Official BBR Tier List v5

[da K.I.D.]

these are the most inane discussions

its funny that u bring this up, since the topic i brought up right b4 this one was:

'Why is Coneys ddd winning tourneys?'

 

[Seagull Joe]

Considering people keep telling me that Wolf has the tools to deal with his bad matchups....it would be nice to see some Wolf players actually playing his bad matchups.

I do go Wolf for 4/6 of his bad matchups. His bad matchups include:

• Wario
• Sheik
• Mk
• D3
• Falco
• Pikachu

I go Wolf vs Falco, Sheik, Wario, and Mk. Those matchups are relatively 45-55 these days. I don't go Wolf vs Pikachu and D3. I just was handed the two matchups I never use Wolf for. I still like playing those matchups, but they're too risky to actually play in tourney.

Not to mention that our best Wolf(Kain) goes solo Wolf, deals with bad MUs, and wins Regionals. Wolf does indeed have the tools, and Kain is the living proof of it. In comparison to Fox, TKD is the best, but he goes MK against bad MUs or on a stage he doesn't like.

Why is he below him again?

Seagull Man has had MK for a secondary for as long as I can remember. I don't think he does it just for bad MUs, but also because he enjoys playing MK.

Edit: Sniped by Ryu. He knows what's up. :3

I like using Mk. He helps my bad matchups.

And no offense to Kain, but he has 0 good D3's in any region I've seen him go to. Also never seen him verse a Pikachu.

its funny that u bring this up, since the topic i brought up right b4 this one was:

'Why is Coneys ddd winning tourneys?'

Verse it.

 

[_Kadaj_]

Joe did you know you can SDI the f tilt lock up and shine sheik to stop it everytime?

I was doing it a few weeks ago, and forgot to actually mention it you

 

[da K.I.D.]

seriously the wolf boards venerates players who only get 2-stocked by m2k

doesnt that make anti the best wolf then?

 

[Coney]

its funny that u bring this up, since the topic i brought up right b4 this one was:

'Why is Coneys ddd winning tourneys?'

i'm talking specifically about like, who's better between lucas or ness, or who wins between lucario and mario

i guess the falco/marth one was pretty good though

but falco's better

and the only reason i win tournaments is because i have no MKs in my region and i'm good against ddd's bad MUs

 

[Seagull Joe]

Joe did you know you can SDI the f tilt lock up and shine sheik to stop it everytime?

I was doing it a few weeks ago, and forgot to actually mention it you

What percent were you at when the Sheik started the lock? It doesn't work if Ftilt isn't stale at like 50-70%. I forget which.

I know you can SDI the final hit, but I don't think you can SDI it every time and then shine it.

Which way did you SDI?

 

[_Kadaj_]

You SDI upwards then Shine

You can get out around those percents too, idk if it's because the shine is being buffered out of hitlag or what the deal is.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Analog and C-stick upwards?

 

[_Kadaj_]

I suppose DBLStick SDI would help improve the SDI

 

[Yikarur]

but then you don't push both sticks upward :0
The ftilt SDI Window is so small, regular SDI doesn't really have an effect, I think ASDI is enough

 

[Deleted member]

Falco is arguable. A lot of Wolf mains don't have trouble with Falco at all. He has never been listed as a counter, either IIRC.

 

[Laem]

Falco is arguable. A lot of Wolf mains don't have trouble with Falco at all. He has never been listed as a counter, either IIRC.

spot spouting lies

 

[Red Arremer]

btw, apparently you're a hypocrite if you call out hypocrisy
yayuhz

wut?

What was hypocritical in people assuming whatever certain players are thinking?
However, saying "omg, i wonder what are these players thinking if you talk about them? they must think you're stupid!" is hypocritical, and even a very prime example of that.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Wolf is bad, get over it. There's nothing wrong with playing a bad character, most of us do.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Falco is arguable. A lot of Wolf mains don't have trouble with Falco at all. He has never been listed as a counter, either IIRC.

He always has been listed as a counter from 08' till 11'.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Wolf isn't bad at all. Sure, he's no MK, Diddy, or even Tink, but he's a solid character who can succeed on his own.

 

[Goldenadept]

he mediocre in every sense. maybe even average, but thats it

 

[Z'zgashi]

That was directed @ SFP

 

[_Kadaj_]

He has two bad mu's that send him over the edge more so than anything (D3 & Pika) and in combination with his readable recovery it puts him at a disadvantage.

He does fairly well vs most characters besides that

 

[tekkie]

i'm not seeing any wolf players beating top MKs, snakes, falcos, warios, etc. in tournaments

i didnt list sheik because no one plays sheik

 

[Goldenadept]

That was directed @ SFP

yeah i know, i just thought I'd throw that in there, he's solid but that doesn't help a whole lot. he's very... ok

 

[_Kadaj_]

Candy use to when he mained Wolf lolol

But seriously it's because he is somewhat under-developed, those mu's are pretty much all 55/45 with the exception of maybe wario (Because of the Cg I'm guessing but I've only seen two Wario's that were ever able to do it consistantly)

AC has beating TKD's Mk a few times, Anti has come close to beating M2k with Wolf as well (he hasn't played Wolf since he started lol)

TBH Wolf hasn't had those one or two really good players (tournament/placing wise on a more national scale) to come out and show his true potential like most of the other higher tier characters.

The same deal could be said for Pit who is also a very solid character but he is underused (except for in Japan) They know his potential hence why he's so high on their tier list, the also see a lot of his mu's being very close if not even

And in a sense Fox as well

 

[-Mars-]

Joe did you know you can SDI the f tilt lock up and shine sheik to stop it everytime?

I was doing it a few weeks ago, and forgot to actually mention it you

If it's stale and I do it correctly...no you can't.

 

[Goldenadept]

i know semifer just recently beat Lights sheik over in Europe, if what yikarur said is true. he also beat quiksilver's ZSS who's suppose to be a top European ZZS

 

[_Kadaj_]

You sure Mars?

I'm pretty sure he looked like he was in the percents to be locked (ie. when they have their head backwards while being f tilted)

 

[_Kain_]

LOL at Seagull saying I never vs any good D3's when I friendlied Coney when he came from MD/VA, when Lain used to be one of the best D3's when he played him and I used to play his too, and saying I don't play any Pika's when I used to play Anther all the time when he was at his prime.

 

[Seagull Joe]

LOL at Seagull saying I never vs any good D3's when I friendlied Coney when he came from MD/VA, when Lain used to be one of the best D3's when he played him and I used to play his too, and saying I don't play any Pika's when I used to play Anther all the time when he was at his prime.

My mistake.

 

[Yink]

I was just trolling, they're cute as an idea but execution needs work.

So I made them as a gift, and made like 20 of them. I think it's the thought that counts. <3

Then how did you get one? You're a Lucas main, not a Yoshi main. Though I do understand the desire to switch it up to a better character...

He posts in the YGD, and is (or at least was) a regular to my knowledge. The Ness board gets them too, so will Luigi because I mod those boards. It's just a little gift to them for being good posters and stuff.

 

[Delta-cod]

I was just trolling, they're cute as an idea but execution needs work.

Then how did you get one? You're a Lucas main, not a Yoshi main. Though I do understand the desire to switch it up to a better character...

Okay, seriously, this might be spam, but where the **** are all those cool sigs above me from?

You all seem pretty mad.

 

[DMG]

Anger? Let me get my trap box and find the right bait so I can catch all the Red Gyarados!

 

[Chuee]

LOL at Seagull saying I never vs any good D3's when I friendlied Coney when he came from MD/VA, when Lain used to be one of the best D3's when he played him and I used to play his too, and saying I don't play any Pika's when I used to play Anther all the time when he was at his prime.

I thought Seagull said you don't have any good D3's in your regions, not you don't play any good D3s.

 

[NAKAT]

I only use MK when I have to play a death MU or a mu that I am incapable of doing with Fox at the moment which are a few. Other then that you see my Fox out there about 80-85% of the time. Try living in the EC where death mu's float around everywhere. I mean I could've just went MK on Will and spammed all day, but instead I chose my main. I could've went MK on Zac but instead I did it with Fox without knowing the MU and pulled through :D

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Anger? Let me get my trap box and find the right bait so I can catch all the Red Gyarados!

You know, you should probably use Pokeballs rather than fishing bait. You might get eaten
Just sayin'


So how's about that Kirby guy. Does anyone still play him? Same for Wario

 

[Deleted member]

He always has been listed as a counter from 08' till 11'.

I could have sworn he was listed as 55:45 Falco. My mistake. And Laem, notice I said IIRC. I wasn't positive.

I still stand by that Falco only has a slight advantage over Wolf, and there are other Wolf's that agree with me on this. You guys overestimate Falco. Ban FD. Platform camp until mid-30 percent range. After that, the MU is not hard to deal with at all.

@SFP, you said yourself not too long ago that you don't know much about Wolf. You also placed him below Yoshi on your tier list. If you don't know much about him, what reason do you have to say he's bad?

 

[_Kadaj_]

Both of those match-ups aren't bad for fox Nakat lol

 

[Exceladon City]

Both of those match-ups aren't bad for fox Nakat lol

^This. Fox does work on DK.
Fox vs GW is atleast 50:50.

 

[NAKAT]

Both of those match-ups aren't bad for fox Nakat lol

That's the point, but Gnw on the other hand. I've had a terrible history against him lol Vinnie killed in literally .5 seconds a whillleeeeee long ago when I was a nublett. Sometimes I do just go MK to use him though lol. He will never get as much time as my Fox does.

 

[-Mars-]

ITT: MK invalidates TKD and Nakat

@ Kadaj

When I played JJ about a year ago he would shine out of some of my ftilt>usmashes.

I'm pretty sure if you buffer each ftilt correctly and buffer the usmash you have enough advantage from stale ftilt to true combo.

What frame does Wolfs shine come out on though?

Probably the best way for Wolf to get out of it though.

 

[_Kadaj_]

It comes out frame one and he's invincible from frames 1-6, Hitbox comes out frame 7

 

[-Mars-]

Hmmmm. Maybe. I'll check more into it and get back to you.