Sexy Poses!: An In-Depth Move Analysis for Zelda - Move #18-20, 22 Up/Down B, Dash A

[goodkid]

I like F-tilt. I like how the hit-box looks and its deceiving range.

F-tilt can also send opponents straight up, but I don't know where on her arm that this occurs. The other f-tilt is when you are very close to opponent and it sends them forward. These two f-tilts seem to kill earlier than the other f-tilts that send @ angles. If Zelda is standing right by the ledge, facing the stage and she f-tilts and it hits, this should kill earlier, because there is less room to DI. Killing %s of F-tilt is dependent on the position of where you hit them on-stage and how you hit them(straight-up, diagonal, forward)

Also this is situational, but on Smashville, when Zelda's on the moving platform, all of her hitboxes are extended. I think F-tilt may be double the range, unless the magic sparkles just fly away w/out extending her hitboxes. If you do this, try up-tilt and you will see what I'm talking about it.

 

[KayLo!]

F-tilt can also send opponents straight up, but I don't know where on her arm that this occurs.

This is the opponent DI'ing (or possibly SDI'ing) the hit. It's not a unique hitbox.

Also this is situational, but on Smashville, when Zelda's on the moving platform, all of her hitboxes are extended. I think F-tilt may be double the range, unless the magic sparkles just fly away w/out extending her hitboxes.

Umm, not sure about this one. I'll test it and see what I find, but I highly doubt it's double the range, if anything.

 

[<π]

ftilt actually sends people at different trajectories depending on how close you are to her. hit wit the tip you got a more of an vertical angle. if you are close you go at more of a horizontal angle.

 

[KayLo!]

ftilt actually sends people at different trajectories depending on how close you are to her. hit wit the tip you got a more of an vertical angle. if you are close you go at more of a horizontal angle.

False. There are only two hitbox trajectories: the one that angles behind her (mid-tip range hit) and one that sends the opponent straight forward (close-range/arm hit).

Any deviations from that are due to the opponent's DI. At higher percentages, the angle might look more vertical, but it's the same angle as always.... they're just flying farther away.

 

[Heartz♥]

I gotta say her Ftilt is quite the simple trap for an offensively strong character like Zelda. It gives non-aggressive players a break. I like to play very slow and laidback with Zelda, but I do not camp. But at the same time, using Ftilt whenever your oponent gets too close kinda keeps them on edge, considering that it is a very annoying lock attack.

Sorry I can't give technical input like others. I just play the **** game.

 

[KayLo!]

I gotta say her Ftilt is quite the simple trap for an offensively strong character like Zelda. It gives non-aggressive players a break. I like to play very slow and laidback with Zelda, but I do not camp. But at the same time, using Ftilt whenever your oponent gets too close kinda keeps them on edge, considering that it is a very annoying lock attack.

Are you thinking about dtilt? Ftilt doesn't lock or trap in any way, shape, or form. =X

 

[<π]

False. There are only two hitbox trajectories: the one that angles behind her (mid-tip range hit) and one that sends the opponent straight forward (close-range/arm hit).

Sorry, tiz what I ment.

 

[KayLo!]

Sorry, tiz what I ment.

Oh, okay, hehe.

I'm leaving for the weekend, but when I get back on Monday, we'll be moving on to the next attack. Which move(s) would you guys like to discuss?

Feel free to add any last words about ftilt in the meantime. If someone could do a bit of testing and find out which (important) aerials it beats, that'd be fabulous as well.

 

[MrEh]

Discuss Dtilt. It's Zelda's only good move.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

im up for Dtilt, or jab.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Discuss Dtilt. It's Zelda's only good move.

considering that Dtilt is only so good because it leads into zeldas other attacks..........

 

[<π]

I like nair. nair combos into usmash and dsmash I think...

dtilt or utilt next please.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

when you cancel nair whilst the foe is in it, yeah, it puts them in AWFUL positioning.

 

[Kataefi]

Guys kaylo and hotgarbage have both actually looked into dtilt, jab and nair really extensively and it's all been written up. We just need to complete the frame data such as shield stun and lag and stuff to fully complete those moves.

I think we should discuss a more obscure move and visit dtilt/jab/nair later on.

 

[MrEh]

Discuss DownB then. It's Zelda's best move, since it changes her into a better character. lol

 

[Kataefi]

I wouldn't mind doing Utilt actually aka the killer rainbow =p

 

[<π]

I think we should discuss a more obscure move and visit dtilt/jab/nair later on.

utilt perhaps?

I say we save down B for last.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I wouldn't mind doing Utilt actually aka the killer rainbow =p

killer rainbow?

oh.... you mean "Purdy" ?

 

[powuh_of_PIE]

killer rainbow?

oh.... you mean "Purdy" ?

yeah, that's what they're thinking when we kill them with utilt. "Purdy..." GAME!

Utilt sounds nice ^ ^

 

[mountain_tiger]

UTilt or DSmash would be good.

 

[KayLo!]

If you guys close your eyes reaaaal tight and wish on a star, I might have utilt info up by tomorrow so we can start discussing it.

Otherwise, Monday.

(Out of town, but I might be able to get the info e-mailed to me.)

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

so we've chosen "Purdy" over Dsmash?

that's probably good. most people know how to use Dsamsh

 

[choknater]

wow, kata and kaylo, i really like the info on the 2D vs 3D moves hitting spot dodges and their invincibility frames and stuff

i never knew about that game mechanic useful!!

 

[KayLo!]

wow, kata and kaylo, i really like the info on the 2D vs 3D moves hitting spot dodges and their invincibility frames and stuff

i never knew about that game mechanic useful!!

No problem! I was getting weird, conflicting numbers when I first started testing Zelda's moves a while ago..... that's when I found out about the whole 2D/3D thing. Sucks for G&W, but he's a good character regardless, so I guess it's not that crappy.

Anyways, I didn't have time to update this morning (we decided to get up super early for breakfast in the city), but if I have time tonight/tomorrow, I'll switch to utilt in the OP.

Did anyone get any info on which aerials ftilt beats? Just the important ones. I'd really appreciate it.

 

[PhantomX]

****... I was expecting KayLo in sexy poses... I just wasted my time!

 

[KayLo!]

****... I was expecting KayLo in sexy poses... I just wasted my time!

x.o Well, you play Wario, so I was expecting you to be a perv. I guess I was right.

Spoiler

<3 PX

 

[XFadingNirvanaX]

x.o Well, you play Wario, so I was expecting you to be a perv. I guess I was right.

Spoiler

<3 PX

Wario's not a perv, he's more of a I-don't-give-a-**** kind of guy.

 

[Heartz♥]

Are you thinking about dtilt? Ftilt doesn't lock or trap in any way, shape, or form. =X

rofl. I was barely awake when I typed that. Yeah I meant Dtilt. I already failed this thread.

 

[KayLo!]

Wario's not a perv, he's more of a I-don't-give-a-**** kind of guy.

You right. Maybe it's just PX, then. =O

rofl. I was barely awake when I typed that. Yeah I meant Dtilt. I already failed this thread.

Lol, it's all good.

A few notes:

On ftilt: It's a 3D move, but unfortunately, Kataefi, the frames I had for it were right. Even though Zelda swings her arm around, 12-14 are the only frames during which there's an actual hitbox. The animation is really deceptive.... I thought I might have been wrong too and was looking forward to reporting an additional frame or two, but nah.

I've added two extra types of info to the frame data section: whether a move is 2D or 3D and what kind of priority it has.

When we finish a move, I'll copy the complete frame data to the research thread.

That's all. Let's discuss utilt!

 

[GodAtHand]

Dtilt Uptilt combo. And once in a while for edge guarding... That is all... of course you can use it for the pretty sparkles as well.

 

[-Mars-]

I would like to use this move more, but it's really too slow and has too much cooldown time. Of course i use it to kill out of a dtilt.....and the neat part about it is that the move is almost always fresh. I sometimes hit roll spammers with it, but it's usually a better idea to just dsmash.

I would like to discuss the fact that this move has transcendental priority and if we should be utilizing that more.

 

[Kataefi]

Thanks kay... good of you to have tested and made sure though. The organisation in this thread is amazing.

lol.. rainbow of ****ing death... what's the shield disadvantage like if she hits with the final hit of the move on their shield? (hitbox at 24 frames) Is it still the same?

I don't really know how to apply this move personally... hope someone can help me =p I always instinctively use usmash from a dtilt popup... I should use utilt much more often because it kills so early.

This move is interesting to me because it lingers for a long time and travels behind where she is facing. Characters who bait aerially might hop over her and be caught off guard. I've realised it can always trade... it trades even again MK's aerials iirc... trades with Peach's Fair which has godlike priority so it definitely packs a punch.

 

[KayLo!]

I would like to discuss the fact that this move has transcendental priority and if we should be utilizing that more.

I agree. It's a gift and a curse.... but the fact that it always trades means that it might be worth it to take the extra damage for the kill sometimes.

what's the shield disadvantage like if she hits with the final hit of the move on their shield? (hitbox at 24 frames) Is it still the same?

No, there's less of a disadvantage then.... I was just being lazy at the time and didn't feel like testing from the front and the back. @.@

I'll look into it when I get back to Philly (tomorrow morning), but it'll probably just be 14 frames less (the difference between frame 10 and frame 24).

I've realised it can always trade... it trades even again MK's aerials iirc... trades with Peach's Fair which has godlike priority so it definitely packs a punch.

Yeah, that's the transcendent priority Mars was talking about, similar to ftilt and most of MK's sword attacks.

 

[-Mars-]

Screw it i'm gonna just start calling it laser priority like everyone else since transcendental takes forever for me to type.

 

[KayLo!]

Screw it i'm gonna just start calling it laser priority like everyone else since transcendental takes forever for me to type.

Laser priority? XD Never heard that one.... I've only ever heard transcendent/transcendental/aerial priority. I like it, though, hehe.

Sometimes spotdodge > utilt works on newbier players. The front part comes out on frame 10, which isn't that slow for a Zelda move..... it's faster than grabbing or jabbing, anyway. x.x

It just sucks balls if you miss, because you have to wait for the looooong hitbox and loooong cooldown frames to finish.

 

[-Mars-]

Yea I think it originated because of Wolf and Falco's lasers not trading with anything so people just started referring too it as that. Sheiks needles and chain also have "laser priority" and most of Lucario's moveset.

Now that you mention it, it is faster than a jab or grab.......but really I would like to just use this move at KO percentages. Usmash is probably a better option in most cases.

Kata did bring up an interesting point however. For players that like to use crossups on you this might be worthwhile to pull out. Usmash probably might be a better option for that too.....uuuuugh!

 

[MrEh]

Learn how to land this thing.

If you opponent airdodges into you, learn how to Utilt. It could snag you the early kill that Zelda desperately needs to win. Utilt will probably be fresh too, so extra coolness right there.

 

[Kataefi]

Learn how to land this thing.

If you opponent airdodges into you, learn how to Utilt. It could snag you the early kill that Zelda desperately needs to win. Utilt will probably be fresh to, so extra coolness right there.

Could this be??? Could this be the first time you've said something motivational? xD

~~

I really want to focus on this move... Mars I think its horizontal range is much much better than Usmash, and if they do crossup, where the move finishes allows Zelda to cooldown less than Usmash (I might be lying though, because I havn't check the frame data yet lol)... as long as the hitbox itself follows their movement around Zelda then it should act as a decent protector of some kind.

I'm gonna try this more on warios and peaches and see where it takes me... I might even try some reverse utilts and see where it takes me. Reversing them takes 14 frames of lag off so it's a lot of better this way imo.

 

[KayLo!]

Could this be??? Could this be the first time you've said something motivational? xD

Honestly......... that was the first thing I thought when I read his post, LOL.

I'm so proud of him. ;-;

and if they do crossup, where the move finishes allows Zelda to cooldown less than Usmash (I might be lying though, because I havn't check the frame data yet lol)... as long as the hitbox itself follows their movement around Zelda then it should act as a decent protector of some kind.

It has 22 frames of cooldown.... iirc, usmash has 24, so that's 2 frames less. Not a huge deal, but it's still a valid point I guess.

Every character will get hit before frame 24 unless they're spotdodging or airdodging, though, because they're all tall enough to get hit by ~22 or so. Exceptions may be if someone's crouching, but.... uhh. I dunno anyone who'd just be crouching behind you unless they're about to dtilt.

 

[MrEh]

Since the hitbox for the Utilt lasts forever, it's good for eating up airdodges or intercepting certain attacks. Personally, I think that's the easiest way to land a Utilt. If you predict your opponent is going to airdodge behind you, Utilt. If you think they're going to airdodge in front of you, turnaround Utilt.

An example of a turnaround Utilt can be seen here.

It's a Bowser vid, but the same concept applies. Zelda's Utilt is essentially Bowser's Utilt, just far slower and crappier.

Could this be??? Could this be the first time you've said something motivational? xD

Utilt sucks.

Fixed.