"Rate My Moveset!" :: Moveset Critique Thread

[UltiMario]

Base 100 speed isn't low at all even at 0 EVs/IVs and a -Spe nature.

 

[Wave⁂]

Yeah, 100 Speed is pretty high.

 

[Ripple]

it decreases so that I only out speed things under base 70.

which isn't much

 

[UltiMario]

At that point you're out speeding so little that its pointless. When you set up Trick Room, you're slow, and after you set it up, you're STILL slow (or, too fast to be slow, more accurately)

Bronzong is just plain better for a equal job.

 

[Wave⁂]

Well, you could give Jirachi 252 HP / 252 Speed with a Jolly nature.

1. Trick Room
2. Opponent uses move
3. Opponent uses move
4. Jirachi uses U-Turn
5. Rhyperior switches in unmolested.

 

[Circa]

Well, you could give Jirachi 252 HP / 252 Speed with a Jolly nature.

1. Opponent uses move
2. Trick Room
3. Opponent uses move
4. Jirachi uses U-Turn
5. Rhyperior switches in unmolested.

Fix'd. Trick Room has -7 priority.

 

[kirbyraeg]

didn't know that, but yeah. in that case, all he really does is come in vs. something, set it up, then u-turn out.

Bonus points for faking out a DDGyara by holding shuca/occa berry and using trick room as they switch out scared of scarfed thunderpunch...

 

[Wave⁂]

Hm. Thanks, Writer.

As a lead, you might want Occa Berry.

 

[Ripple]

Slowbro @leftovers

Relaxed ( +def/-spe)

252 HP/ 204 Def/ 54 Atk

-Belly Drum
-Aqua Tail
-slack off
-Zen headbutt


keep in mind that I'm hoping bronzong starts off with hypnosis, trick room, then explodes/switches. or my jirachi trick rooms then u-turns

I know I only get 2 turns of **** but I really think its so much better than trick room Calm mind slowbro

the 54 atk EVs guarantee that everything in OU and below is OHKO'd except snorlax, lapras, vaporeon, cresselia and a few NU poke's

the def EVs and nature almost insure that nothing physical in OU does over 50% of my health (unless SE). and 62% is what they'll need to do in order to kill me sure fire after trick room ends (assuming They did not hit slowbro when he uses belly drum). not even Electivire with full atk EVs and nature with expert belt using thunder punch does not hit slowbro hard enough to kill him in 1 hit. the only physical sweepers guaranteed to kill slowbro un-choice banded would be herecross and infernape.

any physical attacker that doesn't have a super effective attack on me allows me to use slack off and regain more HP (along with leftovers) than they could possibly take


poke's that can hit slowbro hard enough are the special sweepers that counter water/psychic. those would be gengar, zapdos, Heatran, and azelf if it has life orb. jolteon, and magnezone too but IDK if those are considered sweepers

if this works out right slowbro automatically sweeps 2 of their pokemon and a very high chance of a third

 

[Pink Reaper]

I feel the need to point out that Belly Drum is a 100% completely useless move at this point.

Most pokemon wont hit more than 1100 attack after a belly drum, in fact Jolly Charizard hits a total of 1068 and is left with 25% health AT MAXIMUM after a use. And while 1062 isnt a BAD attack stat, its not something that will really beat even lower tier walls(Slowbro himself comes immediately to mind) But moreover, +6 Jolly Charizard reaches 1068 Attack. +2 LO Kabutops reaches 1083 WITHOUT SACRIFICING 50% OF ITS HEALTH TO DO IT! There's never a reason to bother with Belly Drum when there's INFINITELY better choices already out there.

On to the next point, that Slowbro set is crap. Literally 100% unusable garbage. Those 54 attack EV's mean NOTHING. No you wont be OHKOing everything in OU. Standard Skarmory only takes 68% MAXIMUM from Aqua Tail, any and all bulky waters easily wall you and random bulky pokemon like Rotom-A and Zapdos can both survive a hit AND OHKO you back.

Also, there's the Scizor problem. In that CB Scizor is NOT OHKO's by you and easily OHKO's you back with U-turn since you're now at 50% health.

 

[Ripple]

QQ

guess this really shows how new I am to this game. I thought steelix would have the overall best survivability in the game with its impressive def and max HP. then I found snorlax and cresselia. I wouldn't have thought that skarmory would be better.

I don't see why the set is COMPLETE crap. 3/4 moves are basically the same. the special trait is just switched with regular atk.


and I don't know practically any abbreviations so could you tell me what LO kabutops is and CB scizor is.

back to the drawing board

 

[UltiMario]

Slowbro is a better special attacker than Physical.

BTW.

Also LO is Life Orb and CB is Choice Band.

 

[Ripple]

Slowbro is a better special attacker than Physical.

BTW.

Also LO is Life Orb and CB is Choice Band.

I know that his stats are better for special sweep but who would expect a physical slowbro?

 

[UltiMario]

Due to Stealth Rock ALWAYS beeing in virtually every scenario, and Spikes/Tspikes Picking up, plus the ever-so-common standstorm, they'll either attack you on your Belly Drum, and you at like 40% leniency at best, will die, or they'll switch into something, then outspeed and KO you.

And if you don't belly drum everything will completely wall you and kill you, for example, in OU, Celebi. Even Blissey will give this Slowbro a hard time.

Its a terrible set to even attempt to chase after.

 

[kirbyraeg]

gotta go all out 252hp/252 atk brave, 0Spe if you're going to even bother with something like that. The gimmick here is trick room giving you the first hit...IF you weaken dedicated walls like skarm just a bit you can power through a lot of things with his dual water/psychic stab. I actually think a set like that could fit on a hail team (which would rack up that extra bit of damage vs. skarm as you phaze around their team with walrein). Giving slowbro trick room himself over slack off is probably a better idea as well just because him going first is absolutely critical: as long as the wall doesn't resist both his stabs, he can power through it (mixpert takes 85% minimum from aqua tail and skarm takes around 75% minimum with max attack). It auto-loses to celebi and other slowbro, but cress is 2hko'ed and can't do much to it back except moonlight stall to waste turns of trick room (assuming no weather) and even 252hp/252 def bold blissey is ohko'ed by both attacks. Other bulky pure-grass types beat it too, but only because they're neutral to zen headbutt. Slowbro also resists a lot of priority, so you could always try this if you wanted to make a team out of it, lol.

 

[UltiMario]

Trick Room is a bad gimmick until a held item that increases how long it lasts is made.

And even then its a bad gimmick.

 

[kirbyraeg]

We could discuss this in a more serious setting, I made a joke about pain split starmie but I really only now realize the potential of it to beat blissey.

Starmie @ Life Orb/???

252 Spe/252 SpAtk/4 Def, 0 HP IV
Timid/Modest nature

Surf/Hydro Pump
Substitute
Pain Split
Tbolt/Ice Beam/Grass Knot/Thunder Wave

This is a team support set that can still hit hard. I listed thunder wave as the last option, but it could be used on a different, more defensive take on the same set. Thunder Wave would make scarfers and various other things that come in to deal with starmie useless, and it RUINS scarftar. Pain Split+sub deals with blissey hardcore as starmie can switch out of status and no blissey will break starmie's nice mixed defenses, and seismic toss does enough to make pain split more effective while not threatening starmie's livelihood at all. Forcing switches and draining health is the primary idea behind this set, so just one layer of spikes would give great support for this and paralysis ensures getting the pain split off vs. faster revengers. Coverage options can deal with threatening pokemon or common switches, which might work better, but really depends on the use of the set.

 

[Gates]

I was going to post a CroCressalia build but then I realized Cressie's only good special moves are:

Charge Beam, which is redundant with Calm Mind and she'll get walled by ground types and Jolteon.

Psychic, which lets her get ***** even harder by TTar and other dark types and walled by steel types.

Ice Beam, which lets her get walled by steel and water types.

Shadow Ball, which gets her walled by normal and steel types.

Energy Ball, which lets get get walled by...well, lots of things.

Signal Beam, which is pathetically weak against most of the metagame, even if it's +6.

And Hidden Power, which varies. Hidden Power Water is the best option imo because it lets her get the exact same type coverage as Suicune, which is pretty good when you think about it - only walled by Vaporeon and bulky water types, hits steel types for neutral damage, and super effective against threats like Heatran, Gliscor, Infernape, Hippowdon, and TTar.

This is what I've got so far.

Cresselia @ Leftovers
Levitate
Bold
IVs: 13 Atk/30 Spe/30 SpA
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SpA
-Calm Mind
-Hidden Power [Water]
-Rest
-Sleep Talk

Let me know what you guys think.

And for those who say "why not just use CroCune", Cresselia has higher HP, defense, and special defense and immunity to ground, which Suicune doesn't. These make up for the worse defensive typing and lower SpA imo. Besides, not every team can use CroCune due to the fact that maybe they already have a bunch of stuff weak to electric/grass/Vaporeon or need something defensive more than something bulky. Again, this is only an experiment.

 

[Wave⁂]

+6 HP Water vs. standard CB Tyranitar: 55.6% - 65.6%

That's not saying that Tyranitar counters that set, but it's saying that it's really, really weak.

 

[Gates]

Well a 2HKO isn't TOO bad and it'll 3HKO with only a few boosts.

But yeah, the set is hella weak.

 

[Wave⁂]

HP Dragon would be superior in UU. HP Fire might work in OU if you have Heatran bait (Forretress Earthquakes on predicted Heatran switch-in).

Actually, on second thought, HP Dragon with Magnezone might be the best.

 

[Gates]

HP Dragon with Magnezone sounds good. I was thinking about HP Fire too but that would be assuming your opponent doesn't have Heatran or that you have a bunch of ways to take care of him.

Cressie isn't UU anymore btw.

 

[Wave⁂]

FACEPALM
I'm a OU kind of guy, so if it's not OU, it's UU.

 

[Gates]

lol I know what you mean.

 

[Sunnysunny]

Hmm ok, well this is something odd I made up awhile ago by tweaking a mono-tomb set.
Spiritomb
Nature: Relaxed
Item: Leftover
EVs 252 HP, 252 def, 4sp.def
Moves:
Calm mind/nasty plot
dark pulse
confuse ray
protect

This thing is annoying in UU and is meant to force some switches. It works well with hazard support and blocks rapid spinners. Confuse ray is there to force switches, and calm mind up on the switch. If they stay in I still got a 50/50 chance to get a free turn. Protect is there to get a little extra from left overs, nullify the attack (or not if they get hurt in confusion) of pokemon that want to stay in even if there confused, and scout for dangerous moves. Protect also helps spiritombs ability pressure sap away PP. Not really that useful but i've had people lose fire blast or hydropump from it. Dark pulse I chose over shadow ball so im not completely walled by normal types. Calm mind also lets me beat other walls that oppose him like milotic.

Clefable is the biggest threat to this set though. Taunt (if I haven't calm mind a enough times), and miracle guard destroy it.

I need a lil suggestions for the EVs though. Think I need to invest more on the Sp.def side?

 

[Gates]

Didn't you post this exact set earlier in this thread?

 

[Sunnysunny]

Didn't you post this exact set earlier in this thread?

Nope. =w=

It was posted in my normal team thread, but it wasn't meant to be rated as a set there. Its meant to be rated individually here.

 

[Gates]

I've been using this as a lead (in OU), it works decently.

Nidoqueen (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Poison Point
EVs: 252 HP/200 Def/44 Spd/12 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic Spikes
- Roar

It works like a slightly worse Swampert. I was afraid of Azelf leads ****ing this over but I almost never see them now. Swampert is a threat too but I can almost always predict the Earthquake and switch out to Skarmory or Rotom. Access to both Rocks and Toxic Spikes is very good on a stall team and the typing is not too shabby with immunities to poison and electric and resistances to fighting and rock. The defense EVs are also very good for it, as it's able to survive an unboosted LO Lucario Extremespeed and hit back with Earthquake.

 

[Wave⁂]

Azelf ****s that over. Also Aerodactyl and Gliscor.
Metagross... does it 2HKO? Or OHKO?
Roserade / Smeargle lol

 

[Gates]

I know Azelf ****s on it, but as I said I've been lucky to not face any. Aero is also bad but I've seen very little of him either. Same with Gliscor.
Metagross probably OHKOs it but most Gross just set up rocks turn 1 so I can switch out to Rotom turn 2.
I have a resttalker on my team to absorb sleep so Roserade and Smeargle are a non-issue.

So yeah, a lot of this is dependent on the rest of my team =/

 

[ss118]

I personally like Fire Blast over Roar. Roar is better when your team is trying to abuse spikes(which it might very well be doing).

There are only three things that avoid Toxic Spikes: Flying-types, Steels, and Grounded Poisons. Flying-types are limited by Stealth Rock, Steels are beaten by a combination of EQ+Fire Blast, and Grounded Poisons are smashed by EQ. Period.

First post in a while. I know.

 

[Gates]

Yeah man, long time no see.

Anyway, I think Fire Blast would just be kinda redundant. My team is trying to abuse entry hazards, so Roar is important. Fire Blast would help against, say, Skarmory, but I have other answers to him on my team anyway.

 

[Wave⁂]

Herro timssu

Also, if you want to abuse shuffling, either Sleep Talk Aerodactyl or Latias / Hippowdon.

 

[Gates]

I did use Latias for a while. It worked ok. I use Resttalk Gyara right now and it works pretty well.

 

[c3gill]

been out of playing for a bit, just been ****ing around in HG/SS and having fun exploiting glitches. but yea, id like to hear yalls opinions on an old standard of mine.... as i have a hard-on for rain dance teams, it kinda fits:

my favorite Jirachi set so far:

Jirachi @ Damp Rock
248 HP / 80 SpAtk / 180 Speed
Timid
Rain Dance
Thunder
Water Pulse
Iron Head

Dance into something that will run from you. Thunder @ 100% acc. and 60% para rate, then comes Water Pulse with its 40% confusion rate and improved damage in the rain. Once Para-fused up, you can Iron Head your opponent into oblivion. Flinch Rate + Parafusion, and it gives rain support.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

You might as well throw in Cosmic Power / Wish in there instead of Iron Head. Along with a Timid Nature Iron Head isn't doing you too many favors.

-Terywj

 

[kirbyraeg]

U-turn probably fits best over iron head on that set: jirachi is meant to be a supporter ultimately, and using a turn of rain to fire off iron head isn't the best use of your limited time. usually.

 

[xLeafybug =D]

Yeah, that set's pretty cool, but use U-Turn.

 

[Gates]

I actually think Wish would be the best means of support here. Wish and Rain gives it two things to pass which makes it even more beneficial for a rain team.

 

[kirbyraeg]

So...substitute lure set?

Salamence @ Life Orb/Expert Belt
16 Atk/240 SpAtk/252 Spe

Substitute
Draco Meteor
Outrage/Earthquake
Flamethrower/Fire Blast

idk lol