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Official Stage Legality Discussion
- Thread starter Mic_128
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Tick&Hail
Smash Rookie
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- Feb 13, 2009
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- 6
I'm all up for big blue being legal, but I think it isn't because there isn't any real pattern of the raptors and is easy for certain characters to win without much effort, and their names aren't C Falcon. But I honestly don't have a clue why Norfair is legal and Pirate Ship isn't. I'm not a fan of racing Metaknight to a stupid small *** tube and getting whorenadoe'd and D-Smashed to ridiculous percents just to survive some lava. And I sure as hell am not spot dodging the lava.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
Big Blue is one of those "Let's ban it in Brawl because it was banned in Melee."
Spotdodging the lava is so easy. You can even shield it. Norfair and Pirate Ship are legal up here.
If you jump off FD, you are edgeguarding. If you jump off Big Blue, you are ********.
If you get shield-pushed off FD, it's all good, you can recover. If you get shield-pushed off of an F-Zero racer, you're ****ed. You'll end up tumbling into the ground, causing lag which will kill you.
There's a few key differences between the River and the Track.
River: At the left, you're screwed. Anywhere else, not too hard. Bunch of landing lag all the time. Time-based hazard.
Track: Landing lag only if you go into freefall or hitstun, which mostly screws you over. Landing off of a jump will make sure you're always safe. Upward ramps basically kill you as jumping does nothing, and running causes you to slow down somehow.
The two stages are also the same size, except it's easier to kill off the top on Big Blue as you're usually in the middle of the stage.
Bonus Notes:
Japes: zAirs get destroyed when misspaced on the middle platform (they try to tether)
Blue: 40 seconds of circle camping in randomly spaced intervals, but timed so that you never end the match in a chase.
Spotdodging the lava is so easy. You can even shield it. Norfair and Pirate Ship are legal up here.
If you jump off FD, you are edgeguarding. If you jump off Big Blue, you are ********.
If you get shield-pushed off FD, it's all good, you can recover. If you get shield-pushed off of an F-Zero racer, you're ****ed. You'll end up tumbling into the ground, causing lag which will kill you.
There's a few key differences between the River and the Track.
River: At the left, you're screwed. Anywhere else, not too hard. Bunch of landing lag all the time. Time-based hazard.
Track: Landing lag only if you go into freefall or hitstun, which mostly screws you over. Landing off of a jump will make sure you're always safe. Upward ramps basically kill you as jumping does nothing, and running causes you to slow down somehow.
The two stages are also the same size, except it's easier to kill off the top on Big Blue as you're usually in the middle of the stage.
Bonus Notes:
Japes: zAirs get destroyed when misspaced on the middle platform (they try to tether)
Blue: 40 seconds of circle camping in randomly spaced intervals, but timed so that you never end the match in a chase.
Da-D-Mon-109
Smash Lord
The worse a person can jump in Big Blue, the more unfair the stage is. If it didn't have the nearly fatal track that's deadly everywhere though, it might be another version of Rainbow Cruise, only you are fighting to stay on the platforms, instead of using the platforms to fight to stay on the screen.
Norfair and Pirateship are, again, no problem. Infact, if you jump off of the screen, the lava misses you, and you can prepare a smash while the person is still stuck inside of the tube. I love doing that to people. Fastfall, and then they eat an Aura Sphere once the bunker opens up.
Norfair and Pirateship are, again, no problem. Infact, if you jump off of the screen, the lava misses you, and you can prepare a smash while the person is still stuck inside of the tube. I love doing that to people. Fastfall, and then they eat an Aura Sphere once the bunker opens up.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
Gimping is way worse than accumulating damage. Electric Formation is brutal.
SexTornado
Smash Journeyman
I think pkmn stadium 2 shouldn't be banned but hey, that's my opinion.
Eternal Yoshi
I've covered ban wars, you know
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- EternalYoshi
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Norfair is banned in some places. That stage forces you to pay attention to the lava more than your opponent because of how frequent the lava acts up.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
The lava hardly interferes considering its EXTREMELY slow in movement and predictable.
paco27291
Smash Rookie
can someone give me the link for the most updated legal stages? sorry if its a dumb question but cant find it, thanx
deepseadiva
Bodybuilding Magical Girl
Check the first post to this thread. xD
Samus Aran X
Smash Cadet
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- Feb 12, 2009
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- 35
Um, this may seem random, but why is The Summit banned? If anything, the lowest it should go is Counter/Banned. It has very obvious threats (When the stage begins to slide, you'll obviously get whisked away since it's moving, The fish is so predictable. Players could easily stay above the shallow water level.)
There's nothing really bad about it, and I don't see how the light gravity could be such a nuisance seeing as Pirate Ship, a counterpick, has light gravity as well which also acts as an advantage, but unpurposefully. Also, it has less predicatable threats (The canon balls can be a nuisance if you're paying attention more to the fight than the background..) unless the characters sliding around is extremely problematic..
For the summit, all you have to do is follow two rules to avoid threats
- Stay out of the water (it's not like people just stay there and float throughout the match)
- Don't step on the mountain while you're falling down. (kind of obvious unless you're blind)
There's nothing really bad about it, and I don't see how the light gravity could be such a nuisance seeing as Pirate Ship, a counterpick, has light gravity as well which also acts as an advantage, but unpurposefully. Also, it has less predicatable threats (The canon balls can be a nuisance if you're paying attention more to the fight than the background..) unless the characters sliding around is extremely problematic..
For the summit, all you have to do is follow two rules to avoid threats
- Stay out of the water (it's not like people just stay there and float throughout the match)
- Don't step on the mountain while you're falling down. (kind of obvious unless you're blind)
Linkshot
Smash Hero
All of those issues are valid and we see them the way you do.
You missed an issue that many forget (due to playing without a timer on, maybe; or not "playing to win" in a traditional sense).
Circle Camping.
It has been proven you can circle-camp around the left side. It's the same reason Temple and New Pork are banned.
You missed an issue that many forget (due to playing without a timer on, maybe; or not "playing to win" in a traditional sense).
Circle Camping.
It has been proven you can circle-camp around the left side. It's the same reason Temple and New Pork are banned.
Samus Aran X
Smash Cadet
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Is it with any chars or just a few?
Linkshot
Smash Hero
Basically, Pikachu becomes the only viable character due to Thunder mechanics.
It's a game of tag.
A 7-minute game of tag.
It's a game of tag.
A 7-minute game of tag.
Eternal Yoshi
I've covered ban wars, you know
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The Circle camping doesn't last for long due to the collapsing platforms and water. The real reason the stage is banned is due to the lack of ledges and the fish. Yes, it's predictable, but if you happen to be in the water, your opponent can footstool you back in the water, allowing the fish to kill you. On a side note, tripping happens more frequently here than any other stage.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
Ironic.
Gimpyfish = bannable.
Gimpyfish = bannable.
I actually have been involved in the production of video evidence of how you can run away forever on the Summit. It's a shame too; otherwise it's a great course (only scrubs have trouble with the fish).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=decTFkAiOzo
Also, what would you guys think of a general poll among the users of smashboards on stage legality in general? I'm curious what the community in general thinks about it; the only problem would be formatting a way to let people vote easily without making cheating easy (this is actually really hard, perhaps impossible to do itself). Of course, I'm sure we'd get some odd/scrubby results, but it could be interesting regardless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=decTFkAiOzo
Also, what would you guys think of a general poll among the users of smashboards on stage legality in general? I'm curious what the community in general thinks about it; the only problem would be formatting a way to let people vote easily without making cheating easy (this is actually really hard, perhaps impossible to do itself). Of course, I'm sure we'd get some odd/scrubby results, but it could be interesting regardless.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
To the last paragraph, Smogon is trying to do that with the Pokemon Tiers, but people are abusing the "professional vote" and just voting Uber for everything they hate.
I think smashboards is a little more intelligent than the Pokemon community; we didn't ban Meta Knight while, well, look at Garchomp/Wobbuffet/Deoxys-e. Actually the Pokemon community has a lot of deep problems that make the smash community look just about perfect...
Anyway, I figure with tournaments that have 4 starters and 10 counterpicks already existing, we couldn't really produce a more ban-happy list via such a method. I do anticipate that we'd see a lot of that effect though; Pokemon Stadium 2 would doubtless not do well in such a situation...
Anyway, I figure with tournaments that have 4 starters and 10 counterpicks already existing, we couldn't really produce a more ban-happy list via such a method. I do anticipate that we'd see a lot of that effect though; Pokemon Stadium 2 would doubtless not do well in such a situation...
deepseadiva
Bodybuilding Magical Girl
No, many did ban MK.
It was the SBR that suggested against it.
The SWF is stupid AA.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Wait wait why should Wobbuffet and Deoxys-E not be banned? I am a bit ancient so bring me up to speed on why those pokemon should not be banned plz.
highandmightyjoe
Smash Ace
What do you have against Donkey Kong?
Linkshot
Smash Hero
They obviously have something more against Samus. Brinstar is a great stage, Norfair less so, but they're both still very legal. Just because it has "nonstandard" features doesn't mean it should be banned :/
Linkshot
Smash Hero
You can avoid the lava easily. If your opponent hits you into the lava and combos you, they're playing the stage properly, and you're not. Easy.
hichez50
Smash Lord
not ever charter has a direct combo. And if you playing a match and lava RANDOMLY comes out you get hit. At least with big blue its always the same pattern. I don't think big blue should be a counter pick but norfair is ridiculous.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
The lava is very slow and you have enough time to react. If you don't react, it's your fault.
Gea
Smash Master
Mute City was a counterpick. Learn to stay on the upper platforms if you really can't tell when the lava starts to rise. Visual clues help alot. I don't care for Norfair because of the platform layout, but its definitely not bannable.
Just play on it more and you'll start to do better.
Thunder Of Zeus
*Rumble Rumble*
^ I think norfair is legal, annoying, but legal. i just use the kirb cause im rotten at grabbing those plats
Absolutely nothing. I just hate really gay stages.
There is no such thing as a "gay" stage. Stages are genderless.
Linkshot
Smash Hero
I laughed so hard.
SoSlickAndSoFly
Smash Rookie
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But he's right
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