*Pika, DK, G&W, Jiggy, Weegee*. In-depth analysis of attacks that trip your opponent!

[Twilightwolf]

Aye.... guess.

(read that aloud)

Anyway, there is a post in the Wolf section saying that his Fsmash (pseudo wiener) trips. In the posted vid, Lucario is tripped on the first hit of Fsmash. Also, he hasn't taken any damage iirc. The second time it hits in the vid (2:12) the back of the initial hitbox connects, tripping Lucario again. I wonder if the positioning of the hitboxes have anything to do with it. The trip window of the whiffed Fsmash looks like 0~14%... but that is only from the video. I'll do my own testing to figure it out (unless you do it before me).

The video (The Buzz Saw vs sugarpoultry): http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=oi5FvVHrD54

 

[mugwhump]

Aye.... guess.

(read that aloud)

Anyway, there is a post in the Wolf section saying that his Fsmash (pseudo wiener) trips. In the posted vid, Lucario is tripped on the first hit of Fsmash. Also, he hasn't taken any damage iirc. The second time it hits in the vid (2:12) the back of the initial hitbox connects, tripping Lucario again. I wonder if the positioning of the hitboxes have anything to do with it. The trip window of the whiffed Fsmash looks like 0~14%... but that is only from the video. I'll do my own testing to figure it out (unless you do it before me).

The video (The Buzz Saw vs sugarpoultry): http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=oi5FvVHrD54

That's what I thought at first, too (because the first move I tested was Lucas' dtilt). But no, after like 24 hours of testing I've concluded that the positioning of the hitboxes only effects which version of the move you get (like if you get the wiener version or not). Which version you get is what effects tripping.

 

[joenopride]

I like this topic. BUMP!

HUARGH!

 

[mugwhump]

Updated! Finally finished doing Olimar! Man I'm really slowing down lol. D:

Anyways, I forgot to mention before that sloped terrain affects HUARGHing and WHARRGARBLing. Also, I believe DI doesn't affect tripping at all.

 

[Eten]

Does directional ftilts change it up? I know that Zamus trips a lot more on a downwards ftilt than a normal ftilt or up ftilt, a character you've already covered.

Also this is way cool to learn/know. Tripping an opponent is a unique action that has a lot of impact on at the very least, the flow of the match. With the % numbers on attacks and analysis it players can more actively consciously use it.

 

[Tristan_win]

Basically what I've discovered with Zamus Ftilt is that the three variations not only have different hit boxes but different effects as well.

Note: this was all done in training mode

Upper Ftilt cannot cause a trip and has equal knock back as a middle Ftilt. Causes at full strength 6 damage

Middle Ftilt can cause a trip but not very often and has equal knock back and damage given as an upper ftilt, however because of this lower knock back it can trip people in the higher percentages.

Lower Ftilt can trip people very often (at least 1/3 of the time) and has more then double the knock back of the other two Ftilts, also at full strength it does 9 damage.

I’ve also tested to see what percentages it takes cause someone to trip and I’ve notice that heavier characters have a larger range that allow them to be tripped then lighter one’s. For example the Lower Ftilt can only trip Kirby up to 25% while on Bowser can be tripped up to 33%

Hope this helps ^-^

You should add this information to your thread.

 

[Ørion]

Thank you, this is exactly the kind of data that will be able to be used to eventually make the in depth strategies for each character once brawl gets some tournaments started.

 

[Tyr_03]

Lucas's weak hitboxes of PKT2 can trip as well. It'd be good to get some percentages for it if you have the time

 

[mugwhump]

^I'll see if I can test that.... might be a bit tedious to get though.

You should add this information to your thread.

Yeah thanks, I'll add a note on that in the Zamus section.
I'm pretty sure my data is for the mid ftilt, I have to go back and check the other variations. This is good for Zamus though, makes an already good trip move even more versatile. And she can punish trips pretty well, too.

What's really wierd is that Zamus seems like the only character whose ftilt variations have different properties (except maybe for Samus? I don't remember). I tested like 10 other characters, but their angled ftilts all had exactly the same damage, knockback, and knockback angle. Does anyone know of any ftilts (or fsmashes!) whose angled versions have different properties?
edit: seems Falcons upwards ftilt does 1% more, and samus' angled ftilts both do 3% more
With both of them, their upwards fsmash does +1%, and their downwards angled fsmash does -1%.

Also, if anyone can explain the slight reduction in knockback in training mode, that'd be awesome, cuz it's driving me crazy.

 

[Sasurai_no_Hiroshi]

This is some pretty interesting information! I just wanted to commend you on a job well done! Good effort looking into this, and I especially praise you for the amazing terms and silly humor. xD
Good job! *Does Captain Falcon salute*

 

[eyestrain92]

Humor AND conclusive-esque research? It's impossible!

Thank you!

 

[mugwhump]

Okay added some info on upwards/downwards variations of ftilts/smashes. If anyone knows any ftilts/smashes (aside from Samus/zss/falcon) whose upwards or downwards variations do different damages, tell me.

And remember guys, what hit state your opponent is sent into can have a large effect on combo opportunities even if they don't get tripped. An opponent in the higher WHARRGARBL range will have the longest hitstun (yes, longer than someone barely sent airborne- though obviously not as much as someone sent flying with 999%). For example, if Falcon does an auto-cancelled SH dair on a Bowser with 37%, bowser will WHARRGARBL, and Falcon can naturally combo into a jab when he lands. But if Bowser has 38%, Falcon's dair sends him airborne, and Bowser can air dodge before Falcon's jab comes out. So yeah... know your hit states.

Also, I'm now quite sure that how often a move trips is determined by other properties of the move, rather than being specified by the developers. Peach's dtilt trips at a high rate on metal opponents up to ~170%.

 

[tect]

wonderful. =)

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

The first hit of Pit's Up-smash has a 10% chance of tripping at any percentage. You can land only the first hit by doing a dashing Up-smash underneath someone on a platform.

 

[thesage]

I know that this happens with Rob's bair.

Ness' d-tilt has a hitbox that causes them to trip, it's not a percentage. Simna tested this.

 

[thesage]

I know that this happens with Rob's bair.

Ness' d-tilt has a hitbox that causes them to trip, it's not a percentage. Simna tested this.

 

[Free ZKO]

For my first post on the forum, I just want to say that while I have no idea how to possibly incorporate this into my game, this is a fantastic post, both entertaining and insightful.

 

[mugwhump]

Thanks.

The first hit of Pit's Up-smash has a 10% chance of tripping at any percentage. You can land only the first hit by doing a dashing Up-smash underneath someone on a platform.

Wow, from 0-999%. Nice find.

I know that this happens with Rob's bair.

Ness' d-tilt has a hitbox that causes them to trip, it's not a percentage. Simna tested this.

Robs bair? You don't mean his dair? Because I tested and his bair always WHARRGARBLs. Of course, if the move is stale, or you're hitting your opponent up a slope, it may be able to HUARGH and trip them...

Anyways gannondirf added.

 

[Waggles]

I think WHARRGARBL will have to be my word of the day

 

[Valdens]

Not only does he expand the dictionary, but he gives us info that could be pseudo-useful. Hoorah.

 

[Tyr_03]

Could you test the weak hits of Lucas's PKT2? I know they have a chance of tripping. I'm also pretty sure his Dsmash can trip.

 

[tutata]

Dam marth can sure trip ppl with different attacks

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

This is probably the coolest informative thread on Smashboards at the moment. Everyone could learn from this.

And also: the weak part of Wolf's Fsmash seems like it trips a lot more than 50%. More like 80% IMO.

 

[CorrTerek]

I have a file at home with info on most characters' trip moves. Well, not most, really, but which dairs, ftilts, and dtilts trip. Since you don't seem to have all characters info yet, would you like me to post that?

 

[leafgreen386]

I'm not entirely sure this is right about you not being able to trip airborne opponents... I could've sworn that I've (soft) knee'd aerial foes before, and they landed in their tripped animation.

Otherwise, this was a very informative and entertaining article.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Hey, you forgot Ness and his 50% trip on Dtilt.

 

[mugwhump]

I have a file at home with info on most characters' trip moves. Well, not most, really, but which dairs, ftilts, and dtilts trip. Since you don't seem to have all characters info yet, would you like me to post that?

FALCON YES

 

[Metal_Dave]

This is crazy but possible...what about tripping that occurs randomly when no damage is taken???

 

[Taymond]

...? You mean the normal tripping-from-dashing tripping? That's not what this thread is about. This thread is about attacks that force your opponent to trip.

This thread is about the mechanic that causes tripping while dashing, which is completely random and cannot be induced by an opponent's actions: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=162850

 

[Fuzzyness]

i have a feeling you're mistaking tripping with slightly flying over the ground and landing (because at high % you obviously fly differently), Tripping is random :/ probably random from some hits too possibly

 

[fallenangemon0]

i have a feeling you're mistaking tripping with slightly flying over the ground and landing (because at high % you obviously fly differently), Tripping is random :/ probably random from some hits too possibly

No, If you actually try to notice it you would soon see that some moves actually cause people to go into the tripping animation.

I somehow got My friends Metaknight to like 62 damage cause I just spamed Jiggs Dair

Where are the stats for jiggs though?

if you could PM them to me youd be the bestest in the whole wide world


oh and kudos on the super funny terms that were somehow understandable in the end

 

[mugwhump]

Well the only reason I did so many characters before is because I was avoiding schoolwork, now that it's summer and I've got nothing to do I'm afraid I don't have time.

 

[KeyKid19]

Since you had a ? about Falcon's Dair, I figured I might as well link you the thread I made about it. I found the Dair trip very interesting so I put in a bit of time finding out pretty much everything about it (except how often it trips but I'm not sure how to do that).

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=166019

 

[sFoster]

Hey I remembered this thread and looked it up and it was useful, thanks.
I have no idea how you got those percentages though haha

Did you really sit there and test every move for every character, at every percentage?
Especially when some of the attacks only trip 10% of the time lol

 

[sFoster]

In the OP you say "Basically, tripping can occur with moves that send you opponent straight horizontally"

But then you go on to give Zelda's D-Tilt as one of your main examples.
Zelda's d-tilt consists of like... zero horizontal knockback. It's all vertical.

 

[Mattnumbers]

What is the "wiener" version of a move?

 

[Brainiac_man]

lolz, WHARRGARBL

Thx, I needed to know this.

 

[Mr. Escalator]

G&W's #2 hammer induces tripping.
I also think his Fair might do the same?

SO HARRY UP AND GET HIM ADDED OK THANKS
pikachu cna wiat

 

[Sosuke]

"WHARRGARBL"
hahaha
but yeah nice work.

 

[mugwhump]

Since you had a ? about Falcon's Dair, I figured I might as well link you the thread I made about it. I found the Dair trip very interesting so I put in a bit of time finding out pretty much everything about it (except how often it trips but I'm not sure how to do that).

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=166019

Oooooh, good jorb. Those percentages should be useful when figuring out the character weight ratios.

In the OP you say "Basically, tripping can occur with moves that send you opponent straight horizontally"

But then you go on to give Zelda's D-Tilt as one of your main examples.
Zelda's d-tilt consists of like... zero horizontal knockback. It's all vertical.

Yeah it's either straight horizontal moves or ones that knock your opponent down into the ground. I'm not sure about the horizontal bit though, it just seems that way.

What is the "wiener" version of a move?

It's when you hit with a wimpier version, like a non-tippered Marth attack or a flubbed falcon knee.

Hey I remembered this thread and looked it up and it was useful, thanks.
I have no idea how you got those percentages though haha

Did you really sit there and test every move for every character, at every percentage?
Especially when some of the attacks only trip 10% of the time lol

Yup yup yup.

Anyway I did Ness.

I tried to hit bowser on a slope to simulate the effects of stale moves on Ness' fsmash (which is usually too strong to trip), and got it to trip at low percentages. I don't think my testan was that reliable though, sometimes ness seemed to wharrgarbl randomly. ¯\(ºдಠ)/¯