your dad. That's what it sounded like you said.

Remember LINK AND TOON LINK ARE THE SAME PERSON. DIFFERENT AGES. Unlike Junior and Bowser.


Discofunctioning, I don't think the difference between Link and Toon Link is nearly as extreme as Bowser and Junior COULD be.

 

[Big-Cat]

I just thought of something. Let's say there's a demand for Skyward Sword Impa. Why not, as a compromise, lend some of her abilities to Sheik since she'd likely play in a similar style? I'm curious as to how that epic looking blue attack would be applied. Perhaps something like this:

This attack might not look like much, but I know very well what's it's capable of in the SF games and in real life. In the SF games, it pushes the opponent back with a lot of force (or chi if you will) and knockback. The EX version also does wall bounces.

Requoting this from earlier. Seems like a fun idea for Sheik.

One thing I forgot to mention that in SF, that attack can nullify fireballs. I was thinking that, since Impa uses it this way, that the attack can also be used to absorb attacks with recoverable hyper armor and that Sheik can attack safely. Basically, she would be parrying with a temporary loss in health with an open spot in return.

 

[Johnknight1]

Doesn't matter. Still a Canon character.

Yes she is canon. No one is denying that. However, she hasn't had any role in a Mario game since then. Currently all four Mario characters have appeared in just about every canon Mario game since Super Mario Bros.

Toad has appeared in every canon Mario game to my knowledge. Bowser Jr. has appeared in every canon Mario game since his creation in Super Mario Sunshine (minus Super Mario Land 3D). Paper Mario has 4 games of his own (1 isn't out yet obviously), and each has sold very well.

Again, Daisy isn't anywhere nearly as important as Toad or Bowser Jr., and she doesn't have a spin-off role anywhere near as big as Paper Mario does in his self-titled series.

None of his non-canon games are garbage though except a select few, and that's YMMV at best. Thus, I don't see what that has to do with it whatsoever.

In my opinion, most Mario Party games are garbage, and most of the sports games (the Soccer, Baseball, Basketball, Tennis, whatever other sports Mario plays, and nearly all of the recent Mario Kart games) don't have much replay value. All in all 5 years down the road remembering these games is like trying to differentiate several kinds of food with water down salt. You just can't tell the difference after a while.

Plus I think most of us don't want to see Smash Bros. become like a Mario Sports game party game. Is smash a party game? Yes. But it is also a fighting game, a platformer, a third person shooter, an adventure game, and above all, a unique experience unlike any other. Smash Bros. is a different animal entirely. Thousands of people play smash bros devoutly for years. Aside from a small group of people, I can say that for a Mario sports game, most Mario Kart games, or Mario Party..

Also, when was the last time a character who is only playable in a spin-off Mario party/sports game made it in smash bros=???

The people who play them, of course. You act like they would forget about them when they liked playing as them. Just because they're not canon means absolutely nothing.

There are 40 trillion Mario characters playable in those games. There is a freak thing that shoots eggs out of its' mouth without a gender (Birdo,) a bunch of turtles (Koopas of all kinds), guys that ride on clouds (Lakitus or whatever they are called), a bunch of flying thieves (Shy Guys), a bunch of brown guys who for some reason can die from being stepped on (Goombas), ghosts (Boos), plants that attack you and can eat you (Piranha Plants), things that sting you (Bees), and a guy made of friggen Metal (Metal Mario).

Why the heck would I remember a half Luigi/Wario mix compared to those characters=??? Waluigi is best-known as "part of the gang" in all the Mario Party, Kart, and sport titles, just like how Shy Guy, Petey Piranha, and now Queen Bee will be remembered.

Many people haven't played Mario RPG or even the first game. In fact, many have only played Galaxy and just Mario Party 8. So why would they remember characters that were only in RPG if they never played it? Oh, wait, they wouldn't. Also, Mario Party games are pretty easy to find, and the characters aren't hard to be known of. Waluigi's pretty well known for good reasons.

People remember Mario Party 8=??? Tell me, do you remember any specific differences between Mario Party 5, 6, 7, and 8=???

Super Mario RPG is a cult game, and a retro game. Sakurai seems to cater to them. *points to the Ice Climbers* Smash Bros isn't about having just popular characters-but "unique characters that make you want to play the game." That's Sakurai's words, not mine. Again, smash bros has many unique retro characters, and a character like Geno fits in that category.

The Ice Climbers fit in that category (retro), albeit Ice Climber is a garbage game. Unlike Waluigi they are unique. They made a lot of people want to play smash, including me, because of how unique they looked. Again, people want to play as characters with a unique play style and unique move set, which caters to characters like the Ice Climbers who have been forgotten. Personally, it makes the game more unique to me. Having a smash bros game with only "popular" characters would be dumb.

The Mario Party's weren't forgettable, nor were the Kart's, etc. You're only speaking strictly for yourself. I actually remember characters from games I play. A lot of people only play the side games since they're all multiplayer. Not everybody cares about a single player experience, only doing it for unlocking if needed. Mario Party, Kart, Tennis, Golf, they were pretty much MADE for multiplayer.

Mario canon games > Mario Party, Sports series, and Kart. Sakurai doesn't add playable characters because they are in spin off sports games, but because they have a big role in the canon Mario series, or they could add something to the smash bros. series. Besides let's be real: the spin-off party, sport, and kart games are popular because the canon games rock. And let's be honest again: The canon games and RPG spin-offs are way better than the spin-off party, sport, and kart games.

Urgh, I can't believe I'm even talking about Mario Party games post-N64.

I usually don't forget games, but the last few Mario Karts seem all alike (DS aside, which was amazing). The same goes with all the Mario Party games post the N64, and the two console Mario Tennis games (the handheld ones were better). I have an incredibly good memory. I still remember old friend's phone numbers that I last called at least a half decade ago, if not a decade ago. Meanwhile the early Mario Party and Mario Kart games I remember very clearly. Again, this is just my opinion, but I think a lot of other people feel this way too.

In smash bros the characters are much more unique compared to Mario Party. In Mario Party all of the characters have the same moves, and the only difference between them is they look different. In Smash Bros. characters have all kinds of unique moves.

Presuming this actually matters since Waluigi is pretty damn well known. Which we both know is true.

Being well-known doesn't get you in alone in smash. You need to be one of the most unique Nintendo characters not currently playable in smash to be a smash bros newcomer. Just look at the list of playable characters, and count the characters you didn't know of before smash.

How many people knew who everyone but Wario and Luigi were among your list? Not many. R.O.B. was only known due to a side game, funnily enough. Few people remember the other three, and a lot of people didn't know who Marth is. Thus, yeah, Waluigi is more well known and would be an easy choice because people do INDEED want to play as him, proving your point wrong.

I'm not arguing whether people know a character or not. My question is how many people would want to play a smash bros game because of a particular character. Tons of people probably bought a smash bros game just to play Luigi or Wario. They always look fun to play as, as do all of the smash bros character (even the clones). Well... maybe that troll Pichu aside!

Some people would definitely want Waluigi in smash. Sure. But would they buy the game just because he is playable=??? NO! And if they did, it would be a much smaller amount of people compared to people who bought the game because of any character currently in smash.

ROB also starred in two games, and was obviously a very popular and successfully and popular NES (and Famicon?) attachment.

A lot of people. A lot of people bought Mario Party as well. Why? Because it was a great fun game. Whether you find it fun or not doesn't mean it didn't get bought. As I said before, you're trying to speak for an actual minority, not the majority here. The majority have played the spin-offs as is.

Again, do you remember the differences between Mario Party 5, 6, and 7 like you know the differences of Smash 64, Melee, or Brawl=???

Many people have played the spin-off Mario games, but not many people remember the differences between them like they do with smash bros. Smash bros, again, is a whole different and more interesting animal.

Toad was only playable in a select few games(that is, the REAL Toad, not a random one to our knowledge, meaning... Super Mario Bros. 2). He's also part of a moveset. Waluigi is playable in more, meaning, YEAH, people do want to play as him. Also, what makes you think people know more about retro characters when they're just starting in gaming? Mario Party, Kart, they're pretty easy to find compared to those other games. Waluigi's just that well known.

Toad is playable in Mario games that matter. In Super Mario Bros. 2 he has his own unique moves.
Waluigi is playable in games where he has all the same moves as everyone else. Literally the most original idea Sakurai could come up with his move set is Waluigi using a tennis racket and a golf club. What else is there to add=???

A voice actor, a movie, the guy who appears in over a hundred spinoffs and cameos who does more than just fight a bad guy. His personality might not be much, but he sure as hell does a lot. He's more than just a hero anyway. And so far, we only think the spin-offs aren't canon. That's really just how we see it. What would happen if they WERE by Word of God? See the problem here? There's no proof either way. This isn't like with the Zelda CDi games which were actually said to not be canon.

People remember Mario in a much more simple way then you make it out to be. I remember, for example, Darth Vader, as the villain in Star Wars, and Luke Skywalker's father. That's it. That is really all you need to know (those God awful prequels that need to be forgotten aside).

Again, there's been no smash bros. character added who is only a "supporting character" in party games.

Then perhaps you should play them before saying nobody cares about it. Because frankly, people DO. You're only speaking for yourself. All of them had their own charm. Whether or not you like them doesn't ultimate matter, as people DO like them.

Most people who play Mario Party are too young to buy the game with money they worked for.

Sakurai and the smash bros development team don't care about characters just because they are in Mario Party. They want a character that adds something to the game and are unique. And trust me, there are a heck of a lot of characters more unique than Waluigi that aren't in smash.

Again, this isn't about popularity only, it's about uniqueness as well. ROB is a heck of a lot less popular than Waluigi was pre-Brawl, but he definitely made a better smash bros. character than Waluigi ever would.

You'd be dead wrong. No matter what game exists, SOMEBODY will read deeply into it as much as possible. That's how it is.

Why the heck would you deep read into a party game with no story=??? That's pretty... out there.

Again, does Waluigi have popularity? Yes. Does he have a fan base? Yes. Does he have some unique features? His laugh and not a whole lot more. Are there a ton more unique characters that would add more to smash? Yes.

Expect him to be an Assist Trophy. He's still got no chance in my eyes, and nothing will change that. I said that pre-Brawl, and I will say that again.

How did you know it failed? Also, that's his official backstory to what we know. He's been worthy a spot for a long time, as he's nearly among the main characters in how important he's become to the story. If not one of the main secondaries. Waluigi just has a hatred of Luigi. Sure, he could use more personality. Most Mario characters need more, anyway. But hey, personality isn't Nintendo's biggest strong point, clearly.

If a canon Zelda game sold over 200,000 units it would be deemed a failure, and nowhere near as important as any of the Zelda canon games.

Again, Tingle isn't still hasn't appeared in a canon Zelda game in about 6 or 7 years. Heck, even Skull Kid has appeared in a more recent game than Tingle. If he were important he would have appeared in a game more recent than that. He seems to have... disappeared! o.O

Have you played Tingle's game? If not, you saying it's lame is an utter lie due to you never playing it. Don't speak of stuff you've never played. Yeah, it MIGHT look lame, but you don't know that firsthand. We have a term for this: "Complaining about Games you've never played". It's a matter of FanDumb. So until you play those games, don't you be praising/complaining about them. It's pretty much Trolling. I have yet to play the Tingle game, and I actually want to. I don't know how I can, since I think my friend might've bought it, and maybe I can borrow it. But I sure as hell want to play every Zelda game atleast once.

There's nothing unique looking about it to me. I'm not trolling, I'm giving my opinion. There are too many good games, in my opinion, to waste my time on average game, with the only exception being if there is something awesome or unique about an average game. Again, that is just my opinion.

And yes, YouTube is full of idiots.(myself included) But that's beside the point. Not much you can do but flag 'em.

Youtube people are pretty dumb (I wouldn't call you an idiot by any means). I like the guys who have... "different" opinions like yours (which could be probably labelled to most everyone here!), but most of them are just "WTF? X character is totally popular and better than the characters you wanted" when I was talking about a character's likelihood. If I got my desired smash bros roster there would be a heck of a lot more Metal Gear characters.

I still love how I have the most viewed pre-Brawl character prediction video and the most right. I'm still upset at myself for randomly forgetting Captain Olimar from that list. I kicked myself for a long time for forgetting Captain Olimar in that video! The only characters that made it in Brawl that made it into the roster were Olimar by accidentally not including him, the Pokémon Trainer, and ROB; I put the video on youtube a few minutes after Ike was confirmed in Brawl, the first newcomer confirmed on the dojo (he was on my list before that; I had 45 characters).

 

[Oasis_S]

Was it really worth it, John.

 

[yani_]

People remember Mario Party 8=??? Tell me, do you remember any specific differences between Mario Party 5, 6, 7, and 8=???

Just wanna answer this to test myself!

Mario Party 5 had the addition of Toad, Boo , and Koopa Kid. I think they cut DK from this one. And I think this one introduced the use of "candy"

Mario Party 6 This one had the orbs I think idk.

Mario Party 7 I believe this was the one with day & night and the use of the mic

Mario Party 8 - the fail one

 

[Disfunkshunal]

@shortie
I was just saying you described an existing relationship But I do agree that the differences between bowsers have the potential to be way more different.

@john
Mario party 5 had super duel mode. One of the best side modes in the franchise IMO only rivaled by Mario party 3's duels with the sidekicks. The rest do sorta blend together though. 2/8 memorable games is kinda bad.

IMO we need to instate a "twitter law". Any post exceeding 150 chars goes in collapse tags. Looking at you John :rage:
I'm joking btw. Something tells me someone will take this seriously

 

[Johnknight1]

Even if Junior was a Semi clone, he would be the most interesting semi clone we have EVER had. Taking a large, slow, tall character, and making him a small, medium weight, quick character is something we have never seen. Besides, he wouldn't even be a TRUE clone. Let's remember true clones are, as far as I can tell, dead.

Umm... your idea of Bowser Jr. sounds like the opposite of what happened with Ganondorf as a Captain Falcon clone. It isn't that unique.

Realistically, if Ganondorf can be a clone of Captain Falcon, nearly any newcomer could be a clone of any current character. Paper Mario could be a Mario clone. Bowser Jr. could be a Bowser clone. Toad could be a Peach clone. Krystal could be (another?) Fox clone. Ridley could be a Charizard clone. Victini could be a Lucario clone. Dixie Kong could be a Diddy Kong clone. K. Rool could be a King Dedede clone. Starfy could be a Kirby clone. Hell, Mega Man could be a Samus clone!

And yes, true clones are dead. Heck, the clones in Brawl have more original moves and original frames than any Smash 64 character does. All the characters have the same 2 or 3 aerials for each button in Smash 64. We've come a long way with "clones," and I can easily see "clones" new and old becoming a lot more original than they were in Brawl.

An example of this is the way Sakurai made Wolf. He was a bit heavier, slower, and stronger than Fox, but the way he crouched to make him a smaller target (which I thought made him more balanced), and his general movement and play style felt pretty unique.

Was it really worth it, John.

But yeah, this pretty much needs to be watched... because it is awesome!

 

[augustoflores]

Remember LINK AND TOON LINK ARE THE SAME PERSON. DIFFERENT AGES.

no shortie, what you mean is that they are essentially the same person. semantics, but the extra effort makes the point much more meaningful

Was it really worth it, John?

i think i just found new respect in you just now...

 

[---]

Well after looking over the past few pages all I can see is a bunch of whining Baby Marios.

Can we agree to disagree?

I for one would rather wait until E3 to have the alliances fight to the death like they usually do...

Spoiler

Mortal Kombat style

 

[Johnknight1]

Just wanna answer this to test myself!

Mario Party 5 had the addition of Toad, Boo, and Koopa Kid. I think they cut DK from this one. And I think this one introduced the use of "candy"
Mario Party 6 This one had the orbs I think idk.
Mario Party 7 I believe this was the one with day & night and the use of the mic
Mario Party 8 - the fail one

Why the heck would you cut Donkey Kong from Mario Party=??? LAMEEE!!!

As for your list, I'm not sure if I should be impressed or sympathetic. What should I feel towards you yani=???

@john
Mario party 5 had super duel mode. One of the best side modes in the franchise IMO only rivaled by Mario party 3's duels with the sidekicks. The rest do sorta blend together though. 2/8 memorable games is kinda bad.

IMO we need to instate a "twitter law". Any post exceeding 150 chars goes in collapse tags. Looking at you John :rage:
I'm joking btw. Something tells me someone will take this seriously

The Mario Party 3 duel mode was still way more super awesome than anything about Mario Party 5.

That plane mini-game from Mario Party 3 was the best ever. No seriously. I still play that bro! I played that all the time with my friends.

I can type short posts if I want. Of course, I usually type fast and ramble because people make posts that I have so many different views on. Only when I spend a lot of time on a post or someone gives a simple post do I post a short response.

 

[Kantrip]

Past few pages apparently.

Let's burst out of whatever bubble we were in and think positively!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Yes she is canon. No one is denying that. However, she hasn't had any role in a Mario game since then. Currently all four Mario characters have appeared in just about every canon Mario game since Super Mario Bros.

That has no relevance to the fact that she's still canon. Less memorable? Sure. Still canon. So I have no idea what point you're trying to make here anymore.

Toad has appeared in every canon Mario game to my knowledge. Bowser Jr. has appeared in every canon Mario game since his creation in Super Mario Sunshine (minus Super Mario Land 3D). Paper Mario has 4 games of his own (1 isn't out yet obviously), and each has sold very well.

Sure, if you can give me a statement from Nintendo declaring which games are Canon of his. We're going bey a definition we made up. Bowser Jr also has barely been in any games as is, making Waluigi just a bit more notable in the overall series. Not just "Canon", which isn't defined officially. The only game that is not officially part of any Mario Canon is Hotel Mario. No other game has been shown that they're not. Same thing with the Zelda CDi games. Which means Canon isn't even a relevant argument anymore.

Again, Daisy isn't anywhere nearly as important as Toad or Bowser Jr., and she doesn't have a spin-off role anywhere near as big as Paper Mario does in his self-titled series.

Toad isn't anywhere near Jr's importance either. He is playable as an indefinite role in SMB2 and that's it. There's too many Toads, and no way to know if the MAIN Toad is in which game or not. Stop acting like you have an exact list of the main Toad's appearances. You don't. Unless you can prove Nintendo stating that, you're overstating what he does.

In my opinion, most Mario Party games are garbage, and most of the sports games (the Soccer, Baseball, Basketball, Tennis, whatever other sports Mario plays, and nearly all of the recent Mario Kart games) don't have much replay value. All in all 5 years down the road remembering these games is like trying to differentiate several kinds of food with water down salt. You just can't tell the difference after a while.

That's my exact opinion on Sunshine, Galaxy 1 and 2, and both New Super Mario Bros. games. None of this is relevant to whether Waluigi is good choice or not. The games themselves do not state whether he's a good character or not. In fact, it's he himself that matters.

Plus I think most of us don't want to see Smash Bros. become like a Mario Sports game party game. Is smash a party game? Yes. But it is also a fighting game, a platformer, a third person shooter, an adventure game, and above all, a unique experience unlike any other. Smash Bros. is a different animal entirely. Thousands of people play smash bros devoutly for years. Aside from a small group of people, I can say that for a Mario sports game, most Mario Kart games, or Mario Party..

If that's what you think bringing in an unique character is, then you really don't know what you're talking about here. Waluigi doesn't make it a sports party game. In fact, it's a Party Fighting game. The party elements were there well before Waluigi ever existed. And you're completely wrong on your last point. There's more Mario Kart, Party, and Sports games. They all sell for good reasons. You have no proof that people don't enjoy them. There's a lot of people who want Waluigi in Smash as is, including me. You're only speaking for yourself, which is fine if you don't like him. Nobody said you had to. But don't say that other people hate him, when some may, some may not.

Also, when was the last time a character who is only playable in a spin-off Mario party/sports game made it in smash bros=???

As a playable character? None. As a CHARACTER as is? Waluigi is already there. It's just a matter of bumping up his status. If he was really not cared about by Sakurai, he wouldn't have gotten AT Status. He clearly is something that Sakurai is interested in by that alone.

There are 40 trillion Mario characters playable in those games. There is a freak thing that shoots eggs out of its' mouth without a gender (Birdo,) a bunch of turtles (Koopas of all kinds), guys that ride on clouds (Lakitus or whatever they are called), a bunch of flying thieves (Shy Guys), a bunch of brown guys who for some reason can die from being stepped on (Goombas), ghosts (Boos), plants that attack you and can eat you (Piranha Plants), things that sting you (Bees), and a guy made of friggen Metal (Metal Mario).

None of those are any more than random enemies. Waluigi was clearly more important in his two dominant roles. None of those guys besides SPECIFICALLY NAMES ONES IN PAPER MARIO can say the same thing. A race =/= important.

Why the heck would I remember a half Luigi/Wario mix compared to those characters=??? Waluigi is best-known as "part of the gang" in all the Mario Party, Kart, and sport titles, just like how Shy Guy, Petey Piranha, and now Queen Bee will be remembered.

Why the heck would I remember some random guy named Toad who does nothing in most of the games of any real importance? So far, the only thing you've given me that makes Toad supposedly better is Canon, which is a flimsy excuse at best.

People remember Mario Party 8=??? Tell me, do you remember any specific differences between Mario Party 5, 6, 7, and 8=???

5 has the Go-Kart Battles. 6 was the first to introduce the Microphone, and the only game to have a Party Mode as the overall main game. It's Story Mode was a crappy linear part that only unlocked a few games. 7 kept the microphone, added up to 8 players for some small mini-games, had unique courses that were no longer just gathering Stars and Coins. 8 introduced the Waggle style, and kept the exact difference from 7 except to remove the Microphone mini-games.(last I checked, since I didn't play 8 myself much) Every game added something unique, and aren't carbon copies of eachother.

Super Mario RPG is a cult game, and a retro game. Sakurai seems to cater to them. *points to the Ice Climbers* Smash Bros isn't about having just popular characters-but "unique characters that make you want to play the game." That's Sakurai's words, not mine. Again, smash bros has many unique retro characters, and a character like Geno fits in that category.

Which won't make a single difference unless Sakurai can get Square-Enix to allow him to add stuff from it. Also, it isn't a first party game either. Every unique character from there is Third Party. Likewise, not everybody has heard of/played the game, same as Ice Climbers, Game & Watch, and Fire Emblem before Melee. Not even everybody heard of Mother/Earthbound.

The Ice Climbers fit in that category (retro), albeit Ice Climber is a garbage game. Unlike Waluigi they are unique. They made a lot of people want to play smash, including me, because of how unique they looked. Again, people want to play as characters with a unique play style and unique move set, which caters to characters like the Ice Climbers who have been forgotten. Personally, it makes the game more unique to me. Having a smash bros game with only "popular" characters would be dumb.

If they're not popular, why would they get chosen? Outside of R.O.B. or being first in Smash, every character has/had a following. Pretending they don't is silly.

Mario canon games > Mario Party, Sports series, and Kart. Sakurai doesn't add playable characters because they are in spin off sports games, but because they have a big role in the canon Mario series, or they could add something to the smash bros. series. Besides let's be real: the spin-off party, sport, and kart games are popular because the canon games rock. And let's be honest again: The canon games and RPG spin-offs are way better than the spin-off party, sport, and kart games.

We make up which are Canon and which are not. This statement has no relevance, since it's a made-up theory. The fact that you're taking that as the gospel, and not what Nintendo said(which is the CD-i games only) is appalling. They're canon unless Nintendo says otherwise(hint: They haven't).

Urgh, I can't believe I'm even talking about Mario Party games post-N64.

I usually don't forget games, but the last few Mario Karts seem all alike (DS aside, which was amazing). The same goes with all the Mario Party games post the N64, and the two console Mario Tennis games (the handheld ones were better). I have an incredibly good memory. I still remember old friend's phone numbers that I last called at least a half decade ago, if not a decade ago. Meanwhile the early Mario Party and Mario Kart games I remember very clearly. Again, this is just my opinion, but I think a lot of other people feel this way too.

I only thought the n64 games were good myself. But what does this have to do with anything related to what I said whatsoever? It doesn't speak for the series' popularity. It's just purely your preference, but that's it. As I said before, it's FINE if you only enjoy specific games. Just don't speak for everyone like you know their preferences. I personally preferrably Mario Party 1, 3, and 5 only myself.

In smash bros the characters are much more unique compared to Mario Party. In Mario Party all of the characters have the same moves, and the only difference between them is they look different. In Smash Bros. characters have all kinds of unique moves.

Clones say Hi. Not all of them are super different, you know. But once again, Smash isn't Mario Party, so I don't see how any of this is relevant whatsoever.

Being well-known doesn't get you in alone in smash. You need to be one of the most unique Nintendo characters not currently playable in smash to be a smash bros newcomer. Just look at the list of playable characters, and count the characters you didn't know of before smash.

Lucario was popular, the only reason he got in. In fact, that's pretty much all he had: Popularity power. There's no way for us to know of anything else, since he was high on the polls. People wanted to play as him, in other words, popularity. Tons of characters have their own cult following. Except E.T., maybe.

I'm not arguing whether people know a character or not. My question is how many people would want to play a smash bros game because of a particular character. Tons of people probably bought a smash bros game just to play Luigi or Wario. They always look fun to play as, as do all of the smash bros character (even the clones). Well... maybe that troll Pichu aside!

Pichu was pretty popular in the Anime and games too. People wanted to play as him, so he was a great choice. People want to play as Waluigi too. A lot of people are pissed off than Waluigi's not in Mario Kart 7. Imagine THAT.

Some people would definitely want Waluigi in smash. Sure. But would they buy the game just because he is playable=??? NO! And if they did, it would be a much smaller amount of people compared to people who bought the game because of any character currently in smash.

Anybody who's a huge fan of him. Like me. I sure as hell would. Your hypothetical situation is very flawed. Majority, okay, sure, but everyone? Nope.

ROB also starred in two games, and was obviously a very popular and successfully and popular NES (and Famicon?) attachment.

How many new players played them? Not many. He's only well known to new players thanks to Mario Kart DS.

Again, do you remember the differences between Mario Party 5, 6, and 7 like you know the differences of Smash 64, Melee, or Brawl=???

I own every Mario Party game. And I explained earlier. Should I explain Mario Party 1-4 as well? In fact, the ONLY game I have yet to play is the DS version, but I'm lazy on that front. So that's the only thing you have me on, but that's it.

Many people have played the spin-off Mario games, but not many people remember the differences between them like they do with smash bros. Smash bros, again, is a whole different and more interesting animal.

Okay. But what does that matter when they enjoy the game anyway? And not everybody likes Smash Bros, but may play only those spin-offs. You're pretending like you're once again knowing exactly how they think. You don't.

Toad is playable in Mario games that matter. In Super Mario Bros. 2 he has his own unique moves.
Waluigi is playable in games where he has all the same moves as everyone else. Literally the most original idea Sakurai could come up with his move set is Waluigi using a tennis racket and a golf club. What else is there to add=???

That matter to YOU. Not to everyone else. Until you get that you are not the only mindset when it comes to Mario games, you will not get anywhere in this debate. People like things more than the Super Mario Bros(named) games. Also, Tennis Racket, Golf Club, Bob-omb, Piranha Plant, various punches and kicks, headbutts, ground pound. He's done a lot throughout the games he's been in. It's also easy for him to be a Dance Battler too.

People remember Mario in a much more simple way then you make it out to be. I remember, for example, Darth Vader, as the villain in Star Wars, and Luke Skywalker's father. That's it. That is really all you need to know (those God awful prequels that need to be forgotten aside).

So? Does that mean they don't want to play as characters besides him? Of course not. He's iconic, duh. We both know that. But that doesn't mean other characters aren't besides him.

Again, there's been no smash bros. character added who is only a "supporting character" in party games.

Change this to Playable Smash Characters, and sure. Too bad that really doesn't matter to Sakurai, since that has nothing to do with whether they can be playable or not. That's solely your opinion, and isn't important to actual character choices.

Most people who play Mario Party are too young to buy the game with money they worked for.

Sakurai and the smash bros development team don't care about characters just because they are in Mario Party. They want a character that adds something to the game and are unique. And trust me, there are a heck of a lot of characters more unique than Waluigi that aren't in smash.

Bowser Jr/Shadow Mario, Toad, Paper Mario. That's about it. And you have no proof of this either. You're just speaking for Sakurai quite incorrectly. He's never said a single thing pertaining to this.

Again, this isn't about popularity only, it's about uniqueness as well. ROB is a heck of a lot less popular than Waluigi was pre-Brawl, but he definitely made a better smash bros. character than Waluigi ever would.

This is more like reading "I hate Waluigi and refuse to accept that he could have an unique moveset." You have no proof of this whatsoever, and it's completely irrelevant too.

Why the heck would you deep read into a party game with no story=??? That's pretty... out there.

Mario Party 3 sure as hell had a better story than everything but Super Mario Galaxy. Also, by technicalities, the RPG's aren't Canon either, since they're spin-offs. In fact, every Mario Party game since 3 has console-wise has had some unique story that isn't just "save the princess". Sure as hell a lot better. You even said yourself you haven't played much of them, so you're completely wrong on the story front.

Again, does Waluigi have popularity? Yes. Does he have a fan base? Yes. Does he have some unique features? His laugh and not a whole lot more. Are there a ton more unique characters that would add more to smash? Yes.

Your last point is clearly opinion and is not factual at all. He also has weapons nobody ever really uses either. As I pointed out before. He's taken many ideas from various media and made an unique villain that's more than "kidnap the princess".

Expect him to be an Assist Trophy. He's still got no chance in my eyes, and nothing will change that. I said that pre-Brawl, and I will say that again.

Congrats speaking solely for yourself. Too bad many people 100% disagree with you, and what you say has no relevance on whether he has an actual chance or not. You have yet to give any factual reason on why he can't be upgraded.

If a canon Zelda game sold over 200,000 units it would be deemed a failure, and nowhere near as important as any of the Zelda canon games.

What the hell does this have to do with anything? Also, the only non-Canon Zelda game is the CD-i games. That's it.

Again, Tingle isn't still hasn't appeared in a canon Zelda game in about 6 or 7 years. Heck, even Skull Kid has appeared in a more recent game than Tingle. If he were important he would have appeared in a game more recent than that. He seems to have... disappeared! o.O

And? What does this have to do with anything? Maybe that he's not a recent character? That isn't a good reason to disclude him. He's more well known than Girahaim or Skull Kid or even most one-offs. Or hell, even, what's that guy from Minish Cap... Vaati? Who's been in a few games? All of them have pretty much an equal chance of getting in.(except Girahaim)

There's nothing unique looking about it to me. I'm not trolling, I'm giving my opinion. There are too many good games, in my opinion, to waste my time on average game, with the only exception being if there is something awesome or unique about an average game. Again, that is just my opinion.

There's nothing unique about Daisy, or Bowser Jr., or Galaxy Mario, or Shadow Mario, or the Goombas, or any various enemy. I also think all the regular main games past Mario 64 were crap. But does that mean they were? Hardly. I just didn't find them very good at all.

Youtube people are pretty dumb (I wouldn't call you an idiot by any means). I like the guys who have... "different" opinions like yours, but most of them are just "WTF? X character is totally popular and better than the characters you wanted" when I was talking about a character's likelihood. If I got my desired smash bros roster there would be a heck of a lot more Metal Gear characters.

You have no idea what a character's likelihood is here. Also, Waluigi fits every single one of Sakurai's reasons. Which means his likelihood is no different from Toad's or Bowser Jr/Shadow Mario's.

Next time you reply, remove all your Canon points from the argument, as there is no surefire official statement of what Mario games are canon besides Hotel Mario. They all currently are, even if they have branching storylines, or even a hard to tell one.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Mario Party 5-Introduction of Toad, Boo, and Koopa Kid. Donkey Kong removed from playable characters. Also introduced Orbs, DK spaces, and the arena where you battle self-created vehicles.

Mario Party 6-Introduced Night-Day concept. Inclusion of Toadette. Mic compatability. Mic Mode and Single Player Mode are also introduced. Star Bank is brought in.

Mario Party 7-Included Birdo and Dry Bones. Kept Mic compatibility. Introduced 8-player minigames. Introduced figurines. Koopa Kid is removed from playable characters.

Mario Party 8-Included Hammer Bro and Blooper. Every course has a unique twist. Orbs are dropped in place of Candy. Figurines are further expanded. Utilizes the Wii's motion controls. Bonus Mode introduced with exclusive minigames.

Hmmm... Don't think I missed much.

 

[Johnknight1]

Well after looking over the past few pages all I can see is a bunch of whining Baby Marios.

Can we agree to disagree?

I for one would rather wait until E3 to have the alliances fight to the death like they usually do...

Spoiler

Mortal Kombat style

Trust me, I say this out of being here before Brawl came out when I say this: Smash bros. character allegiances are a lot deadlier than anything in Mortal Kombat. There will be blood spilled, guaranteed.

Spoiler

..at a blood drive

Really though, it gets intense. If I had a dollar for every time somebody lost it and went off on me for a simple opinion I would have enough money to buy a Wii U, 3DS, and a bucket of KFC for every person on this thread!

Every so far has been civil... minus me trying to control your minds!

*prepares for a long yet short response*

 

[ElvishSpirit]

ehhem...

kinda offtopic but does anyone know if there is a database around here or somewhere with the little signature character boxs for SSB4? Ya know, the ones that are like "Megaman SSB4" with a picture of Megaman?

 

[augustoflores]

so... is this a new rivalry/destined nemesis?

we have KumaOso v. SmashChu, Pieman v. MasterWarlord, etc.

and now we have HyperFalcon v. JohnKnight

(who are some of the other rivalries we have here? (don't ask who pieman and warlord are))

 

[---]

Trust me, I say this out of being here before Brawl came out when I say this: Smash bros. character allegiances are a lot deadlier than anything in Mortal Kombat. There will be blood spilled, guaranteed.

Spoiler

..at a blood drive

Really though, it gets intense. If I had a dollar for every time somebody lost it and went off on me for a simple opinion I would have enough money to buy a Wii U, 3DS, and a bucket of KFC for every person on this thread!

Really?

Well then I guess I'll need more popcorn.

 

[Kantrip]

ehhem...

kinda offtopic but does anyone know if there is a database around here or somewhere with the little signature character boxs for SSB4? Ya know, the ones that are like "Megaman SSB4" with a picture of Megaman?

Yes, star has a shop of sorts set up here.

I think he is long done with making them, though.

 

[Big-Cat]

Shorts vs. Asage?

 

[yani_]

Why the heck would you cut Donkey Kong from Mario Party=??? LAMEEE!!!

As for your list, I'm not sure if I should be impressed or sympathetic. What should I feel towards you yani=???

Cutting DK was such a bizarre move

But by looking at the other guys' posts about the Mario Party differences it seems I was off a bit

They did get boring after 5 though, 8 was miserable. Although I have to admit I'm excited for 9.

 

[augustoflores]

really? hmmm... what about in the old thread?

 

[Disfunkshunal]

@john
Cheap cheap chase and snowball summit(?) were my games. I wish my 64 still worked man. Oh wEll i'm oUt of Luck Aren'T I? E
=]

 

[Shorts]

Shorts vs. Asage?

NOT a rival. I want Oasis to be my rival. He actually makes good points, and doesn't pretend like he has connections with GameFreak. but Oasis's uncle made Pokemon, or something like that.

 

[Kantrip]

Broasis is just the friendly neighbourhood mach ridleyer though.

 

[Oasis_S]

So far our arguments have ended with cookies and kittens though, Shortshorts. Aren't we more like PARTNERS.

i think i just found new respect in you just now...

I think you smell nicer today.

 

[Kantrip]

Sherlock and Watson imo